Was the Japanese internment wrong?

[M.Dancer]

During the latter part of the 7th century, there was a movement to centralise power and the title of the monarch was revised from “Great King” to “Emperor”. Emperor Temmu commissioned two great literary works, the Nihon Shoki and the Kojiki, both of which cemented the imperial lineage and gave it a divine heritage. They claimed that the imperial line was descended from the Japanese Sun Goddess Amaterasu.

http://www.discoverychannelasia.com/japan/...ror/index.shtml

Thank you, you have been a wonderful audience. I be back same time tomorrow, meanwhile, try the prix fix and tip your waitress large.....

[FascistLibertarian]

121 1846 to 1867 Emperor Kōmei Osahito

Modern Japan

122 1867 to 1912 Emperor Meiji Mutsuhito

123 1912 to 1926 Emperor Taishō Yoshihito

124 1926 to 1989 Emperor Shōwa Hirohito

Notice how no ones heard of Osahito.

You should do a little more research and look at what happened to the emperor after that.

Japan was never a static entity, Japanese history did not being in 1854 or 1868 and a state had existed at least since 660 CE so it is difficult to say when the modern period starts. By 1800 Japan had “reached advanced premodern development in comparison with other societies that were to become latecomers” (Black: 348). It is important to remember that Japan could be considered superior to the West at many times in its history in numerous ways before it was pulled into the developing world system. The UK’s defeat of China in the first Opium Wars (1839-42) their annexation of Burma (1885) and US’s annexation of Hawaii (1893) were watched by the Japanese with a mixture of interest and fear. A small elite in Japan believed they would have to modernize their country or it would be colonized by one western power or another. In 1875 a Japanese intellectual, Fukuzawa Yukichi, wrote that “in Japan there is a government but no nation” (Doak: 286). This paper will examine the importance of the emperor, the state, and invented tradition in the top down modernization of Japan specifically focusing on efforts to promote national consciousness.

The reorganizing of the Japanese state, in order to first resist and later compete with the West during the 19th century, was directly linked to reinventing the role and status of the imperial system. The success of this modernization was completely compatible with the new emphasis on ancient legitimate power and rituals concerning the emperor. This was a crucial factor in the successful modernization of the country (Webster: 825). An early example of this in the historical record was the revival of the Shinto faith in late eighteenth century for political reasons with political and religious results, the most important of which was turning the Japanese population against the ruling Tokugawa dynasty (Dickins: 217). This reorganization reached its peak during the Meiji restoration and was legitimized by Japan’s first modern Constitution, but was a continual process without clearly defined boundaries.

The personal power of the emperor varied throughout Japanese history depending on the period (Yamaguchi: 11). During some periods it is doubtful whether the emperor’s power even extended to all of his palace if even beyond this (Dickins: 231). Although all of the emperors powers fluctuated his military and political powers did so more than his religious power (Yamaguchi: 6). Originally the Japanese emperor had very different powers and responsibilities than he would come to occupy during Japans period of rapid modernization. The role of the emperor has always been that of a supreme priest who mediated between mortals and deities (Yamaguchi: 6). Before Meiji he was not considered a deity himself but rather a mortal who had extraordinary abilities. It is important to recognise that cultural meanings change over time in important ways. The emperor was originally considered a “shaman-cum-political leader whose ability to ensure a bountiful crop of rice was crucial for his political legitimacy”, this power was eroded over time (Ohnuki-Tierny: 199). The Imperial system reached its height in 8th century CE and declined after until the 1868 revolution. During two later periods in Japanese history, Medieval (1185-1603) and Tokugawa (1603-1868), imperial rituals were usually cancelled or preformed on a smaller scale due to political/economic reasons. (Ohnuki-Tierny: 204). During periods when Emperor was unimportant politically he did have some religious power although Japanese leaders were able to rule easily. After the Imperial system declined the Japanese state continued to function adequately. The Shoguns often punished emperors who displeased them without any negative repercussions (Ohnuki-Tierny: 210). Shoguns had ‘hard’ secular power, they were weary of attempting to gain ‘soft’ religious power and when they gained such power it was proved impossible to pass on to the their descendents (ibid).

The forced opening of Japan, by a United States Naval armada under Commodore Matthew Perry in 1853, caused the country to be thrust into the world system. Although Japan’s isolation for the previous two centuries was more of a myth than reality after 1853 there was no choice but to interact with Western powers as the country was to weak to resist gunboat diplomacy. A small educated Japanese elite believed that the state must modernize or be colonized. They were aware of contemporary events in Asia and Africa as well as the history of Western colonialism in the Americas. Instead of submitting Europes divide and conquer paradigm they created their own pick and choose paradigm. By 1872 the Japanese government employed 214 foreign experts (Fisher: 352).

Emperor Kōmei, who was born in 1831 and ruled from 1846 to 1867, did not interact with foreigners and knew very little about them. There is a definite progression towards more contact with foreigners and greater integration of the Japanese monarchy into world affairs. Over time the emperor gained important diplomatic power, Japanese emperors made visits abroad while European heads of state paid respectful visits to Japan. An attempt was made on the life of Czar Nicholas in the 1890’s on a state visit to Japan by a delusional policeman who believed proper respect was not being paid to the Emperor. In 1921, following the Great War, Crown Prince Hirohito travelled to Britain where he paid respects to and observed King George V, at a time when the British Monarchy still had serious political and nationalist power. He also visited European Battlefields with military experts while studying Western military history.

After the death of Emperor Kōmei the Meiji emperor ascended the throne in 1868. This started a process of centralization, which there was violent opposition to, and is considered the start of the Meiji restoration. The cult of the Japanese emperor drew elements from the past, recently or ancient, which were inserted into the system during the Meiji years to suit current needs (Gluck: 39). For the creation of a centralized government and the elimination of previously semi-autonomous domains to be successful it was vital that the Japanese population transfer their loyalties from the local (the old domains) to the national (the new state) (Doak: 286).

This lead directly to the Greater Japan Imperial Constitution of 1889 (also know as the Meiji Constitution) which was created specifically to centralized the state under the command of the emperor. In the 1870’s and 1880’s People’s Rights activists agitated for a progressive liberal or libertarian constitution (Ienaga: 242). Their efforts were a failure and the Meiji Constitution, which was conservative and authoritarian, was imposed from above (Ienaga: 21). The Meiji state copied and used Western constitutional theory (Doak: 297). The Japanese had studied the various Western constitutional systems. The most important parts of the Meiji Constitution were Chapter 1 Articles 3 and 11. Article 3 stated that the emperor was sacred and could not be intruded on (Ohnuki-Tierny: 204). He was defined as either a Manifest Deity or a Visible Deity (ibid).# There are similarities here, in the divine absolutist sense, to the Russian Czarist system as well as the Judeo-Christian God. Previously the Emperor had earlier not been considered a deity but rather as being able to communicate with deities, however with the Meiji restoration the emperor was lifted to the level of a god. Article 11 gave the emperor military power as commander in chief of the newly formed Japanese Imperial Navy and Army, this soon led to the emperor Meiji appearing in military uniform with numerous decorations (Ohnuki-Tierny: 205). There are superficial links which can be drawn to fascism, however this process is better linked to nationalism as the ultimate goal was to unite the population and make them feel a sense of patriotism and of being Japanese. Lastly, and arguably most importantly, the Japanese people were defined as subjects of the Emperor, with the era being defined based on which Emperor was ruling. This state of affairs existed until January 1, 1946 when the emperor made an announcement stating that he was human and not a deity. In the new American imposed Constitution of Japan (1946) there was a clear separation between church and state and the emperors official powers were mostly eliminated.

If you are really intrested, and have access to JStor

The Dual Structure of Japanese Emperorship

Masao Yamaguchi

Current Anthropology, Vol. 28, No. 4, Supplement: An Anthropological Profile of Japan. (Aug. - Oct., 1987), pp. S5-S11.

The Making of an Emperor (in Narrative)

Thomas Crump

Anthropology Today, Vol. 7, No. 2. (Apr., 1991), pp. 14-15.

The Origins of the Japanese State

F. Victor Dickins

The English Historical Review, Vol. 14, No. 54. (Apr., 1899), pp. 209-234.

What Is a Nation and Who Belongs? National Narratives and the Ethnic Imagination in Twentieth-Century Japan

Kevin M. Doak

The American Historical Review, Vol. 102, No. 2. (Apr., 1997), pp. 283-309.

Originally Shamans were human with the power to communicate with deities and get favours for humans. Discrete categories did not exist so much as a spectrum (Ohnuki-Tierny: 206).

Many Japanese knew even during these periods the Emperors were humans, in the past there were many folktales emphasising the humanness of the emperor (Ohnuki-Tierny: 209).

The dichotomies of magic/religion and primitive/modern do not work in this situation. “The emperor ... has been like an empty vessel, whose content can be assigned and reassigned meaning by historical actors” (Ohnuki-Tierny: 211).

[betsy]

We are a superior people.

Now that's scary.

Corrections. You seemed to have missed a significant part of that statement....therefore, you have it out of context. Here is the complete statement.

This has a lot to do with MORAL HIGH GROUND .

Actually it is insulting to all Canadians to compare internment in Iran to internment here! We are a superior people.

[Black Dog]

This has a lot to do with MORAL HIGH GROUND .

It's too bad that if folks like betsy had their way, that high ground would be measured in milimetres.

[jazzer]

We are a superior people.

Now that's scary.

Corrections. You seemed to have missed a significant part of that statement....therefore, you have it out of context. Here is the complete statement.

This has a lot to do with MORAL HIGH GROUND .

Actually it is insulting to all Canadians to compare internment in Iran to internment here! We are a superior people.

Still scary.

[betsy]

Really? The Japanese monarch was considered divine 1500 years ago? Wow thats news to me.

I guess all the books and articles I have read have been wrong.

Could you please cite your source, if you dotn have one I am sure you could make a lot of money by advancing this new theory.

Really.

"The role of the emperor of Japan has historically alternated between that of a supreme-rank cleric with largely symbolic powers and that of an actual imperial ruler. An underlying imperial cult (the idea of Arahitogami) regards the emperor as being descended from gods"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_emperor

"When the Emperor passed by we had to bow our heads very low. We were made to believe that the Emperor was too awe inspiring for ordinary humans to look upon directly.”

Such was the depth of reverence afforded the Japanese Emperor. Children were, in fact, told that they would go blind if they looked directly upon the face of the Emperor. Devotion to the Emperor meant being willing to die for him. Thus, children were taught in school from a very young age to willingly give their lives to defend the leader. Young people were taught that they were aohitogusa – growing human weeds – who were to protect the Emperor by serving as his shield. This was, of course, seen as a great privilege. To die for the Emperor was the highest honor that could be attained.

The Japanese people were actually taught that their Emperor was of divine origin. So, for them in battle, a supernatural protection would be in effect. Many believed that bullets would simply bounce off them in battle because they were fighting for their God Emperor.

Such beliefs in the Godlike status of the Emperor have existed in Japan for well over a thousand years. Because of the awe that surrounded the Emperor it was considered inappropriate for him to have any dealings with affairs of state. He was, therefore, given a staff of deputies who served under him and handled all matters regarding the making and execution of policy. The role of the Emperor was far more priestly than political. From about the Ninth Century onwards the real political ruler of Japan was the Shogun. Although the Emperor theoretically appointed the Shogun, it was the Shogun who was the real ruler. In 1867, however, The Shogun relinquished rulership to the Emperor. It was in that year that Meiji became Emperor of Japan. Later he was to grant a constitution to his subjects that stated that the Emperor was “sacred and inviolable.” Yet, despite granting himself political authority, Meiji did not actually exercise that authority. He was content to remain a figurehead. "

http://iaia.essortment.com/japaneseemperor_rfac.htm

[Drea]

Perhaps he was "simply divine"... like fine chocolate.

[betsy]

We are a superior people.

Now that's scary.

Corrections. You seemed to have missed a significant part of that statement....therefore, you have it out of context. Here is the complete statement.

This has a lot to do with MORAL HIGH GROUND .

Actually it is insulting to all Canadians to compare internment in Iran to internment here! We are a superior people.

Still scary.

Oh well, what can I say if you get scared so easily.

If it's scary to you.... it's scary. I won't argue with you about that.

[Drea]

Betsy says:

Yes! Indeed! We should when it becomes an all-out war! And it soon will....

Who is the scared poster again?

Betsy's seeing muslim terrorists behind every bush and light pole. EEEk.

(you really gotta cut down on the wine hon, its making you paranoid)

[Black Dog]

I'm confused" what the belief in the divinity of the Emperor had to do with the internment of Japanese-Canadians/Americans? Keep in mind, many of those interned were second-generation citizens, who's loyalty to the Empire could not be taken for granted.

[betsy]

I'm confused" what the belief in the divinity of the Emperor had to do with the internment of Japanese-Canadians/Americans? Keep in mind, many of those interned were second-generation citizens, who's loyalty to the Empire could not be taken for granted.

No wonder you're confused. You didn't even read the post!

[betsy]

First of all, internment has nothing to do with race or religion. It has to do with enemy status

And how are you judging who qualifies as an enemy? Why, race and religion!

What? That they are religious fanatics is the the reason they are our enemy?

NO! It's because they're shooting at us and threatening us and killing our soldiers! And soon our children!

THAT'S why they're our enemy. They just happen to be religious fanatics.

Did we defend against the Nazis because they were religious fanatics or because they were German? No, it was because they threatened us and killed our soldiers and our allies.

At least get a grip on reality if you can't get a grip on logic!!

[betsy]

This has a lot to do with MORAL HIGH GROUND .

It's too bad that if folks like betsy had their way, that high ground would be measured in milimetres.

No. It's measured in miles. And we're miles high.....well, I am anyway. The only thing miles high about the terrorists is their victims.

I don't know how you feel. Maybe you've aligned yourself with Drea.

I feel superior to these guys who are blowing people sky-high.

The only good aspect is that they're blown miles high too. I guess it's the dwarfs!

Everybody gets dwarfs! Virgins my a**.

[Bonam]

All human beings are equal. All of us. You, me and that asshat next door are all equals. To believe otherwise is bigotry plain and simple.

I dunno if you can really say that ALL human beings are equal. For sure, to deem the value of one human being as higher or lower than another due to religion or ethnicity is unacceptable, however, there are other factors which must be considered.

For example, is a scientist that's found the cure to cancer and on his way to finding the cure to another disease, resulting in the prevention of millions of deaths, of equal value as a bum that's never contributed anything to society and most likely never will? Is an old man with a terminal illness with a few months left to live of equal value as a child with a full lifetime of potential ahead? Is the life of a serial murderer of equal value as that of a law abiding citizen? Sure, in some ideal world, it is best to grant equal rights to everyone, but when push comes to shove, you often have to make hard choices. If you're in a situation where you have to pick which lives and which dies (for whatever reason), it quickly becomes apparent that the value of some individuals is greater than that of others, and that they are therefore not equal.

[Peter F]

For the sake of argument...how would that apply to internment of Canadians in 1942?

[Peter F]

And you are assuming that not one Japanese would have acted upon the words of the emperor, had there been no internment.

Do you have anything to back up this assumption?

It is easy to make your "assumption" in confidence now that we're in the present times and discussing a war-time that had happened half a century ago. This is like giving the results of 6/49 lotto....making "assumptions" and "predicting" the winning numbers of December 31, 2006.

There is no evidence that I am not a terrorist and/or supporting terrorism. I should be arrested forthwith.

That applies to you too...and BC2004 and everyone else on this board and in this country including General hillier and Stephen Harper.

But we havn't been arrested because the assumption is we are not terrorists.

We are at war and that assumption is an unnacceptable risk.

I don't know if Hitler, speaking as a divine, had issued a direct edict towards all Germans, near and far....reminding them of their duty and where their loyalties should lie. That first and foremost, they (Germans) are Germans.

I don't know if Germans do take their honor so seriously as that of Japanese people....or if German soldiers were willing to die not only for their country, but for their emperor.......just like the Japanese kamikaze pilots....which incidentally makes me wonder now if they (the Kamikaze) were not the inspiration that the 9/11 pilots copy-catted!

I know definitely that if the responsibility of taking care of Canadian citizens had happened to rest on my shoulders durng those days, I would never have gambled upon it, and would've taken the POSSIBILITY quite seriously.... that some Japanese-Canadians would've responded and followed the emperor's edicts!

In fact, I would have assumed that some would.

After all, borrowing the words from one NDP MP, "it's better to err on the side of caution! "

It was not just about Canada either! It was a WORLD WAR! The balance of world power was in great peril!

So again I should be arrested forthwith. I could in fact be a terrorist. Prudence demands it.

Osama bin Laden himself issued a fatwa calling on all faithfull muslims to kill Americans ergo we should arrest and intern all Muslims.

Lets just hope the Pope doesn't say something stupid...or Ian Paisley...or Pat Robertson...or Micheal Moore...or Stephan Dion...or Paris Hilton...

My mother in-law's father was interned. He was German. Her mother was closely watched.

And yet she understood only too well the necessity of it!

War is war. It's always ugly. There would always be innocent casualties. That is a fact. That is reality.

Why wasn't she (your mother-in-law) interned also? If her farther had have been Japanese she would have been interned...but he wasn't, so she wasn't. Isn't bigotry grand?

[betsy]

And you are assuming that not one Japanese would have acted upon the words of the emperor, had there been no internment.

Do you have anything to back up this assumption?

It is easy to make your "assumption" in confidence now that we're in the present times and discussing a war-time that had happened half a century ago. This is like giving the results of 6/49 lotto....making "assumptions" and "predicting" the winning numbers of December 31, 2006.

There is no evidence that I am not a terrorist and/or supporting terrorism. I should be arrested forthwith.

That applies to you too...and BC2004 and everyone else on this board and in this country including General hillier and Stephen Harper.

But we havn't been arrested because the assumption is we are not terrorists.

We are at war and that assumption is an unnacceptable risk.

Let’s just stick with the Japanese internment for now, shall we? In your previous post to me, you said:

You are assuming that Japanese-Canadians would act upon the words of the Japanese Emporer. What evidence was there to support that contention? Attendance at secret meetings? Some sort of Rally? A Japanese underground? Anything at all?

I contend there was nothing at all to back up your assumption.

And I replied:

And you are assuming that not one Japanese would have acted upon the words of the emperor, had there been no internment.

Do you have anything to back up this assumption?

For indeed, this is just your assumption! Reckless, and outrageous I dare add.

How can you be so sure that, had there been no internment at all, not a single Japanese-Canadian would’ve acted upon the words of the Japanese emperor?

How can you be so sure that the Japanese internment did not deter anyone, or squash any plans of carrying out the edict of the emperor?

How can you be so sure that just because they had become Canadians, their ties to the old mother country, their culture, and their family back home – some of whom were possibly enlisted soldiers fighting for the Empire – were suddenly severed?

That second-generation Japanese-Canadians were not taught of their past, cultures and heritage by parents who have no wish for that heritage to be forgotten?

Do you have anything to back up your assumption?

Why wasn't she (your mother-in-law) interned also? If her farther had have been Japanese she would have been interned...but he wasn't, so she wasn't. Isn't bigotry grand?

How should I know….anymore than you do….the reasons or politics behind governments’ and war cabinets’ decisions. I haven’t actually experienced any all-out war – and I assume you aren’t that old to have been around during that time either.

My mother in-law was from England. Her father’s internment happened in England.

And of course, it isn’t bigotry! To label something you’ve obviously no deep understanding about – shown by your lack of insight regarding immigrants from other countries – is quite foolish and so juvenile.

Current trends we are experiencing now regarding immigrants’ status only give resounding credible support for my stance regarding cultures and heritage!

Some things are not so easily cut or severed.

[FascistLibertarian]

This devine thing has gotten way out of hand. My origional point was before 1867 most Japanese did not give a rats ass who the emperor was or what he said.

Anyone who thinks the internment was not linked to racism needs to have their head examined.

Germans are white people, like the people in charge of the govt.

The Japanese are Asians.

[betsy]

This devine thing has gotten way out of hand. My origional point was before 1867 most Japanese did not give a rats ass who the emperor was or what he said.

Anyone who thinks the internment was not linked to racism needs to have their head examined.

Germans are white people, like the people in charge of the govt.

The Japanese are Asians.

Well, at least you've managed to realize your divine thingy had gotten way out of hand.

That's a good sign....shows your mind is capable of grasping something.

Don't lose hope.

Some things take time.

[buffycat]

By Betsy's reasoning then one could assume that we should be locking up every Afghan immigrant here in Canada! (heck may as well round up every bloody Muslim - just to be safe!!)

Let's just face it - the internment was wrong, racist and a shameful act on the part of our forefathers. Period.

[betsy]

By Betsy's reasoning then one could assume that we should be locking up every Afghan immigrant here in Canada! (heck may as well round up every bloody Muslim - just to be safe!!)

Let's just face it - the internment was wrong, racist and a shameful act on the part of our forefathers. Period.

I guess your quite so short and simple statement is the classic admission that you cannot even explain to defend your simplistic argument - such a short tunnel-vision that it is.

And of course I'm right! I never had any doubt about that!

But, of course, with your having had the nerve - or having lack of knowldege - to compare Iranian-style of "internment" to that of ours was proof enough that you don't make any sense at all.

[buffycat]

By Betsy's reasoning then one could assume that we should be locking up every Afghan immigrant here in Canada! (heck may as well round up every bloody Muslim - just to be safe!!)

Let's just face it - the internment was wrong, racist and a shameful act on the part of our forefathers. Period.

I guess your quite so short and simple statement is the classic admission that you cannot even explain to defend your simplistic argument - such a short tunnel-vision that it is.

And of course I'm right! I never had any doubt about that!

But, of course, with your having had the nerve - or having lack of knowldege - to compare Iranian-style of "internment" to that of ours was proof enough that you don't make any sense at all.

Actually Betsy, I wasn't comparing Iranian style internment to the type employed by Canada - I was noting that according to YOU - internment is justifiable based on 'enemy' (read race/religion) status. Hence - if you feel that Canada had a right as a soveriegn nation to lock up a whole group of people based on where their genetic lineage originated from then by default Iran or any other country would have the same right.

Note - I do not think you are right, nor do I think that any group is superior to any other (unlike you - the supremicist). Canada has many skeletons in her closet Betsy - but of course you riegn Supreme!!

LOL

[betsy]

What some of you are failing to grasp is that the main role - ideally the only role, not daycare, not healthcare, not interference in our day to day living - the main role of our government is security and defense. It's the primary responsibility of government to protect its citizens against its enemy.

If it fails to take the action it deems appropriate to maintain the seciruty of its citizens, then it's failing in its role.

The citizenry in our free society has the right - what may be considered their role - to criticise the actions of the government in this respect. But the fact that some of the citizens may not agree with the actions of the government doesn't alter the fact that it's the responsibility of the government to act or abstain from acting, if they feel that's appropriate.

They've been elected to act in the name of the people. And as long as they are in power, they're required to act.

[Peter F]

Betsy:

How can you be so sure that, had there been no internment at all, not a single Japanese-Canadian would’ve acted upon the words of the Japanese emperor?

I can't be so sure. However, I think that some sort of evidence to support the assumption that Japanese Canadians would follow the dictates of the Emporer of Japan would be proper before we incarcerate them and sieze thier property. Sorta like every other Canadian is treated - even in times of war. We don't and otherwise have never siezed people and thier property because of thier parents nationality. Thats something

our enemies did and our Stalinist allies did.

You can't be sure that any Muslim is not a terrorist. Shall we incarcerate them and thier families and sieze thier property?

[betsy]

By Betsy's reasoning then one could assume that we should be locking up every Afghan immigrant here in Canada! (heck may as well round up every bloody Muslim - just to be safe!!)

Let's just face it - the internment was wrong, racist and a shameful act on the part of our forefathers. Period.

I guess your quite so short and simple statement is the classic admission that you cannot even explain to defend your simplistic argument - such a short tunnel-vision that it is.

And of course I'm right! I never had any doubt about that!

But, of course, with your having had the nerve - or having lack of knowldege - to compare Iranian-style of "internment" to that of ours was proof enough that you don't make any sense at all.

Actually Betsy, I wasn't comparing Iranian style internment to the type employed by Canada - I was noting that according to YOU - internment is justifiable based on 'enemy' (read race/religion) status. Hence - if you feel that Canada had a right as a soveriegn nation to lock up a whole group of people based on where their genetic lineage originated from then by default Iran or any other country would have the same right.

Note - I do not think you are right, nor do I think that any group is superior to any other (unlike you - the supremicist). Canada has many skeletons in her closet Betsy - but of course you riegn Supreme!!

LOL

First, what do you mean "...based on 'enemy' (read race/religion)". I said what I mean. If YOU mean race and/or religion, say it. If YOU mean enemy, say it. If there is confusion in your mind as to the differences, do us all a favour and say nothing.

Second, Canada has a responsibility - not just a right - to protect its citizens. The Japanese were our ENEMY. You don't have to agree with what happened or how they were treated. But you have to acknowledge that the government has the responsibility to protect its people, especially in time of war. Stop digging up the racist crap. Funny how those that pretend to be all loving and accepting, the ultimate in tolerance (except of course for those with whom they disagree), seem to be unable to see anything in terms other than bigotry. Perhaps it exposes a fairly ample dose of self-awareness that they would rather project onto others. (BTW, 'i' before 'e' except after 'c' or used as an 'eh' as in neighbour and weight...and reign...LOL) Anyway, I digress.

Third, why is it difficult for you to admit that internment in Canada and 'internment' in Iran are significantly different? Ask some Jew or 'human shield' who has had the pleasure of Iraqi hospitality if they'd rather spend their next internment in Canada. But better hurry. It can be difficult to answer such life-altering questions when your head is about to leave you. If you have problems with that difference, let's see if we can conjure up a more 'Canadian' perspective - like the world view from the comfort of your couch. Just imagine that the latest reality TV scenario is "Take Your Pick of Internment Spots". Where would you, as "winner", choose to spend your time given the above considered alternative?

Finally, the discussion started as a consideration of the internment of the Japanese in WWll. Fitting our current dilemma into the WWll mold is a game for fools. The circumstances are different, the enemy is different, the 'rules' are different. Hey, the world has changed!

Read this. If you don't understand, you've really got problems. Intelligence problems.

First of all, internment has nothing to do with race or religion. It has to do with enemy status

And how are you judging who qualifies as an enemy? Why, race and religion!

What? That they are religious fanatics is the the reason they are our enemy?

NO! It's because they're shooting at us and threatening us and killing our soldiers! And soon our children!

THAT'S why they're our enemy. They just happen to be religious fanatics.

Did we defend against the Nazis because they were religious fanatics or because they were German? No, it was because they threatened us and killed our soldiers and our allies.

At least get a grip on reality if you can't get a grip on logic!!

Just because you want me to be a bigot, because it would make you happy if I was, doesn't make me one.

And I don't mindlessly imagine that everyone is equal. I can see the difference between a suicide bomber and a child eating pizza. I AM morally superior to the terrorists AND to those who see themselves equal to those lunatics.