A Soldiers Story

[weaponeer]

http://www.thetelegram.com/index.cfm?sid=20132&sc=79

Good read.......

[Army Guy]

It is a good read, It brings back alot of memories, good and bad.

[jbg]

http://www.thetelegram.com/index.cfm?sid=20132&sc=79

Good read.......

Great read. Freedom isn't free.

[Borg]

http://www.thetelegram.com/index.cfm?sid=20132&sc=79

Good read.......

Great read. Freedom isn't free.

jbg

I have done my time - and in fact will do more very soon - but when I read your comment it was almost a complete microsecond before this cynical thought went through my mind.

"Yes it is free - all you have to do is stand back and let someone else do it for you"

Anyway - you're right - unfortunately far too few realize it and I am therefore simply disgruntled.

Borg

[Melanie_]

Borg -

I respect and value the job of soldiers, but I refuse to feel guilty for not being one. Its not just standing back and letting someone else do "it" for you - we also serve the cause of freedom by simply going about our lives, living in a way that embodies and models freedom for others. As a woman, I like to think that I serve the cause of freedom with every paycheque I earn.

The article above was moving for me, a former "army brat" - I remember when my dad went to Cyprus in the early 70's. I don't think I really understood until years later what could have happened to him while he was gone, but I clearly remember being resentful that he wasn't there for a school play. Maybe he was just as unhappy to miss it.

[weaponeer]

Borg -

I respect and value the job of soldiers, but I refuse to feel guilty for not being one. Its not just standing back and letting someone else do "it" for you - we also serve the cause of freedom by simply going about our lives, living in a way that embodies and models freedom for others. As a woman, I like to think that I serve the cause of freedom with every paycheque I earn.

The article above was moving for me, a former "army brat" - I remember when my dad went to Cyprus in the early 70's. I don't think I really understood until years later what could have happened to him while he was gone, but I clearly remember being resentful that he wasn't there for a school play. Maybe he was just as unhappy to miss it.

I have no doubt your dad wanted to be there for you, and thought of you evry day he was gone. I am a soldier now, and I was a base brat too. My dad missed several occassions. People do not have to feel bad about not being a soldier. If everybody was a soldier nothing would get done here at home. Besides the line ups at supply are long enough now:)

I posted this just to let folks see it from the soldiers point of view, not the gov't now the media... People want to know and see progress over there, well ..... read on

[Borg]

Borg -

I respect and value the job of soldiers, but I refuse to feel guilty for not being one. Its not just standing back and letting someone else do "it" for you - we also serve the cause of freedom by simply going about our lives, living in a way that embodies and models freedom for others. As a woman, I like to think that I serve the cause of freedom with every paycheque I earn.

The article above was moving for me, a former "army brat" - I remember when my dad went to Cyprus in the early 70's. I don't think I really understood until years later what could have happened to him while he was gone, but I clearly remember being resentful that he wasn't there for a school play. Maybe he was just as unhappy to miss it.

You missed the point completely and I am too tired to go into it.

Borg

[Melanie_]

"Yes it is free - all you have to do is stand back and let someone else do it for you"

This is the point I was responding to, and I don't think I missed it at all. You want to engender guilt in those of us who aren't soldiers, and I refuse to be a part of that. It is self aggrandizing to say that those of use who aren't soldiers are standing back; all of us play a part, overt or subtle. It leads to the question - how much respect do you have for the average Canadian citizen, who is going about the business of being free?

[weaponeer]

"Yes it is free - all you have to do is stand back and let someone else do it for you"

This is the point I was responding to, and I don't think I missed it at all. You want to engender guilt in those of us who aren't soldiers, and I refuse to be a part of that. It is self aggrandizing to say that those of use who aren't soldiers are standing back; all of us play a part, overt or subtle. It leads to the question - how much respect do you have for the average Canadian citizen, who is going about the business of being free?

As long as they are law abiding people, I have all te respect in the world for them.....

[Army Guy]

Melanie:

The article above was moving for me, a former "army brat" - I remember when my dad went to Cyprus in the early 70's. I don't think I really understood until years later what could have happened to him while he was gone, but I clearly remember being resentful that he wasn't there for a school play. Maybe he was just as unhappy to miss it.

I just finsihed my tour in Afgan, the hardest part for me was not the combat, not the heat, or anything else, but missing my family and my kids. it would not be uncommon to shed a few tears after talking to them on the phone.

So ya i would say your dad felt the same way.

[Borg]

"Yes it is free - all you have to do is stand back and let someone else do it for you"

This is the point I was responding to, and I don't think I missed it at all. You want to engender guilt in those of us who aren't soldiers, and I refuse to be a part of that. It is self aggrandizing to say that those of use who aren't soldiers are standing back; all of us play a part, overt or subtle. It leads to the question - how much respect do you have for the average Canadian citizen, who is going about the business of being free?

Yes you are right - you are always right and I of course, am always wrong.

Sorry to have intruded into your world.

Borg

[leonardcohen]

"Yes it is free - all you have to do is stand back and let someone else do it for you"

This is the point I was responding to, and I don't think I missed it at all. You want to engender guilt in those of us who aren't soldiers, and I refuse to be a part of that. It is self aggrandizing to say that those of use who aren't soldiers are standing back; all of us play a part, overt or subtle. It leads to the question - how much respect do you have for the average Canadian citizen, who is going about the business of being free?

Yes you are right - you are always right and I of course, am always wrong.

Sorry to have intruded into your world.

Borg

http://www.ottawasun.com/News/National/200...887582-sun.html

I'm not sure whether this is appropiate to put this in, but i thought it would

be reminded of the price that soldiers pay to do their job..

[Catchme]

"Yes it is free - all you have to do is stand back and let someone else do it for you"

This is the point I was responding to, and I don't think I missed it at all. You want to engender guilt in those of us who aren't soldiers, and I refuse to be a part of that. It is self aggrandizing to say that those of use who aren't soldiers are standing back; all of us play a part, overt or subtle. It leads to the question - how much respect do you have for the average Canadian citizen, who is going about the business of being free?

This is not just engendering guilt, your are correct, it is trying to engender a superiority notion of deed, by fostering first the notion of guilt. There apparently is supposed to be more respect for those in the military, than for 'regular Canadians'. Which is complete nonsense. Who in the hell do they think are paying their wages and who are providing money for all the equipment and providing the money for 150k shells instead of programs and materials?

The story smacks of Jessica Lynch's story IMV, and beyond that it is a recruitment device trying to play to young hero's out there.

This is what our military was supposed to be doing there and using CIDA money/connections to build infrastructure. Glad to see it is now starting!!!!!!

The story also noted he was a specialist doing this, and THAT it was his first time there but he has been deployed around the world elsewhere over an 18 year period. Now one would ask, if we were supposed to be there reconstructing all this time, why weren't the "specialists" like him going in prior?

When the rich wage war, it's the poor who die. ~Jean-Paul Sartre

[White Doors]

Catchme

Nice that you are finally not pretending to be ex Canadian Forces any longer. What made you give that lie up anyways?

This is not just engendering guilt, your are correct, it is trying to engender a superiority notion of deed, by fostering first the notion of guilt. There apparently is supposed to be more respect for those in the military, than for 'regular Canadians'. Which is complete nonsense. Who in the hell do they think are paying their wages and who are providing money for all the equipment and providing the money for 150k shells instead of programs and materials?

Uhh.. we DO have remembrance day for a reason. Being a soldier and being in action makes you a VETERAN and yes we DO accord them special respect as it should be. Strange that you have an issue with that.

This is what our military was supposed to be doing there and using CIDA money/connections to build infrastructure. Glad to see it is now starting!!!!!!

Uhh, they always have been doing this. You just started to pay attention now it seems. But the world does not operate through your cloud of confusion about the issue.

The story also noted he was a specialist doing this, and THAT it was his first time there but he has been deployed around the world elsewhere over an 18 year period. Now one would ask, if we were supposed to be there reconstructing all this time, why weren't the "specialists" like him going in prior?

If you read SLOWLY you would see he is a reservist. Also, I imagine that there are other people that are qualified to do his job in the CDN forces, so just because he is a specialist does not mean he is the only one.

You feel better now?

When the rich wage war, it's the poor who die.

War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself.

John Stuart Mill (1806 - 1873)

[weaponeer]

"Yes it is free - all you have to do is stand back and let someone else do it for you"

This is the point I was responding to, and I don't think I missed it at all. You want to engender guilt in those of us who aren't soldiers, and I refuse to be a part of that. It is self aggrandizing to say that those of use who aren't soldiers are standing back; all of us play a part, overt or subtle. It leads to the question - how much respect do you have for the average Canadian citizen, who is going about the business of being free?

This is not just engendering guilt, your are correct, it is trying to engender a superiority notion of deed, by fostering first the notion of guilt. There apparently is supposed to be more respect for those in the military, than for 'regular Canadians'. Which is complete nonsense. Who in the hell do they think are paying their wages and who are providing money for all the equipment and providing the money for 150k shells instead of programs and materials?

The story smacks of Jessica Lynch's story IMV, and beyond that it is a recruitment device trying to play to young hero's out there.

This is what our military was supposed to be doing there and using CIDA money/connections to build infrastructure. Glad to see it is now starting!!!!!!

The story also noted he was a specialist doing this, and THAT it was his first time there but he has been deployed around the world elsewhere over an 18 year period. Now one would ask, if we were supposed to be there reconstructing all this time, why weren't the "specialists" like him going in prior?

When the rich wage war, it's the poor who die. ~Jean-Paul Sartre

What happened, your soldier boyfriend dump you or something????

[Army Guy]

This is not just engendering guilt, your are correct, it is trying to engender a superiority notion of deed, by fostering first the notion of guilt. There apparently is supposed to be more respect for those in the military, than for 'regular Canadians'. Which is complete nonsense. Who in the hell do they think are paying their wages and who are providing money for all the equipment and providing the money for 150k shells instead of programs and materials?

Apparently you can't stand the fact that soldiers do contribute more to this nation than the ordinary citizen. And it pisses you off that soldiers are respected more for doing it.

I guess since your paying the bills i should ask you why most of the military equipment is older than both of us together. That i should be pionting the finger at the taxpayer and asking why ? is the military in the state it is today....Or perhaps you should stop taking credit for something you have no control over....that includes paying my wages, new equipment etc...

Everyone in Canada pays taxes including soldiers, it's all used in the common good of the nation, and only a small portion of those taxes collected are used to pay our wages, purchases new equipment. So before you fall off that high horse your on, take 2 seconds out of your busy day, and let this sink in, Our nations military provides more to this nation than this nation has provided the military...think about that next time some SAR tech risks his life dragging your ass out of the ocean, or our soldiers fight forest fires , floods, Ice storms, let alone carring out our nations forgien policy thru out the globe....Our nations soldiers don't ask for much... just your respect, something they have earned many times over...don't worry it won't cost you a dime...

[M.Dancer]

...think about that next time some SAR tech risks his life dragging your ass out of the ocean, or our soldiers fight forest fires , floods, Ice storms, let alone carring out our nations forgien policy thru out the globe....Our nations soldiers don't ask for much... just your respect, something they have earned many times over...don't worry it won't cost you a dime...

Well said

[Fat Freddie]

Borg -

I respect and value the job of soldiers, but I refuse to feel guilty for not being one. ......

I hardly think not being in the military makes you any less respected. The life of the military member is one that requires dedication to no one but the uniform. Sometimes being a civilian and supporting that person in uniform us just as important. I respect both the person who wears and the person who supports. Its the ones that preach peace and call those in uniform babykillers that I have no respect for. Just don't be afraid to tell one of them you are supporting them. And by the way, you don't have to agree with the war, you just have to respect that the people in uniform that are doing the job the people hated them most sent them on. Incase you weren't paying attention, it was the Liberals that started this mess. The Conservatives are the ones that are going to help the boys and girls finish it.

[hiti]

Why do our soldiers have older equipment? Because Canada was left to clean up $40 billion deficit and the cold war ended. Which meant all nations over the world were spending less on their military.

And don't ever mention that our soldiers went to Afghanistan equipped with the best vehicles that saved them when they were hit with road side bombs and bombers. Vehicles that a Liberal government supplied them with.

Now the following is interesting..... Quote: A simple example: the Afghan Women’s Society wanted money to purchase sewing equipment to make blankets to sell to raise money to buy more equipment and train more women to make more blankets to sell to buy more equipment to train more women, etc. They came to us looking for money. The Afghan National Police Force came to us looking for blankets to issue to their men in the field. We have many connections with the international organizations and non-governmental organizations who are interested in investing money in worthy and charitable causes that benefit local communities. So, we propose a project to an organization. They like it and donate the money, which we give to the women to pay for the equipment to make the blankets. The women make the blankets and give enough to the Afghan National Police to outfit their field officers, while selling the rest to facilitate their production and training cycle, which increases employment, which bolsters the economy. -end quote.

I have read the above example many times this past year. And I was wondering if the soldier who wants us to know what it is like has any other examples than the above repeat.

While we should respect and appreciate our military, they are not pawns to be used for political advantage.

[Army Guy]

hiti:

Why do our soldiers have older equipment? Because Canada was left to clean up $40 billion deficit and the cold war ended. Which meant all nations over the world were spending less on their military.

Not true, defense has never been a minor let alone major issue for Canadians. Our soldiers have older equipment because that is what Canadians where willing to give them, end of story...

As for the cold war ending , give me a break, even at the hieght of the cold war we only had 4 small brigades, a comparable airforce and navy, shit even luxenburg had a larger military than we did, exactly where is luxenburg anyways....4 small brigades to defend the 2 and largest nation in the world...

To put that in prespective, we are having problems suppling troops and equipment to Afgan and we now have 3 under manned brigades... We are they way we are because Canadians wanted it that way...although that is slowly changing today, we as a nation can only piont the finger at our selfs.

As for the Budget deficit did you mean deficit, or net federal debt, as they are two differnet animals?

And don't ever mention that our soldiers went to Afghanistan equipped with the best vehicles that saved them when they were hit with road side bombs and bombers. Vehicles that a Liberal government supplied them with.

OK ...you must be a liberal, yes they did purchase the LAV III for the military, what you forgot to mention was they did not purchase enough of the vehs, or enough of the add on armour kits, or enough parts, Ammo, etc etc and the LAV's were only one of many much needed pieces of equipment needed for the Afgan mission let alone the defence of Canada.... but you should check the TO&E that the liberals did send us over to Afgan with, it includes the Ilitis jeep, the LSVW, MLVW, all light vehs, and not enough extra amour kits for Lavs or HLVW's.... Don't climb to high on that liberal horse, inregards to our nations military. The liberals had 12 or more years to look after DND and chose not to. the Conv have done more in one year for the military than the liberals entire reign. Thats what truely pisses the liberals off....

I have read the above example many times this past year. And I was wondering if the soldier who wants us to know what it is like has any other examples than the above repeat.

Your not interested in hearing about the mission, you've already made up your mind, along with most of the liberals, the DND web site has dozens of examples, along with most of the major media outlets. All it takes is a little effort to find.