Goddess

While I have no doubt that some Muslims choose to ignore certain parts of the religion, I'm not as confident as you that when a religion's mainstream teachings are misogyny, violence, homophobia, death to apostates and non-believers and that their religion's divine destiny is to overtake the rest of the world that it has no effect on its followers. The facts of what is happening in Islam around the world tell me the religion DOES affect how they behave. There are millions of JW's who would obediently sacrifice their children to their blood transfusion laws. There are millions of Scientologists who subscribe wholeheartedly to destroying any they deem as "enemies" of Scientology. There are millions of Mormons who willingly shun family who are not Mormon. Why do you believe that Islam is the only religion that the majority of followers do not actually adhere to the tenets of the faith? On what do you base that? You have said before that just because a man insists his wife wear a burqa, it does not mean he's misogynistic. Do you realize how absurd that sounds? I suppose the ones throwing 210 homosexuals off rooftops also do not believe homosexuality is wrong?

I've provided 2 links to writers who have commented on the shirts. That you refuse to accept either of them, does not make it "unfounded BS." Is it Goddess "spreading BS" by talking about the tshirts, or is it Muslims who are actually wearing them in deference to the Koranic verse quoted by Dog above that are "spreading BS"?

Thank you, Charles, for moving the comments to the appropriate thread.

...........And that's the difference right there. Christians are waiting for God to clean things up. Muslims are told to do it themselves. No, you'll be fine. You're an excellent little dhimmi.

Scurry away to your "religion of peace". Guess I won this round.

Utter baloney. There is no F'ing way you'd be making excuses for Canadians wearing such t-shirts.

No. You made excuses for it. If Canadians started wearing t-shirts that said "2030 - Then Muslims are getting the boot!" you'd be singing a very different tune. It certainly wouldn't be...... .......then, would it?

I apologize for using the word "most". Just weird how *that* offends you, but the actual tshirt and it being popular amongst Muslims does not and is excusable. Muslims and imams all over the world taunting with threats to take over countries is not as bad to you as inadvertently inserting the word "most" in a sentence. Well, not weird, coming from you. But very transparent.

Oh, aren't you a smart one. You attack the person who talks about the t-shirts, but excuse the ones who wear it, just because they belong to your pet religion.

In the age of Islamic terrorism, the excuse you make for this doesn't seem like a smart move. I notice you - again - have to twist and insert words to excuse this. Please note: I did not make it up that this shirt exists and is popular. I did not force Muslims to wear it. They chose to wear it. They chose to wear it during this age when Islam's "peacefulness" is being questioned. I am not the only one questioning Islam being "the religion of peace."

I can't reply on the other topic, but here is another source that talks about the popular Muslim t-shirt from Stockholm - "2030 - Then We Take Over": The book, "Religion, Terror and Error: US Foreign Policy and the Challenge of Spiritual Engagement" by Douglas M. Johnson. I guess if you choose to continue to believe that everyone is lying about this and that it's just a smear campaign against Muslims, that's up to you.

I don't understand why this bothers you - some cultural garments are extraordinarily beautiful. I have 2 saris that I love to wear and some Chinese jackets and dresses - I had a designer friend create a beautiful oriental cross-tie jacket that everyone compliments when I wear it. There are no "values" associated with most cultural clothing - no shaming of women just for being female. The hijab and burqa are exceptions. Hijabs can be beautiful too. When the woman is obviously wearing it by choice. When a hijabi woman is cowering behind a man, getting screamed at by him with 8 children in tow and he's not even helping her with the kids or the bags - then hijabs are not so beautiful to me.

https://nationalpost.com/opinion/europes-no-go-zones-inside-the-lawless-ghettos-that-breed-and-harbour-terrorists This article is from 2016. Strange how they are becoming "separate Islamic societies" where Jews and Christians are not welcome, yet apologists insist that Christians and Jews are equally to blame and that antisemitism in Islam is of normal levels with the rest of society. **cue the "not all Muslims" chorus**

They're not killing innocent people in every country of the world in random terror acts, but Bountiful BC is one. They are however, a group that enjoys no applause from the larger community for doing what they're doing, have been the subject of police and legal actions and have no political influence whatsoever, so that would be a disingenuous comparison.

I first saw it in the book "While Europe Slept". Here is the excerpt. The links are in the back of the book, which I don't have with me right now. You won't get the context of what is being discussed but it's happening in many countries of Europe (France, for example, as shown in the article linked above) - Muslims taunting citizens with a take-over of their own country and backing it up with no-go zones, terrorism and legal wranglings.

And I see Islam as being a threat to women and gays and Jews, because that is what is happening and not just in Muslim countries. You may not want that talked about, but some of us think that is pretty important. When France is saying it's difficult for Jewish kids to even get an education, when Muslims are violently attacking free speech in nearly every country, when women are still walking around in burqas and young girls in hijabs, when the most popular tshirt for Muslims is a shirt that says "2030 - then we take over" and making comments like the one in the above article "You'll see - in a few years Allah will be in power", when almost 80% of UK Muslims want Sharia law instead of democracy.......Sorry, but "They don't really mean that" and "Not ALL of them want that" coming from you, isn't very reassuring. Yes, Dia - we all "get" that not ALL Muslims are the same. But there are far more bad ones out there than apologists like to admit.

So basically, ANY criticism of Islam is "rhetoric" to you. Because, just for starters, you include "threat to women" in there - which Islam definitely is. That is not rhetoric.

From the article: There was already an issue in these areas before the Yellow Vest Movement. The Charlie Hebdo attacks made it worse and then: ....... because: ......which matches what many are coming to realize - that some apologists for Islam are only such because they like that Islam hates who they hate. Think about this: I see YOUR counterpart in those German citizens who made excuse after excuse for increasing Nazi atrocities, except you do it for Islam.

I don't think she read the article. It's just a knee-jerk "Don't say anything bad about Islam or you're a racist" response. From the article:

She has since recanted her statements about non-Muslims. I find it disturbing that the religion inspires so much hatred.

Is that Relic in your avatar?

And right now it's the Saudis shaping Islamic jurisprudence. You'd think that would concern both Muslims and non-Muslims but for some, if it does concern you - you're a racist.

It's not a benign religion. It's a political system - a political system than almost 80% of Muslims in the UK want instead of democracy. Ex-Muslims and Muslim reformers have written books, articles and blogs warning of the same thing. So it's not just one little woman on an obscure internet forum. Take your beef up with them. If you can spare some time from your Jew-bashing.

Attack me with your inane accusations on the appropriate thread so we don't hijack this one.

Weird how you rail against this - although men are not jailed, beaten or killed for non-conformity - yet hijabs and burqas are symbols of women's empowerment and right to choose. Honestly, the mind games and thought twisting you guys go through to excuse what Islam does is absolutely bizarre.