US Dumping Corn in Canada?

[August1991]

The Canada Border Services Agency (CBSA) announced today the initiation of an investigation into the alleged injurious dumping and subsidizing of grain corn in all forms, excluding seed corn (for reproductive purposes), sweet corn, and popping corn, from the United States of America.

--

Dumping occurs when goods are sold to importers in Canada at prices that

are less than their selling prices in the exporter's domestic market or at

unprofitable prices. Subsidizing occurs when goods imported into Canada

benefit from foreign government financial assistance. The Special Import

Measures Act protects Canadian producers from the damaging effects of such

unfair trade.

Newswire

Numerous Canadian groups are opposed to this action:

La Western Canadian Barley Growers’ Association s’est dite inquiète des répercussions plus vastes de l’augmentation des prix des céréales fourragères. « Notre industrie de l’engraissement des animaux ne restera pas ici », avance Douglas McBain, président de la Western Barley Growers’ Association. « Les bovins d’engraissement vers le sud m’inquiètent plus que le maïs qui entre ici. Si les bovins d’engraissement partent, vous n’utiliserez pas l’orge ou le maïs et vous ne les abatterez plus ici. Votre industrie, la création de valeur ajoutée et de richesses qui vient de ces animaux, disparaît. »

La voie agricole (Sorry, I couldn't find an Englsih quote.)

If US taxpayers want to subdidize Canadian corn buyers, then I say great. If US corn producers decide to sell corn to Canadians at bargain-basement prices, I say fine too. I believe corn is used mostly for feed so this indirectly helps our meat and poultry industries.

The only possible reason to object is that US subsidies to farm production are somehow damaging to the continent's environment.

By considering the possibility of imposing a counterveiling duty on imported corn, the CBSA is playing into the hands of Canada's corn producers. (Just as the US duties against our softwood lumber plays into the hands of US softwood producers.) In fact, the two actions are probably connected.

[cybercoma]

This hurts our farmers by making it so they can't compete forcing them to either a) get subsidized by our government or fold up shop.

Corn isn't just used for feed, another major concern is its use in the production of ethanol. There's an ethanol refinery in Chatham, ON that is literally situated amongst cornfields, but they buy their corn from the US because it's cheaper.

No good.

[Toro]

Bad idea.

Of course, the US is a stupidly large subsidizer of food, so most food could be considered as "dumping". Of course, that makes food - the most important commodity - cheaper in Canada.

[moderateamericain]

This hurts our farmers by making it so they can't compete forcing them to either a) get subsidized by our government or fold up shop.

Corn isn't just used for feed, another major concern is its use in the production of ethanol.  There's an ethanol refinery in Chatham, ON that is literally situated amongst cornfields, but they buy their corn from the US because it's cheaper.

No good.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hahah, retaliate? How bout all the canadian garbage thats trucked down into michigan and dumped the US garbage dumps? As far as im concerned you already have.

I stand corrected and here is why

http://www.michiganwasteindustries.org/news/trashtalk.html

[August1991]

This hurts our farmers by making it so they can't compete forcing them to either a) get subsidized by our government or fold up shop.

Corn isn't just used for feed, another major concern is its use in the production of ethanol.  There's an ethanol refinery in Chatham, ON that is literally situated amongst cornfields, but they buy their corn from the US because it's cheaper.

No good.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

No good?

It's great. The US taxpayers are subsidizing Canadian consumers. That means we can buy ethanol, corn oil, corn sugar and meat and chicken more cheaply - all thanks to American taxpayers.

If an American sent you a coupon for a free night at the local Hilton, would you refuse?

[Shakeyhands]

This hurts our farmers by making it so they can't compete forcing them to either a) get subsidized by our government or fold up shop.

Corn isn't just used for feed, another major concern is its use in the production of ethanol.  There's an ethanol refinery in Chatham, ON that is literally situated amongst cornfields, but they buy their corn from the US because it's cheaper.

No good.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

No good?

It's great. The US taxpayers are subsidizing Canadian consumers. That means we can buy ethanol, corn oil, corn sugar and meat and chicken more cheaply - all thanks to American taxpayers.

If an American sent you a coupon for a free night at the local Hilton, would you refuse?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

What of those Canadian farmers that are impacted by the subsidized US goods?

[Yaro]

from what I understand corn is far better grown south of the border regardless and isn't a particularly profitable product regardless. If there was a longer turn around time for our farmers to start producing corn or there was any kind of relitive shortage of demand in agriculture it might be nessecary but as of right now there really is no story here.

Toro

Bad idea.

Of course, the US is a stupidly large subsidizer of food, so most food could be considered as "dumping". Of course, that makes food - the most important commodity - cheaper in Canada.

The food subsidies in the US are actually a very good story, they were actually started shortly after corporate farms started to grow and force out family farms but only because it had been such a great political tool against the USSR that farms had been lost to the state and they didn't want to see farms start to be run out of business because of the potential for political fallout. Today those very same subsidize are collected largely by those corporate farms. I wish I could remember the book on this, was a great one.

[Toro]

Bush massively increased subsidies to farmers a year or so after he was first elected. The idea was to hit the Europeans hard, and force the Europeans to the table of the Doha Round of the current WTO negotiations.

However, food subsidies are about the worst policy for the very poorest countries in the world as agriculture is one of the few industries which the very poorest nations have a competitive advantage over the rich West. If people are truly concerned about helping these people, these policies, which are just a massive money grab by one part of the population - farmers - at the expense of everyone else, should be scrapped.

[August1991]

What of those Canadian farmers that are impacted by the subsidized US goods?

I guess they could produce something else.

from what I understand corn is far better grown south of the border regardless and isn't a particularly profitable product regardless. If there was a longer turn around time for our farmers to start producing corn or there was any kind of relitive shortage of demand in agriculture it might be nessecary but as of right now there really is no story here.

I agree with Yaro. I think it's fairly easy to switch into or out of corn. (Am I right?)

Today those very same subsidize are collected largely by those corporate farms.

Farm subsidies, what a story that is. Corporate farms receive alot but I don't think that is the cause.

However, food subsidies are about the worst policy for the very poorest countries in the world as agriculture is one of the few industries which the very poorest nations have a competitive advantage over the rich West. If people are truly concerned about helping these people, these policies, which are just a massive money grab by one part of the population - farmers - at the expense of everyone else, should be scrapped.

I disagree Toro, but if your argument has for result that poor people in rich countries (including Canada) stop subsidizing rich farmers, I'll agree with you.

Here's a policy the NDP, both the Left and the Green, should be all over. Why aren't they? Is it ignorance or pragmatic politics?

Smart European Greens now use the argument that farm subsidies encourage environmental destruction.

[Guest eureka]

You are absolutelu right, Toro. The new subsidies of Bush were $300 billion if I recall correctly It is worse than criminal and the subsidies are possubly the biggest factor in the declining standards of the Third World.

It was curious that the Bush subsidies came at the time that France and Germany were meeting to try to reach an agreement on the eliminatiion or reduction of their subsides.

[cybercoma]

This is simply payback for exporting Celine Dion to Vegas.

[theloniusfleabag]

Dear August1991,

I guess they could produce something else.

That should be dictated by the markets, if corn were not profitable in a 'fair' market, farmers would produce something else. Besides, should Canada simply give up competing on every product the US trades unfairly in? Perhaps those softwood lumber producers should simply find other jobs...

from...

http://www.northern-crops.com/crops/crops.htm#corn

Other recent developments for corn usage include biodegradable plastics and packing materials, specialty chemicals for cosmetics and pharmaceuticals, a non-corrosive road substitute (calcium magnesium acetate), adhesives and paper products. These products are expected to increase in demand in the future.

from what I understand corn is far better grown south of the border regardless

Corn grows all over the world, but evidently 'Taber corn' (from southern Alberta) is one of the best.

[masterkush]

My Fellow Canadians a time is approaching when we must PULL the plug on our American neighbor

they owe too much money

they are dumping garbage on us

the 76% of there exports that come here must stop

and we must make the lights go out in america by pulling the plug on electricity

they are in a position now that THEY can hardly pay their debts

and they dont abide by international trade agreements

they are like babbies with candy we must teach them restraint

they walk around like they are their arab masters when they are poor and destitute

pull the light switch , stop buying rusty fords ,and gm vehicles.

stop the consumerism.

they are no longer the good neighbor

they have become insane with lust and greed

[August1991]

Unbelievable. A government trade tribunal that makes an intelligent decision.

On April 17, 2006, the Canadian International Trade Tribunal (CITT) found that the importation of grain corn from the US had not caused and is not threatening to cause material injury to domestic Canadian corn producers, despite a determined legal and public relations effort by Canadian corn producers to persuade the CITT that US subsidies, together with alleged dumping by US producers of corn in Canadian markets were indeed causing such injury.

Link

Canadian Corn Producers beg to differ (of course):

Canadian Corn Producers (CCP) are disappointed by the Canadian International Trade Tribunal's (CITT) finding that dumped and subsidized imports of U.S. grain corn are not causing injury to Canada's domestic producers.

The CITT finding of no injury came despite the fact that Canada Border Services Agency (CBSA) in both its preliminary and final determinations found that virtually all U.S. grain corn imports were dumped and subsidized into Canada. The combined margin of dumping and amount of subsidy represented a staggering 44% of the export price of U.S. grain corn.

"Given the preliminary CITT injury finding, and CBSA's two subsidy and dumping findings, today's CITT decision that no injury was found obviously is disappointing", said Brian Doidge, spokesperson for the CCP. "Unfortunately, in this David vs Goliath battle, Goliath was able to convince the CITT that Canadian corn farmers are not being injured despite massively dumped and subsidized imports backed by 2.4 billion more bushels of surplus U.S. grain corn. We do not agree with that finding and are considering all our options. Canadian corn farmers are being pushed out of business by unfair and illegal U.S. subsidies. We will not give up as our future and the future of the Canadian grain and oilseed sector is at stake."

With the CITT decision today, the preliminary duties of U.S.$1.65/bushel imposed December 15, 2005 on imports of U.S. grain corn are removed and all duties already assessed will be returned.

Link

I wonder if the election had anything to do with this decision.

[GostHacked]

80% of the corn that is grown in the U.S. is geneticly modified as well. Plant growth only recognize climate zone borders, not country borders.

Also alot of what you eat the the grocery store contains byproducts of corn. Check your cupboard. This is not helping either.

http://www.ontariocorn.org/classroom/products.html

http://www.campsilos.org/mod3/teachers/r_index.shtml

http://www.accidentalhedonist.com/index.ph...ning_high_fruct

[Drea]

from what I understand corn is far better grown south of the border regardless and isn't a particularly profitable product regardless.

Wrong.

The more "stress" (ie; cold nights) a plant has to go through the better the plant. For example, corn grown in BC's interior is "crisper" than that grown in more southern climes.

I live in the BC Fraser Valley's "Corn City" -- no the corn isn't quite as good as the northern variety but it's a far cry better than the mushy stuff from California.

When I go to Save On Foods and see California corn I shake my head. I just ask the cashier for extra cash and stop in to a roadside stand and buy local. So what if it costs me $3 more? At least I can be assured that I'm supporting our local economy and I get a better cob of corn!

IMO

If a product is available locally, buy it.

[August1991]

IMO

If a product is available locally, buy it.

How local do you define "local"? Do you grow your own food? Do you buy from food from out of province?

[Wilber]

We look forward to the local sweet corn crop every year. Buy it fresh picked from a local farmer daily. No day old crap for us.

If you are a farmer I guess it depends where you sit. My daughter and her husband have a dairy farm in the Fraser Valley and grow a lot of feed corn for their own use. If the US government wants to sell them the stuff cheaper than they can grow it themselves, I don't think they would be unhappy to put their land to another use.

[Drea]

IMO

If a product is available locally, buy it.

How local do you define "local"? Do you grow your own food? Do you buy from food from out of province?

Local means...

1. The Fraser Valley

2. BC

3. Canada

4. wherever else I can get what I need. (last resort LOL)

[Charles Anthony]

Do you grow your own food?

That question goes straight to the heart of the matter.

The blanket generalization of "buy local" is noble (I do it too, even when the local produce is more expensive) but it is not a wise generalization. For a few reasons:

- most of what we consume is FAR from local

- many things that we consume CAN NOT be produced locally

- for some people, the price difference between imports and local products is unaffordable

Therefore, the decision to "buy local" is great so long as you are not forcing it or legislating it. However, forcing "buy local" policies is no longer noble. In fact, it would be more efficient to:

- tell local producers to stop working

- import the cheaper product

- charge local consumers a higher price

- give the non-working local producers the extra charge

If you expand the principle beyond fruits and vegetable to include everything we trade, it becomes self-evident that "buy local" is not financially viable if we want to maintain our current life-style and consumption patterns.

[America1]

My Fellow Canadians a time is approaching when we must PULL the plug on our American neighbor

they owe too much money

they are dumping garbage on us

the 76% of there exports that come here must stop

and we must make the lights go out in america by pulling the plug on electricity

they are in a position now that THEY can hardly pay their debts

and they dont abide by international trade agreements

they are like babbies with candy we must teach them restraint

they walk around like they are their arab masters when they are poor and destitute

pull the light switch , stop buying rusty fords ,and gm vehicles.

stop the consumerism.

they are no longer the good neighbor

they have become insane with lust and greed

hahahahahaha - I love it when Canadians talk tough. You sound like a fool when you say you are going to teach us a lesson by "pulling the plug" on us. Newflash, the US is a country of ~300 mm people compared to what not even 40mm in Canada and our GDP being almost 12 times as large as yours.

[GostHacked]

My Fellow Canadians a time is approaching when we must PULL the plug on our American neighbor

they owe too much money

they are dumping garbage on us

the 76% of there exports that come here must stop

and we must make the lights go out in america by pulling the plug on electricity

they are in a position now that THEY can hardly pay their debts

and they dont abide by international trade agreements

they are like babbies with candy we must teach them restraint

they walk around like they are their arab masters when they are poor and destitute

pull the light switch , stop buying rusty fords ,and gm vehicles.

stop the consumerism.

they are no longer the good neighbor

they have become insane with lust and greed

hahahahahaha - I love it when Canadians talk tough. You sound like a fool when you say you are going to teach us a lesson by "pulling the plug" on us. Newflash, the US is a country of ~300 mm people compared to what not even 40mm in Canada and our GDP being almost 12 times as large as yours.

LOL I know eh? More guns, more weapons, bigger military, bigger drug problems, bigger crime problems. bigger international problems, You are right USA > Canada.

[Drea]

Do you grow your own food?

That question goes straight to the heart of the matter.

The blanket generalization of "buy local" is noble (I do it too, even when the local produce is more expensive) but it is not a wise generalization. For a few reasons:

- most of what we consume is FAR from local

- many things that we consume CAN NOT be produced locally

- for some people, the price difference between imports and local products is unaffordable

Therefore, the decision to "buy local" is great so long as you are not forcing it or legislating it. However, forcing "buy local" policies is no longer noble. In fact, it would be more efficient to:

- tell local producers to stop working

- import the cheaper product

- charge local consumers a higher price

- give the non-working local producers the extra charge

If you expand the principle beyond fruits and vegetable to include everything we trade, it becomes self-evident that "buy local" is not financially viable if we want to maintain our current life-style and consumption patterns.

Of course we can't buy absolutely everything local. Not everything is produced locally (food, good, services).

I've never thought that "shop local" should (or ever would) be legislated. That's taking away the consumer's choice and we don't want that. I do, however, make my purchases locally if possible. Why wouldn't I support the corn grower down the road instead of the guy in California?

Excellent GostHacked!

LOL I know eh? More guns, more weapons, bigger military, bigger drug problems, bigger crime problems. bigger international problems, You are right USA > Canada.

I get tired of "Our thingy is bigger/better/faster/stronger than your thingy!".

[Charles Anthony]

I've never thought that "shop local" should (or ever would) be legislated. That's taking away the consumer's choice and we don't want that.

Correct but it can be legislated -- albeit in a roundabout underhanded way in the form of quotas, tariffs and subsidies.

Anything short of absolute 100% indiscriminate free trade is legislated "buy local" policy in a hidden way.

Of course we can't buy absolutely everything local. Not everything is produced locally (food, good, services).

Yes but we can produce similar products or same products of different quality. This opens a grey area within which legislators and lobby groups and marketing boards can mask quotas, tariffs, subsidies and quality standards -- effectively take away consumer choice.

[Wilber]

Why is a tariff that protects producers from a subsidy more immoral than the subsidy that made the tariff necessary in the first place? Subsidies that drive some producers out of business in favor of other producers does not increase consumer choice.

Any nation that intentionally increases its reliance on other countries for something as basic as food, is a nation of fools IMO.