Should mental Health Professionals Be Culpable For Failures Like The Maine Shooting?

[CdnFox]

9 minutes ago, Hodad said:

To "school" someone you'd do better to try saying something remotely intelligent. I simply can't take you seriously. It's like trying to argue with a crazy guy ranting in a street corner. 

Pot meet kettle. Kettle , pot.

 

Edited November 1, 2023 by CdnFox

[Guest]

8 hours ago, Hodad said:

You asked for data.

I asked for proof that there were actual systems in society, stopping women or minorities from advancing. 

There are none. 

Let's just say I put an ad out for a receptionist. I call all qualified candidates.

I call 12 that have Indian names. Of the 12, 2 of them have a strong spoken English--a prerequisite for the role. Based on your "data", those 10 others, are subject to "social barriers". 

Nobody will say this in public, because it's racially insensitive.

I still remember being served at a gas station. I walk in to prepay for my gas, and I tell the clerk my pump number and amount desired:

"Kay vish?"

Huh?

"Vood you like kay vish"

No, that's okay, just the fuel please.

"Kay vish cheaper"

At this point am grimacing, as have no clue what he is talking about. 

"Kay vish?"

No kay vish. Only fuel. (am starting to feel my race will come out if he asks one more time)

At this point, he looks at me highly offended. I don't know what I said. I honestly feel he is offering me Indian food for all I know.

Then he sticks his head out, to see the sign next to me, and points to the options he was trying to upsell me on. I feel incredibly low IQ, and apologize.

Oh, a car wash. 

Again to you, him being stuck in low pay jobs, is because of his skin color. 

9 hours ago, Hodad said:

I sure have seen it in the workplace though.

So have I. There still is no proof that this is systematic.

My wife is Asian. She worked for a large corporation, and was seen as a pretty skirt.

Higher ranking men would make advances towards her. She politely turned them down.

They tried to ruin her. One issue. She is an entrepreneur through and through. Networking is her super power. She builds strong networks, and is a strong communicator. This caught the eye of the CEO and highest ups. 

She earned her promotion. She is smart enough to know what she needs to be the best, and so puts herself in a position where no competition can touch her.

If she gives up and quits, its because of her gender according to you.

This ignores how cut throat that corporate jobs are. How competitive. You are bumping elbows with people who put all of their energy into growth. Will destroy you to get ahead.

Either you're cut for it, or aren't.

Again. You assume that one not cut for it, is due to gender or race.

You leave qualifications out of the conversation. This is what makes your numbers incredibly unreliable.

My alcoholic uncle on my dads side who has a wife and 7 kids and is a welfare fraud.

Uses food money on booze and strippers.

Will whip his d*** out anywhere and pee. Against a fence, with horrified preschoolers staring in horror? No problem. I was unfortunately in his car, hiding, a few years before cutting him out of my life.

To you, his complaints about white people holding him back, are accurate. Him f***ing his own life up, is out of the question. I wouldn't hire him if you paid me to. To you, am racist. Has nothing to do with race. He is a horrible human and I feel sorry for his kids.

Hard to challenge your numbers publicly, without coming across as racist. Its why they're effective to use, but are just meaningless stats that don't point to any reality socially.

Again. Asian people tend to do better than white people, socially and academically. 

A heavy amount of entrepreneurs are Asian (including my wife). This alone, throws your stats in the garbage.

Doesn't mean Asian people aren't heavily discriminated against. It just points to their high success, despite this.

9 hours ago, Hodad said:

But it's objectively true that I would have had to work X% harder if I had been a minority or a woman.

Let's say your stats prove this. How does this stop you from opportunity? Systematically, no less.

[WestCanMan]

11 hours ago, Hodad said:

To "school" someone you'd do better to try saying something remotely intelligent. I simply can't take you seriously. It's like trying to argue with a crazy guy ranting on a street corner. 

You'd say the same thing to Nikola Tesla or Albert Einstein. Everything I say is over your head. 

[Hodad]

10 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

You'd say the same thing to Nikola Tesla or Albert Einstein. Everything I say is over your head. 

Aw, the pitiful thing is you probably believe this. Bless your heart.

[robosmith]

On 10/31/2023 at 2:03 AM, Perspektiv said:

Hardship is part of life. 

It is part of SOME lives. Others have it VERY EASY.

Like the son of the company owner, who has been chosen by the boss to succeed him.

Esp if he inherited his father's (or mother's) brains.

Hardship (if any) is a very small part of life for (most of) the offspring of the very wealthy.

While your attitude is commendable, your vision is highly distorted and does not reflect the part of reality of which you are not familiar. 

[robosmith]

On 10/31/2023 at 10:32 AM, reason10 said:

If we are going to hold shrinks accountable for such things, why limit this to mass murders? How about the practice of emptying insane asylums, creating the current homelessness crisis we have now? There could be BILLIONS of dollars to be made in THOSE lawsuits.

Emptying insane asylums became the thing under Reagan. My mom worked in one, so I am aware why it closed and when.

Most of those who were deinstitutionalized from the nation’s public psychiatric hospitals were severely mentally ill.

Quote

As a psychologist who began practicing nearly 40 years ago, I’ve seen a significant shift in the care of the mentally ill since the mid-1980s — and it hasn’t been for the better. After the deinstitutionalization movement began in California in the 1960s, many state mental health hospitals closed, forcing many folks who needed a lot of care onto the streets. Without those facilities, many mentally ill people ended up in jails and prisons which are not set up to provide safe, compassionate care for brain illnesses. But in 1981, when President Ronald Reagan deinstitutionalized the mentally ill and emptied the psychiatric hospitals into so-called “community” clinics, the problem got worse.

 

[robosmith]

13 hours ago, CdnFox said:

Pot meet kettle. Kettle , pot.

 

Kettle and pot in ^one.

[robosmith]

1 hour ago, WestCanMan said:

You'd say the same thing to Nikola Tesla or Albert Einstein. Everything I say is over your head. 

Your predictions/speculations are NOT over anyone's head. In FACT they are downright stupid because you really don't know.

I see your logical fallacies here all the time, have demonstrated them to you, and called you on them.

Like your belief that WAPO reporting one "false" scenario (when it's proven true), means every other one is also false.

That is an obvious logical fallacy.

Meanwhile Trump LIES ALL THE TIME, yet you TRY TO defend every one with your logical fallacy.

Your arrogance is unjustified by your posting history here.

[Guest]

43 minutes ago, robosmith said:

It is part of SOME lives. Others have it VERY EASY.

You're assuming as such.

Money helps, but it also will help amplify whatever issue that you're dealing with.

If you're dealing with addiction, well you're now dealing with addiction with far more enablers surrounding you. 

I know tons of rich kids who f***ed up their lives. 

If they have high profile parents, there is a pressure to behave a certain way and a freedom that is removed from you. 

Many documented cases of kids who couldn't handle that pressure and living under a microscope.

75% of lotto winners turn out to bring broke within just over 5 years of winning.

What you should do, is find better data, vs assuming things about entire demographics of people decrying discrimination, ironically enough.

[robosmith]

35 minutes ago, Perspektiv said:

You're assuming as such.

Nope. It is de facto true. Of course having an easy life does not prohibit making bad decisions wrt not keeping it.

35 minutes ago, Perspektiv said:

Money helps, but it also will help amplify whatever issue that you're dealing with.

If you inherit your parents' intelligence, that doesn't have to be a factor.

35 minutes ago, Perspektiv said:

If you're dealing with addiction, well you're now dealing with addiction with far more enablers surrounding you. 

Addiction is a choice. And not a smart one. When I was a kid, I tried cigarettes my Dad got on an airliner.

A day later I wanted to try another, and asked myself why? I was smart enough to know the answer and decided not to.

35 minutes ago, Perspektiv said:

I know tons of rich kids who f***ed up their lives. 

Doesn't mean they didn't have it easier than the millions of less fortunate who also ruined their lives.

35 minutes ago, Perspektiv said:

If they have high profile parents, there is a pressure to behave a certain way and a freedom that is removed from you. 

The answer is simple: choose better parents. I should have chosen the wealthy ones.

35 minutes ago, Perspektiv said:

Many documented cases of kids who couldn't handle that pressure and living under a microscope.

Doesn't mean they didn't have it easier than the millions of less fortunate who also ruined their lives.

35 minutes ago, Perspektiv said:

75% of lotto winners turn out to bring broke within just over 5 years of winning.

They had a much greater chance than those who didn't win.

35 minutes ago, Perspektiv said:

What you should do, is find better data, vs assuming things about entire demographics of people decrying discrimination, ironically enough.

There is certainly discrimination, and while it does not prohibit success, it makes success much less likely.

Just like wearing weights makes it unlikely you'll set any world records at the Olympics.

[CdnFox]

1 hour ago, robosmith said:

Kettle and pot in ^one.

SIgh.  I've confused you again haven't I.  

I'll explain the joke to you - just give me a minute to find some crayons first.   

[CdnFox]

1 hour ago, robosmith said:

Emptying insane asylums became the thing under Reagan. My mom worked in one, so I am aware why it closed and when.

yea - that's called 'Home schooling' now but we're glad she finally got you out of the house.  Go on.   

[Guest]

26 minutes ago, robosmith said:

Of course having an easy life

You're assuming being wealthy is easy.

Born into wealth and keeping it, I will give you that. But acquiring wealth?

You're lumping a whole lot of people in the same box. It also assumes the parents chose to give their kids a silver spoon, vs building their child on merit, so that they can actually succeed in life. 

27 minutes ago, robosmith said:

Addiction is a choice.

As is sitting on your loins, vs powering through adversity.

Adversity affects everyone. Rich to poor. 

You clearly haven't spent any time around movers and shakers.

Many are built different.

Growing up poor, I was surrounded by people who made excuses. Blamed others. While not all poor people are like this, some of those who stay in their situation, are. Your stats are to vague to tell one from the other.

I am now surrounded by business people, and they are often solution based. Regardless of gender and skin color.

My wife got out of extreme poverty because this set her apart. 

You present her with a wall, she will figure a way around it, under it, or buy the tools to get her through it. If all else fails, she'll add 3 corners and a roof, and sell it.

Success isn't a secret. Certainly isn't something that bars minorities from access. 

However, if difficulty stops you, one thing is certain, you will never experience it.

Won't matter if you're white, black or of any other demographic.

37 minutes ago, robosmith said:

They had a much greater chance than those who didn't win.

If you win the lotto with horrible money management skills, that will be amplified tenfold. If you think buying a Bugatti and 6 homes is a wise choice, not realizing the insurance on the car alone, along with maintenance will set you back tens of thousands of dollars, then that is part of the problem. 

You're associating money with privilege. 

Knowing what to do with it, is far more powerful than acquiring it.

Go to China. Millions there build their wealth brick by brick, living modestly. 

Many are taught investment. How stocks work. Understand the difference between a liability and an asset. Understand that banks just hold your money. See through it and learn how to grow their money.

In the black community, find me one prominent voice teaching this. 

You can easily become a millionaire by the time you're 50, if you invest wisely.

Again. Tell me that this is because of racism, and isn't cultural.

45 minutes ago, robosmith said:

There is certainly discrimination, and while it does not prohibit success, it makes success much less likely.

You're cherry picking stats to point to a problem that doesn't exist.

Tell me something. What is the percentage of fatherless black youth?

The percentage of high school drop outs?

Teenage mothers?

These are what you call demonstrable obstacles to success.

What you're selling is garbage.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, robosmith said:

They had a much greater chance than those who didn't win.

I was raised to hate white people. The police. They all were bad. 

Yet the only people who would steal from me or try to harm me, looked black just like me.

I knew so many growing up who "couldn't find jobs", but would quickly grow defensive at being asked how many applications that they sent. 

If they had adapted the resume to the job they were seeking. If they sent a cover letter, further separating themselves from the competition. 

Apparently adjusting to the job market and pitching my skills in a more efficient manner, made me white.

Funny thing, is all my relatives that think like this, are wealthy.

Sorry, but until you show stats that prove otherwise, in a free society the only person who can stop you ultimately, is you.

I just don't buy that ambition, coupled with tenacity and vision is stoppable. 

If you see yourself as inferior because of your skin color, you have already lost in the game of life. 

If you see yourself as superior, because you're white, you are the one who is being prejudiced.

[robosmith]

1 hour ago, Perspektiv said:

I was raised to hate white people. The police. They all were bad. 

Yet the only people who would steal from me or try to harm me, looked black just like me.

I knew so many growing up who "couldn't find jobs", but would quickly grow defensive at being asked how many applications that they sent. 

If they had adapted the resume to the job they were seeking. If they sent a cover letter, further separating themselves from the competition. 

Apparently adjusting to the job market and pitching my skills in a more efficient manner, made me white.

Funny thing, is all my relatives that think like this, are wealthy.

Sorry, but until you show stats that prove otherwise, in a free society the only person who can stop you ultimately, is you.

I just don't buy that ambition, coupled with tenacity and vision is stoppable. 

If you see yourself as inferior because of your skin color, you have already lost in the game of life. 

If you see yourself as superior, because you're white, you are the one who is being prejudiced.

Discrimination is based on the attitudes of others, not necessarily you.

Sure you can be self-defeating JUST LIKE ANYONE ELSE.

But if you choose to not recognize the extra barriers you face, that is just you not facing reality. Maybe it works better for you, since you put in the the extra effort. But for people who lack your confidence, it may be very different.

However, it is not nearly as bad today as in prior years. That is affirmative action which put many more people like yourself in the position of decision maker. That was success, that helped you succeed.

Employers' Replies to Racial Names

Quote

Job applicants with white names needed to send about 10 resumes to get one callback; those with African-American names needed to send around 15 resumes to get one callback.

 

[robosmith]

1 hour ago, Perspektiv said:

You're assuming being wealthy is easy.

Born into wealth and keeping it, I will give you that. But acquiring wealth?

Of course I mentioned being born to the company OWNER'S family. Pay attention.

1 hour ago, Perspektiv said:

You're lumping a whole lot of people in the same box. It also assumes the parents chose to give their kids a silver spoon, vs building their child on merit, so that they can actually succeed in life. 

Almost all do the former.

1 hour ago, Perspektiv said:

As is sitting on your loins, vs powering through adversity.

No one said otherwise. The issue is the artificial barriers.

1 hour ago, Perspektiv said:

Adversity affects everyone. Rich to poor. 

VERY DIFFERENTLY. The paycheck to paycheck guy faces existential threats that the rich guy doesn't.

1 hour ago, Perspektiv said:

You clearly haven't spent any time around movers and shakers.

I have met my share of company VPs. And VP wanna be's.

1 hour ago, Perspektiv said:

Many are built different.

Growing up poor, I was surrounded by people who made excuses. Blamed others. While not all poor people are like this, some of those who stay in their situation, are. Your stats are to vague to tell one from the other.

I am now surrounded by business people, and they are often solution based. Regardless of gender and skin color.

My wife got out of extreme poverty because this set her apart. 

You present her with a wall, she will figure a way around it, under it, or buy the tools to get her through it. If all else fails, she'll add 3 corners and a roof, and sell it.

Success isn't a secret. Certainly isn't something that bars minorities from access. 

However, if difficulty stops you, one thing is certain, you will never experience it.

Won't matter if you're white, black or of any other demographic.

If you win the lotto with horrible money management skills, that will be amplified tenfold. If you think buying a Bugatti and 6 homes is a wise choice, not realizing the insurance on the car alone, along with maintenance will set you back tens of thousands of dollars, then that is part of the problem. 

You're associating money with privilege. 

Of course MONEY BUYS PRIVILEGE. It also buys you 2nd and 3rd chances which the poor never get.

Like Trump whose daddy bailed out numerous times.

1 hour ago, Perspektiv said:

Knowing what to do with it, is far more powerful than acquiring it.

Go to China. Millions there build their wealth brick by brick, living modestly. 

Many are taught investment. How stocks work. Understand the difference between a liability and an asset. Understand that banks just hold your money. See through it and learn how to grow their money.

In the black community, find me one prominent voice teaching this. 

You can easily become a millionaire by the time you're 50, if you invest wisely.

Again. Tell me that this is because of racism, and isn't cultural.

You're cherry picking stats to point to a problem that doesn't exist.

Tell me something. What is the percentage of fatherless black youth?

The percentage of high school drop outs?

Teenage mothers?

These are what you call demonstrable obstacles to success.

What you're selling is garbage.

What you're selling is only applicable to those with very above average talents.

[CdnFox]

19 minutes ago, robosmith said:

Discrimination is based on the attitudes of others, not necessarily you.

Sure you can be self-defeating JUST LIKE ANYONE ELSE.

But if you choose to not recognize the extra barriers you face, that is just you not facing reality. Maybe it works better for you, since you put in the the extra effort. But for people who lack your confidence, it may be very different.

However, it is not nearly as bad today as in prior years. That is affirmative action which put many more people like yourself in the position of decision maker. That was success, that helped you succeed.

Employers' Replies to Racial Names

 

LOL - you see that @Perspektiv,, he knows far better than you do about what challenges you face, and if you disagree you're just denying reality   thank god he's here to tell you all about your struggles  

LOL - honestly Robosmith, i'm reminded of that line from Deadwood - "What a type you must consort with to say such things and not fear a beating"  

[Guest]

17 minutes ago, robosmith said:

What you're selling is only applicable to those with very above average talents.

So the Asian community is more talented than the white community?

Why is it that an average Asian person coming from humble beginnings, will do far better, socially?

Or is their culture why more of them will value education and family more? That sloth and entitlement are shameful?

Is my wife more talented than her white counterparts?

Or was she raised to value family, to save herself for marriage, and to be diligent with her money, all while being explosed to entrepreneurial spirit, culturally?

All my Lebanese friends, are business owners. Why is that? Talent? Or culture?

All Filipinos I know, are property owners and have side hustles. Talent? 

I couldn't even start to tell you how many Indian people I know who run businesses. Many of which, don't have a strong English, but understand money and hustling. Talent?

Do you want me to show you graphs of how much better socially that Asian people do? 

Raise your kids well, they tend to do well in life. 

[reason10]

21 hours ago, robosmith said:

Emptying insane asylums became the thing under Reagan. My mom worked in one, so I am aware why it closed and when.

Most of those who were deinstitutionalized from the nation’s public psychiatric hospitals were severely mentally ill.

 

WRONG, liar.

JFK signed the bill deinstitutionalizing insane asylums. They only got attention under President Reagan because he had caused gasoline prices to plummet, defeated the Soviet Union and gave American the greatest economy of all time. You retards were looking for something, ANYTHING to bash him about.

Democrat fingerprints are all over the homeless.