GostHacked

Whites came to North America. Killed the natives and scattered them around to small pockets. WWI and WWII were fought mostly by whites, caused by whites as well. Whites invaded many parts of the world in the last few hundred years. (Africa/slaves) So when you say ... ... you are actually lying. It just seems to be a glitch in overal human nature that allows us to be violent. Humans have not lost the barbaric touch at all. All humans can/do/will resort to the lowest form in desparate situations.

Ouch Jerry has a point here (for once). Ontario has a large system of lakes and rivers. Enough that with all the current forest we have around us, there is still no shortage of water. Man made dams for hydroelectricity have more of an effect on water flow than trees that have been part of the ecosystem for centuries. Speaking of dams, the locks for the Great Lakes controls MOST of the water flow to the St. Lawrence river. Even if we took out the locks, you would not really see much of a change in the water levels in the Great Lakes at this current moment.

Do you actually know anything about this ? I'm not saying I do but I am a little sick of hearing from self proclaimed experts. I never proclaimed to be an expert, but I know about things you do not. You always go back to WTC 7 'proved inside job' but again you fail to see how all the other shit that went on that day fits in. INCLUDING the flight crash in Pensylvania. I think it was shot down to prevent more damage to it's target. And since you don't know the difference between an EMP bomb and a conventional bomb, you have lost credibility and the power of neutral observation. I have seen a pattern with you Polynewbie. And it is now 85 pages long. State facts, someone says something different, you pooh pooh then and continue on with "FACTS". You are one of the types of people that the general public tends to stay away from because of how you present things. You need more proof then what was rehased over 85 fucking pages. Try something different. Try another angle or something. Stop bashing your head on the wall. And you have no clue what the difference is between an EMP and a pulse engine. And on that note, I am not sure either, for I had never heard of a pulse engine untill you mentioned it here.

Well, I wasn't convinced the first 5,000 times I heard about Alhalamjwearsarmyboots' outburst about Israel, but this article from two years ago totally changed my mind about Iran being a bigger nuclear threat than the Soviet Union during the Cold War, the PRC, North Korea and Pakistan (a country with lots of nukes, an extremely shaky regime, high levels of popular support for Islamist groups such as Al Qaeda and a history of supporting terrorism). Not only that, but the compelling argument that we should just not let Iran get nukes (would perhaps a firm "no", or a timeout suffice?) has totally convinced me of the power of wishes. The scales have fallen from my eyes, lord a-mighty I'm free at last. Good to hear your coming around. just to educate your really quickly: 1. MAD was a good deterrent for the ruskies - whereas Armageddon is a desirable part of the deal for the Imams in Iran. 2. North Korea already has 'em (didn't you know?) 3. Pakistan's leadership hasn't expressed the desire for Armegeddon. 4. Airstrikes can set back the research in Iran. Game, Set, Match. Now go back and study for your next post - I am wiping the floor with you in my down time while you scurry around the internet looking for creative lefty new ways to rationalize letting an Armageddonist kook get nukes. North Korea has nukes yes, therefore rhetoric of peace talks and disarmament. Lybia denouced terrorism (or so they say) Pakistan supports terrorism, this country should be invaded after Saudi Arabia. Airstikes will just accelerate the death of Isreal. And possibly the whole middle east. Axis of EVIL indeed. Black Dog is always studying, he is trying to devise away to teach the blind in this world. Also I know for a fact that Black Dog has offered much more substance to this forum than you have Jerry, like come the hell on, look at this post for example. A one liner jab about shit that was debunked last year. Oh sure you owned the Black Dog... Jerry Sienfeld is a poster about nothing.

Not just yet. I will wait for some more global warming. I find the waters a bit chilly right now.

So what facts do you know about EMP ?? I thought I came of ass insane to my friends to saying that there was some government involvement in 9/11, but you make me look totaly sane. You make me want to change my beliefs in the 9/11 inside job angle. Juse for the way you present it all. Pompous like. Nose up in the air like. If you stick with only facts, then you don't have many facts. Much of this is speculation, as is with the official story. Both have some holes you could fly planes through. Do you know the difference between a conventional weapon and an EMP weapon?? Do you know that they are fundamentaly different? (well except the case of a nuclear weapon. So what did happen on that plane? An EMP type engine would render the plane useless. A pulse engine is different from an EMP device. Show me your facts. SHOW ME YOUR FACTS !!!!

One common trend in subversive activities is to use the country, or allies of the country, of whom you are having a conflict with, weapons. The US and Israel did a great job of sourcing USSR weapons to send to the Muj in Afghanistan. So, for Iranians to try to source US, Brit, shells would not be unheard of. That said, Iran did lots of trade with the US for Weapons prior to the revolution and during the Iran Contra Affair. As you can see weapons trade involves lots of unscrupulous activity. This Iranian report isn't yellow cake. It is just overblown hype, that has gotten out of hand. The military has seen an increase in these kinds of weapon attacks. They are going to see lots more. But when some of those reports, even the CBS report said the weapons were of Iranian origin. The design of the weapons were Iranian (something about the tailfins on rockets being welded on instead of casting). Now that sounds strange to me. So Iranians would make bombs with a certain manufacturing process that would trace it back to Iran and use plain of English writting on the bombs. OK so then if the bombs came from the US back in the 80s, would they not say that the bombs are of US origin, but the intel shows that they were made in the US, this still has many questions about it. It just does not make sense to me. Someone is lying, and going by the USs rhetoric before Iraq (and we know what happened next) I will take everything the US says with a bucket of salt. Gotta cover up that bad taste in my mouth somehow. Or did I just throw up a little in my mouth. Madmax Nope, it won't stop it one damn bit. And with so much ADD going on in this world, they won't even remember they were lied to 5 years ago about Iraq. Maybe it will take another 9/11 for the people to really get galvanized behind the war on terror.

Jerry Yeah, it was called a meteor. Some big rock from space smashed into the planet causing instant climate changes to the entire planet. So are we going to be wiped out by some large space rock? Is that how we find out the hard way as well?? When you use analogies like this, you really need to clarify how you are using that analogy. I think you just picked it out and stated it. Eventhough dinosaur extinction and global warming are two different events that have really nothing to do with each other.

That is not what was said. The question is that would a high powered explosive going off in an airplane cause an EMP pulse. I don't know. It certainly would behave like a pulse jet engine. It would depend on what type of explosion occurred. Most conventional bombs do not give off EMPs, or if they do, they are not that strong to effect any electronic systems. Nuclear weapons definately give off an EMP because of the nature of the explosive. You can devise an 'EMP bomb' and not have it do any physical damage, but the EMP blast can be effective. If it was a conventional bomb then the plane would have been destroyed in the air. If it was an EMP bomb, then the result of the EMP blast would have rendered the plane useless. The plane would become nothing but an unpowered uncontrolled missle. All electronics (if not encased in very thick lead, kind of like the black box, which I doubt would still survive a good EMP blast) would be instantly fried. Impossible to control any large commercial aircraft without electronicly controlled FWB (fly by wire).

Welcome and first real the rules before making another post. Provide links and use the quotes.

It's like he tooks this out of a pagebook written by the Neo-Conservatives (aka your current USA Administration) Fear sells. Global warming is not something we really need to worry about. The earth will balance itself out long after we are gone. Maybe the earth is sick. Maybe it wants to purge us from the planet for we are making it sick. Mother nature will deal with us eventually. Climate change will always happen. The Sun is the major factor in all our weather. Ice ages have come and gone. Not worries too much about this. Why is the left the ones who are ECO-NAZIS. Wealth distribution?

EMP Pulse Engines don't exist. Or if they do, they have no application for standard flying. If the engines always let out an EMP then the whole plane would shut down because of the pulse. The first thing to be affected would be the plane on the tarmac when it fires up the engines. Resulting in going nowhere. All the electronics would become useless in the airplane. So eventhough I think 9/11 was allowed to happen or to an extent carried out by the US government, this theory of EMP engines is just absurd. You lost me again Polynewbie. So how can one contain an EMP ??? Can it?? No. Also as someone with flying experience (never went for my license) controlling a plane without the tail is impossible. Even with the tail still in tact, the plane would have been a one in a million shot of comming out of thatg spiral dive. When I was flying, you were trained to get out of a spiral dive. So I had to purposly put the plane into a spiral dive in order to know how to get out of it. First thing is you put FULL POWER to the plane. Since you are spiraling down, pulling back on the stick will get you nowhere. You need to generatge lift on the wings, which really is not happening in a spiral dive. Full power then you straiten out the plane and come out of the dive. This will cause a good deal of stress on the airframe. I went into the spin at 10,000 feet, 15 to 20 seconds later after comming out of the dive, I was at 4500 feet. That was in a little Sesna 160 Aerobat (I think) So a commercial jet airliner would have been a fucking bitch to get out of one of those dives. An experienced pilot would still have great great difficulty with it.

Jerry Well yeah, fear the nuclear weapon. Fear what it can do. Fear who actually had it at that time. I don't see how two cities in Japan were militaristic. Pearl Harbour must have been some civilian place right?? Wilber Once that secret weapon no longer became a secret, Pandora's Box was opened. We are still feeling reprocussions from that day. My father/brother could have easily been killed in many other situations comming home from the war. Trip fallen on a ship and broke his neck falling down some stairs. That weapon does not guarentee anyone comming home alive, no matter what side you are on. Jerry Actually, we would like to get rid of all the nuke weapons on the planet. BUT seeming that some countries will NEVER give up their weapons, it does not make sense for others to go without. Both the USA and Russia have more than enough nukes to themselves to obliterate the planet. And you are worried about one guy who would like at least ONE nuclear weapon?? Kind of hypocritical right? If I must go without, then you must as well, to make it even. Only then will you have any sense of morality. Or you would look like a lying cheater. And who really likes lying cheaters anyways.

Loaded poll. Saudi Arabia, then Pakistan. Then the United States :}

Newsmax? Oh yeah, they're reliable. Kind of a convenient time for this little bit to come out. I wonder why CNN and FOX and CBS and MSNBC are not reporting this. Figuring this would no doubt quell the minds of the masses with questions of the pre-war Iraq intelligence. On some days they say the intelligence was failed/handpicked On some days they say the intelligence was right on the money On some days they say the intelligence was failed/handpicked On some days they say the intelligence was right on the money back and forth..... why does this even need to happen? Stick with one fucking story and GO WITH IT... why do they constantly need to change what is said on a daily basis.... http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/02/16/...in2485525.shtml and this wonderful bit So, like they say, you can't have it both ways. Also check CBS's website for the video titled ..... ........"Pentagon: Faulty Intelligence "................... So who is right B.MAX ???

Canadian Blue I have had one friend do two tours in Afghanistan. Another who is still there. An uncle of mine went over on a civilian contract. He never left the compound. I know these people gave their lives to the county. But I do not want them dying for a lost cause. Canadian Blue, you would be missed if something happened to you. We are all saddened by the loss of our soldiers, so one way to releive that pain is to bring them all home and say that this was not a good idea to begin with. Just because someone has not signed up for the military, we cannot sacrafice something? While those men and women are dying, we are fighting to bring them back home. yes we support our troops, just not the mission.

Leafless Job loss? Our jobs are going to the Europeans? I thought they were going to India, China, Mexico, Bangladesh, ect ect...... So by North American corporations expoting jobs to those countries mentioned. I really don't see how jobs are being lost to Europeans.

Borg I find myself thinking and feeling the same way. My personal conflict was that I never really went with my gut feeling. Now I do. My gut tells me more that I think I know. Now I listen to it closely. Those gut feelings are rarely wrong. This is interesting to me. I have found myself with a little cloud over my head when people say 'well what can I do about it....' and then nothing more happens after that. 'Yah, but whattaya gonna do.?!' Something else besides sitting on your ass and saying ''Yah, but whattaya gonna do.?!" I think it is time to put some fear back into the government where it came from. The Canadian people own this country, not the politicians. This is your home too, get involved.

leafless Actually it was up to the Bush Administration and the CIA/Intelligence services to proove to the world that there WAS wmd's. If you say something, like SADDAM HAS WMDs!, you better have the evidence to back it up. But they don't have any evidence to back it up. So basicly this argument is no longer valid. It was all lies. Or are you aware of what a LIE really is? Have they been found yet? No. Was the intel before the war sound? No. Why do I have to proove to YOU that there were none. It was the Bush Admin and Co that told us there were WMDs. (fuck, this shit is getting old with you people) It was up to them to proove to us that Saddam had WMDs. So after the invasion, well 2-3 years later, they are not even looking for this 'smoking gun in the form of a mushroom cloud' evidence. Bush and Co said - Yes there are weapons. None were found. And eventually they stopped looking for this 'slam dunk' evidence. Any of this getting through at all?? Also if the plan in 1998 was to oust Saddam, then why even say he HAS WMDs, when you intel clearly showed there was no real solid proof. Remember those so called undergroud bunkers Al-Qaeda has? I wonder why they have not mentioned anything else of that. So by this 1998 resolution, the USA planned to go into Iraq at some time. All that crap leading up to the invasion in 2003 was just hogwash bullshit to get the public on board for the war. Those who don't have a sharp mind may get bogged down in all this 'evidence' that the Bush Administraion has said existed. If they lied about that, what else could the Bush Administration have lied about? This leaves things pretty open does it not? So by all the fuckups that happened before the war in Iraq, all the lies to get into the war, the lies AFTER the war, and the lies about the current situation with Iran... HEY WAIT A MINUTE... was there another resolution in the US about Iran?? Similar to the 1998 Iraq plan?? I bet it exists somewhere. I just got to find out to see if the evidence is actually there. Or else I am just speculating.

Leafless On that issue, why are they also just as quiet on SPP.Gov and the North American Union? If this was such a good thing for the US, then all the talking heads would be saying something about it. But you hear little to none of it on MSM. On CNN I had seen a piece with Lou Dobbs essentialy with a look on his face of bewilderment of why this is not a bigger story than it is. Also this... Your initial post for this thread did not have ANY links at all. You are as guilty of this as her, right here and now. Care to dispute that? And for all we know the European Union is hated by the populations of the member states involved. Never see that either in western MSM either.

Thats has always been my thoughts too, and he has admitted about the old intelligence. Wonder what people hope to gain by continually posting the same crap over and over again. Maybe you should talk to the Commander in Chief about THAT one there. The Bush Administration say the same bullshit over and over again. Most of it which is lies or purposeful misdirection. And we repeat our arguments to show how hypocrtitical the current administration is. Shows how much people actually pay attention in this ADD world. It is for those ADD'ers that we repeat the same things over and over again, hoping HOPING SOMEDAY we will get through to you with the 'facts' that are displayed for us all to see. Bush and company have already seeded the 'Iran is Bad' into the subconcious of the American population. So they can say the weapons are comming from Iran, which .. hehe, will turn out to be false. Mark this post for that occasion. And make a note somewhere for the ADDers might forget about ... LET'S GO RIDE BIKES !!!!

Does anyone recall the fuel shortage of the early 1970's in the United States? How can anyone (like the USA) criticize Iran with how they do their stuff, when there was a fuel shortage at that time? I guess someone did not forsee the downturn (actually it seemed to have beenb predicted in the 20's and 30's about the oil shortage in the 70's). Canada is using much of it's natural resources to get some of that oil out of the Alberta oil fields. Natural gas is used to heat the oil to extract it from the dirt. Overall this produces a net loss in overall energy output through oil. Using up too much natural gas to extract the oil, then using machines that use oil to work in order to get the oil out of the ground. Just seems like an overall net loss in consumable energy. Leafless Well the Iranians never said it was for military purposes. They have always claimed it was for civilian use. So you really cannot bitch about that part. marcinmoka Maybe they discovered other scientific methods of getting nuclear energy. Possible?!? Indeed. Iran at best in my estimates are about 5 years away from getting enough nuclear material to make ONE bomb. Chances are they would test that bomb to make sure their science is sound. Or else things go wrong. So, I am going to bring up North Korea here. Why have they not been invaded since they stated they have a nuclear weapon? Nothing but 6 party talks to get NK to stop. The US knows they cannot deal with NK alone in this aspect, so it has to present the threat to the rest of east Asia is order to get things done. Why was North Korea nothing but diplomatic talks and Iran it seems to be about the push to war. I guess strategicly/economicly/resources NK does not have anything the United States want's. Considering it is an AXIS OF EVIL (muuaaaahahahaha) along with Iran, should they not face the same scrutiny? Or is this another matter of botched up.... correction SEXED UP INTEL which later turns out to be false?

Leafless So if they had this plan to go in, and these were the real reasons, why did they tout the WMD line for so long??? Simply lying and passing the buck, and confusing everyone. Also that list seems to have been in reverse order Securing the oil feilds was the first item on the agenda. Funny how they stopped looking for the slam dunk wmd materials, north, south, east , west somewhat of Bahgdad. Just more smoke and mirrors.

All those who think Saddam had a snowballs chance in hell of getting a nuclear programm up and running, really need to learn some history. And not the history the winners provide. leafless What hegemony does Iran have? What way are you using the term 'hegemony' ?? I think your common sense chip is busted in that robot brain of yours. Head down to the shop for a firmware update please. Most of whom had never contributed troops to the battle. Just a pat on the back as you go. Not even money came from these other countries. Seemed like only the US, UK, Australia, Italy, Spain contribited troops to the battle. Most have pulled out now. OH CRAP ALMOST FORGOT ABOUT POLAND !!!! You are quite right about this. He had nothing to do with it. Just prepared the troops for war to move on the word of the President 'LET'S ROLL !!' Scriblett And you expect to find peace among the residents of the Middle East by doing just that? Since is has worked SO WELL in the past? Wake up. Really wake up. The internal conflicts in most of you 'right wingers' must be fantastic and dramatic. Knowing the lies are lies and the invasion of Iraq was the wrong plan, but yet touting and toting the official dogma comming out of the current administration. Manic depressives??? Stop being one of the duped.

Figleaf This is an interesting question is it not? Leafless Apparently they do not know the definition of FREEDOM either. Hmm sectarian violence.. ahh hell with it, call it what it really is. A CIVIL WAR !!!! but [common sense deleted]. I must state that freedom and democracy and change in general comes from within. NOT from without. If Iraq wanted to change that bad, they would have done that years ago before the US went in. Saddam would have been ousted by his own people. That would have been termed a revolution. Maybe this is their revolution.