Harper's Olympic absence

[jdobbin]

Harper's actions speak louder than words. The Chinese are PO'd at him.

And some Conservatives seem eager to escalate the hostilities.

[Wild Bill]

And some Conservatives seem eager to escalate the hostilities.

Perhaps not an accurate assessment. There are two possible approaches to dealing with a government like China. There's the Winston Churchill approach and the Neville Chamberlain approach.

In your arguments you don't seem to be a Winnie-style advocate.

[jdobbin]

Perhaps not an accurate assessment. There are two possible approaches to dealing with a government like China. There's the Winston Churchill approach and the Neville Chamberlain approach.

In your arguments you don't seem to be a Winnie-style advocate.

I think you forgot the third approach. The Nixon one.

[blueblood]

I think you forgot the third approach. The Nixon one.

Nixon didn't have the India option.

[jdobbin]

Nixon didn't have the India option.

Neither does Canada unless we are prepared to help them catch up in ten years in terms of consumer products and industrial goods.

[Guest American Woman]

Prime Minister Stephen Harper has short-sightedly risked relations with China by failing to attend the Olympic games and going overboard in honouring Tibet's Dalai Lama, former Prime Minister Jean Chrétien said Monday.

Speaking to a Canadian Bar Association gathering, Mr. Chrétien said the missteps are indicative of a government that naively fails to understand that the Chinese government has made enormous strides in recent years – and that China has a long "collective memory" when it comes to international slights. link

Chrétien seems to be saying the same thing as GWH Bush-- that we have to look at the strides China has made, how far it's come.

Mr. Chrétien said that were he still prime minister, he "would not have hesitated for a second" to attend an Olympic games that obviously mean so much to Chinese national pride.

He speaks of the importance of trade with China and how Canada is "too small a global player to hector the Chinese or try to hurt them with boycotts."

"We are at the bottom of the ladder in terms of having any influence with China," he said. "Ask any businessman who has been to China, and he will tell you the same thing."

I have to say that I agree with just about everything that he said.

Edited August 18, 2008 by American Woman

[William Ashley]

http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/stor...ame=beijing2008

Other prime minister's have missed previous games but given Harper's previous stand on China, the Chinese media is labelling the absence as a boycott.

I wonder if Harper will feel he has to go for the closing ceremonies. He probably didn't care when the Opposition asked him why he wasn't going but if it is becoming a major issue in China, it could be a problem.

Bush has had it both ways. He went to the game and criticized China's human rights.

Maybe he was worried they'd renovate sussex while he was gone?

Edited August 18, 2008 by William Ashley

[capricorn]

Prime Minister Stephen Harper has short-sightedly risked relations with China by failing to attend the Olympic games and going overboard in honouring Tibet's Dalai Lama, former Prime Minister Jean Chrétien said Monday.

Speaking to a Canadian Bar Association gathering, Mr. Chrétien said the missteps are indicative of a government that naively fails to understand that the Chinese government has made enormous strides in recent years – and that China has a long "collective memory" when it comes to international slights. link

Chrétien seems to be saying the same thing as GWH Bush-- that we have to look at the strides China has made, how far it's come.

Mr. Chrétien said that were he still prime minister, he "would not have hesitated for a second" to attend an Olympic games that obviously mean so much to Chinese national pride.

Oh brother! Did Chretien really have to pipe in on this one? And this coming from Chretien who should be the last one to criticize the sitting PM's statesmanship qualities.

Prime Minister Chretien has apologized for missing Monday's funeral of Jordan's King Hussein.

Canada was alone in the international community in not sending its head of government or head of state. Foreign Minister Lloyd Axworthy attended the ceremony in Amman.

Upon his return last night from a family skiing holiday at Whistler, B.C., Chretien said he had prepared for the funeral and had expected Jordanian officials to give him 24 hours notice.

He noted that Friday he had sent an advance team to the Mideast nation, but by the time the call came, it was too late for him to fly to Jordan and arrive on time for the funeral. The prime minister says he wasn't about to cancel a family trip to wait for news.

"I'm sorry," Chretien said last night, "nobody knows when somebody will die."

http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/1999/02/09/hussein990209.html

Chretien should look in the mirror before pointing fingers.

[Guest American Woman]

Chretien said he had prepared for the funeral and had expected Jordanian officials to give him 24 hours notice.

Even your quote said: by the time the call came, it was too late for him to fly to Jordan and arrive on time for the funeral.

You can hardly compare less than 24 hour notice with Harper's knowledge that Beijing was going to host the Olympics this summer; we've all known that Beijing was going to host the Olympics for years, while Chretien didn't know when Hussein was going to die. Furthermore, he apologized for not attending, something Harper hasn't done.

As I said, they aren't comparable situations.

[capricorn]

Chretien said he had prepared for the funeral and had expected Jordanian officials to give him 24 hours notice.

Even your quote said: by the time the call came, it was too late for him to fly to Jordan and arrive on time for the funeral.

You can hardly compare less than 24 hour notice with Harper's knowledge that Beijing was going to host the Olympics this summer; we've all known that Beijing was going to host the Olympics for years, while Chretien didn't know when Hussein was going to die. Furthermore, he apologized for not attending, something Harper hasn't done.

As I said, they aren't comparable situations.

"Chretien said he had prepared for the funeral and had expected Jordanian officials to give him 24 hours notice."

Why did he wait for notice from Jordanian officials? Whether Chretien received notice on time or not, Hussein would have still been dead. Exactly what prevented Mr. Chretien from making his way to Jordan? After all, he admits he was prepared. And how come all other heads of state made it on time? Chretien's excuse was lame.

Chretien should have kept his thoughts on Harper not attending to himself. This man is out of politics and yesterday's man. Why doesn't he just write a book, tend a golf course or something and stay out of my face.

[jdobbin]

You can hardly compare less than 24 hour notice with Harper's knowledge that Beijing was going to host the Olympics this summer; we've all known that Beijing was going to host the Olympics for years, while Chretien didn't know when Hussein was going to die. Furthermore, he apologized for not attending, something Harper hasn't done.

As I said, they aren't comparable situations.

Harper was waiting for a few more years notice.

[Guest American Woman]

"Chretien said he had prepared for the funeral and had expected Jordanian officials to give him 24 hours notice."

Why did he wait for notice from Jordanian officials? Whether Chretien received notice on time or not, Hussein would have still been dead. Exactly what prevented Mr. Chretien from making his way to Jordan? After all, he admits he was prepared. And how come all other heads of state made it on time? Chretien's excuse was lame.

Yes, he admits he was prepared. In other words, he planned on attending. He just didn't get the 24 hour notice that he had expected. As I said, he didn't know when the king was going to die. He died on Sunday and the funeral was Monday, so he didn't have enough time to fly to the funeral.

Whether his excuse was "lame" or not, at least he had an excuse. He planned on attending. He apologized for not attending. Harper knew for years that the Olympics were going to be held at this time in Beijing. Yet he didn't plan on attending and he has no excuse for not attending, "lame" or otherwise.

The situations are not comparable.

Chretien should have kept his thoughts on Harper not attending to himself. This man is out of politics and yesterday's man. Why doesn't he just write a book, tend a golf course or something and stay out of my face.

No, he shouldn't have kept his thoughts on Harper to himself. It's a free country so he has every right to speak his mind, just as many other former leaders have done, and will continue to do.

[Topaz]

I think Harper should get a new "excuse minister" and come up with better excuses!!!

[noahbody]

From article:

Mr. Chrétien said that Canada has to keep in mind that it is too small a global player to hector the Chinese or try to hurt them with boycotts.

Someone should really tell our athletes that we're boycotting. Chretien confirms it.

[capricorn]

No, he shouldn't have kept his thoughts on Harper to himself. It's a free country so he has every right to speak his mind, just as many other former leaders have done, and will continue to do.

Chretien can do whatever he chooses and I will continue to hope he fades into the background.

[capricorn]

"Mr. Chrétien said that Canada has to keep in mind that it is too small a global player to hector the Chinese or try to hurt them with boycotts."

Of course, it would not be in Chretien's and his family's business interests that Canada boycott anything Chinese. It makes more sense to me now that Chretien went public with his criticism of the PM. His comments have made international news as I'm sure he hoped. His business cohorts in China (including his son-in-law Andre Desmarais of Powercorp repute) will take note and be proud he is standing up for their business interests here in Canada.

[blueblood]

Neither does Canada unless we are prepared to help them catch up in ten years in terms of consumer products and industrial goods.

Ten years is bugger all and a smart investment to take China down a peg.

[jdobbin]

Ten years is bugger all and a smart investment to take China down a peg.

So you advocate a trade war with China.

[Argus]

Chretien said he had prepared for the funeral and had expected Jordanian officials to give him 24 hours notice.

Even your quote said: by the time the call came, it was too late for him to fly to Jordan and arrive on time for the funeral.

As I recall, it was later shown that he was lying. The military had a plane standing by all ready. He just didn't want to attend.

[Argus]

Prime Minister Stephen Harper has short-sightedly risked relations with China by failing to attend the Olympic games and going overboard in honouring Tibet's Dalai Lama, former Prime Minister Jean Chrétien said Monday.

Chretien never had the slightest interest in human rights concerns. He cozied up to the world's butchers without a second thought (not that Chretien generally did much in the way of thinking). There was nothing Chretien wouldn't do for his paymasters - the corporations which made him a multi-millionaire and continue to repay him for the generosity of the actions he took on their behalf while he was prime minister.

Without question the most corrupt Prime mnister in the last hundred years - and the dumbest. George Bush was an intellectual compared to Chretien.

[Wild Bill]

So you advocate a trade war with China.

http://www42.statcan.ca/smr04/2005/08/smr04_24105_04-eng.htm

http://www.international.gc.ca/eet/pdf/Mon...ics-Dec6-en.pdf

These are just two sites I googled up. The last shows that in 2006 we were in the hole to China by nearly 27 billion!

Geez, if we were to start a trade war with China I guess we'd really lose! How could we survive without owing them all that money?

At this rate, where will we be in 10 years? In 20?

Thank you, M Chretien! You really opened up trade with China!

From a purely Darwinian standpoint, it would appear that the Chinese are far, far smarter than we are.

[jdobbin]

These are just two sites I googled up. The last shows that in 2006 we were in the hole to China by nearly 27 billion!

Geez, if we were to start a trade war with China I guess we'd really lose! How could we survive without owing them all that money?

You don't think more expensive products in Canada would not cause inflation and economic problems?

[eyeball]

Chretien never had the slightest interest in human rights concerns. He cozied up to the world's butchers without a second thought (not that Chretien generally did much in the way of thinking). There was nothing Chretien wouldn't do for his paymasters - the corporations which made him a multi-millionaire and continue to repay him for the generosity of the actions he took on their behalf while he was prime minister.

There's not much I can disagree with here.

Without question the most corrupt Prime mnister in the last hundred years - and the dumbest. George Bush was an intellectual compared to Chretien.

Chretien was smart enough to keep us out of Iraq. That one glimmer of brilliance just about redeems everything else he neglected. Unfortunately he still managed to get us mired in Afghanistan. As for Harper, he epitomizes the observation that the business of Conservatives is to prevent mistakes from being corrected.

[AngusThermopyle]

As I recall, it was later shown that he was lying. The military had a plane standing by all ready. He just didn't want to attend.

This is true, it came to light that a plane and crew were on standby to go. Skiing with his family and then telling lies to excuse it just struck him as a preferable course of action.

[Wild Bill]

You don't think more expensive products in Canada would not cause inflation and economic problems?

Gee, I guess you're right!

Best thing for us is to double or triple our trade deficits with China. Or with anyone else, I guess.

Thanks for pointing out the error in my logic. Particularly as regards to losing trade with China automatically meaning more expensive imports. I had forgotten that we never could afford toasters before and that there are no other countries that could supply us such goods at attractive prices.

I guess those countries that try to achieve trade surpluses must be fools! Thank heavens we're so smart.