Bernier Resigns

[Wild Bill]

You are confused. Some of the committee work had nothing to do with the throne speech and did not cover any current legislation.

Basically, you are saying everything is related to the throne speech and therefore everything is a matter of confidence if the government chooses so.

Your point is totally moot, considering that Dion would not oppose a confidence motion anyway!

It's a waste of time to even argue!

[Topaz]

Julie is now offering to testify to any committee but I'm sure Harper will try to stop any committee hearing on this subject.

[BubberMiley]

Wow its come to punctuation.

I guess we know what's important in political sparing.

Spelling is important too.

It's sparring.

Now that we've established you can't write coherently and you try to debate matters you know nothing about, such as the requirements for a confidence vote, don't you feel that, like many on the Right on this board, you're doing your cause far more harm than good by trying to represent it?

Edited May 30, 2008 by BubberMiley

[jdobbin]

Your point is totally moot, considering that Dion would not oppose a confidence motion anyway!

It's a waste of time to even argue!

It is part of Dion's super secret strategy to let the Tories get most of their agenda through the House so that the cupboard is bare and then they are left bumbling when there is no script to follow! ha

In any event, Harper let 19 confidence motions pass himself when he was in Opposition making him look weak and ineffective. Just five months before the election, a movement existed in his party to oust him.

[scribblet]

And the government doesn't have the slightest inclination to find out despite former RCMP and CSIS officials saying that it is indeed a legitimate concern.

hmmm I thought the gov't had no business in the bedrooms of the nation. We don't know if it's a legitimate concern, we don't know anything other than rumours spread by the opposition, should the gov't investigate every rumour on the Hill.

[noahbody]

She was associated with a number of bikers. The Tories are really grasping if they think that security shouldn't have been an issue. Even non-partisan security experts are saying security concerns are legitimate in this case. They have been saying so all along.

It's all how you frame the question. If you look at the details she wasn't much of a threat and that threat no longer exists. Is there any evidence a crime has been committed? No. Have the RCMP check her phone records and confiscate her computer, I don't care. Just don't hold some grand inquiry at taxpayers' expense just for political gain.

I find it a bit odd you're so concerned with organized crime, since the government you voted for were guilty of it.

[DrGreenthumb]

Sirois, the one to whom she was married, became an informant so there's really no connection with organized crime there. The previous boyfriend is dead. As far as other associations:

As I mentioned earlier, you don't do attempt to break up your wedding or kill you a favour. And in this case, there's really no favour to be had, since the Hell's Angel's aren't likely interested in foreign affairs.

http://network.nationalpost.com/np/blogs/p.../08/169434.aspx

No the Hell's Angels surely wouldn't be interested in any foriegn products, say from afghanistan? They wouldn't be at all interested in contacts there and ways to be put in charge of airport security so they could make sure no illegal products came from overseas and somehow got into Canada to be sold for massive tax-free profits. That's just silly isn't it?

The hell's really just want pot to be decriminalized so that everyone can grow their own, and they won't have to waste their valuable time supplying it to everyone for huge profits right?

Forget hypocricy, the conservative posters are really just displaying their stupidity now.

[noahbody]

No the Hell's Angels surely wouldn't be interested in any foriegn products, say from afghanistan? They wouldn't be at all interested in contacts there and ways to be put in charge of airport security so they could make sure no illegal products came from overseas and somehow got into Canada to be sold for massive tax-free profits. That's just silly isn't it?

The hell's really just want pot to be decriminalized so that everyone can grow their own, and they won't have to waste their valuable time supplying it to everyone for huge profits right?

Forget hypocricy, the conservative posters are really just displaying their stupidity now.

Well if you want to use your imagination, since Coulliard was suspected by biker gangs of being friendly with police, maybe she has been a CSIS agent working undercover (no pun intended) all along. The maffia that infiltrated government under Chretien has now corrupted CSIS and has set this whole thing up to create trouble for their rivials the Hell's Angels. Glad we got that beer and popcorn money. Can't wait for the movie.

Edited May 30, 2008 by noahbody

[guyser]

But the liberals wahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.

Keep dodging boys keep dodging ...LOL

[Alta4ever]

Spelling is important too.

It's sparring.

Now that we've established you can't write coherently and you try to debate matters you know nothing about, such as the requirements for a confidence vote, don't you feel that, like many on the Right on this board, you're doing your cause far more harm than good by trying to represent it?

Nice to see liberal arrogance is a constant factor.

It speaks volumes when all you have left is a pathetic attempt at character assassination.

But then again it is your main form of debate, as you have nothing of relevance anyway.

Edited May 30, 2008 by Alta4ever

[noahbody]

Note to CSIS and RCMP: You are just a bunch of conspiracy theorists with your claims that a relationship with someone with long term biker associations might pose a security threat.

Note to CSIS and RCMP: Association, past or present, doesn't necessarily make one a security threat. Remember that whole Arar thingy?

[Alta4ever]

It is part of Dion's super secret strategy to let the Tories get most of their agenda through the House so that the cupboard is bare and then they are left bumbling when there is no script to follow! ha

In any event, Harper let 19 confidence motions pass himself when he was in Opposition making him look weak and ineffective. Just five months before the election, a movement existed in his party to oust him.

The cupboard bare, that’s a laugh. The CPC has forty years of legislation to rewrite, since the liberals have such a poor record of creating policy. I guess when you stand for nothing you are excatly that, nothing. Not to mention fixing the red tory governments mistakes of the eighties. Dion will be long gone by the time the CPC runs out of policy.

Besides, your strategy is foolish, the CPC is showing that a government is suppose to govern, not just sit and collect pay checks do nothing. Not to mention the fraud committed by the liberal party. What did Jean and Paul do with 13 years of majority, nothing just defer their jobs to the supreme court.

Dobbin you are a blind hack. Who can’t face his party’s demons, and is scared to stand the liberal record up against the CPC record for comparison.

[Alta4ever]

But the liberals wahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.

Keep dodging boys keep dodging ...LOL

Pathetic

[Fortunata]

Those of you who maintain the CPC propaganda line are very short sighted followers. If you think outside your box for a minute you could imagine the ramifications. All I can say is you should quit being an unquestioning follower - the world is comprised of shady doings that you may not see in your sheltered environment but we know it happens. Why put this country in a position where it can?

[guyser]

Pathetic

Now you get it !

That is exactly what I thought of the attempts to deflect to the "but the liberals" whine.

[Alta4ever]

Those of you who maintain the CPC propaganda line are very short sighted followers. If you think outside your box for a minute you could imagine the ramifications. All I can say is you should quit being an unquestioning follower - the world is comprised of shady doings that you may not see in your sheltered environment but we know it happens. Why put this country in a position where it can?

Are you really that daft to think that the same can't be said for you or any of the other party hack? Its a matter of perspective.

The world is full of shady doings the Liberals know all about that, whats it like being caught with your hand in the cookie jar?

Although I forgot who I was talking to the left always knows best. Must just be your ignorance and arrogance.

I am a conversion to the center right my friend, I've looked at the situtation from your angle, I realised that the conclusions on the left are all wrong. Its taken many years of political, historical, and economic study, but in the end it is what it is.

[jdobbin]

hmmm I thought the gov't had no business in the bedrooms of the nation. We don't know if it's a legitimate concern, we don't know anything other than rumours spread by the opposition, should the gov't investigate every rumour on the Hill.

Trudeau would have been the first one to say security trumps privacy. Don't remember the war measures act?

[jdobbin]

It's all how you frame the question. If you look at the details she wasn't much of a threat and that threat no longer exists. Is there any evidence a crime has been committed? No. Have the RCMP check her phone records and confiscate her computer, I don't care. Just don't hold some grand inquiry at taxpayers' expense just for political gain.

I find it a bit odd you're so concerned with organized crime, since the government you voted for were guilty of it.

I find it odd the Tories are dismissive of security checks since they campaigned as being the party of law and order.

Our allies are both laughing at us and are appalled by Harper's lack of concern, I'm quite sure.

[jdobbin]

Note to CSIS and RCMP: Association, past or present, doesn't necessarily make one a security threat. Remember that whole Arar thingy?

Actually, it does. I had no problems with security forces monitoring Arar for his associations. They were doing their job.

Allowing Arar to be sent to another country to be tortured though is out of bounds.

Considering that Bernier's girlfriend was travelling on a special passport, I think it was only fair that she be vetted by security.

[jdobbin]

The cupboard bare, that’s a laugh. The CPC has forty years of legislation to rewrite, since the liberals have such a poor record of creating policy. I guess when you stand for nothing you are excatly that, nothing. Not to mention fixing the red tory governments mistakes of the eighties. Dion will be long gone by the time the CPC runs out of policy.

Funny how the rumour is that Harper will prorogue Parliament because there isn't anything in the cupboard now.

Last national poll had the Liberals one point ahead of the Tories. This week's national Decima poll shows more and more people dissatisfied with the Harper government. Oh my, it is all spiraling out of control.

I suspect we'll be hearing about some angry right winger talking about separation, moving out of Canada, blaming the media and ethnic groups if things don't go their way.

[Fortunata]

Are you really that daft to think that the same can't be said for you or any of the other party hack? Its a matter of perspective.

The world is full of shady doings the Liberals know all about that, whats it like being caught with your hand in the cookie jar?

Although I forgot who I was talking to the left always knows best. Must just be your ignorance and arrogance.

I am a conversion to the center right my friend, I've looked at the situtation from your angle, I realised that the conclusions on the left are all wrong. Its taken many years of political, historical, and economic study, but in the end it is what it is.

It doesn't matter what the Liberals have or haven't done. It is to do with here and now and this government is not doing it's job. All this sticking to the script is so they don't have to admit they mishandled this affair. They know they were wrong. And the mindful masses know they were wrong. It doesn't help either our image or our security to have the parrots carry on their script. Canadians should be outraged that a government should be so lax and then so dishonest no matter who is forming the government. Because someone did it before is no argument; in fact it's a condemnation of this government who promised to do it different. So go be a parrot, keep your head in the sand. Next time it might not turn out as well as it did this time.

[Alta4ever]

I find it odd the Tories are dismissive of security checks since they campaigned as being the party of law and order.

Our allies are both laughing at us and are appalled by Harper's lack of concern, I'm quite sure.

Law and order is a lot different then the party of big brother, or are you happy to give away your freedoms?

Edited May 30, 2008 by Alta4ever

[jdobbin]

It doesn't matter what the Liberals have or haven't done. It is to do with here and now and this government is not doing it's job. All this sticking to the script is so they don't have to admit they mishandled this affair. They know they were wrong. And the mindful masses know they were wrong.

If Harper had taken the questions seriously when they were first asked, he might have spared himself a lot of trouble. He could have said that it hadn't been policy to vet spouses but that given the need for security in this day and age, it was prudent to do so and he would remedy the situation.

There are a variety of jobs in Canada where security clearances extend to family members. I figure cabinet minister should be one of them.

[jdobbin]

Law and order is a lot different the the party of big brother, or are you happy to give away your freedoms?

I submit to background and criminal checks all the time. What have you got to hide?

Security is an important issue and if you want to be a cabinet minister, you submit to a check. Spouses and families should also be checked. Many companies do exactly that when they hire someone.

[jdobbin]

In today's Montreal Gazette:

http://www.canada.com/montrealgazette/feat...87-81c214eebf1f

The contradiction is fascinating. While Maxime Bernier proved to be a lethal mix of incompetence and irresponsibility, we're now hearing that his resignation as minister is somehow a great loss for the Tories in Quebec.

If anything, the real loss for the Tories won't stop at the borders of Quebec. The real damage is to Stephen Harper's image as a strong leader because he failed to intervene in a situation where his foreign affairs minister could have jeopardized national security by associating privately and publicly with a woman who once had very close ties to members of organized crime.

The Europeans are probably having second thoughts about sharing information with Harper when he doesn't even pay attention to the security of that information in the hands of his ministers.