Rue

Why is it difficult for you to say some people engage in female circumcision because of their strong religious and cultural beliefs that come into conflict with existing Canadian laws and they choose their religious and cultural beliefs over the laws of Canada? How hard is that to say? Why do you avoid the connection and try skirt around it?

I am no sure why I bother to respond to such drivel but I will. The fact that Eye makes a Royal proclamation that he believes discriminatory views about the Islamic religion began after 9-11 speaks to his narcissism and elitism. He invents and pronounces his fabrications as truth all must follow. Of course discrimination against Islam or any religion started once the religions became practiced. Its what humans do. Humans who do not agree with a specific belief may do so for well thought out logical reasons or subjective emotional ones or a bit of both. There is no time line because Eye ball decides to arbitrarily draw one after 9-11. Next Islam is a religion no a race so his continuous attempt to refer to what he thinks are discriminatory assumptions about the Islamic religion have nothing to do with race. The problem though is people like Eye don't think. They spew mantra. They spew dogma without thinking about what they say. They use racism without thinking what Islamophobia is. They are hardly spokespersons for Islamophobia when they can't even understand the basic concept of what is being discriminated against. Next The second sentence again repeats Eye's delusion that he can blame the internal religious strife among Muslims that has gone on for thousands of years and long before the West as we know it on Canadians. He can stuff his stereotyping and blaming the West. That stereotyping and scapegoating the West is the very kind of ignorant discriminatort thought pattern he claims we Islamophobes engage in. He generalizes negatively and makes this idiotic assumption that Muslims don't create their own refugees the West did. In his world its all very simple. If anything goes wrong in an Islamic society, you blame it on the West. It can't possibly be Muslims let alone Islam tales responsibility for any violence. Isn't it interesting then because in his third sentence his accuses anyone who disagrees with him from disconnecting from the real problem-this coming from someone who attempts to scapegoat the West as the only reason Muslims kill one another let alone non Muslims. Talk about disconnecting from the real problem. Next he spews incoherent nonsense about :our" need for dictators to protect "ourselves" from the barbarous cultural practices of their victims. Someone need explain to Eye he is a privileged little rich boy who needs to leave his bubble. Someone needs to tell the little Prince that when females have their clitorises mutilated its not done by dictators. When Muslims stone each other its not done by dictators. When Muslims engage in terrorism against one another its not done by dictators. In the fantasy world Eye lives in he has never walked the streets of a Muslim country to understand dictators are but one phenomena in such societies. They may front systems of political corruption at one level but at the grass-roots level these dictators don't function or survive without conforming to and kissing the hands of their Idslamic clergy. Eye has zero clue how dictators can not function in Islamic societies without the support of Mullahs and Imams. Not a clue. Not a friggin clue how the Islamic regimes of Iran, Saudi Arabia, et al function. I only respond because each time I think he can't state something any more simplistic and stupid that stereotypes not just the West byt Islamic societies, he does.

You again missed the point. If an illegal crime is a direct result of engaging in a cultural or religious practice that cultural or religious practice is problematic. We are discussing the cause of a crime-some crimes are not caused by religious or cultural practices. People jay walk from all cultures and religions. Their religion or cultural beliefs don't teach them its ok to jay walk. That was the original point Betsy made and BCSapper is making now. I agree with BC except in his last sentence I would myself state the continued practice of female circumcission while illegal speaks to the abusiveveness of the culture or religion that promotes it which in many cases is Islam... To ignore the cause and effect of religion and circumcision of females is inaccurate and unhelpful in stopping it. Sexual beliefs in Islam and other religions lead to practices we need to challenge and root out in a progressive democratic society. There is no place for them. Mutilating a clitoris is unacceptable. If a religious leader teaches it they are to be challenged. I see no place for mutilating clitorises in any culture-yah call me intolerant against mutilating clitorises. If its taught by people in the name of Islam it has to be challenged and called out for what it is idiocy. If someone has a problem I have no foreskin, God bless them but my penis was not mutilated it works and I studies show I am less likely to spread viruses that can lead to cervical cancer. Now mind you Tim Horton's discriminates against me every year in their roll up the rim contest but I can live with that. Let's get serous what does culture and religion have to do with female circumcision, honour killings, wife beatings? You need to ask?

Come on Di, Jay walking, speeding and drug dealing are not done because of religious or cultural reasons and murder maybe but only when its an honour killing. You missed her point. Female circumcision is done the same reason certain other illegal practices are done, because when such people come to Canada, they do not feel they need assimilate to our laws. That was the point. I deal with men in groups who use their culture as an excuse to engage in domestic violence. I tell them to their face, you don't like the laws in Canada, you want to bring that shit to Canada, make a choice. Either follow Canadian laws or go back to the country where you can do what you think is acceptable with women. Some things do not balance or compromise. That is the point. Female circumcision is practiced because of entrenched cultural and religious beliefs, no different than the burka continues in some but not all Muslim nations and people bring it to Canada. You think it harmless and a reasonable expression of belief and preference, I don't. The law does say you need to show your face in court as a witness and when stopped by police driving. There is a limit to everything. As for female circumcision., its mutilation of the female genitilia AND many times in the name of Allah. Sure Its also practiced in other religions. Its equally as barbaric. If some idiot wants to come on the forum and compare it to cutting off foreskin I expect that. The idiots can't tell the difference between skin and an actual part of the body with nerve endings. Its par for the course with men who do not understand female bodies and relate everything back to their penises. I have zero tolerance for body mutilation of genitilia Some liberal wants to use culture or religion as an excuse to justify abusive practices, and claim female circumcission is no different than make circumission. Bull shit Male circumcision was done to keep dirt and sand from under the foreskin. Female circumcision was done to prevent sexual sensation. Is a Burka abusive. I concede for some women but not at all. For others, it sure as hell is because its imposed on them by the males in their family or society. I support any women who claims she can be a Muslim without covering her face or head. On the other hand I have to be polite and respectful to those who choose such things. Doesn't mean I have to like it or condone it being forced on people or not challenging it as an antiquated symbol. That said people come to Canada and chew that damn plant I forget the name that for them is like coffee what is it called kat? Its illegal and yet is smuggled in everyday because people are hooked on it. That is a an addiction like we have to caffeine. I am not gonna fret over that. Bring in heroin from Iran yah I would. Its subjective for sure. Laws can be based on moral values, hygiene. Just adding my 2 cents. I don't necessarily disagree with you but the analogy was a tad off. That said I consider Orthodox Jewish men wearing bear hats to be idiots and barbaric. They should leave black bears alone and wear tuques OK? I hate all men with beards and bad hair cuts and stupid hats once we are at it. Don't get me started.

I live in a world where your humour is called passive aggression. Some of your earlier comments were well said. Don't assume you know some of the men on this board you think you can ridicule. You don't know us. You do not know what we think. I grew up in a world where women have to serve in the military They have no choice. I also live in a world where mothers have their children taken from them by terror cells at night and they are beaten or shot if they resist. I come from a world where young women strap bombs to themselves, and would engage in terrorism with zero problems. I come from a world where women serve and put their lives on the line. Sense of humour. Don't talk to me about how I joke with other women. You would not understand. To get to the point to make the comments you said you will have to do a lot more than sitting on your sheltered ass making assumptions about how enlightened you are compared to the men you think you ridicule.

Using your reasoning, in your world a bunch of fundamentalist head to toe covered Muslim women sitting in the same room with feminist non Muslim women will soon be talking about their babies and grandkids and then men. You know because you know women. Drum was dead on. What you said was juvenile sexist shit. You don't' speak for me or any man I know. In my world women fight terrorists and don't sit around with other women laying eggs and they sure as hell don't support fundamentalist religious doctrine and your definition of them as all being domestic hens. Man I would give you less than 10 seconds before you'd be spitting your balls our your nose saying what you did to some women I know.. You have no clue what a woman will do to defend her family, friends and comrades from terrorism or for that matter when they engage in terrorism, that much is obvious. What is also obvious is you reference women like some asswipe little Prince who grew up in a sheltered world of clucking hens who doted over every word you said.. You are deluded . In the real world, when those women get together, if they do reference you its to compare you to the hemmeroids they have.

Get a grip. He supposedly got 32,000 phone in write in votes. That's a reflection of just how few NDP voted or cared about their party.

Hey please do not omit Elanor Roosevelt.

No you don't Hal. Its probably just over-rated porn.

He didn't say he holds all Muslims responsible. You have to read what he writes. He is saying to me something he knows I get-he's saying in the field he aint about to put his guard down. He said it to remind me why his guard is up. He's no monster. I wish I could explain it but people like him don't hate all Irish because of the IRA they just can't decipher who it is in the shadows. Its just a debate I push on us -how far do we go with this vigilance. There is no answer. Too little gets you dead, too much gets the innocent killed and the terrorists exactly where they want you-shooting at shadows. I have no lectures for DOP on putting his guard down.. He has to hear that otherwise I would be full of shit. I just hate what all this shit this terrorism t does to good people. That is all I mean. I am not lecturing DOP I just challenge all of us not to goo too far in watching the shadows for shapes because your mind can create patterns that may not be there. I am not trying to lecture anyone on how far hatred will go. Everyone already knows how easily it can get out of control. It starts with Muslims or Jews or Christians or whatever and then it suddenly goes from a small brush fire to a damn inferno. Surely history has taught us that.. That is all I meant. .

I support your views on the Burka and Hijab and respectfully disagree with Dialamah's and I don't think either of you are monsters, lol. Then again I thing beneath DOP's crude exterior is an NCO I sure as hell deferred to in the field. I just knew better then expect him to dance at one of those fancy military balls. His kind are too buy smoking cigars and drinking anything that moves. Its a damn miracle they don't catch fire.

I don't want you or anyone to let their guard down in that respect. Just sayin don't let them phackers sucker you into their game.. Its what they want. I am not about to lecture you on a damn thing. Just expressing an opinion. I do the same phacking you do. I am no different. I am in no position to judge anyone believe me. Just debating, challenging myself included into watching where I point the gun. .

Sorry I needed to take time to respond. Unlike some you take thought in what you say to me so I take time to read and think it through. In regards to your first sentence I tend to agree with you. Its a criticism that can hold as to any organized group imposed thought or value system. In regards to your second question I appreciate it and it yes is tough to answer and I understand why you ask it. Point taken. On the one hand Judaism provides a code of argument the Talmud. We as Jews are not supposed to take anything literally in the Bible. Everything is subject to constant debat eand change as to meaning. Judaism is meant to change constantly in its values and beleifs-its suppose to constantly be questioned and adapt to new contexts and scenarios and never stay fixed or entrenched. That said, in practical reality Rabbiahs like Priests, Mullahs and other Clergy or Theological scholars usually dominate the debate on the meaning of the Talmud, Bible or Rabbinical essays. Good point in that all religions probably have this issue. You are right I am not religious conventionally and that is precisely because I don't like anyone telling me what I MUST believe Now in regards to your opinion about mainstream Islam not being violent, I think you show integrity coming on this forum and taking a lot of personal attacks for saying that. I have to respect you for that. I also listen carefully to your views. Can I say this. I will concede a great deal of my exposure to Islam has come from the media or terrorism or travelling which does focus on violent Islamic expressions of terrorism of course. Mainstream Muslims? Well just how many do I deal with? Not that many today and the ones I do interact with no are not violent. My neighbour who is Muslim though said things about Jews no doubt quoting what he was told in his Mosque and he had no idea how offensive they were. No idea. None. I challenged him and said the fact I was not Muslim did not mean I am not equal to him or not a true believer as he lectured me.. Then again he said the same thing about Christians. Now I have had Jehova's witnesses and . Mormons come to my door and say if I didn't accept Jesus as my savour I am going to hell. They did not hink that offensive either. Are such thoughts violent? On a physical level no. On a spiritual level for me, yes. That said when I lived in Israel I got along with all the Muslims I knew. But I really didn't see them as "Muslim". I saw them as "Arabs" and in that group of "Arabs" I also saw Christians and Jews not just Muslims and also I saw Beduins whose beliefs are not the same as others and to tell you the truth most Palestinians I knew were like Israelis or Arab Israelis or Palestinians-none of us were religious. Then again I was 16, 17, 18 at that time. Today I am 61 and the Middle East has changed and the extremist Islamic religious terror cells are a fact now everywhere. In the time I was there the PLO was not religious. Many of the Palestinian terror groups were in fact atheist and communist. Hamas when I was there was not a terrorist organization and Hezbollah was a Shiite extremist religious group yes but only in Lebanon in the Shiite area. The war with Israel and the hostility against Israel I experienced was based on a Pan-Arab national identity that defined Muslims and wscreated by Nasser no different than how Zionists defined Jews. It was a political-cultural group identity not a religious one as it is today/ You know from a Zionist perspective only, our belief in being free by creating a state to protect ourselves from extinction has not brought freedom-it has brought a group psychosis of denial from mainstream Arab countries most using Islam and the concept and belief of khafir and dhmmitude to reject our right to be a free people and equal to Muslims so I don't see much freedom in being free. I see us Jews in Israel surrounded by hostile forces in the name of Islam wanting to wipe us out. On a religious level I never met a Rabbiah or any clergy I didn't think was full of himself and his teachings. I say that about all clergy. I mean I am respectful to all clergy equally about the history and culture of their religions. The only time I get my nose out of joint is the moment someone tells me what I MUST believe. The violence I saw, the terrorism I saw, could come from Arabs who look no different than Israelis. My perspective from what I saw first hand was that the so called Palestinian national movement of terrorists were nothing more than drug lords and pimps using the cover of being terrorist nationalists to sell their drugs and young boys and girls to the Europeans and on to New York City from Marseilles, France. Everyone knew Arafat was gay and everyone knew they sold Arab boys and girls to the sex trade along with heroin and hash. My perspective was on corrupt people like Arafat using terrorism to cover crimes. Hell I dug ditches in the West Bank for sewage along side Israeli and Palestinian volunteers. Shit looks the same. So do people when we saw them after they were blown up and left on the streets. When you see that as a young man-when you see blown up bodies, you don't see Arabs or Israelis, Jews or Muslims, you just see bran matter, intestines, organ pieces, feet, arms.teeth. There are always flies and a smell and maggots. All you think of is cleaning up the ground because the smell and flies in the sun and heat are horrible. No one walks away from that going that was a Muslim body. That was a Jewish body. At least not in the moment. Everyone Palestinian or Israeli walks away with the same reaction that you just won't turn your back to anyone and sitting in a café or bus or even going to a movie theatre is always a matter of being vigilante. You can't see a physical difference in people so you suspect them all. That's the reality. It becomes a blur of who you see. It could be anyone who blows you up or shoots you or knifes you.h because both were equally as violent. So I am not sure what to say. I feel the same way about extremist Jews as I do extremist Muslims or extremist Christians. My apprehension can get triggered by tappearance, i.e., beards, clothes, smell, sound. My apprehension is there. I genuinely don't like any human until one on one I get to know them and can trust them I think people like Trudeau come from sheltered environments and do not get terrorism and are exposing this country to extremists coming in and yes Muslim ones. That said it does not mean I hate Muslims and want them all arrested. Terrorist Muslims want all of us to hate mainstream Muslims so we alienate mainstream Muslims from mainstream non Muslims to make it easier to recruit them. I just wish we could be blunt and challenge Muslim extremism but balance it with a sense of understanding we have to avoid hating all Muslims which is what Muslim terrorists want. You are challenging some stereotypes which needs to be done.

I actually produced some. The point is there are violent references and passages and peaceful ones in the Koran just like there are in the Bible. Quoting verses can be done but no one denies the Koran has violent verses just like no one denies the Bible has some violent verses. How the Koran is used is the question. I believe the point Dialamah made is not all Muslims just like not all Christians use the Koran to justify violence Surely I as a Jew am not violent because Leviticus tells me to stone homosexuals. I think that is her point. I am not sure reading out a Koranic verse and assuming it is to be read in isolation and can only be read in one way is any more helpful than when Altai tried to do the same with the Old Testament,.

If in fact you can easily prove who "these people who snap in this fashion" are and that they are "inspired by their extreme religious beliefs" why didn't you provide a list of their names and prove of their beliefs? I would suggest you provided no example of either because you simply through these references out with no thought. You then refer to "racist assholes" but if these people are in fact anti Islam they would not be racist but anti Islamic as Muslims are not a racial group. Then you made a reference to an inference racists celebrate without ever referencing the inference which rendered the reference meaningless. You also suggested an inference can be celebrated which is not possible as they are not expressed and so could nto be celebrated. You then make some accusation that someone maintains fear and loathing and hatred of Muslims again with no reference to any words anyone said to indicate that. This renders your response illogical and incoherent. If you provide a specific reference to someone's words and then explain why you think they are illogical or unfair, I would be glad to consider them. Until then you knee jerk react with no specific position you have evidenced or supported..

Not sure what your point is. In my world both psychiatry and history have shown me all humans have the ability to heal or harm the world in the actions we take. I don't see the potential for depravity in homo sapiens limited to only one sub type defined by specific religious or political views. I think we all can stink or smell sweet. depending on the circumstances. Certainly the Nuremberg trials proved that.

No not an idiot an important contruibutor to moderating discussions.

Then I thank you and support you and openly defend you.

I have spelled their name wrong countless times but constantly refer to the Amadiyah,/Ahmadi a speaceful Muslims and I have been to their Mosque in Mississauga. I am sorry we get into tangents on this discussion. I respectfully disagree with you on some issues but I openly state again my beliefs are limited to extremist Muslims and if they sound like they attack all Muslims I would be wrong to do that. That is all I will keep saying to you a slong as I see the lines getting blurred. When Muslims act like terrorosst all it does is make me respect the peaceful ones who speak out aganst them. No terrorist will get me to hate all Muslims and the ones I despise I despire for being terrorist. Their use of Islam as their rationalization to me is not the issue, their actions are.

The terrorist who acted in Edmonton was not stirred up by Canadians, You engage in a rape myth that rapists need to be provoked to rape. Bullshit. This myth that terrorists only are set off by Westerners is bullshit. Its a deflection from admitting the terrorist was inspired by Muslim extremist ideology. Likewise and with due respect to Dialamah saying the Wst promotes violence even if that could be shown to be true does not suggest Islamic extremist views do't promote violence. I do not agree with Marcus, Dialamah, Eye, or anyone else's position if it can not acknowledge the direct connection between terrorism and Muslim extremism specially if they make a direct connection between violence and the West's ideologies but not Islam and terrorism. That is illogical. I also will state the attempt on this forum to suggest more Muslims have been shot dead than non Muslims because of hatred is precisely the kind of bullshit exploitation of Muslim deaths we d not need. We see that attempt to reduce the issue of terrorism to a point score of how many are killed a lot, particularly in anti Israel threads. Its a fallacy. Deaths are not a goal in soccer or points in some sports match. Any death that comes about because of terrorism is wrong. Any act of violence In the name of morality or political ideology is a huge failure of humankind. Its not justified in comparing death scores. Morality is not defined by volume of death. To protect innocent Muslims from being lumped in with terrorist ones I argue we have to speak openly about the Muslim connection not deny it. As for Dialamah while I am respectfully disagree on her denial of the Muslim connection to terrorism I assure her I agree that connection has to be discussed in a respectful manner so as not to smeer or stereotype innocent Muslims.

Democracy simply refers to the concept that the people of a society delegate representation of their view by people they elect to represent their views. It stops there. Any political ideology at that point expressed by the elected representatives that goes on to be violent in expression is not part of the concept of democracy. Democracy as a concept does not define the delegation of representation as being violent, on the contrary, its to be done peacefully/ If people act in a violent way democratic societies have laws for that which in fat prohibit the violence. intrinsic to a society being democratic is freedom of expression and lack of violence in reaction to difference of opinion. When a democratic nation engages in a war with another country or in actions to contain terrorism those actions of war or counter-terrorism are implemented by a non democratic entity called a military force. No one claims the military or wars or counter-terrorism is a form of democracy. Its carried about by organizations that don't allow free speech. When emocracies engage in war or use military which are not democratic that does not mean democracy is inherently violent but it does mean if a system of democracy in a country is endangered by another country that is or is not democratic, democracy may become limited in application and/or suspended until the war or counter-terrorism is resolved. It doesn't make the democratic system violent, it makes the need to counter violence to democracy at times violent. Democracy is not a religion. It does not define what political views are appropriate or inappropriate, the people do through partisan political policies. Democracy necessarily allows freedom of speech and people to have different ideologies-those differences fall outside democracy when defining them-they become separate political ideologies that may or may not believe in the democratic method of electing representatives. Islam on the other hand is not democratic. As practiced it is authoritarian and does not allow free thought. Thoughts, values and beliefs are instructed by Mullah or Imam. There's no discussion and challenging of how to interpret Muslim ideology-you are told and you follow. If you don't you are called into question as a non believer. There's no electing of Mullahs or Imams. There's no questioning of their beliefs. There is no code of debate to be used to question the Koran. In fact Islam is a religion, a theocratic belief that humans can and will dictate to other humans how to conduct themselves and what to believe at all times. Its a control system that uses the Koran as interpreted by Mullahs and Imams as an agent to guarantee and enforce conformity to specific and certain beliefs. That is not what democracy does or claims to do. Democracy only refers to the method of how one chooses their leaders, period. Islam imposes the leaders, then goes on, unlike democracy to then impose a system of beliefs all must conform to. Islam does not permit free speech and without free speech there is no tolerance and without tolerance, necessarily there is intolerance which is another word for lack of permission to disagree. Once that limitation is imposed and free discussion is prohibited, that discussion goes underground and it necessarily remains repressed growing in its repressed state until eventually it surfaces as all repressed thoughts do. They can only be held inside or repressed so long. The longer those thoughts and feelings re kept inside and build up, the stronger that build up, the stronger the expression is when it necessarily erupts. That eruption is inherently and necessarily violent. Democracy by allowing debate out in the open through free expression is supposed to prevent a build up of repressed thoughts leading to that violence. If in fact democracy is curtailed not practiced, violence can occur because expression in authoritarian societies that don't allow democracy and freedom of expression are no different than Isla,-they set the conditions for violence to grow and erupt. Islam has been since its inception violent. Its expressed with violence, war, intolerance and speeches that do not allow difference of opinion and create objects to scornn and hate including non Muslims, gays, women,. With due respect the religion is inherently violent. Muhammed was a violent man. He encouraged wars, extermination of specified groups and people he hated. To paint him as a peaceful man is nonsensical. He believed in forced and imposed will on those who disagreed with him. Islam is violemt. Its practiced as a code for violence, war and terror and systemic discrimination of non Muslims and Muslims of dark skin as well as Muslim women and Muslim gays. While it is inaccurate and inherently unfair to say all Muslims are violent or should be assumed to be violent or can never evolve to be non violent the religion as its expressed mainstream today is violent. The fact is freedom of thought is not going to be permitted for a non Muslim or Muslim in Iran, Saudi Arabia, or in any mosque or Muslim country as it is for any of us in Canada Muslim or non Muslim Muslim and not just in Canada but Israel or any democratic nation as opposed to a sharia law nations. That is a fact and the difference between the two.

Here we go back to the myth that Muslim extremists and terrorists don't do anything unless provoked. Yah they say that about wasps too.

The list provided was made up by Marcus with no references. " You" need to get it clear, that "you" are lazy. If the best the lot of "you" can do is regurgitate unsourced Iranian government piss on Israel scripts, its done. Either reference "your" sources or understand something-this is not one of "your " congregations where anti Israel pissantes gather to chant your scripts without thought. This is a forum. It requires referenced sources not sputum .or urine. By the way "you" might want to just once find out where Canada is on the map if "you" want to name yourself one of its bays and top it off with what you think sounds like a Canadian name. You see where the Hudson's Bay is and all around it are these things called reservations. Go find out what one is if you want to pass yourself off as an authority on cantons. Oh but I do like the accusation about the jets and snipers killing Palestinians. I mean why not throw that in right? Its all a crock of shit anyways, why not toss that in. What a friggin joke "your" script. here they come walkin down the street singing death to Israel to everyone they meet hey hey its the Tehran Monkees singing bad Jew to the honkies comin to a town near you so theycan piss on a Joooo hey its Hudson on the drums wipe out Zionist cancer he hums then we got the prophet Marcus who tries to rock us he thinks he's a real star playin the Qatar they play just one song even get that wrong they think they can play the blues about those damn Joooos usin the same flat cord rippin up the Oslo Accord hey come on baby light my fire you should known Yasir was a liar

http://www.meforum.org/5275/jizya-fact-fiction http://www.frontpagemag.com/fpm/203611/return-jizya-egypt-raymond-ibrahim https://pamelageller.com/2014/06/isis-begins-imposing-jizya-christians-mosul.html/ from wikepedia: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dhimmi In modern times The dhimma and the jizya poll tax are no longer imposed in Muslim majority countries.[15][140] In the 21st century, jizya is widely regarded as being at odds with contemporary secular conceptions of citizen's civil rights and equality before the law, although there have been occasional reports of religious minorities in conflict zones and areas subject to political instability being forced to pay jizya.[141] In 2009 it was claimed that a group of militants that referred to themselves as the Taliban imposed the jizya on Pakistan's minority Sikh community after occupying some of their homes and kidnapping a Sikh leader.[142] As late as 2013, in Egypt jizya was reportedly being imposed by the Muslim Brotherhood on 15,000 Christian Copts of Dalga village.[143][144] In February 2014, the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant (ISIL) announced that it intended to extract jizya from Christians in the city of Raqqa, Syria, which it controls. Christians who refused to accept the dhimma contract and pay the tax would have to either convert to Islam or die. Wealthy Christians would have to pay half an ounce of gold, the equivalent of USD 664 twice a year; middle-class Christians would have to pay half that amount and poorer ones would be charged one-fourth that amount.[145] In June, the Institute for the Study of War reported that ISIL claims to have collected jizya and fay.[146] On July 18, 2014 the ISIL ordered the Christians in Mosul to accept the dhimma contract and pay the Jizya or convert to Islam. If they refused to accept either of the options they would be killed.[147]

Or he engaged in blasphemy and had to recant in confession before he could return to the church. Technically what he said is in direct conflict with the most basic of Christian values-that Jesus is the only messenger. Its weird that is for sure. Then again there are rules for the rich and privileged and those for the unwashed masses in all religions. Oh hell what was it yesterday Prince Harry stood next to Melania Trump and gave what many believe was the sign of Satan on his jacket while he posed standing next to her. You can see him selecting his fingers to hold sideways on his jacket! If Trudeau is one of the "illuminati" he has no fear travelling anywhere and being an impostor. warning: the above contributor is inbred and can be traced back to Adam and Eve the original sinners