Leafless Posted March 6, 2007 Report Share Posted March 6, 2007 Forget CO2 as the cause of global warming, now it's floating soot particles that change the chemistry of the air, scientists say, turning regular clouds into towering storm clouds through convection, or rising warm air. China and India seem to be to the blame for using sulphurous coal. http://www.canada.com/ottawacitizen/news/s...b02d9df&k=89291 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gc1765 Posted March 6, 2007 Report Share Posted March 6, 2007 Forget CO2 as the cause of global warming, How does this change the fact that CO2 causes global warming? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leafless Posted March 6, 2007 Author Report Share Posted March 6, 2007 Forget CO2 as the cause of global warming, How does this change the fact that CO2 causes global warming? You make outrageous statements without proof? What are you, a ding bat? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gc1765 Posted March 6, 2007 Report Share Posted March 6, 2007 You make outrageous statements without proof? What are you, a ding bat? Huh? What are you talking about? I asked you a simple question and that's how you respond? I'll give you a chance to redeem yourself....how does this change the fact that CO2 causes global warming? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leafless Posted March 7, 2007 Author Report Share Posted March 7, 2007 You make outrageous statements without proof? What are you, a ding bat? Huh? What are you talking about? I asked you a simple question and that's how you respond? I'll give you a chance to redeem yourself....how does this change the fact that CO2 causes global warming? Sorry, soot is not carbon dioxide, it is much larger particulate matter with higher heat retention qualities at a lower level (height) which do not stay in the atmosphere for any great length of time. So maybe you can prove to me how man made carbon dioxide (not natural) is the cause for accelerating the greenhouse effect to the point where these temperatures are actually responsible for warmer ground temperatures and extreme weather patterns. What this article is describing is the abnormal weather patterns caused by soot clouds resulting in abnormal global weather, with the soot primarily imported from China and India. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B. Max Posted March 7, 2007 Report Share Posted March 7, 2007 how does this change the fact that CO2 causes global warming? Maybe it does at the outer edge of the lunatic fringe, but here on earth CO2 does not cause global warming. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdobbin Posted March 7, 2007 Report Share Posted March 7, 2007 You make outrageous statements without proof? What are you, a ding bat? Why are you acting abusive? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gc1765 Posted March 7, 2007 Report Share Posted March 7, 2007 Sorry, soot is not carbon dioxide, it is much larger particulate matter with higher heat retention qualities at a lower level (height) which do not stay in the atmosphere for any great length of time. So maybe you can prove to me how man made carbon dioxide (not natural) is the cause for accelerating the greenhouse effect to the point where these temperatures are actually responsible for warmer ground temperatures and extreme weather patterns. What this article is describing is the abnormal weather patterns caused by soot clouds resulting in abnormal global weather, with the soot primarily imported from China and India. I know what soot is, thanks. Perhaps I'm not being clear enough here. I will try to make this as simple as possible, I hope you can understand. Your article states that soot, rather than global warming, is responsible for bad weather. Where does it say that CO2 does not cause global warming? There, that's as clear as I can make it. If you still fail to answer my question, I can only assume you are just trolling, and will be ignored. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck E Stan Posted March 7, 2007 Report Share Posted March 7, 2007 Where does it say that CO2 does not cause global warming? There, that's as clear as I can make it. If you still fail to answer my question, I can only assume you are just trolling, and will be ignored. Who says......you got it all wrong..... global warming causes co2, not co2 causes global warming. Global warming condemned as 'scam' "The fact is that [carbon dioxide] has no proven link to global temperatures," says Mr. Durkin. "Solar activity is far more likely to be the culprit." Scientists in the Channel 4 documentary cite what they claim is another discrepancy involving conventional research, saying that most of the recent global warming occurred before 1940, after which temperatures around the world fell for four decades. Mr. Durkin's skeptical specialists view this as a flaw in the official view, because the worldwide economic boom that followed the end of World War II produced more carbon dioxide, and therefore should have meant a rise in global temperatures -- something he says did not happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdobbin Posted March 7, 2007 Report Share Posted March 7, 2007 Who says......you got it all wrong..... global warming causes co2, not co2 causes global warming.Global warming condemned as 'scam' The last time Durkin had a global warming special on Channel 4, the network had to whimper apologies for being so wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catchme Posted March 7, 2007 Report Share Posted March 7, 2007 The religious right is trying to oust an evangelical leader for fighting global warming. Rev. Richard Cizik, an executive at the National Association of Evangelicals, has led Christian environmentalists for "creation care." In response, several groups have sent the NAE a letter suggesting he should be silenced or pushed out. Their complaints: 1) Global warming may not be caused by humans. 2) It's a left-wing hoax to promote birth control and impede capitalism. 3) It's a diversion from bigger issues such as abortion, gay marriage, and abstinence. Cynical view: Don't worry—if we destroy the world, God can make us another one in six days. (For a previous update on global warming, click here. For Human Nature's take on neo-creationism, http://www.slate.com/id/2161289/fr/rss/ sulfur particles in the air cause acid rain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leafless Posted March 7, 2007 Author Report Share Posted March 7, 2007 Perhaps I'm not being clear enough here. I will try to make this as simple as possible, I hope you can understand. Your article states that soot, rather than global warming, is responsible for bad weather. Where does it say that CO2 does not cause global warming? There, that's as clear as I can make it. If you still fail to answer my question, I can only assume you are just trolling, and will be ignored. Your the one that's trolling. You are not addressing the content of the article and choose to obfuscate this topic in order to impress your own concerns concerning another matter, primarily CO2. The article is NOT concerned with CO2 and ignores it. And you have not supplied proof, like I ask you to produce, that in fact man made CO2 is the cause of global warming. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catchme Posted March 7, 2007 Report Share Posted March 7, 2007 Here is just 1 recent thread that has also been started, plus, please do feel free to read ALL the other threads of the same topic here. All the other theads detailed quite clearly, just because topics have moved from the active list does not mean the info in them is not current or applicable. Aand you yourself have started many of them. One wonders why you keep trying the same old boring nonsense of asking for proof, then refusing to acknowledge it, and start yet another thread? http://www.mapleleafweb.com/forums//index....wtopic=8293&hl= Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jester Posted March 7, 2007 Report Share Posted March 7, 2007 just throwing some hot air around.......... http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/20...html?source=rss Mars Melt Hints at Solar, Not Human, Cause for Warming, Scientist Says they are all at it now, just shows nobody knows for sure everyone is just guessing....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leafless Posted March 7, 2007 Author Report Share Posted March 7, 2007 One wonders why you keep trying the same old boring nonsense of asking for proof, then refusing to acknowledge it, and start yet another thread? The topic covered here is "not boring nonsense" as science discovered a new factor: "It marked the first time climate scientists have been able to measure the effect of "aerosols" -- minute airborne particles -- on climate." The reason proof was asked for in this instance, related to CO2, was that gc1765 made a FACTUAL CLAIM concerning global warming which is simply not true. Your right, there have been many threads on the subject initiated and basically this is due to SCIENCE BEING IGNORANT on the subject and continually making newer claims on a regular basis, which in turn is picked up here and discussed. Blame scientist for all the confusion as they are the ones making the headlines and not members of this site. In fact the entire scientific community should perhaps keep their mouths shut, until they get it right. In the meantime we simply carry on as usual, agreed? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catchme Posted March 7, 2007 Report Share Posted March 7, 2007 It seems so weird, that some continually misconstrue what is being said, about climate change, what different factors are causing climate change, such as, GHG emissions causing global warming, particulate matter causing acid rain and increased storms, all of these things have been known and discussed for a couple of decades now. This article you linked to, is only stating that now they can measure accurately particulate matter, they have not founded a whole new science and debunked all other ones. Perhaps it is new to you, but not others. My cousin in Winnipeg got her PHD in environmental sciences in the late 80's, early 90's, studying sulfur particulate matter in air, and how it causes acid rain that is destroying ecosystems. In fact, that is what Mulroney's and Regan's clean air treaty was all about, in what was that 1984 or 1985? Truly, you need to get caught up, before you start stating things that are not correct. The fact is, and always has been since it was first identified, air pollution, in ALL its many different forms, causes climate/weather changes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catchme Posted March 7, 2007 Report Share Posted March 7, 2007 just throwing some hot air around..........http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/20...html?source=rss Mars Melt Hints at Solar, Not Human, Cause for Warming, Scientist Says they are all at it now, just shows nobody knows for sure everyone is just guessing....... Yes, you are throwing hot air around now, that National Geographic report was of one scientist, not ALL. And in fact, had you read further in the article, he was debunked. Amato Evan, a climate scientist at the University of Wisconsin, Madison, added that "the idea just isn't supported by the theory or by the observations." Planets' Wobbles The conventional theory is that climate changes on Mars can be explained primarily by small alterations in the planet's orbit and tilt, not by changes in the sun. "Wobbles in the orbit of Mars are the main cause of its climate change in the current era," Oxford's Wilson explained. (Related: "Don't Blame Sun for Global Warming, Study Says" [september 13, 2006].) All planets experience a few wobbles as they make their journey around the sun. Earth's wobbles are known as Milankovitch cycles and occur on time scales of between 20,000 and 100,000 years. These fluctuations change the tilt of Earth's axis and its distance from the sun and are thought to be responsible for the waxing and waning of ice ages on Earth. Mars and Earth wobble in different ways, and most scientists think it is pure coincidence that both planets are between ice ages right now. "Mars has no [large] moon, which makes its wobbles much larger, and hence the swings in climate are greater too," Wilson said. No Greenhouse Perhaps the biggest stumbling block in Abdussamatov's theory is his dismissal of the greenhouse effect, in which atmospheric gases such as carbon dioxide help keep heat trapped near the planet's surface. He claims that carbon dioxide has only a small influence on Earth's climate and virtually no influence on Mars. But "without the greenhouse effect there would be very little, if any, life on Earth, since our planet would pretty much be a big ball of ice," said Evan, of the University of Wisconsin. Most scientists now fear that the massive amount of carbon dioxide humans are pumping into the air will lead to a catastrophic rise in Earth's temperatures, dramatically raising sea levels as glaciers melt and leading to extreme weather worldwide. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
White Doors Posted March 7, 2007 Report Share Posted March 7, 2007 Truly, you need to get caught up, before you start stating things that are not correct. The fact is, and always has been since it was first identified, air pollution, in ALL its many different forms, causes climate/weather changes. How exactly does acid rain cause climate/weather changes again? I must have missed that one. LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leafless Posted March 7, 2007 Author Report Share Posted March 7, 2007 Truly, you need to get caught up, before you start stating things that are not correct. The fact is, and always has been since it was first identified, air pollution, in ALL its many different forms, causes climate/weather changes. How exactly does acid rain cause climate/weather changes again? I must have missed that one. LOL Don't you know? It causes people to drive more, creating more CO2. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leafless Posted March 9, 2007 Author Report Share Posted March 9, 2007 This article you linked to, is only stating that now they can measure accurately particulate matter, they have not founded a whole new science and debunked all other ones. Truly, you need to get caught up, before you start stating things that are not correct. The fact is, and always has been since it was first identified, air pollution, in ALL its many different forms, causes climate/weather changes. The article states more than 'measuring particulate matter'. It also stated: "The Pacific storm track matters more, the Molina team notes, because it influences the flow of air, and tropical heat, all the way around the globe." Does this not directly influence so called global warming, something we did not know before? BTW. Before you go off the deep end and criticize people alleging they don't know what they are talking about, consider this. 1.- Oceans alone emit 90 Billion tons of CO2 annually. 2.-Decaying vegetation emit another 90 Billion tons of CO2 annually. 3.-Man emits 6 Billion tons of CO2 annually. AGAIN THAT NUMBER IS 6-BILLION tons of CO2. 4.-100 Million years ago there was 6-times the amount of CO2 in the air than there is now and temperatures were marginally COOLER than they are to-day. 5.- There is NO scientific consensus that suggest CO2 is responsible for global warming. So it looks like you are the one that does not know what your talking about and owe me an apology. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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