What must we do to protect our White culture?

[kimmy]

...the actual concerns that some people have are less about race, and more about culture, and how with the shift of demographic, the western culture that we presently have may be replaced by the cultures that are prevalent in the homelands of our immigrants.

Pizza. How dare they bring that stuff and alter our pure White culture!!!! What next? Falafals and belly dancing? <shudder>

I will take this opportunity to again voice my opinion that Canadians *love* multiculturalism as long as it's confined to funny hats, tasty food, wacky dancing, and that sort of thing. Superficial stuff.

Canadians are far less enthusiastic about multiculturalism if one understands it to include less superficial aspects of culture.

I think that very few Canadians are accepting of, for instance, Sharia law, or the kind of contempt for women seen in some cultures, or the marital practices of the Bountiful Mormons, or that kind of stuff.

Canadians enthusiasm for multiculturalism dims considerably once you're past the funny hats and pizza stage.

And do you have a citation for the comment that non-Whites have contempt for Whites?

For the record, there have been a number of incidents discussed on this board that demonstrated as much. One that springs immediately to mind is comments from members of a Muslim rape gang in Australia, who targetted white women and said utterly horrific things about them.

There was also a thread discussing an interview with some young Muslim men in Sweden who had appalling attitudes toward white women. I don't have time right now, but I'm sure that others on the board might remember them. Or try the forum search button.

I'm not even sure what you mean by White culture.

This is somewhat where I step off the parade route too. To me, it means the outstanding tradition of freedoms and democracy and human decency that we've inherited and expanded upon.

For others, I suspect that the word "Christian" figures heavily into it.

-k

[Hollus]

White culture in Canada = Canadian culture dominated by a majority White population and and its history and cultural traditions that include Christianity.

So correct me if Im wrong: 'White culture' = White people that you identify with.

If thats not the case, than I would expect your posts to contain a description of the values that you feel are in need of protection. In a thread titled 'What must we do to protect our White culture' you might want to specify what exactly that is and how or if it is exclusive to 'whites', otherwise you just come off sounding like a racist asshole.

[Hollus]

I will take this opportunity to again voice my opinion that Canadians *love* multiculturalism as long as it's confined to funny hats, tasty food, wacky dancing, and that sort of thing. Superficial stuff.

Canadians are far less enthusiastic about multiculturalism if one understands it to include less superficial aspects of culture.

I think that very few Canadians are accepting of, for instance, Sharia law, or the kind of contempt for women seen in some cultures, or the marital practices of the Bountiful Mormons, or that kind of stuff.

Canadians enthusiasm for multiculturalism dims considerably once you're past the funny hats and pizza stage.

No I think Canadians love for multiculturalism goes far beyond superficial stuff. Its easy to vilify a culture by focusing on the dark (and often misunderstood) corners of it. To hold these examples you mention as representative of the culture as a whole is akin to holding white supremicists as representative of western culture.

For the record, there have been a number of incidents discussed on this board that demonstrated as much. One that springs immediately to mind is comments from members of a Muslim rape gang in Australia, who targetted white women and said utterly horrific things about them.

There was also a thread discussing an interview with some young Muslim men in Sweden who had appalling attitudes toward white women. I don't have time right now, but I'm sure that others on the board might remember them. Or try the forum search button.

Again, a few horrible examples are used in an attempt to vilify a whole culture. The same cheap tactic could be used on western culture.

This is somewhat where I step off the parade route too. To me, it means the outstanding tradition of freedoms and democracy and human decency that we've inherited and expanded upon.

And to expand on those further we must build bridges to other cultures without the demand that they conform to what is on our side (ofcousrse Im not speaking in terms of criminal law within our country). Yes some of these cultures have issues to deal with that our culture may have already addressed but that doesnt mean we should be self-righteous and exclusive. We need to build a cultural consciousness that recognizes the good in other cultures as much as we recognizes the good in our own. And we must scrutinize our own culture as much as we do others. If you were to step outside of the western media and examine the mechanisms of western foriegn policy, the picture would certianly not dipict a culture that values freedom, democracy and human decency.

[Liam]

So what are you saying? Are you pissed that muslim immigrants are not wearing halter tops? Are you pissed that we are not as intolerant as Saudi Arabia?

No, but calls for fatwas against political cartoonists, desecrating Jewish cemetaries and insistence on practicing sharia law might be a decent start.

[Leafless]

Maybe police in Winnipeg are simply uninformed.

Caucasian is the proper word to describe a person from the White race and is the 'primary definition', unlike the definition of white.

For all practical purposes especially relating to brownies, White=Christian and thus hated by the current line of Islamic-Muslims and their terrorist acts.

The Toronto Police force uses the term as well. Perhaps they use the same style guide as Winnipeg.

I can't recall seeing white or Christian being used as a reason for attacks.

Well if that is factual, then Toronto police are also wrong to use white over Caucasian or without the use of upper case 'W'.

I think you are showing contempt for the White race by agreeing the classification of the White race with a lower case insignificant 'w', whereas it is absolutely imperative to acknowledge the White race as 'White' or Caucasian.

You say you can't recall white or Christian being used as a reason for attack by Islamic-Muslims....give me a break. Maybe you can tell me what Islamic-Muslim terrorism is all about and why foreign immigrants coming to Canada insist on retaining their culture from their country of origin.

Is Canada simply a place to unload your baggage and live like they did in their old country. The hate is there and it is evident they have no respect for Canada as a country and they are not about to change there ways anytime soon.

[Leafless]

I presume you know what the issue is and would appreciate your views on the issue rather than attack this poster with a question that does not reflect the seriousness of a rather complex situation that continues to be force fed by government in a totally irresponsible manner.

You are the one who implied that ethnic immigrants should not be filling important jobs in Canada. I was just curious if you are actually serious, or whether you wrote that in haste, because I am surprised that someone would actually suggest that non-whites shouldn't be allowed to fill important jobs.

I am serious when I said ethnic immigrants, pertaining to those who have demonstrated a high level of incompatibility with the White race should not be filling jobs in Canada's important institutions.

This also applies to Quebecers, especially separatist, working for the federal government, who are or could be (at a moments notice) incompatible with English Canada and present a serious threat by sabotaging the inner federal workings if a English/French conflict develops, bringing Canada to a standstill.

[Hollus]

So what are you saying? Are you pissed that muslim immigrants are not wearing halter tops? Are you pissed that we are not as intolerant as Saudi Arabia?

No, but calls for fatwas against political cartoonists, desecrating Jewish cemetaries and insistence on practicing sharia law might be a decent start.

I guess your referring to the cartoon that depicted Mohammed standing at the gates of heaven and waving off a long line of singed muslims saying that there were no virgins left? I thought that was a pretty funny one. However, it seemed to piss off alot of muslims. It was culturally insensitive to depict their God which is something they do not do. Muslims here in Canada protested peacefully en masse, which I consider to be quite a respectful reaction. So a fatwa was issued by some cleric in a distint country. Was it followed anywhere? How about the 'fatwas' issued here on this board where members call for the whole culture to be 'swept into the dust-bin'? Does that not deserve your condemnation?

Your mention of Jewish cemetarty desecration deserves no reply as it is a cheap tactic designed to vilify a whole culture.

Yes there are courts in Canada practicing sharia law, but these courts do not deal with criminal law and work on a voluntary basis. There are Jewish courts and Native courts that operate under the same principle. So whats the big deal?

[Hollus]

I am serious when I said ethnic immigrants, pertaining to those who have demonstrated a high level of incompatibility with the White race should not be filling jobs in Canada's important institutions.

This also applies to Quebecers, especially separatist, working for the federal government, who are or could be (at a moments notice) incompatible with English Canada and present a serious threat by sabotaging the inner federal workings if a English/French conflict develops, bringing Canada to a standstill.

Sounds like you dont like democracy Leafy. Who else does this sentiment apply to? The opposition party?

[NovaScotian]

Ok people, lets have a reality check.

According to stats Canada. The nation is still 83% of 'white' decent and the population is still about 70% Christian. Only 1.9% are Muslim. So "white culture" is hardly being overwhelmed.

Canada is more then race or religion anyway. It is about a set of ideals based on freedom, openness and respect for others.

[kuzadd]

Simple question.

What must White Canadians do to protect our White cultural and Christian associated traditions, that have been ravished or undermined by Quebec culture, Aboriginal culture and immigrants and their imposing cultures?

Canadian streets are now full of ethnic foreigners, our hospitals are full of Islamic Muslim doctors and stores full of ethnic help and our English language being attacked by forces of government to impose the French language.

what's a white canadian?

what's white culture?

Are all christians white?

'Canadian streets are now full of ethnic foreigners'

so?

Immigrants largely built this country, so what else is new?

Bigots like leafless made my father's migration to canada, that much more difficult, inc, but not limited to members of my own family, and also as a child of an immigrant I can recall the name DAGO, oh so well.

Yes there was a time when italians were like black people, stealing jobs and OMG, marrying white women!!!

sick!

[Mad_Michael]

Good gosh is this thread for real?

Do people actually take this crap seriously?

The first post should be enough to consign this thread to the trash heap of obscurity without a single post in reply.

But five pages later, it looks like people are having fun.

When it comes to white supremists - NEVER give them the platform that they crave. Every post to this thread just bumps it back to the top so that it stays current. Racists depend upon mindless repetition to inculcate their views into the mainstream. Every poster in this thread is contributing to this (and yes, I realise that I'm contributing to this so no need to reply to inform me of this fact - I post this quite reluctantly, only since it seems necessary).

[jdobbin]

Well if that is factual, then Toronto police are also wrong to use white over Caucasian or without the use of upper case 'W'.

I think you are showing contempt for the White race by agreeing the classification of the White race with a lower case insignificant 'w', whereas it is absolutely imperative to acknowledge the White race as 'White' or Caucasian.

You say you can't recall white or Christian being used as a reason for attack by Islamic-Muslims....give me a break. Maybe you can tell me what Islamic-Muslim terrorism is all about and why foreign immigrants coming to Canada insist on retaining their culture from their country of origin.

Is Canada simply a place to unload your baggage and live like they did in their old country. The hate is there and it is evident they have no respect for Canada as a country and they are not about to change there ways anytime soon.

The police in many jurisdictions use white, black and aboriginal in their descriptives of subject. I don't think it shows contempt.

You'll have to show me the citation that Muslim extremism is directed at whites.

I think all immigrants retain some of their culture from the country of their origin.

[kuzadd]

Good gosh is this thread for real?

Do people actually take is seriously?

The first post should be enough to consign this thread to the trash heap of obscurity.

But five pages later, it looks like people are having some fun.

When it comes to white supremists - NEVER give them the platform that they crave. Every post to this thread just bumps it back to the top so that it stays current. Racists depend upon mindless repetition to inculcate their views into the mainstream. Every poster in this thread is contributing to this.

You are right, but nonetheless, since i have some personal issues, with this type of crap, that affected my childhood and upbringing, I must point out it is disgusting!

[White Doors]

I guess your referring to the cartoon that depicted Mohammed standing at the gates of heaven and waving off a long line of singed muslims saying that there were no virgins left? I thought that was a pretty funny one. However, it seemed to piss off alot of muslims. It was culturally insensitive to depict their God which is something they do not do.

Well that shows the 'depths' that your multi-cultural love in goes.. not very deep apparently.

Mohammed isn't a god, he is their prophet. Allah is their god. same as the Jews.

Seems you superficalliy love multi culturamism too as Kimmy correctly observed.

[Leafless]

White culture in Canada = Canadian culture dominated by a majority White population and and its history and cultural traditions that include Christianity.

So correct me if Im wrong: 'White culture' = White people that you identify with.

If thats not the case, than I would expect your posts to contain a description of the values that you feel are in need of protection. In a thread titled 'What must we do to protect our White culture' you might want to specify what exactly that is and how or if it is exclusive to 'whites', otherwise you just come off sounding like a racist asshole.

A description of Canadian Western values based on majority White culture can include dearly held traditions, Christmas and Easter, devotion to the docile majority Christian religion and its moralistic teachings are being attacked by ethnics.

Traditional sporting events football, baseball, hockey are all part of our heritage and currently being attacked by imported soccer with ethnic communities catering to their individual culture.

Schools are not what they use to be and reflect a dangerous racial diversity that is the cause of social unrest, even death within these schools harbouring the student body.

Canadians enjoy malls and shopping which are now ruined by large crowds of foreign youth and adults hanging around making malls a place of social gathering defeating the purpose they were built for, intimidating White Canadians and causing many Canadians to shop elsewhere.

Our hospitals are plagued by foreigners with their many genetic diseases placing a huge burden on our health care system along with non-Whites in emergency with injuries caused by a callous disregard for knives and guns like Whites use knives and forks for utensils for eating purposes.

Let's face it Hollus, our whole White society,including housing, has been adversely affected by uncivilized ethnics (compared to Canadian standards) and I really don't know how much longer the system can maintain an orderly approach while being confronted or bombarded with the actions of problematic non-Whites. This does not apply to all but many.

BTW- Racism exist in every country, so don't knock Canada for being out of line with racist attitudes.

[Moxie]

It's politically incorrect to be proud of your heritage if it's from European White blood, when is the last time a poster saw a Scotish kiosk at a multi-cult event? An English one an Irish one, nope we aren't even allowed to participate in the left's social experiment of Mulit-cult events but we pay for it. It appears to me that only non-whites are allowed to be proud of their heritage and get tax dollars to fund multi-cult events.

The police need to describe one's apparance when they describe a suspected perp, if a suspect is a 6 foot black man should the cops put out an APB on a short white man with blood hair. Of course not, the discription is absolutely necessary to apprehend the suspect.

[White Doors]

It's politically incorrect to be proud of your heritage if it's from European White blood, when is the last time a poster saw a Scotish kiosk at a multi-cult event? An English one an Irish one, nope we aren't even allowed to participate in the left's social experiment of Mulit-cult events but we pay for it. It appears to me that only non-whites are allowed to be proud of their heritage and get tax dollars to fund multi-cult events.

The police need to describe one's apparance when they describe a suspected perp, if a suspect is a 6 foot black man should the cops put out an APB on a short white man with blood hair. Of course not, the discription is absolutely necessary to apprehend the suspect.

How about a white history month?

White appreciation day?

LOL

[Rue]

I respond to Leafless' comments;

'My definition of a "White Canadian" 'would be of the human group having a light coloured skin'.

You walked right into that Leafless and I am calling you out. Does that include albino Indo-Pakistanis, albino negroids and Albino mongoloids?

Give it a rest. You made it clear when you started this post this is not just about light coloured skin but anyone who doesn't fit your narrow category of Anglo-Saxon Christian. don't hide Leafless behind an attempt to suggest you are inclusive of anyone with light skin-you can't even handle that without sub-dividing it further to light skin of heter-sexual nature, and your kind of ethnicity and version of Christianity. Have the integrity Leafless to at least come out and state with honesty what it is you are restricting your definition to.

" Again this thread has nothing to do with me wanting anyone to be Caucasian or Christian but has to do with the federal government whitewashing the majority group that built this country and its history and traditions by unfairly promoting cultural values of minorities namely, Quebec, Aboriginals, and ethnic immigrants at the expense of the majority White, English speaking Canadians and their history and traditions."

Talk about talking out of both sides of the mouth. Of course you don't want anyone to be Caucasian-Christian. You have created an exclusive club precisely because YOU DO NOT WANT.

You do not want anyone who is not just like you. You do not want them period. Your trying to intellectualize you are solely concerned about promoting your cultural values is a crock. It is a crock because you express your culture not by defining what it is but what it is not.

People who must define themselves by saying what they are NOT have no culture. That is precisely why they speak the way they do.

If you had any sense of who you are and what it means to be a Christian you would not come on this post and tell people what you are not.

"In turn this is resulting in a takeover of Canada's important institutions by minority cultures placing at great risk the safety and welfare of White, English speaking Canadians."

You think you speak for me? I am Caucasian. So are many Muslims, Buddists, Bahaiis, Christians, Wiccans, and people of countless other religions or groups such as atheists and humanists. You think you speak for them? You like to use that word white don't you when we all know you don't mean simply white, you mean white, and whose religious views and political views are the same as yours. don't hide behind the word white Leafless because it fools no one. Your reference is to a specific sub-group of whites.

Let me say it to your face Leafless. You are afraid. You are afraid of anyone you feel is not just like you so you project your insecurity on the rest of us and talk of conspiracies of those who do not look and talk and smell like you and accuse us of taking your power away from you.

Your lack of power Leafless comes from your decision to define what you are NOT rather then what you are. Your lack of power does not come from us, it becomes from your own inability to define who you are and then try blame others for thinhgs you think they have and you do not.

You do not have Leafless not because you are a victim and it was taken away, but because you choose to hate and be negative and tell people what you are not.

You resent others for the sense of identity they have, because you have none. When you look in the mirror what do you see Leafless. Well it isn't dark skin. It isn't gay. It aint Muslim, Jewish, Hindu, Bahaii, Buddist, atheist, agnostic, Taosit, Zoroastrean, Italian, Spanish, Portugese, Latin American, South American, French, Bulgarian, Greek, Turkish, now is it.

"This has also transformed Canada into a country with few, if any values relating to loyalties and patriotism to the country"

Why don't you stop sanitizing it Leafless. Say it. Instead of the word "This" use the word "They", and then spell it out and stop codifying your words. Say it Leafless. " This" means "They", "they" means blacks, Asians, Muslims, Jews, aboriginals, French Canadians, non Christians, people with dark skin, gays, anyone who isn't pale and Anglo Saxon. Yep those Irish can get quite dark can't they.

Tell us all. How is it you take all these people, which is the vast majority of Canada and state they are a minority? By your very definition you have made such an exclusive club that you are a member of it necessarily includes you and probably the Klu Klux Clan and Aryan Brotherhood and some drunk skin heads in Kamloops.

Come on Leafless tell us. Who do you speak foor? Spit it out. Why the code word? Tell me right now, do you or do you not refer to the definition of white as defined b the Klu Klux Clan and Aryan Brotherhood?

I say you are verbatum and I want you to come on this post and deny it. Tell us why it is not the same. I ask anyone to go on the internet look at the definition of white as defined by the KKK and Aryan Brotherhood and compare it back to what you have stated and tell me why it is not the same!

I state this loud and clear. You came on this forum and state their platform of the KKK and Aryan Brotherhood, no more, no less then you veil it with references to loyalty to Canada on your part.

Come on tell us what tests you have used to determine all these less then pale people, all these non believers, are not loyal and patriotic to Canada?

Tell me why I am not patriotic to Canada. Tell me why gays are not. Tell me why people with brown skin are not. Do tell. Tell us the test you used to determine our loyalty.

Did you go around and take surveys? Did you walk up to black men in the Jane Finch corridor and say-excuse me you are black, or either that or you appear to have a tan, are you loyal to Canada?

Did you walk up to every Siekh and say-um excuse me you have dark skin and a beard and a turban-are you loyal to Canada?

Did you walk up to every Muslim, every Hindu every Asian, every native person, anyone with dark skin or narrow eyes or big lips and noses and ask them?

Did you speak with any Albino negroid humans to check their loyalty?

Or did you assume Leafless...and do you assume Leafless because that is what this post is about-you making generalizations and assumptions about the majority of Canadians in a negative and derogatory way-you dare suggest I am not loyal to this country because I do not fit your criteria?

You assume a lot Leafless and in a way I am glad this post has come about so there is no doubting what your agenda is Leafless. Its nice you finally came out of the closet. And no you no longner need the hood although I can now understand why it was pointed.

Take care not to get a tan this summer Leafless, someone may mistake you as lacking loyalty and patriotism.

" I think White English Canada has been pushed around enough and I want to know what we can do about it."

The above is a phrase is one of the most common phases used by Aryan Brotherhood and Klu KLux Klan in all their literature. Must be a coincidence.

Edited July 9, 2007 by Rue

[Leafless]

The police in many jurisdictions use white, black and aboriginal in their descriptives of subject. I don't think it shows contempt.

I did quite a bit of research on this and found there is no clear answer. The only reason I can think of why police use lower case 'w' as in white is for in the case of 'half breeds' that possibly could look or appear White but are in fact not White.

Is this another plus factor what multiculturalism has done to Canada?

You'll have to show me the citation that Muslim extremism is directed at whites.

You still have not answered my inquiry concerning 'what exactly is Islamic-Muslim terrorism is all about'.

Let's face it jdobbin, Islamic-Muslims cannot bear their hallucinatory fantasies of being beaten down by especially American White Christians and their associated political and social ideologies.

[jdobbin]

I did quite a bit of research on this and found there is no clear answer. The only reason I can think of why police use lower case 'w' as in white is for in the case of 'half breeds' that possibly could look or appear White but are in fact not White.

Is this another plus factor what multiculturalism has done to Canada?

You still have not answered my inquiry concerning 'what exactly is Islamic-Muslim terrorism is all about'.

Let's face it jdobbin, Islamic-Muslims cannot bear their hallucinatory fantasies of being beaten down by especially American White Christians and their associated political and social ideologies.

I have no idea what the style guide is for police. I think they try to best describe what the suspect looked like in terms of skin colour.

As far as Muslim extremism goes, a lot of it is directed at fellow Muslims. I always thought Osama bin Laden's attacks on the west were based on the west's support of Israel as well as U.S. and allied forces being in Saudi Arabia.

Edited July 9, 2007 by jdobbin

[NovaScotian]

Your ethnic scapegoating is very reminencent of the German scapegoating of Jews in the 20's and 30's.

[Bonam]

Rue, you have to consider the actual issue that exists rather than ignoring it just because some present it in a racist way. To deny that there is any risk or problem that can arise from mass immigration without assimilation is unrealistic.

Take a look at Sweden, where entire (previously prosperous) communities are being abandoned (by Swedes) in the wake of gang-rape, arson, stone-throwing, and other violence that is being perpetrated primarily by a rapidly growing Muslim minority. The issue comes as a result of rapid immigration of people of a very different culture from that of Sweden and the failure of Sweden to assimilate these newcomers.

We don't want that to also happen in Canada, and wanting to prevent that is a valid concern. To that end, there are valid reasons for wanting to preserve the western culture that we have in Canada. One of the ways to do this is by assimilating immigrants. Another way is by making sure that population growth of the existing culture is the primary component of population growth, rather than immigration. Neither of these are racist policies.

Edited July 9, 2007 by Bonam

[Rue]

"It's politically incorrect to be proud of your heritage if it's from European White blood, when is the last time a poster saw a Scotish kiosk at a multi-cult event? An English one an Irish one, nope we aren't even allowed to participate in the left's social experiment of Mulit-cult events but we pay for it. It appears to me that only non-whites are allowed to be proud of their heritage and get tax dollars to fund multi-cult events. "

Sorry but what a stupid thing to say. There are hundreds of Irish and Scottish cultural groups full of Irish people and Sciotts proud of their heritage and who meet in public and this Jew has been welcomed at their cultural events with warm open arms and I absolutely love Gaelic culture and I most certainly know who Saint Andrew is and what a Presbyterian is and who invented golf. How dare you try misappropriate their pride of culture to try suggest that is why this line of posts were raised.

By the way You really think Irish Catholics would come under Leafless' definition? Ask him and if you are dont' hold your breath. You think an atheist or agnostic of Liberal Christian Scott would come under his definition? You think one of those communist-socialist union supprting Scotts would come under his definition? You think soem of those mushy tolerant Liberal Presbyterians who love their fellow non Christians would come under his definition and opened their hearts to me would qualify? Hah.

In fact me and many minorities consider the Scotts and Irish as role models of how the rest of us can be proud of our own cultures. Its precisely because of their love of history and their folklore and their music that we try learn the same and take pride in our own. This is not a competition. It is not a pissing match.

This series of posts was not started to cherish and speak of the joy of Scottish and Irish culture. It does anything but that. It is about using couched and code words to say it is acceptable to hate others and make negative generalizations about them that suggest they are inferior, and not loyal to Canada.

The Scotts and Irish I know stand tall and proud and expect me to do the same and no they have never once questioned my love or loyalty to this country and my father fought side by side with them in the air force and army.

The post Leafless started is not about pride of culture it is about being angry and resentful at others for having their own culture-don't get suckered into this head space.

If you really are proud to be a Scott or Irish person do you really think this Jew sits around with Jamaicans and Muslims conspiring to prevent you from having historic or cultural associations or churches?

I am part of are inter-cultural and inyter-faith associations where Scotts and Irish and English heritage people lead the way opening their culture and traditions up for others to share and so we do the same vice versa precisely because they know exactly who they are and what they stand for and they serve as role models of positive behaviour not negative behaviour.

Now tell us how does it appear to you only non whites are allowed to be proud? Just who is it not allowing this? Do you really believe there are people doing that or what you really mean is you feel to frightened to state who you are. Are you really frightened of blacks ridiculing you if you take pride in your culture?

You really think someone of West Indian heritage at Caribana would hate you for having a parade? Got news for you the Jamaicans would be the first there partying with you. You think Bob Marley's culture is about hating anyone? Come on.

Do you think some young black guy will beat you up? You really think some crazed Jewish zealout will attack you? You think some Muslim will tell you to stop?

Yes Gays have their pride day and the Caribean peoples have Caribana but have you ever heard of St. Pat's day? My God man, even this Jew has cedlebrated it and was allowed to tell people for that day he was Irish not withstanding the obvious Jeiwsh last name I do have red hair and freckles and know what Guiness is and what blarney means.

Get real.

I also challenge you to come on this post and produce a government policy or a policy from any of the groups you seem to mention that indiocates they lobby and try forbid and get the government to disallow Scotts or Irish to take pride in themselves and celebrate their culture.

Don't let this man's coded buzz words lower you to such purile hatred.

These minorities he excludes do not want Scotts or Irish or anyone else treated in an inferior manner.

This Jew who is writing this post to you openly shares Irish and Scott culture and English culture and is bloody well happy he can. It is these groups whose forefathers established a way of government that enables me to live for the first time in my line of family without being massacered. You think as a Jew I do not learn and appreciate the history of the people who enabled me to live this way!!!!?

You think my father fought side by side with such men because he is not loyal and patriotic and taught me to be the same way?

It is also precisely the reason I defer back to the native peoples. I thank them for showing and teaching me their culture and I am grateful ti share the earth with them because very few people have done that with my people genuinely as did the aboriginals.

I learn from as many cultures as I can and so do the vast majority of us.

My God man, stand up straight and be proud if you are really a Scott or Irish person. Did it not dawn on you you could be a positive role model for those of us who are not if you show some pride in yourself and share it? Be proud of who you are and share it and I will be the first to respect you.

You are not a victim. Stop it. Be proud of who you are and I will most certainly admire you. A man who does not know what he is and so resents others for knowing who they are is doomed to try spread hatred and resentment in others. Stands up straight and learns to be proud what you see in the mirror.

If the only way you can feel good about yourself is to feel bad about others, trust me I have seen it close up in my very face-it will rot your insides out and eat away at you. It is what turns some into terrorists. It alienates you because people don't hate you because of your culture, they are repulsed by you because of your own self-loathing. That is what you pick up on. They feel you hating yourself and they wish no part of it. Be proud and share it and you will be suprised how many strangers will embrace you.

Edited July 9, 2007 by Rue

[Hollus]

I guess your referring to the cartoon that depicted Mohammed standing at the gates of heaven and waving off a long line of singed muslims saying that there were no virgins left? I thought that was a pretty funny one. However, it seemed to piss off alot of muslims. It was culturally insensitive to depict their God which is something they do not do.

Well that shows the 'depths' that your multi-cultural love in goes.. not very deep apparently.

Mohammed isn't a god, he is their prophet. Allah is their god. same as the Jews.

Seems you superficalliy love multi culturamism too as Kimmy correctly observed.

Blow it out your ass White Door. Cultural acceptance does not mean you must be well versed in theology it has much more to do with values. All you racists like to hold an entire population accountable for a small minority of bad people so it is you who are superficial. The point made from which you took my qoute from its context was that in response to a direct assult on these peoples cultural norms, they responded quite respectfully with peaceful protest. When I meet a person regardless of race, creed, or gender, I do so with an open mind and an open heart. That is a core value of multi culturalism.

Edited July 9, 2007 by Hollus

[Rue]

Rue, you have to consider the actual issue that exists rather than ignoring it just because some present it in a racist way. To deny that there is any risk or problem that can arise from mass immigration without assimilation is unrealistic.

Take a look at Sweden, where entire (previously prosperous) communities are being abandoned (by Swedes) in the wake of gang-rape, arson, stone-throwing, and other violence that is being perpetrated primarily by a rapidly growing Muslim minority. The issue comes as a result of rapid immigration of people of a very different culture from that of Sweden and the failure of Sweden to assimilate these newcomers.

We don't want that to also happen in Canada, and wanting to prevent that is a valid concern. To that end, there are valid reasons for wanting to preserve the western culture that we have in Canada. One of the ways to do this is by assimilating immigrants. Another way is by making sure that population growth of the existing culture is the primary component of population growth, rather than immigration. Neither of these are racist policies.

Bonam you are talking something absolutely different then what Leafless is.

What you are discussing which is entirely different and could have been raised without the racist buzz words and code words is the following; if someone brings a cultural value to Canada that is in direct conflict to Canada's what should we do.

You are damn right to ask that question. No it is completely unrealistic to think we can tell ultra-orthodox Jews or certain Muslims or fundamentalist Christians they can impose their laws on all of us and opt out of the laws of Canada they do not like.

That is a different issue and what racists do is take their own agenda of intolerance and try use that issue to get there's out.

People of all cultural groups who come to Canada have to take pride in Canada and understand Canada comes first. What I am telling you is the vast majority of Canadians whereever they come from understand this and no only taking in immigrants from England as would be Leafless' preference is no guarantee of anything other then him thinking it will bring more people who think like him and will allow him to be privileged.

Canadian Immigration Policy has been very lax as to expressing what we expect from prospective Canadians simply because we have no vision and we certainly won't create one with Leafless whose idea of a culture is to define what a culture isn't. That is precisely why Canada is at a loss to present a vision. It has the Leafless' to tell us what we are not and until we define what we are and what we want to be people like Leafless will continue to spread intolerance under the guise of feigned cultural concern.

You will hear two phenomena that often get misappropriated by racists to try justify their hatred of people they consider non white.

The first is the kind of talk that comes from economic migrants that came to Canada from poor countries to work as cheap labour. Yes if you hear them talk there is a tone of resentment they had to come here and it sounds they do not appreciate Canada and are complaining. You have to listen more carefully. It sounds that way but they don't hate or resent Canada, they simply lament the fact they can't go back and are homesick. First generations are like that. But look at their children. Their children are Canadian and they know that and they appreciate their children are safe and have opprtunities they do not have.

The second is talk from a minority of fundamentalists and militants who come hear and suck the country for all its worth and spit in its face.

For those of us who are born here, we do not know the difference between a tired cheap labourer who is homesick or a genuinely grateful immigrant or refugee from this militant.

We can't tell the difference, particularly with Muslims where the press tells us every day about the terrorist Muslims but there are no stories on the good boring Muslims of Canada no different then you or me.

You know how it is-we focus on that lousy, hateful, minority of a minority and let them dominate our attention and poison our minds into believing all immigrants are like them.

The typical immigrant is happy to be here, is hard working and unlike Canadians born here who complain and insult their country and take it for granted, they do not.

Do I think Muslims can opt out of our family laws for Sharia law. Of course not and neither do the majority of Muslims just as the majority of Jews do not want to opt out of the family law system.

Of course we all have to follow the same laws. A country can't work otherwise. There is nothing at all racist about you bring that up and most immigrants would fully understand what you are saying.

I personally believe, and this is why I am fundamentally opposed to the Leafless' of the world, that the way to assure we all follow the same laws, is to make sure our governments and laws do not try impose on person's religion or culture on another.

I believe religion must be kept seperate from the state precisely because people should not be able to use their culture or religion to opt out of what they don't like and then try impose it on others.

What Leafless is about is not equality-its about preferential treatment for himself and protecting his own self-interests by excluding anyone he does not approve of. It is about Leafless wanting to build an Aryan race of Leaflesses.

He doesn't want to seperate church from state he in fact wants to impose his religious beliefs on others. To me there is no difference beteen him and the Muslim Clerics in Iran or any other facist. The only difference is he thinks he is different. He's just as intolerant.

The way to define what Canada is and to get it across, is to start defining what we are not what we are not.

There is nothing wrong with saying, Canada stands for things. What I am saying is Canada doesn't have to stand for the things Leafless wants to be Canada. He does not have an exclusive monopoly on truth, religion or anything else. He is but one bitter angry man and if he wants everyone to think like him, then run for office and get people to vote for him.

I would suggest if he runs for the KKK or Aryan Brotherhood or Christian Heritage party he won't get any votes and he knows this and his anger is based on the fact that is knows he is a fading dinosaur who can't go back to the era when blacks were called negroes and shined his shoes and Jews were not allowed on Toronto Beach and if you were Irish you had better not think of anything but police or fire services and where Chinese nad Siekhs built the railroad but were not considered citizens and while we are it it, thoese were the good old days right Leafless-no Muslims, the Japanese placed in camps-I mean we knew what things stood for. Good old McKenzie King warned Canada he would never take in Jews as refugees and referred to us as vermin. Ah the good old days.

Then someone encouraged Jamaicans to come here to be our nannies and before you knew it-it was all down hill. People started to dance with rythm and put spice in their foods. And now these pesky native peoples want to be treated as if they were human beings.

Where will it end Leafless. Next someone will say God is universal and loves us all and does not favour anyone. Ooops Bob Marley already said that. Good thing he is dead besides he was only Jamaican and he wouldn't qualify under the Leafless Immigration policy. His skin was too dark even though his was mulatto. He also had dreadlocks. That is a no no in Canada. It endangers our culture. It encourages people to look too African even the caucasian wannabees.

Edited July 9, 2007 by Rue