Why Are We Doing This U.S. Vs. Canada Thing?

[Zeitgeist]

1 hour ago, paxamericana said:

and don't forget, xenophobic. The most bigoted, hateful country on the North American continent, whose entire cultural premise, is that they're not American.

Apart from slavery, bounties on Indians and the odd massacre of civilians in places like Vietnam.  Canada doesn’t have nearly the brutal history of racism and violence, but if you behave yourselves, you too can someday wear a maple leaf.  When you’re looking to invade, you can replace it with an eagle and talons.  

[paxamericana]

46 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

Canada doesn’t have nearly the brutal history of racism and violence

Oh I didn't know amnesia was also a Canadian affliction, history didn't start in 1834 but if we're going to play Archaeology and dig up things from the past, is that why Canada celebrates it's indigenous people day?You all seem so insistent on atoning... I meant recognising this patchwork of hatred with the other provinces.

46 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

but if you behave yourselves

While we're here, don't kid yourselves, if anything, the list of Canadian war crimes mirror that of America right up to and including WWII. You sat out Vietnam, and refused to help the French so not much need to be said about that, but hey, you got your hands dirty there in Afghanistan. Look at you, a mini America with nearly identical war crimes. 

You know, for a country that insist it's not American you all can't help but behave like Americans. If anything I dare say, Canadians are MORE American than actual Americans.

Edited November 17, 2025 by paxamericana

[Zeitgeist]

34 minutes ago, paxamericana said:

Oh I didn't know amnesia was also a Canadian affliction, history didn't start in 1834 but if we're going to play Archaeology and dig up things from the past, is that why Canada celebrates it's indigenous people day?You all seem so insistent on atoning... I meant recognising this patchwork of hatred with the other provinces.

While we're here, don't kid yourselves, if anything, the list of Canadian war crimes mirror that of America right up to and including WWII. You sat out Vietnam, and refused to help the French so not much need to be said about that, but hey, you got your hands dirty there in Afghanistan. Look at you, a mini America with nearly identical war crimes. 

You know, for a country that insist it's not American you all can't help but behave like Americans. If anything I dare say, Canadians are MORE American than actual Americans.

On a serious note, I’m actually very worried about Canada.  The country significantly declined under Trudeau and I don’t see the same Liberal Party turning it around much.  Canada needs leadership that can articulate the precise reasons for this decline and make the hard decisions to turn it around.  Smart people can clearly identify most of the reasons, but I can summarize them generally as follows:

1. Falling birth rate (was an already concerning 1.7 that collapsed to 1.25 in the Trudeau years).  I can guess the reasons why: free birth control, promoting non-traditional sexuality, the most permissive abortion and assisted suicide in the West, and housing costs that make having kids unaffordable.

2. A completely unfounded shaming of Canadian culture and history by the Trudeau federal government as colonial and culturally “genocidal”.

3. A completely misguided economic policy that over regulated natural resource development, created costly programs around identity politics and international programs that neither help nor interest most Canadians, borrowing vast sums of money to pay for it all, and growing the size of government by almost 50%.

All of this was disastrous enough without even getting into the Emergencies Act Trudeau declared to try to maintain inane repressive policies that played loose with constitutional rights.

Canadians have foolishly ignored all of this out of fear that doing things differently is somehow caving into Trump. Canada seems locked into this insane self-flagellation. I don’t even think the Conservatives can fix it because Canadians have become scared of conservatives due to the constant fear mongering of state-funded media. Sometimes I think the Canadian government is exactly what’s holding Canada back, but Canadians hear the coercive rhetoric from the south and cling to what they know.

Edited November 17, 2025 by Zeitgeist

[paxamericana]

3 hours ago, Zeitgeist said:

I’m actually very worried about Canada.

The only way out is with American investment. Canada has natural resource but lack the capital and infrastructure to make full use of said resource. There is no one else to turn to because we're all ageing out. America has a young enough generation of size the Millennial to still support a consumption lead economy. An Economy that Canada could be part of... only one condition, 51st. So while I understand the self begrudging pride you all hold for not being American, I suggest you all do the right thing and at the very least, allow your sons and daughter the ability to become a 51st state when you die. Put a time on it, by year 2050 Canada will enter into formal negotiation of petition for statehood, as an example. You've no idea the amount of American cheddar that will pour into Canada if you did. 

Edited November 17, 2025 by paxamericana

[Zeitgeist]

4 hours ago, paxamericana said:

The only way out is with American investment. Canada has natural resource but lack the capital and infrastructure to make full use of said resource. There is no one else to turn to because we're all ageing out. America has a young enough generation of size the Millennial to still support a consumption lead economy. An Economy that Canada could be part of... only one condition, 51st. So while I understand the self begrudging pride you all hold for not being American, I suggest you all do the right thing and at the very least, allow your sons and daughter the ability to become a 51st state when you die. Put a time on it, by year 2050 Canada will enter into formal negotiation of petition for statehood, as an example. You've no idea the amount of American cheddar that will pour into Canada if you did. 

Are they even allowed to call that Cheddar?  Isn’t it “American Cheese” or some such knock-off?

[herbie]

How dare we protect a paltry dairy industry while the mighty Trump steals our entire auto industry!
Who do we think we are hiding that nickel from the muggers who are stealing our wallet?

[paxamericana]

50 minutes ago, herbie said:

How dare we protect a paltry dairy industry while the mighty Trump steals our entire auto industry!
Who do we think we are hiding that nickel from the muggers who are stealing our wallet?

I mean if you all want to protect a noncompetitive industry at the cost of your other lively hood then that's on you Canada. 

[Zeitgeist]

1 hour ago, paxamericana said:

I mean if you all want to protect a noncompetitive industry at the cost of your other lively hood then that's on you Canada. 

Okay let’s bring some reality to these taunts.  No Canadian will support Canada, a country that’s geographically larger than the USA, becoming one single US state.  It would be mismanagement even from a self-interested US point of view to try to run a massive, complex country as a single US state without regard to provincial and territorial legislatures.  This isn’t Alaska. If that’s all the U.S. Feds have to offer, it’s not happening, ever.  It’s at least 10 states and three territories with a federal government with nation status called Canada, forever.  If the U.S. can work with that and forge some kind of mutually beneficial partnership that gives the citizens of both countries the maximum access to each country’s opportunities possible while protecting the sovereignty of each country, we can do something here. Otherwise you can eat supply management and stuff your American cheese where the sun don’t shine.  We’ll figure it out on our own.  
 

 

 

Edited November 18, 2025 by Zeitgeist

[paxamericana]

7 hours ago, Zeitgeist said:

We’ll figure it out on our own.  

Mhmmm, and yet Canada is still b*tching everytime America changes its foreign trade policy. We've been neighbours for at least 200 years, you'd think Canadians would have learned by now... 

Everyone is making deals with America except Canada it seems. 

Edited November 19, 2025 by paxamericana

[Zeitgeist]

On 11/18/2025 at 10:18 PM, paxamericana said:

Mhmmm, and yet Canada is still b*tching everytime America changes its foreign trade policy. We've been neighbours for at least 200 years, you'd think Canadians would have learned by now... 

Everyone is making deals with America except Canada it seems. 

More like everyone is reluctantly doing damage control in the face of a might is right extortionist mercantilist America.  Few had the balls to push back, but actually Canada did push back.  We have a diverse economy on the supply side, a growing domestic market, and we’re expanding non-US trade.  I would just be careful not to expect countries to be so willing to support US initiatives going forward.  Countries will set up new partnerships and supply new customers.  The U.S. is now seen as a shrinking export market with unpredictable, unreliable trade and other policies.  Even many U.S. companies and citizens are pissed at the arbitrary, undemocratic way costs have been added to their supply chains and goods, including some of the biggest manufacturers.  We can’t influence US policy much, but we can control our own.

Btw, America is looking very weak and gullible on the Ukraine file.  I guess as usual it’s going to be the Brits who lead the way with moral compass, which Canada will once again support.

Edited November 20, 2025 by Zeitgeist

[paxamericana]

9 hours ago, Zeitgeist said:

might is right extortionist mercantilist America.  Few had the balls to push back, but actually Canada did push back.

Canada is a prideful ideot. You got invited to the racket and decided to voluntarily proceed with being scammed. That’s on you Canada.

Edited November 21, 2025 by paxamericana

[Zeitgeist]

15 hours ago, paxamericana said:

Canada is a prideful ideot. You got invited to the racket and decided to voluntarily proceed with being scammed. That’s on you Canada.

We’re avoiding a scam.  

[paxamericana]

1 hour ago, Zeitgeist said:

We’re avoiding a scam.  

Mmmmhmmm

[Zeitgeist]

50 minutes ago, paxamericana said:

Mmmmhmmm

Russia has been given the message by the U.S. that it’s fine to invade countries and that the invaded countries should simply capitulate, give up territory, accept restrictions on the size of their military, and be barred from joining international organizations even if the citizens democratically choose to join those organizations.  The U.S. looks weak, gullible, and undemocratic.  Russia looks stronger than the U.S.  A bad deal demonstrating no moral compass. Really Europe should take over negotiations between Putin and Zelensky.  Everyone knows it.

There’s a case to be made that NATO should not expand eastward, because Secretary of State James Baker had promised that it wouldn’t expand an inch east.  That’s the only arguable concession here.  The UN should be in the Russian occupied regions with third party observers and reps from Ukraine and Russia to ensure that the citizens of the Dombass vote to decide whether to have independence or be part of Ukraine or Russia.  No other conditions are necessary, apart from maintaining penalties on Russia if it continues the invasion.  

Edited November 21, 2025 by Zeitgeist

[paxamericana]

1 hour ago, Zeitgeist said:

Russia looks stronger than the U.S

Wut?

1 hour ago, Zeitgeist said:

A bad deal demonstrating no moral compass.

Such as not paying your NATO bills right?

1 hour ago, Zeitgeist said:

Secretary of State James Baker had promised that it wouldn’t expand an inch east.

I don't think Russian history supports that notion. It's Russia who is looking to expand westward. They've been doing so ever since the Soviet Union collapsed. They're trying to regain their lost territory of the Warsaw pact. Russia doesn't want Ukraine, they want Poland, Romanian and the Baltic countries. 

Edited November 21, 2025 by paxamericana

[Zeitgeist]

6 hours ago, paxamericana said:

Wut?

Such as not paying your NATO bills right?

I don't think Russian history supports that notion. It's Russia who is looking to expand westward. They've been doing so ever since the Soviet Union collapsed. They're trying to regain their lost territory of the Warsaw pact. Russia doesn't want Ukraine, they want Poland, Romanian and the Baltic countries. 

Yes.  Poland and the Baltic states are NATO countries and off limits to Putin. 

[herbie]

Dumb f*ck is so duped by Trump's rhetoric he thinks NATO charges fees for memberahip. Maybe you should boot Icelanf out and let the Russians take it over.

As to the subject at hand that couch f*cking Minime says it has nothing to do with Trump at all so Canada must be just making up grievances out of thin air.

[paxamericana]

9 hours ago, herbie said:

so Canada must be just making up grievances out of thin air.

Canada is absolutely making grievances out of thin air. Canada is the aggressor, it was graciously offered Statehood, refused and attempted to meddle in American affairs illegitimately. Canada is lucky to only be slapped on the wrist with an additional 10% tariff. 

Edited November 23, 2025 by paxamericana

[Zeitgeist]

8 hours ago, paxamericana said:

Canada is absolutely making grievances out of thin air. Canada is the aggressor, it was graciously offered Statehood, refused and attempted to meddle in American affairs illegitimately. Canada is lucky to only be slapped on the wrist with an additional 10% tariff. 

Just keep taxing yourselves and your companies that were taking advantage of resources and energy from Canada. Pretty self-destructive on the whole, and in any event, it probably isn’t supported by the majority of Americans.  Despotic vibes.

An offer to join the U.S. would’ve been fine and perhaps even welcomed by a significant part of the population if it was framed as a preservation of the provincial and territorial legislatures, as well as an administrative centre in Ottawa regarding affairs within the Canadian states and territories.  It probably wouldn’t be adopted by the majority of the population, but it would’ve started a dialogue on how such integration could work at some point.  51st state is dead in the water.

Trump’s rhetoric was a recipe for anti-Americanism.  The way to repair it is to start talking partnership.  Keep the countries, maximize opportunities for the citizens to live , work and trade in either country, and gradually eliminate duplication.  I don’t see it happening under current leadership in both countries, which is a missed opportunity.

Edited November 23, 2025 by Zeitgeist

[paxamericana]

14 hours ago, Zeitgeist said:

a missed opportunity.

Like a petulant child who refuses medicine. It’s better for America to pick the best of the litter than to let you all join. Open immigration for young  successful Canadian. The rest of Canada can sulk. 

[Barquentine]

On 11/17/2025 at 3:18 PM, Zeitgeist said:

1. Falling birth rate (was an already concerning 1.7 that collapsed to 1.25 in the Trudeau years).

Do some research. That's a worldwide trend.

 

On 11/17/2025 at 3:18 PM, Zeitgeist said:

2. A completely unfounded shaming of Canadian culture and history by the Trudeau federal government as colonial and culturally “genocidal”.

You want to rewrite history? Can you write the Beothuks back into existence?

 

On 11/17/2025 at 3:18 PM, Zeitgeist said:

3. A completely misguided economic policy

Some truth to that, not enough focus on productivity. But the pandemic and ensuing problems also hurt us badly.

 

On 11/17/2025 at 3:18 PM, Zeitgeist said:

the Emergencies Act Trudeau declared

Right or wrong, that had nothing to do with the economy.

On 11/17/2025 at 6:27 PM, paxamericana said:

American cheddar

HA! That's as much an oxymoron as you are.

[Zeitgeist]

4 hours ago, paxamericana said:

Like a petulant child who refuses medicine. It’s better for America to pick the best of the litter than to let you all join. Open immigration for young  successful Canadian. The rest of Canada can sulk. 

Really we just need to keep our resources and capitalize on them with our own made in Canada manufacturing and resource developers.  It will take time, but eventually it should make Canadians very well off. 

[Zeitgeist]

4 hours ago, Barquentine said:

Do some research. That's a worldwide trend.

 

You want to rewrite history? Can you write the Beothuks back into existence?

 

Some truth to that, not enough focus on productivity. But the pandemic and ensuing problems also hurt us badly.

 

Right or wrong, that had nothing to do with the economy.

HA! That's as much an oxymoron as you are.

Support your comments with evidence.  Canada’s birth rate is at 1.25.  The U.S.‘s is 1.6.  We were on par or higher than the U.S. birth rate under Harper.  Trudeau has really damaged Canada. Btw, it’s very hard to reverse low birth rates.  Mass immigration will simply erase Canadian culture and values.  In that regard it may be better for Canada to fold itself into the U.S., if our government continues to dismantle Canada’s founding cultures.  Low birth rate is cultural suicide.

Edited November 24, 2025 by Zeitgeist

[paxamericana]

1 hour ago, Zeitgeist said:

made in Canada manufacturing

For which consumer exactly? Has it occurred to you that having magical production means nothing without customer on the other side? You have a decreasing population. 

[Zeitgeist]

1 hour ago, paxamericana said:

For which consumer exactly? Has it occurred to you that having magical production means nothing without customer on the other side? You have a decreasing population. 

China and India.  Oh yeah, Europe and emerging economies in Africa, S America and Asia.  The U.S. is losing importance economically relative to other growing economies. Look, I’d prefer to do more business with the U.S. in terms of cultural and political alignment generally, but the U.S. seems intent on screwing up its relationships with allies and shaking down the rest of the world financially, a sign of economic and moral decline in general.  It’s also a sign of America’s seemingly intractable debt problem.  They’re fracking trading partners for change in the sofas.  

Edited November 24, 2025 by Zeitgeist