Turks threaten to invade Europe

[Altai]

On 3/3/2020 at 9:29 AM, Dougie93 said:

The media is claiming the refugees are fleeing Syria, but these refugees say otherwise, they're from Afghanistan and Pakistan

"When I heard that the borders opened, I came from Afghanistan to Turkey. The Turkish border is open but Greece borders are closed"

 

Europe and all other countries "have to" accept refugees, there are international agreements signed for it. Europe is violating these agreements. Does not matter they are Afghan or something else from non-safe zones. Statistically about %20-25 of the refugees wants to go EU are Syrians.

[Marocc]

On 3/7/2020 at 4:50 AM, Moonlight Graham said:

A person who still lives with their parents and has never left, has their mother cook for them, do their laundry, do their groceries, is a dependent.  In other words, a child.  Why is age more relevant than the stage of human development?

If you would do that, doesn't mean other people do. A frog at the bottom of a well..

[Marocc]

[Argus]

5 hours ago, Marocc said:

Do any of those people expect to be let into another country and be provided with food, clothing and shelter at someone else's expense indefinitely? Do they also expect their hosts to change their ways to accommodate their own beliefs and not offend them?

BTW, not aware of people 'looking down' on those fleeing war and famine. And 95% of the people trying to get into Europe are fleeing neither. They're coming from Turkey, where they're perfectly safe and certainly not going to starve, and they want into northern Europe, not southern Europe, because welfare is more generous up north.

[Marocc]

1 minute ago, Argus said:

Do they also expect their hosts to change their ways to accommodate their own beliefs and not offend them?

I am under the impression your problem with half the countries in the world is just this. They're existence offends your beliefs and you've used an unreasonably large part of your life complaining about that.

[Argus]

Just now, Marocc said:

I am under the impression your problem with half the countries in the world is just this. They're existence offends your beliefs and you've used an unreasonably large part of your life complaining about that.

Their existence doesn't offend me. Their coming HERE offends me. They can stay in their shithole countries - which are shithole countries because of the people living there - and not bother me at all. But this is a civilized country and I'd rather it stay that way.

[Marocc]

1 hour ago, Argus said:

Their existence doesn't offend me. Their coming HERE offends me. They can stay in their shithole countries - which are shithole countries because of the people living there - and not bother me at all. But this is a civilized country and I'd rather it stay that way.

The most self contradicting comment of yours so far. Your intolerance is on the level of being a near illness.

[Dougie93]

9 hours ago, Altai said:

Europe and all other countries "have to" accept refugees, there are international agreements signed for it. Europe is violating these agreements. Does not matter they are Afghan or something else from non-safe zones. Statistically about %20-25 of the refugees wants to go EU are Syrians.

They don't have to take them from Turkey, it's a safe third party country, once Turkey took them in, they are Turkey's problem

Canada & the United States also use this loophole

[Altai]

1 hour ago, Dougie93 said:

They don't have to take them from Turkey, it's a safe third party country, once Turkey took them in, they are Turkey's problem

Canada & the United States also use this loophole

"Safe third country" rule is to provide safety as quick as possible, not to storage all refugees in a country. According to international agreements all the countries have "common" responsiblities about refugees. This is why EU and Turkiye have signed an agreement in March 2016, Turkiye fully complied with the agreement and EU fully violated the agreement. 

[Argus]

48 minutes ago, Marocc said:

The most self contradicting comment of yours so far. Your intolerance is on the level of being a near illness.

Got nothing to do with intolerance. Got to do with standards and judgement. If they weren't shitholes all those people wouldn't want to leave. And what makes a country a shithole? The people living there, their culture, values, education, skills and attitudes.

I see no logical reason to want to import all that here.

[Dougie93]

42 minutes ago, Altai said:

"Safe third country" rule is to provide safety as quick as possible, not to storage all refugees in a country. According to international agreements all the countries have "common" responsiblities about refugees. This is why EU and Turkiye have signed an agreement in March 2016, Turkiye fully complied with the agreement and EU fully violated the agreement. 

The refugees have to apply for asylum to Greece while they are in Turkey, Greece only has to take them in an orderly manner, they don't have to let them flood in en masse

The convention doesn't actually say a country has to take them, the convention only requires a country to give them a hearing

That hearing can be granted them from Turkey, if they qualify for asylum in Greece, only then does Greece have to take them

You are not automatically a refugee simply because you are a migrant, you have to qualify for asylum

The only enforcement mechanism is the ICJ, which means a criminal breach,

But it's not a crime to demand that migrants apply for asylum in an orderly fashion from a safe third party country.

To wit, Greece is not turning them away, Greece is demanding that they cue up in an orderly fashion to be processed

If not, Greece has a superseding UN Article 51 right to defend its territorial sovereignty

It's the same situation from the USA to Canada, you can't be a refugee from the USA to Canada, unless you are fleeing the USA

Only American citizens can claim asylum from America, migrants from other countries cannot be refugees from a third party through the USA

Canada simply doesn't have the capacity to secure its border, if Greece does, more power to them.

Canada does take refugees by way of Turkey, but only after they've had their hearing in Turkey with Canadian officials, Greece is no different.

Edited March 10, 2020 by Dougie93

[Marocc]

2 hours ago, Argus said:

Got nothing to do with intolerance.

"the fact of refusing to accept ideas, beliefs, or behaviour that are different from your own" https://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/dictionary/english/intolerance

You're defying the dictionary.

[Goddess]

18 minutes ago, Marocc said:

"the fact of refusing to accept ideas, beliefs, or behaviour that are different from your own" https://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/dictionary/english/intolerance

You're defying the dictionary.

Let common sense rule.

Some ideas, beliefs and behaviours should be refused.  For example:  Serial killers and pedophiles have very different ideas, beliefs and behaviours than I do.

It's okay to be intolerant of some ideas, beliefs and behaviours.  In some cases, it's necessary.

 

Edited March 10, 2020 by Goddess

[Marocc]

7 minutes ago, Goddess said:

Let common sense rule.

With people who have it, I would.

[Moonlight Graham]

11 hours ago, Marocc said:

Refugees coming to Canada aren't just fleeing war and famine.  Canada is literally one of the furthest away countries from most of the major refugee-source countries.  They're fleeing war and famine and wanting to financially ca$h in at the same time.  People aren't stupid, I don't blame them. 

Refugees want to come to Canada, they don't want to go to Portugal.  They want their free services and their own ethnic communities.  If you're fleeing for your life you should be content to simply be alive and in a country as good economically as your home country.

Edited March 10, 2020 by Moonlight Graham

[SpankyMcFarland]

6 hours ago, Moonlight Graham said:

Refugees want to come to Canada, they don't want to go to Portugal.  They want their free services and their own ethnic communities.  If you're fleeing for your life you should be content to simply be alive and in a country as good economically as your home country.

I wouldn’t mind moving from Canada to Portugal right about now if I could bring my loot with me - warm, friendly, great beaches and Lisbon too. It’s a popular choice with European retirees these days. 

[SpankyMcFarland]

There’s a finite limit on how much immigration a country can tolerate, and when one gets down to tiny Greek islands that number is much smaller. Europe and the EU have to recognize this reality before the demagogues take over. 

[Marocc]

3 hours ago, SpankyMcFarland said:

Europe and the EU have to recognize this reality before the demagogues take over. 

Your panic isn't limited to Canada even? But you panic for the sake of those who don't bother.. I wonder if you all actually care, or if you're just drooling over the drama. I'm guessing the latter for most part.

[Argus]

20 hours ago, Marocc said:

"the fact of refusing to accept ideas, beliefs, or behaviour that are different from your own" https://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/dictionary/english/intolerance

You're defying the dictionary.

No, you're simply misinterpreting it. Ideas like human sacrifice are different from my own and I don't accept it. Does that make me intolerant?

In fact, given you represent the world's most intolerant society, and that its intolerance is more violent and growing worse, I think you're hardly the one to comment on other people's tolerance.

[Rue]

On ‎3‎/‎10‎/‎2020 at 4:44 AM, Altai said:

Europe and all other countries "have to" accept refugees, there are international agreements signed for it. Europe is violating these agreements. Does not matter they are Afghan or something else from non-safe zones. Statistically about %20-25 of the refugees wants to go EU are Syrians.

Someone need tell this composite, that no country HAS TO take in refugees. They have sovereignty. They can do what the hell they want. International agreements are not binding. They require the consent of a nation who signed the treaty to follow them. Any nation can walk away from the treaty they signed at anytime and many nations refuse refugees such as Russia, China, Hungary, Poland. If the world had any intelligence they would have taken out Assad long ago and placed some complacent puppet everyone was happy with in Syria to stop the flow of refugees.

[Rue]

12 hours ago, Marocc said:

Your panic isn't limited to Canada even? But you panic for the sake of those who don't bother.. I wonder if you all actually care, or if you're just drooling over the drama. I'm guessing the latter for most part.

I do not agree lotf of things hesays and debate him but nothing he said that you responded to  was drooling or dramatic. So since   I am the first to challenge him I have to also be fair and defend him as well.  His statement simply states huge movements of people incite demagoguery. That is historic fact.

Edited March 11, 2020 by Rue

[Marocc]

12 minutes ago, Rue said:

nothing he said that you responded to  was drooling or dramatic.

I was using you in plural. You (singular) are included. Nor did I say anyone said something dramatic. I implied you are all just looking for drama of any kind to keep you entertained in this world.

 

[Rue]

1 minute ago, Marocc said:

I was using you in plural. You (singular) are included. Nor did I say anyone said something dramatic. I implied you are all just looking for drama of any kind to keep you entertained in this world.

 

You stated: "I wonder if you all actually care, or if you're just drooling over the drama. I'm guessing the latter for most part. "

I know what you wrote. Maybe for someone so specific with everyone else with your questioning you might want to write more clearly.  That said please understand I was not drooling or looking for drama in my previous  response to you.  I am under the impression you were summarily dismissing the concerns or opinions of others.  

Now me I leak I don't drool. I can give you a medical report on the fluids if you want. Salaam.

[Moonlight Graham]

18 hours ago, SpankyMcFarland said:

I wouldn’t mind moving from Canada to Portugal right about now if I could bring my loot with me - warm, friendly, great beaches and Lisbon too. It’s a popular choice with European retirees these days. 

Retirees only..  The economy isn't great.  If you want to work go elsewhere.

[SpankyMcFarland]

3 hours ago, Moonlight Graham said:

Retirees only..  The economy isn't great.  If you want to work go elsewhere.

It depends what kind of work you are in. If you can bring it with on your computer then Lisbon is a great city to live in.