Bush's Canadian 'Clone' in Jeopardy

[Catchme]

This actually is a very good article as it has broad examples and coverage, so its much more than just an opinion piece.

...Canada’s hard-line Conservative Prime Minister Stephen Harper may become the next ally of George W. Bush to be washed away.

Harper, who modeled his aggressive brand of conservatism on what the Republicans had done in the United States, is struggling in the polls and confronting a reenergized Liberal opposition that was encouraged by the Democratic victory.

The latest opinion surveys look grim for Harper. A pre-Christmas poll showed a surge in Liberal support, rising to slightly over 40 percent. Harper’s Conservatives stood at 33 percent with the Bloc Quebecois, the Greens and uncommitted dividing the remainder.

...Harper’s defeat in Canada would mean that yet another one of President Bush’s international compatriots would be out of a job. Among Bush’s key global allies, Spain’s Prime Minister Jose Aznar lost in 2004, Italy’s Prime Minister Silvio Berlusconi got the boot in 2006; and British Prime Minister Tony Blair has agreed to step down this year.

http://www.consortiumnews.com/2007/011707a.html

[tml12]

Harper's defeat would be an embarassment for Canada on the world stage. Why would we re-elect a party that basically runs an elected dictatorship? Can you imagine the Liberals undoing all the reform made by a PM whom I really believe is a man of the people? I am tired of the Liberals and their washed-up academic Dion. I hope Harper gets a big majority in the next election.

If the Liberals win the next election it will confirm what intelligent officials have known all along...that Canadians are alcoholics who can't live without the addictively paternal Liberal Party.

[PolyNewbie]

I think Harper deserves to be tried for treason - same with Martin - for the (secret) North American Union.

[tml12]

I think Harper deserves to be tried for treason - same with Martin - for the (secret) North American Union.

Why shouldn't there be a North American Union?

[guyser]

Harper's defeat would be an embarassment for Canada on the world stage.

You really think anyone would even notice?

[tml12]

I think Harper deserves to be tried for treason - same with Martin - for the (secret) North American Union.

Why shouldn't there be a North American Union?

I should add that I don't necessarily support one but I think it is coming in the future.

[tml12]

Harper's defeat would be an embarassment for Canada on the world stage.

You really think anyone would even notice?

No but I think there are probably some educated non-Canadians who follow Canadian politics. Furthermore, any educated individual who looks at the Liberal track record and sees that after 12 months Canadian voters were ready to put them back in might think this country was full of idiots.

I REALLY hope Harper gets a BIG majority in the next election...

[Catchme]

Decima Polls today show Liberals in the lead and the CPC dropping even in AB.

The world will in fact notice, rejoice and applaud, us for getting rid of Harper. He has been an embarrassment for us around the world. I.e. the 2 or so Lame Duck Awards given by world environmentalists, alignment with Bush, offensive operations in Afghanistan, starving children just outside Canadian bases in Afghanistan, rejection of Kyoto, not speaking out against the hanging of Saddam, gutting women's programs, etc etc etc. The only thing that has saved face for us, in The World optics, is the fact he is a minority government forced to work in a coalition.

Harper is crumbling and this is why:

In 1993, Harper ran for the House of Commons again, this time aided by a tactic pioneered by U.S. conservatives – having ostensibly independent organizations tear down one’s opponent with large sums of money outside the legal limits on campaign spending.

In this case, a group called the National Citizens Coalition went on the offensive against MP Hawkes, undermining his political support enough so that Harper was able to win the seat in Calgary West.

Harper was learning, too, from conservative spinmeister Frank Luntz, who helped Gingrich draft the “Contract With America,” which became the centerpiece of the Republican victory in the U.S. Congress in 1994. Luntz was a specialist at the take-no-prisoners-style of politics that envisioned permanent conservative control of Washington.

Harper picked up other tips from Bush’s political adviser Karl Rove, such as the importance of transforming the Christian evangelical movement into an activist base for conservative politics...

...The tone of Canadian political discourse followed this shift in the government, especially with CanWest media outlets ready to trumpet news that puts the Islamic world in the worst possible light.

[jefferiah]

not speaking out against the hanging of Saddam---Catch Me

Do you have Iraqi citizenship, may I ask? This is an Iraqi issue. In another post you said people who are not members of a said group do not have any business telling that group how to handle their issues.

"gutting women's programs"

What, cutting a few million off of the 23 million that The Advisory Council on The Status of Women gets to be a politically subsidized lobby group?

Cuts to MADD who basically abused the money they got?

[sharkman]

This actually is a very good article as it has broad examples and coverage, so its much more than just an opinion piece.

...Canada’s hard-line Conservative Prime Minister Stephen Harper may become the next ally of George W. Bush to be washed away.

Harper, who modeled his aggressive brand of conservatism on what the Republicans had done in the United States, is struggling in the polls and confronting a reenergized Liberal opposition that was encouraged by the Democratic victory.

The latest opinion surveys look grim for Harper. A pre-Christmas poll showed a surge in Liberal support, rising to slightly over 40 percent. Harper’s Conservatives stood at 33 percent with the Bloc Quebecois, the Greens and uncommitted dividing the remainder.

...Harper’s defeat in Canada would mean that yet another one of President Bush’s international compatriots would be out of a job. Among Bush’s key global allies, Spain’s Prime Minister Jose Aznar lost in 2004, Italy’s Prime Minister Silvio Berlusconi got the boot in 2006; and British Prime Minister Tony Blair has agreed to step down this year.

http://www.consortiumnews.com/2007/011707a.html

Not so fast. the article is obviously out to lunch with the description of Harper as a hard line conservative who models his conservativism on what the Republicans have done.

It is Bush who is completley against gay marriage, while Harper prefers civil unions, and Bush is a born again Christian, while Harper isn't.

This article is just more left wing trash, trying to round up Bush allies who have gone down to defeat, but ignoring Australia and misreading Great Britian(who did not get rid of Blair after his strong support of Bush), and Canada. Canada got rid of their PM who actually opposed the U.S. in the war on teror, namely Martin. A journalist who doesn't let the facts guide him or her is not worth reading.

Further, this 'journalist' mentions the bounce the Liberals received after electing Dion, but fails to mention that all parties get a temporary surge in the polls after a leader is elected. Also, CURRENT polls show both parties leading, depending on which poll you read.

[Catchme]

Not so fast. the article is obviously out to lunch with the description of Harper as a hard line conservative who models his conservativism on what the Republicans have done.

It is Bush who is completley against gay marriage, while Harper prefers civil unions, and Bush is a born again Christian, while Harper isn't.

... trying to round up Bush allies who have gone down to defeat, but ignoring Australia and misreading Great Britian(who did not get rid of Blair after his strong support of Bush), and Canada. Canada got rid of their PM who actually opposed the U.S. in the war on teror, namely Martin. A journalist who doesn't let the facts guide him or her is not worth reading.

Further, this 'journalist' mentions the bounce the Liberals received after electing Dion, but fails to mention that all parties get a temporary surge in the polls after a leader is elected. Also, CURRENT polls show both parties leading, depending on which poll you read

No, its absolutely true that Harper did model after Bush, the article even gave examples some of which are posted here, and Canadians have in fact been watching Harper be a Bush clone, and he is hard right.

Here is another example the article cited:

Harper even had brought in Republican advisers, such as political consultant Frank Luntz, to give pointers on how the Conservative Party could become as dominant in Canada as the GOP was in the United States.

Those Bush allies have gone down to defeat where have you been? Canada never got rid of Martin because he opposed the USA war on terror, interesting that you would even think that let alone postulate it.

Again the article says this:

Harper’s political movement also has lost the glow of inevitability, one of the chief organizing principles for the planned right-wing dominance across North America.

Instead, Canada appears to be turning against right-wing extremism, much as Americans did, in favor of more pragmatic politics.

A bounce is a temporary surge, a term that is common both sides of the border.

Today's Decima Poll has the Liberals ahead just as last weeks poll did from another polling firm. If we went to the polls now Liberals would probably get a minority. CPC does not have the numbers to make a minority when you go by region and the possible number of seats now available to them.

BTW the Robbin's Poll out today is useless propaganda.

The examples that Bush is against SSM while Harper prefers Civil Unions is semantics.

That Bush says he is born, and Harper does not, means nothing. We ALL know Darrel Reid got his position in Ottawa because he delivered a portion of the fundamentalist Christians. And most ALL know Bush is not born again and most likely isn't even Christian at all.

The journalist did let the facts tell the story something that many should learn.

[gc1765]

And most ALL know Bush is not born again and most likely isn't even Christian at all.

You are quite right...calling Bush a Christian is an insult to the religion.

[geoffrey]

The Harper is a hardline conservative concept is ridiculous... he's done nothing conservative yet.

[weaponeer]

Harper it the BEST PM this country has had in my life time. He absolutly scares the s#@t out of the left, because if he gets a majority they will have to work for a living, and they know it!!!

Work, responsibility, two words that terrify the left!! Working people controlling their own money, thinking for themselves, more frightening thoughts for the left. If they left does not get Harper out soon, people will see what he's really about, not scary at all.

The socialist utopias of eastern Europe fell, China is capitalist in all but name.

quote "THE BEST SOCIAL PROGRAM IS STILL A JOB". S. Harper!!!

[geoffrey]

Unfortunately that's not the Stephen Harper in office. The government collected 10% more in personal income tax last year. Increased spending at double the rate of inflation.

This is no capitalist revolution. This is the same old tax and spend and buy votes mentality that has plagued our country.

[Canadian Blue]

Has anyone noticed how whenever Catchme has to prove a point she uses some half ass radical leftist site.

offensive operations in Afghanistan

Strangely enough, the world must have poor opinion's of the American's, Brits, and Dutch as well.

But hey, we'll get to improve our reputation with Iran and Venezuela, and that's what really count's.

No, its absolutely true that Harper did model after Bush, the article even gave examples some of which are posted here, and Canadians have in fact been watching Harper be a Bush clone, and he is hard right.

Unless Harper was created in some test tube, he ain't a clone.

Canada never got rid of Martin because he opposed the USA war on terror

Yet he was the one that moved Canadian troop's down to the volatile south to take part in offensive action's, interesting.

Instead, Canada appears to be turning against right-wing extremism, much as Americans did, in favor of more pragmatic politics.

If Harper is extreme right wing, I can only assume the person making that claim is a communist.

Either way Catchme is an extreme leftist, I think she said that Venezuela is an example other countries should follow.

And Dr. King called for a positive alternative to the limited and heartless world view of our nation’s leaders, an alternative that people in places like Venezuela, Bolivia and people in activist communities here and around the world are now bringing to life:

The examples that Bush is against SSM while Harper prefers Civil Unions is semantics.

Howard Dean the former liberal Democratic governor of Vermont would disagree with you as he brought forward civil union's in the state of Vermont.

[blackascoal]

Sharkman,

This article is just more left wing trash, trying to round up Bush allies who have gone down to defeat, but ignoring Australia and misreading Great Britian(who did not get rid of Blair after his strong support of Bush), and Canada. Canada got rid of their PM who actually opposed the U.S. in the war on teror, namely Martin. A journalist who doesn't let the facts guide him or her is not worth reading.

I read a lot of british press brother, and Blair's decline because of his support for Bush is no misreading. Not even close. Canada, like the US, may have initially supported the war, but now everyone knows better.

There's a trail of Bush supporting world leaders who have been kicked out of office and hopefully Harper will be the next.

You can make a case for Australia .. NOW .. but who knows .. Australians may get smarter.

[Canadian Blue]

What about the Dutch government?

[stignasty]

This is from Friday's edition of the Lethbridge Herald. While it was on the front page of the paper, it wasn't on their website.

Tories soar in Alberta, stalled everywhere else

The Canadian Press

The federal Conservatives are flying high in Alberta but appear to be grounded just about everywhere else, a new poll suggests. <snip>

The survey by Decima Research, provided Thursday to the CP, puts the Conservatives and Liberals in a statistical dead heat in national support among decided and leaning voters.

But when Alberta respondents -- where Tory support is running four times that of the Liberals - - are taken out of the poll, the Liberals are seven percentage points ahead of the Conservatives in the rest of the country.

[Catchme]

Has anyone noticed how whenever Catchme has to prove a point she uses some half ass radical leftist site.

offensive operations in Afghanistan

As oposed to using some half assed right wing site? Prove it is radical!

Strangely enough, the world must have poor opinion's of the American's, Brits, and Dutch as well.

But hey, we'll get to improve our reputation with Iran and Venezuela, and that's what really count's.

The world does have a poor opinion of the the USA and Brits rregarding this, just where have you been? Now the Dutch on the other hand are a whole different can of worms.

Unless Harper was created in some test tube, he ain't a clone.

Apparently you have not heard of analogies!

Canada never got rid of Martin because he opposed the USA war on terror

Yet he was the one that moved Canadian troop's down to the volatile south to take part in offensive action's, interesting.

Catch up, I was responding to a poster who inferred that Canada got rid of Martin because he opposed the war on terror.

If Harper is extreme right wing, I can only assume the person making that claim is a communist.

You must be more extreme right wing than Harper then, now everything makes sense.

Either way Catchme is an extreme leftist, I think she said that Venezuela is an example other countries should follow.

My lying again, eh , I have never even mentioned Venezuala, nor am I extreme left. What is below is not my quote tyvm anyway!

And Dr. King called for a positive alternative to the limited and heartless world view of our nation’s leaders, an alternative that people in places like Venezuela, Bolivia and people in activist communities here and around the world are now bringing to life:

The examples that Bush is against SSM while Harper prefers Civil Unions is semantics.

Howard Dean the former liberal Democratic governor of Vermont would disagree with you as he brought forward civil union's in the state of Vermont.

Point?

[tml12]

Unfortunately that's not the Stephen Harper in office. The government collected 10% more in personal income tax last year. Increased spending at double the rate of inflation.

This is no capitalist revolution. This is the same old tax and spend and buy votes mentality that has plagued our country.

Harper has to play that card because Ontario accounts for 100+ seats in our dysfunctional first past the post SMP system.

I hope if he gets a majority he starts the Regan revolution here.

[cybercoma]

People who call Harper 'extreme right' should be laughed off this forum for their nonsense.

In fact, anyone who calls any Canadian politician 'extreme' or 'hard' or 'far' anything is ridiculous.

I may not like Jack Layton's ideas of the way our government should run, but to compare him to the extreme left in the United States is just as asinine as comparing Stephen Harper to the extreme right (something Bush certainly is not).

Look up some of the far left and far right radioshows that play in the US and you'll see how idiotic calling any of our politicians hard left, or far right really is.

[Canadian Blue]

I think Catchme considers far right sources to be CTV, CBC, CNN, BBC, Global, etc. Pretty well any mainstream media.

As oposed to using some half assed right wing site? Prove it is radical!

Well the conspiracy theories and the title pretty well shred any credibility you're "source" has.

The world does have a poor opinion of the the USA and Brits rregarding this, just where have you been? Now the Dutch on the other hand are a whole different can of worms.

No the Dutch are doing the same job as we are down in the south, so in this case the world should apparently rejoice when their government is taken down. Even though I'm pretty sure it'll only be a few third world countries.

Apparently you have not heard of analogies!

No, I've heard of blatant stupidity, and simple minded rhetoric.

You must be more extreme right wing than Harper then, now everything makes sense.

No I'm more of a liberal libertarian, I just hate people who think that you have to either be a bible thumping, right wing zealot, and a hawk, or a peacenik, hippy, bleeding heart liberal, and that their can't be any middle ground.

You're extreme left, since you think that Venezuela of all places is a country who is a shining example of what the rest of the world should be like.

My lying again, eh , I have never even mentioned Venezuala, nor am I extreme left. What is below is not my quote tyvm anyway!

Yes it is...http://www.mapleleafweb.com/forums//index.php?showtopic=7807

Wow first you lied about being in the military, and now you're lying about this. You did post it, so it must be representative of you're view.

And Dr. King called for a positive alternative to the limited and heartless world view of our nation’s leaders, an alternative that people in places like Venezuela, Bolivia and people in activist communities here and around the world are now bringing to life:

Point?

Simple, a civil union isn't simply semantics since it would give gay couples full benefits that a heterosexual couple has, only difference is that it's not called marriage thus finding a middle ground between gay rights activists and social conservatives.

I think my point was to show that you probably think Howard Dean is an extreme right wing fanatic as well, since any person with a simple knowledge of politics could figure out that Harper isn't that extreme with regards to how he has dealed with the issues.

People who call Harper 'extreme right' should be laughed off this forum for their nonsense.

In fact, anyone who calls any Canadian politician 'extreme' or 'hard' or 'far' anything is ridiculous.

I may not like Jack Layton's ideas of the way our government should run, but to compare him to the extreme left in the United States is just as asinine as comparing Stephen Harper to the extreme right (something Bush certainly is not).

Look up some of the far left and far right radioshows that play in the US and you'll see how idiotic calling any of our politicians hard left, or far right really is.

I second that, all it really does is add partisan rhetoric to a debate, while producing nothing productive.

[mikedavid00]

Why would we re-elect a party that basically runs an elected dictatorship?... I hope Harper gets a big majority in the next election.

Bingo.

[Catchme]

Canadian Blue said: I think Catchme considers far right sources to be CTV, CBC, CNN, BBC, Global, etc. Pretty well any mainstream media.

BTW, One cannot compare BBC and CBC to CNN or CTV or Global.

Well the conspiracy theories and the title pretty well shred any credibility you're "source" has.

Conspiracy theories what conspiracy theories are there besides none? Harper had American handlers and advisors just as he said Harper did.

http://www.mclaughlinonline.com/services/p...cal/clients.htm

http://www.mclaughlinonline.com/services/p...cal/clients.htm

What is left about the title Consortium News Independent Investigative Journalism Since 1995?

You're extreme left, since you think that Venezuela of all places is a country who is a shining example of what the rest of the world should be like.

I never said a word about Venuzuela that was a quote of someone else's words. I clearly stated that at the begining, it seems you cannot read.

Yes it is...http://www.mapleleafweb.com/forums//index.php?showtopic=7807

Wow first you lied about being in the military, and now you're lying about this. You did post it, so it must be representative of you're view.

Again, having never lied about being in the military, but I have nothing to prove to you in that regard, and I am suspecting you are lying about being in the military by the same token.

However, in the spirit of fairness but not so as not to out myself completely, I will put my cap badge wording up.

Espirit D'Initiative

Simple, a civil union isn't simply semantics since it would give gay couples full benefits that a heterosexual couple has, only difference is that it's not called marriage thus finding a middle ground between gay rights activists and social conservatives.

I think my point was to show that you probably think Howard Dean is an extreme right wing fanatic as well, since any person with a simple knowledge of politics could figure out that Harper isn't that extreme with regards to how he has dealed with the issues.

There is no middle ground on rights, you either fully have them or you do not have them. I believe the democrats in the USA are close to the equivalent of the moderate right, in Canada.

People who call Harper 'extreme right' should be laughed off this forum for their nonsense.

Look up some of the far left and far right radioshows that play in the US and you'll see how idiotic calling any of our politicians hard left, or far right really is.

Harper is not to the extreme right as far as fascism I agree, but he is much further right than are the majority of Canadians, and who knows how far right he would go with a majority. No thanks on looking up extreme right I get enough of that from reading Freedominion the home of Harper's base. As for the extreme left in the USA, I did not know they had a left in the USA.

Harper can't be extreme in his policies yet, he has a minority government.