Rue

"There is no God but Allah. Muhammed is the messenger of God." Just to explain what Dog refers to its the above saying which is known as the Shahada and Dog singles it out because many believe only a Muslim will state this . The term "THE" before the word messenger is interpreted to read that ONLY Muhammed is the true messenger of God, no different then when Christians put the word "THE" before the word "saviour" or "messiah" or "son of God" when referring to Jesus. It is the first of 5 pillars (fundamental beliefs) of Sunni Muslims. It is the most common and so important of statements Muslims make and supposedly devout Muslims say it to their newborns and on the deathbed of those on their way out. Interestingly its the words on the Saudi Green flag in white on top of the white sword. It is said if you quote the above with conviction that is all you need to convert to Islam, which is why many say when Trudeau recited openly that is what he did. Did he do that to pander to Muslims or because he really converted? Lol I suspect the former not the latter but technically a Jew or Christian or believer in any other religion should not say it because its intent is to exclusively select Muhammed as THE no. 1 messenger. To be fair it does acknowledge other prophets, but none at the same level of truth or righteousness as Muhammed, so Jews who practice Judaism would not say that since they are still waiting for the messiah. Christians wouldn't say it since they believe Jesus is the messiah or messenger of messengers. So its a controversial phrase to be sure if you are not Muslim and say it. Now me I believe anyone, I mean anyone is a messiah or messenger of God and we were all "born" from God and sent to try heal the world. That makes me a form of Kabbalist Jew or what others call Gnostic Christians, Taoists, Buddhists, certain kinds of other Eastern religions were we believe God is not a person but an abstract approximation for a source of energy we believe travels infinitely and mutates in expression and form. We believe there is a point where all and nothing are one and the same and from that point all and nothing decides to share itself by creating from a portion of itself a detached form of its energy which in turn does the same and an infinite wave or progression of dettachments then cascades creating infinite numbers of universes and life forms. This believe expressed in most religions is reserved for the mystics, the elders who evolve passed the literal meanings of words and the perceptions of the five senses in our material world which these mystics would call illusions, mistaken constructs caused by the distortion of our material world that leave sus to believe that which is can only be of our 5 senses say so. Now when you get into fundamentalist Islam like fundamentalist Judaism or Christianity, we don't go into discussions about God as an abstract notion of the infinite movement of energy-it says rooted in tales of humans and lessons through Moses, Jesus, Muhammed. Its only when you become a mystic Jew and unlock the Kaballah or are a mystic Christian sworn to the secrecy of the inner lawyer of elite Jesuits or perhaps a rare sect of Suddis or Wahabi Muslims do you get into this mystical world of abstract energy flow as in animistic or aboriginal belief systems or Hinduism, Buddhism, Taoism or certain Martial Arts disciplines. Its probable there are very deep profound mystical Muslims who have transcended the Koran's literal words as Jews and Christians have but we common folk would never know. As for this chant its a faith creed. It is similar to the one in Judaism that says "Here oh Israel, the Lord our God, the Lord is one." or affirmations by Christians in prayer about Jesus being The So of God and all salvation must be through belief in him and his purpose. I treat all humans as having originated from the same source of energy so I would not declare the second part of the saying. In discussions I would say Muhammed, Jesus, are considered equally as divine by their respective followers and in that sense infallible. In Judaism Rabbiahs, learned scholars, are fallible and to be questioned. The expression "messiah" is taken by the majority of religious Jews to literally mean one person who has yet to come. For non religious Jews or modern Jews, like modern Christians or very progressive modern Muslims, we don't read messiah to be one person, just a figurative expression of the potential in all of us to do good and therefore heal or save the world or do bad and injure it. So in that sense it makes us both good and evil not just one or the other, which is ironically in physics what is claimed to make energy-negative and positive poles clashing. The negative and positive poles some believe was made into a coded reference as Adam and Eve. Either that or we are all inbred and that would explain why the planet is full of crazy humans.

I hear all this talk about missiles yes. All it takes is one North Korean with a nerve agent to fly to Canada or the US ad let off a deadly virus. So I wonder is this missile stuff just a cover story? I never understood in this day and age with what we know about viruses and deadly contagious agents we are still talking about inaccurate, clumsy missiles. Maybe its chemicals the US is really worried about. How would we know?

I hate him but with due respect he was brought up by his father as a Jesuit Catholic and remains one. Trudeau is what we call a Liberal PUTZ. He thinks the best of everyone. He's naïve. He grew up in a sheltered environment and learned things from a rich elitist perspective where the only Muslims he knows are filthy rich and go to the same clubs and have trust funds just like him and fly him for Christmas to extravagant resorts. His photo ops with Syrian refugees are followed by use of anti-septic hand wash off screen. . He is an air head. He has no clue about Islam other than a superficial romantic version of it. His brother Sasha is an interesting take Sasha travelled to Iran and did a pro Iran documentary with full support of the Iranian regime, It was a dead ringer for a Goebels WW 2 Nazi propaganda film. Trudeau is pro any minority he thinks will get him re-elected. He uses Muslims no different than anyone else. He panders.

It is practiced that way in many Muslim countries and within terror cells. However its also has been used by Amidyah or Ismaili Muslims to be peaceful and tolerant. I would say it certainly can be the way its practiced and how its used to justifying the current slaughter of fellow Muslims, or against Israel or Kurds, Bahaiis, Christians, etc.. However I would be reluctant to say that in a way that excludes and ignores those Muslims who have chosen not to use it that way, and in fact put their lives on the line of challenging it being used that way I.e., the university students of Iran fighting their regime as one example. I also can not say that about the Beduin Arabs who defended Israel's right to exist and still do and died for that in past wars or who along with Muslim Israelis now join the IDF. I can not say that about the Muslims in Jordan who donated land for kibbutzim for holocaust survivors who fled to Israel and some who were killed for doing so. I can not say that about the Muslims who fought side by side Jews in the Palestinian regiments of the British Army during WW2 against the Nazis. I can not say that about Anwar Sadat a devout Muslim who openly admitted his government and he himself followed Nazism and used it as a model for the Egyptian government-he came to reject that and die for doing just that. I can not ignore rightreous Muslims who support the right of Israel to exist and are progressive and reject the literal concept of kafirism. Righteousness as its defined at Yad Vashem is blind to religion and lists many Muslims. That's the definition I use. There are foe example 63 Muslim Albanians on that righteous list who helped save Jews in WW2. How about Selhatin Ulkumen the Turkish Muslim Governor-General of Rhodes who in 1944 lied to the Nazis and passed off Jews as Turkish nationals so the Nazis could not deport them to their death? So for me I agree with you but I was taught as a Zionist to balance the discussions on Islam saying, learn it, read it, understand how its used as a weapon but also understand how it was used in a method to save Jews as well. I also know better to say anything that would lump righteous Muslims in with Muslim extremist Jew haters. Can't do that. Can't deliberately say something that I know would smeer good Muslims. Its not right and no more right than saying that about Israelis, Zionists, Jews, and Christians. I could spend pages on Christians who collaborated with Nazis. I prefer to spend it on the righteous Christians on the Yad Vashem list who died or put their lives on the line for us. The righteous as we were taught were always a minority but proved you don't have to be the majority to do what is right and leave a legacy of hope not destruction behind. So that said I will challenge how people use Islam. All the problematic verses in the Koran can be reinterpreted as Muslims evolve past their literal interpretation of it. Will that happen soon. Oh hell I am no Pollyanna I aint holding my breath but the fact there are progressive Muslims doing it means I ally with them. I can't expect them to honour my people's right to be a collective if I can not do the same with their people I am also not about to let a handful of anti Israel pissantes on this board claim a monopoly on how Muslims feel about Israel. They have no clue. They still work on the idiotic premises that we LOOK different. I wish I had Moe-Zuz, G-Zuz and Moe Hamed, here today now lined up at a police station. No witness could pick them out. They all look like Axel Rose.

I would think the Charter will prevent the discrimination you fear at a government and public level. In regards to what happens at a private one on one level that I can not say. I also would say this, history has shown us democracy has limits. If there were numerous Muslim extremist terrorist attacks in Canada, the suspension of freedoms we take for granted under the Charter is possible in the name of peace, order and good government, a Charter clause. I personally think for Muslims to fear being mass arrested and persecuted in Canada at one level is no different in subjective belief than those non Muslims who fear imminent terror attacks from Muslims. Both constitute fear based on speculation fueled by current events. I am not in the business of telling a Muslim any more than I am a gentile or a Jew what they should fear or not fear. I can only express my own subjective opinion which is no better than anyone else's and say the enemy is within our society-he/she is already here and no amount of worrying will change that. What I would say is we are now in a war of attrition world wide but its conflict fought by shadow people. By that I mean the war is not a distinct, visible and specific battle with two clear visible enemies for the most part engaging in open warfare. It's a never ending war of attrition where terrorists are invisible dressed to blend into their environment and be able to strike by surprise and engage in isolated unconnected acts deigned to cause a psychological reaction of shock and horror which then translates into a group anxiety or feeling of constant vulmerability and inability to feel secure in the face of terrorism. Conventional wars won't top this. In fact the tactics now used by Muslim extremists are no different than a modern up date of the psychological war the Viet Cong engaged in to neutralize conventional US armed forces. Do more and more, we have to train invisible soldiers, special operatives moving in fast, small teams striking as quickly as terrorists and disappearing after their work as done just as quickly as terrorists hit and run. Canada does this right now in Iraq and none of us reallhy know what they do. The conventional armies have become a smoke screen for special ops who engage in the real anti terror wars and none of us or the press know about. So the fact is the invisible war is here. Its a cat and mouse game between terrorists and these special ops and you and I have no clue the extent of their geographic regions of battle or the tactics they use. Because of that reality I do not fret over it. It is wasted emotion. So are for me the words of politicians exploiting fear to get votes. I grew up in a neighbourhood and in a school where no one said a damn thing if someone called me a dirty Jew or picked a fight over it and pulled out the chains or knives and baseball bats. No government gave a damn. learned I was on my own-I did not assume anyone had my back except maybe my brother. I , picked my battles.I didnn't respond every time-just sometimes-enough to send a message I would and could fight. I hated fighting. Still do...but now and then had to. I day to Muslims in Canada, compared to living in Muslim countries you have a chance-you have the chance to reach out to non Muslims and form coalitions. You have the chance to use the gift of free choice and speech to speak out and denounce terror, intolerance and violence and when you do-each time you do, it will make a difference and win over people. In the interim I would say to Muslims, do not mistake my animosity and war against terrorism with all Muslims. Speak out and I will hear yiu,. Stay silent and yes I may mistake that as condonation of terrorism. That may not be fair but all we minorities face that reality.

Jacee you need to watch the latest Star Trek. It has promise. That said get out of outer space and come back to this thread. Islamophobia is an undefined concept that suggests certain comments or discussions or references to Islam are hateful. How would one know if the words or discussions or references to Islam are hateful unless they examine the contents of those words? The very right to criticize Islam comes under scrutiny when the term Islamophobia might be used to shut down legitimate criticism of Islam. When I deal with Dialamah on the subject she does not claim to me I can not discuss or criticize Islam. I think what she has said to me consistently is that the line for when such criticism is crossed and goes from legitimate criticism to negative stereotypes of all Muslims inciting violence is a concern for her and othersand she frames the concern no different than I do anti-Semitism. As well it is nonsensical to say people may practice their religion aa they choose in Canada. Absolute nonsense. Muslims can not have more than one wife. Certain Christians and certain Mormons have been told they can not have more than one wife. People in the name of their religion can not beat their wives or children and ignore existing criminal and family law. There are most certainly restrictions to our religions. If someone in the name of their religion do not want to hire a gay or lesbian or someone of a faith they believe is unworthy, they will face a law suit for discrimination and violation of human rights. You don't like abortion, you can march and speak out about it, but you don't have the right to shoot doctors performing it in clinics. Part of being a democratic society is engaging in constant dialogue as to what we as a society and as individuals find acceptable and compatible. Its a constant process. At a basic rudimentary level this issue comes down to politeness. Can I debate Islam respectfully and can they debate Judaism or Christianity, etc., respectfully. Respectful debate is not the problem-emotional hateful debate is. Where one ends and the other begins is the million dollar question and I don't believe government should regulate that determination-I think it has to be decided for and by the people at a grass roots level in neighbourhoods, community centres, workplaces, inter-faith, inter-cultural and other situations where people of different back-grounds come together because of a common interest and usually it takes a flood or fire or gag shooting to do that and sometimes entertainment events or sports or art. I worry because where I live I see concentrated cultural-religious-ethnic ghettoes. The people in them are using the messages of feel good liberals like Trudeau to believe it is their right to remain unassimilated-he sends an unrealistic message that minority groups are welcomed without limits. He does not set limits because he believes its politically unpopular and would negatively impact on his ability to get their votes. Politicians don't say what has to be said, they say what they think gets votes and Trudeau is a classic example of this when it comes to Islamophobia something he allowed an MP to raise as a partisan political gesture that I would argue divides people and breeds resentment against Muslims and does not help them in fact it stigmatizes them and defines them as victims. Islam presents a unique problem in that intrinsic to its message is the lesson that non Muslim believers are inferior. Until the time the concept of defining non Muslims as kafir is rejected by mainstream, Islam. it will be at odds with our basic, fundamental democratic values of equality So all I can say and I repeat it again, at a grass roots level, we need to reach out and encourage and form alliances with progressive Muslims who reject the concept of khafir and encourage them to stand strong against fundamentalist Muslims rather than lump them in with extremist Muslims.

Lol Dog you asked me about Koran passages? Me a Muslim scholar. Uh no But I have read the Koran so I do know there are numerous passages in the Koran and the problem is the Koran is a mess, it doesn't flow in a chronological order. You have many of the final comments of Muhammed which contradict his earlier comments not at the end or after the ones he contradicts, but many times before them defying an easy way to find out what means what. Also Arabic is a fluid language. Its like water, It flows in meaning and its easily taken out of its actual context or flow because one word can mean so many different things. Also there is no uniform code of reference to call upon to assist when reading it or commentaries like you have from Christian or Jewish scholars explaining the Bible words. This means you can easily have Muslim extremist terrorists focus on the passages they like and ignoring the rest. Also yes it is absolutely true, the Koran talks of Islam being superior to the other religions, spends I think its 60% of its content on defining what to do with non believers, and is full of comments that define non believers in very intolerant ways. an dyes, at this time probably a majority of Muslims are not at a level to see more than one fundamentalist version of what the Koran says and take it literally as to non believers which would no promote inter faith tolerance if that is your point. That said there remain some archaic and violent references in the Bible quoted by haters as well. There are some peaceful passages like this: Honor each other: "O mankind! We created you from a male and a female and made you into nations and tribes that you may know and honor each other (not that you should despise one another). Indeed the most honorable of you in the sight of God is the most righteous." Chapter 49, Verse 13 I Good and evil: "Whoever recommends and helps a good cause becomes a partner therein, and whoever recommends and helps an evil cause shares in its burden." Chapter 4, Verse 85 Reaction to evil: "Repel (evil) with what is better. Then will he, between whom and thee was hatred, become as it were thy friend and intimate. And no one will be granted such goodness except those who exercise patience and self-restraint." Chapter 41, Verse 34 and 35 Do good: "Be quick in the race for forgiveness from your Lord, and for a Garden (paradise) whose width is that of the heavens and of the earth, prepared for the righteous - Those who spend (freely), whether in prosperity or in adversity, who restrain (their) anger and pardon (all) men - for God loves those who do good." Chapter 3, Verses 133-134 Reward for righteousness: "Whoever works righteousness, man or woman, and has faith, verily, to them will We give a new Life, a life that is good and pure, and We will bestow on such their reward according to the best of their actions." Chapter 16, Verse 97 Acts of compassion: "And what will explain to you what the steep path is? It is the freeing of a (slave) from bondage; or the giving of food in a day of famine to an orphan relative, or to a needy in distress. Then will he be of those who believe, enjoin fortitude and encourage kindness and compassion." Chapter 90, Verses 12-17 Hell I know the above passages well. I used to throw them at Muslim extremists quoting the Koran during inter-faith peace talks or by those looking to write off the entire Muslim religion. Anyways Dog I know my brand of Labourite kibbutznik beliefs makes you gag so lol take some alka seltzer man. YahI am an Abba Eban- Rabin-Levni supporter and outed myself long ago. I have this to say about the inter faith dialogue. It happens when you least expect it. It works because the best thing we can do to prevent war and extremism is to demonstrate in our actions who we are. The other day was a story of an Israeli nurse breast feeding a Palestinian boy whose mother was in a serious car accident. The nurse put out a call and thousands of Israeli women volunteered to come breast feed him and yah some said no way the baby could end up a terrorist. The over-whelming majority of Israeli mothers however offered themselves. That to me is more powerful then any sob terrorist or extremist trying to teach Muslims hatred. I saw IDF soldiers do little things. Maybe it looks so small in the grand scheme of things, but I think every act of kindness and compassion no matter how small is revolutionary and getting people together breaks the barriers down and I don't trust governments to do tit. .

Thank you for the no bs answer. Much appreciated.

I edited and tried to answer your questions. I will tell you one sad answer I have no remedy for yet. I don't know how to discuss anti Semitism or anti Islam yet without it breaking own into a nasty hateful argument. Surely we have to have our governments encouraging inter faith tolerance. in a non partisan manner. More participation from inter faith councils is my best answer not mp's.

Very good points all fair but the protocol is not a law nor is it binding for that matter-its just an educational reference tool when encountering anti Semitism. There is no formal process implemented. Also I have to agree with you if you argue a study should happen first. I just wish they would have done that study and defined the word and then placed it in a non partisan protocol.

Thank you as always for your courteous reponse. Now you talked about the Ottawa protocol on anti Semitism in 2010. Thank you! Right on point. Actually you should It is a protocol that Canada agreed to sign in regards to dealing with anti Semitism, i.e., assisting universities when teaching the subject and let's be clear, criticizing Israeli state policies was not defined anti Semitism. With due respect though Dialamah its not a law. Had there been a protocol like that one drafted for Islam and if there is one I would be the first to sign it. The difference being the protocol is not a law but a researcg guideline and it does not lend to the appearance it is meant to be placed as a priority ahead of other forms of hatred with due respect-it actually says that. It was entered back into in 2010 and at the time it is true it had no reaction from civil rights people or as you see now with M103 precisely because it was not introduced by a Jewish member of Parliament although Irwin Cotler the Jewish member of Parliament ad McGill Law Professor then in the Liberal Party and Jason Kenney both spoke in favour of it and it was a non partisan issue.In my opinion it is the partisan involvement that has ruined any noble intent behind M103ag. I have to concede to it is my personal subjective bias against Trudeau initiating it and not say a neutral religious inter-faith council or progressive Muslim who was not an MP which bugs me. It is a good point you made though. Discussing or dealing with anti Islamic hatred should be done and encouraged by government as it did with that protocol and I think that protocol is one way to do it. although you can see that protocol was lip service because the BDS movement made it a mockery in universities across Canada. I just think such initiatives are better introduced by non partisan inter-faith councils. .

Dialamah do you deny Muslim extremists are the biggest threat to Jews. If so what is your proof they are not?

This country has a history of laws both federal and provincial that prevented free speech and singled out and discriminated against specific minorities. It happened because of the moral values of that day that made their way into the laws no different than trying to single out hatred of Muslims in M103. In fact in the exact same manner.

You are asking for people to give you definitive answers for a government that has not defined what Islamophobia is or what it means to hove the "heritage committee" a mandate to examine ways to implement and I quote "a whole government approach" to fighting Islamophibia". How do you expect anyone to give you a definitive answer or even a prediction when such words are deliberately left undefined and that is the crux of the issue. If I asked you go give me an answer as to why you do not think Muslim extremist ideology is spreading and inciting more terrorism to come surely your answer would be just as speculative and subjective. Asking open ended questions to issues that none of us have proper information on with due respect pointless.

To date Islamophobia has never been defined. It remains an open-ended definition that has not been defined or clarified. Because it remains open ended no one knows when criticism of Islam crosses the line to constitute Islamophobia and so certain people can use it the moment they see any criticism of Islamophobia to shut it down This is why Jaycee's comment that there can not be discussion of Islam is idiotic. Its the very discussion of Islam that could trigger this discussion and at the pith and substance of this debate is WHAT discussion of Islam crosses the line. The proper use of the word "phobia" can be found in the DSV, Psychuiatric Diagnostic manual used by psychiatrists to define phobias. In psychiatry, a phobia is said to be an anxiety disorder triggered by excessive fear of an object or situation. In this case the word is thrown out about it being an excessive fear of Islam. So it could mean discussing the religion, the religion itself, people who dress in attire associated with Muslims, fear of the Arabic language, etc. There is and has never been any objective criteria used to define it. In fact if you trace the origins of the word Islamophobia it comes from the Muslim Broherhood looking for a unique word to describe bigotry against Muslims. They saw how well feminists used the word "sexist", blacks, "racist", Jews, "anti-Semite" and gays "homophobic" and realized in the world of sound bites and today's journalism they needed a brand name that would immediately have people think-, 'Muslim hater". The question remains, why would the government of the day which represents all groups equally knowing that all forms of hatred in this country are EQUALLY as problematic single only one form out? What message did that selective focus on only one form of hatred lend to? Surely no government should play favouritism and single out only one form of hatred particularly when it remains unable to resolve its issues with native Canadians, who if anything in terms of legal priority have the oldest and longest standing legal issues still remaining in dispute. Trudeau himself went to Mosques and prayed with Imams who are extremist, racist, sexist and anti-Semitic. He did not choose a peaceful Imam or Mosque. Tell me....what mandate does this supposed "heritage committee" have to and I quote study how to enact " a whole of government approach" to supposedly fighting Islamophobia. What does "whole of government approach" mean? Not only do we still not have a definition of Islamophobia but now we have yet another buzz phrase with no definition,

You came on the forum and stated you have to use the text to talk feature with my posts. This coming from someone who said he does not read my posts. Yet you need th e text to talk feature. Do you go one response not contradicting yourself engaging in the very thing you claim you don't? Lol. Next you are spineless. You try bait me with the anti semitic slur that you have your text to talk feature using a New York Jewish accent because you find that entertaining. Now you come back and deny what you said was a taunt. All that shows is you are gutless. If you want to make anti semitic insults, coming back minutes later to try deny them means what? Other than you are gutless what does it mean? Do you think trolling and taunting establishes you as a victim? You think at this point when you put crap like that on the board other then to wet your own pants or maybe those of Kactus because I suspect you must be wearing the same panties what does it establish? That you are an idiot? That you have nothing you can debate me on so you lower yourself to being an idiot? In fact Sarah Silverman's sister is a Reform Rabbiah and both are active in the peace movement between progressive Israelis and Palestinians. Once again you show what an idiot you are. I also dont' need a neo Nazi talk to text to substitute for your idiotic words or an Iranian accent to substitute for Kactus's. The fact you need to ridicule Jewish accents says it loudly. By the way my accent is Montrealer. I sound like most English Montrealers whether we were Irish, Jewish, Greek, Wasp, etc. Hard as it is for your bigoted imagination to stereotype Jews in any accent but the New Work one, not all of us talk that way but I am glad you find it entertaining. I am sure you laugh at Muslim immigrant accents or what is it German accents? Now run along you clearly need attention and all I am hear to say is you once again never fail to prove what an ignorant Jew hater you are.

Lol. Speaking about being a compulsive liar, Kactus's attempt to ognore and deflect from his words about Saudi Arabia that I provided with this comment. "your proof means jack shit" does not make what he wrote vanish. But of course he does back pedal. For a man concerned with Islamophobia he had no problems calling for the US to ban Saudi Arabians or degrading all Wahabis. Hey now, imagine that. Lol. Next, of course he again repeats the bull shit canard that Zionism as a racist movement and says it is not indicative of hatred of Jews. To start it again shows how he turned this thread which was supposed to be about Netanyahu being racist against Israelis, to Zionism being racism attached to a continuing series of comments and positions by him denying Israel should be a Jewish state. Not only does he deflect again and try use this thread to deny Israel's existence and piss on Zionists but he does so after repeatedly accusing me and others of deflecting from the thread. He doesn't just lie, he again engages in the very actions he accuses me and others of, repeatedly/ Zionism does not define anyone let alone Jews as races. Kactus and the other anti Israelis on th is board have been asked to provide one document by Zionists that defines Jews as a race let alone a race superior to anyone else. They have not despite numerous requests because they can't-its an out and out lie.. Then again Kactus did engage in the anti semitic canard in an earlier response suggesting "the chosen people" refers to Jews feeling we are superior to others. That misstatement is of course testament to his deliberate anti Semitism and ignorance. The term chosen is a translation into English from Hebrew. It refers to a story told in the Bible that if Jews promised to worship God as a collective, God in turn would remember the Jews as a collective. Its an allegory for a covenant. Chosen only means by choosing collectively to God, God in turn chooses collectively back to Jews. No where in the Old Testament is a Jew described as a race let alone a superior one. Nowhere in the Torah, The Bible, The Talmud, The Kabal in any or all written essays by Rabbiahs has a Jew ever referred to another Jew as a race. This use of the word "chosen people" is repatedly used to try depict we Jews as believing we are superior. That is an anti semitic lie. It has no basis in Judaism or in any Jewih cultural or ethnic belief or value. In fact the Talmud goes into great detail explaining why we define others as equals and this is why unlike Muslims who define non Muslims as filthy and unworthy (kafir) spend 60% of the Koran explaining what to do with Kafir. Christianity still has a central precept that those who do not accept Jesus as saviour go to hell and can not be saved which is why so many try convert people or proseltyze. Modern Christians probably ignore such literal meanings these days. However the fact is the Muslim world openly is killing as we speak thousands upon thousands in the name of Muhammed and Allah stating the people being killed are infidel. Iran is one of the worst states in the world financing terrorists upholding this terrorist extremist belief and ironically you won't hear the Iranian mouthpiece Kactus admit it. Who Iran fund Syria, terrorists in Sudan, Yemen, across North Africa, Boca Raton, on and on-who Iran? In fact the concept of Jews being a race which you promote, was Hitler's creation-he defined us as an inferior race. Your using it makes you a parrot of Hitler. Your using it to lie and say its a concept of Zionism is bold faced lie. Kactus et al engage in this lie as can be seen by all their posts to delegitimize the right of we Jews to define ourselvesx as a collective. They took a thread supposedly accusing Netanyahu of being racist against fellow Israelis to be used as a pretext to engage in a pathetic script which denies Jews like Muslims or Christians or Hindus or anyone else the right to a national homeland and be an independent political collective expressed through a state, precisely because they believe Jews are inferior to Muslims and their Muslimr eligion has taught them we can not be equal to Muslims and thus own land let alone have a state just like Muslims have states. I have been on this forum long enough to know pathological anti Israel mouthpiecess when any of them are confronted and asked to provide one document that Zionism defines anyone by race they can not. They change the subject.. I do remember at one point, the scholar Hudson Jones suggested Israel’s Law of Return is based on racism. When advised over 240 countries have this same law including China, Ireland, Belgium, Germany, Itally, the Czech Republic, Ukraine, Slavic Republic, Estonia, Latvia, South Korea, Taiwan, Japan to name but a few he ran away as he always does with me only to surface responding to other issues. Jordan which was created by Britain illegally out of 90% of the land ear-marked for a Palestinian state, something none of the anti Israelis will acknowledge was in fact created as a Jewish free Muslim Palestinian state and until 1967 offered automatic law of return for Palestinians. It ended this arrangement after Arafat tried to kill King Hussein and Arafat was deported to Tunisia. It was only then after that failed seizure of Jordan, Arafat decided he was a Palestinian and began using that name as you use it now. Until then Palestinian extremists ridiculed the notion of Palestine being a nation and referred to it as part of a greater Muslim caliphate. The law of return which provides expedited application to become citizens to Jews was designed to provide safe and free haven for Jews to be able to flee anti-semitism and this is precisely what it had to be used for, for Jews escaping Ethiopia, (Felashies) or 750,000 of 900,000 Jews illegally cleansed and thrown out of the Arab League of Nations. In fact Zionism was a term invented by atheist Jewish socialists in trade unions in Europe and never defined Jews in a religious sense but in a political sense of gaining freedom through political suffrage no different then women fought to get their vote and independence and form their collective identity, or what blacks did in the US or gays have done in their community. In the case of Jews a state organ was created one step further than women or gays because the dhimmitude-the enforced apartheid of Muslims against Jews in the Muslim world and the holocaust in Europe made it impossible for Jews to continue to exist without a state guaranteeing its safety. The creation of Israel was an existential reaction to extermination and attempts at extinction through mass murder. I think quite frankly had gays suffered like Jews from an extensive holocaust as Jews did they would have been forced to creation an actual gay state. Certainly for Kurds, Armenians, Ukraines, Latvians, Estonians, Lithuanians, Czechs, Slobaks, Poles, Eire, Taiwan, Italy, the state is not just a state it safeguards those persons in other countries of the same national identity not just in its own countries, no different than Jews or Muslim states do with Muslims or the Vatican State does for Catholics or the Anglican State of England does for the English. The creation and existence of the State of Israel after centuries of persecution and isolation is a political and existential statement that we will stand and die as a collective and never again be second class or the target of planned genocide anywhere in the world. There is a place now when regimes attack Jews, where Jews can seek refuge and never again go through the bullshit bigotry and hatred of Islam sharia law or what happened in Europe. NEVER AGAIN. Israel’s uniqueness as a country which grants automatic citizenship to Jews (as well as their non-Jewish immediate family members) who seek to settle there is not about race. In fact non Jews are still eligible for citizenship provided they pass security clearances. I repeat again because it is public domain and legal fact, ndividuals ineligible for automatic citizenship under the Law of Return are eligible for Israeli citizenship under regular procedures equivalent to such requirements in other countries. However and what makes Kactus et al despicables liar and dishonest is they ignore that Arab League nation will NOT allows Jews citizenship or to apply for citizenship. In fact Mr. Abbas of the PA said the 500,000 ultra Orthodox Jews in the Hebron region of the West Bank who have lived their continuously for over 3,000 years and long before any Muslims and are genuine Palestinians, will be deported out of the West Bank when Palestine is created and he claims 2 to 8 million Palestinians who can not be Jews will be returned (even though they never lived there ) to Israeli for him to recognize Israel. In otherwords it too must become a Muslim Palestinian state. That is what he said. He also said until Jordan, Israel and the West Bank and Gaza are one Palesinian sharia law state, he would never stop his war with Israel. Hamas says the same thing but goes the step further saying it will kill these Ultra Orthodox Jews who ironically anti Zionist. In fact some of these Ultra-orthodox Jews were flown in by the Iranian government for its annual anti semite cartoon contests as part of holocaust denial festivities. In fact it is precisely because Zionism does not define any non Jew as inferior, the Bahaiis set up their head Temple in Haifa and the State of Israel's laws make Arabic an official language and protect and guarantee the right of non Jews, i.e., Christians, Muslims, Bahaiis, Druze, Beduins, atheists to own land and vote something no non Muslim h as in a Muslim country of the Middle East. A non Muslim still in Iran lives in fear and virtual house arrest knowing at any moment they could be killed or tortured and accused of being a Zionist supporter just like student activists for democracy, Bahaiis, Zoroastreans, gays, women, journalists, Kurds, ive in fear in Iran. I call Kactus out as an Iranian mouthpiece supporting a fascist regime that does not permit the very rights Israel affords all its citizens. I call Kactus out and state Iran is everything he falsely accuses Israel of. I also would point out the actual wording “Zionism equals racism” has its origins a passage created by the KGB and was used by the Soviet Union and Arab League of nations to pass a resolution at the United Nations on November 10, 1975. The former-UN Secretary General Kofi Annan described that resolution a low point in the history of the UN. That resolution was repealed on December 16, 1991 but pathetic mouthpieces like Kactus spewing pro Iranian mouthpiece propaganda still use it. All Zionism says is we Jews want our freedom guaranteed by a state organ. Nothing else. To say it defines Jews as a superior race, a special people, better than others is a blatant lie. Ask these lying anti Israel pissantes to produce one document from a Zionist defining a Jew as a race. Who Kactus provide one document from a Zionist defining us as a race-who Kactus? Has he ever come on this board and been able to back up one thing he has said?

Oh look another anti semitic slur. Who saw that coming. Lol.

Well its true that on March 24 in response to your soul brother Marcus you used the term "despicable regime" to describe Saudi Arabia in the Suspected Terrorist attack thread which could give you some wiggle room. Then on the thread regarding Trump banning certain Muslim states you stated on March 21 and 13 that Trump should ban the "real culprits" like Saudi Arabia, Egypt and UAE. So in that statement you were in favour of banning all Muslims from these countries rom going to the US. You preceded that with the same co mment, Feb. 14 and Feb.11. Now interestingly on the topic of the ban I stated the ban discriminated against all Muslims from all these countries and failed to distinguish between innocent and terrorist Muslims and therefore was inherently wrong and you agreed with me going so far as to complement me and saying I showed humility and was bang on and yet after your comment, then stated the above suggesting Saudi Arabia be put on the ban list. You started a thread entitled, "Why do we keep sucking up to the House of Saudi Arabia" and you referred to it as a barbaric regime and you blamed it for being responsible for terrorism but remain silent on Iran doing the same. My reading the totality of your comments in the Suspected Terrort Attack, Trump Travel Ban, Home Grown Terrorist, and Who Do We Keep Suckng Up To The House of Saudi Arabia thread which you initiated provided ample ammunition or content from you to show your dislike of not just the Saudi Arabian regime, but all Saudi Arabians by suggesting they all be put on the ban list. That suggesting they all be put on the ban list you can not back pedal on and suggest was only said for other reasons, but its there for all to read. You can not back pedal and say you only meant to discredit the Sau regime and not its citizens as well but you first responded to me and made the righteous statement we all should not smeer all Muslims in one category and then asked why Saudi Arabia, UAE and Egypt should not be put on the ban. You could have stated the process of selecting only certain nations that were Muslim was discriminatory. You did not, instead you singled out Saudi Arabia on Feb.14, Feb.11 for example AFTER you made a statement showing you understood banning any M uslim from any regime was discriminatory. You had no problem singling out Egypt, UAE and Saudi Arabia and that is because when reads your comments in their totality you make it evident you are a mouthpiece for the current Iranian regime and thus have a bias against Saudi Arabia even making a negative reference to all Wahabis. So you see your shit does stink. You generalize about Muslims as much as you accuse Argus of and complemented me for not doing at one point. You've made it clear as you stated you believe Saudi Arabia is a puppet of the US and ISIL. You criticize it, but not Iran your beloved country. Look you want to weasel and slip and slide and pretend you did not say what you did about putting all Saudis on the ban list go ahead. Explain it away but its there, and you knew from earlier comments you placed on the board this is wrong. Ironically you sided with me, and applauded me for arguing against a blanket Muslim ban in the US and then called for Saudi Arabia being put on the ban. Talk it away. Make it go away with back pedaling. Accuse me of twisting what you "really" meant, here is your problem-I do pay attention to each and every comment you make just s I do the comments of Eye or Ghost or Marcus. I am also prepared to produce the words or refer to them. Yah so I got it you calling Saudi Arabia a despicable and barbaric regime doesn't mean you hate Saudis just its regime. Yah I got it you only ate Wahabis no other Saudis. Oh I g ot it. You are an Iranian mouthpiece. No more, no less. You spew what ever biases come out of your mouth which you think supports the current Iranian regime's positions. You support a regime that is as much a fascist police state as Saudi Arabia. You support a regime that imprisons and tortures Muslims and non Muslims, has engaged in a war to try wipe out Kurds, Bahaiis, Zoroastrians, discriminates and tortures journalists, students, trade unionists, feminists and gays. You support a regime that in the name of its version of Islam through a religious council terrorizes and brutalizes Muslims and non Muslims and finances as much if not more terrorism than Saudi Arabia. You only choose however to shit on Israel and use Saudi Arabia to do so calling Saudi Arabia an ally of Israel while ignoring Iran's support of the brutal regime in Syria and its support of the brutal Hezbollah in Lebanon. You support Iran which continuously violates the sovereignty of other nations. Yet you have the audacity to pose on the Islamophobia site as being concerned about anti Muslim comments while you spew them about Egypt, Saudi Arabia, UAE and Wahabism and continue to do so. The difference is and they can speak for themselves, but myself, Argus, Dog , Godess all have very distinct opinions but we use the same standard of criticism against all Muslims, Hews, Christians. We despise anyone who is an extremist and terrorist whereas you support Iranian ones. Now excuse me but I have to go into a meeting. The Rocket Man and Donald are at it again and Melania is about to cause all kinds of trouble over negative comments about her dress.

Stop what? Oh you mean my poetry? Now really. It flows from my heart. Seriously!

No as I said what you just wrote was smug. When I respond its to manifest ridicule and contempt. Go use a dictionary and stop relying on your translator. Look up the word contemptuous.

The above is a lie and anyone can find the words. How about you have the balls to reproduce them. Hmmm? You lie so much now its a joke. Do you think if you deny what you have written it just goes poof? Everytime you lie and I produce the words showing your lie, your pathetically claim the words were twisted. You are a joke Kactus. You don't have the balls to stand up and admit what you said, what you really feel about Jews and Israel. That makes you a passive aggressive jihadi wannabee pissante. Now like I said do yourself a favour run and hide from me like Altai and Marcus or reduce yourself to a blithering dolt when responding to me like Ghost, I really don't care. Oh wait I here a rhyme Oh Shazzam? I just heard a kablam why its cactus's words defining Jews and Kurds you see Kactus knows no not that nose

In fact I h ave not diverted an y topic to the issue of Jews, you, Altai, Marcus, Ghost, Eye and Hudon Jones did. The thread claimed Netanyahu is a racist against Israelis. Within one post it became a series of responses that all Israelis are racist against Israelis and Palestinians because they are Zionists and Zionists are racists and Zionism is racism and then the same old stale recycled bullshit mantra that Zionism is Racism was thrown up and on to this thread by you and them and you accused Argus of being a racist because he suggested there is in fact this group psychosis in the Middle East about denying Israel is a Jewish state and there remains an unresolved conflict to destroy it. You have shown that hatred in each and every one of your responses right down to making this a Jew thread through your choice of words over and over. I only respond to your shit. I have never initiated it. You show the classic method of using the pretext of using any thread on Israel to engage in anti semitic slurs against all Jews not just Zionists and Israelis. When you use THE Jews you show this blatant hatred. Most leftist a-holes on this board claiming they hate Jews make sure to sanitize it by putting the word Zionist in front of the word Jew. Ooops you slipped. The Cohen crack, right on cue. Who the phack do you think you fool coming on this forum hmmm? You think your entourage is civilized? You claim Israel pretends they are civilized. How about you? You think for one phacking second you are civilized? Lol. You are a hateful child who pouts because every time he tries to piss on Israel and Jews I challenge him. Zionist thug? Ooooh that hurts. Ouchy. By the way the "you started it" rationalization for your comments,, uh yah that was a brilliant argument. That sure told me. You respond now like a child sticking his tongue out at the big bad Jooooo. Thus I ridicule you and will continue to do so. Go back to your translator and find out the difference between being smug and showing someone contempt. You show smugness everytime you lecture me or anyone else not to do the very exercise you then engage in with your very next words. You also show how inconsistent you are. I show contempt for you. Go find out the difference.

In fact at no time have I ever placed a word on this forum stereotyping all Muslims in one negative category or as you as as a "bunch of herd". In fact you continuously do on this thread when referring to Jews, Zionists and Israelis. That makes you not just a liar but someone who engages in the very thing over and over you accuse me of. I produce your words, you don't provide a word from me. You in fact have no words from Argus saying all Muslims think the same. You inferred that is what me meant. Then you repeat that inference. I have stated and I repeat again you are a racist and a pathological liar as well as an anti semite. You again in this response suggest all Muslims "look different' and you know the difference. Explain it You have repeated this contention again and again and refuse to prove your point precisely because you are a lying coward. Go on explain the physical differences in what Muslims look like and how Jews look and how Jurds look and how Pakistanis look and how Ax=zari look. Finish your racist, bigoted contention. Point out the secondary physical characteristics of these people that nake them lok different. Finish what you started. Explain the differences. The genetic differences were never dispute, ever. You in fact deflected to try hide behind invisible genetic differenes to try defend and justify your attempt once again now to argue we Jews, Berbers, Kurds, Muslims, etc., look different. That makes you an ignorant bigot and so much of a bigot you repeat it over and over arguing if I challenge that and say stop defining Muslims by subjective physical features which is blatantly racist, you play victim and say that make sme a racist. How pathetic. How intellectually retarded, dishonest and bumbling you are. I love it. The composition of the Halogroup structure does not cause differences in "look". Any differences would be naked to the human eye looking at another's face or body. Now you can try twist your racism all you want but you are exposed. Your agenda on this board is to try incite physical difference in appearance between Muslims and Jews and Kurds, etc., because with difference, comes exploitation by you to fan the flames of hatred and ignorance between such peoples. You are nothing but a pissante-someone who sits hiding in a basement who has no clue who a Kurd, a Jew, a Berber is and would not know the difference between one and a Mexican or Pervian if they bit you in your ass.

I haven't got around to a list for people who are illiterate yet.