Wal-Mart to close unionized store in Quebec

William Ashley · December 24, 2009

im not an union fan but...

Wal-mart fascist strategy to maximize their profit is quite lame...

I find it funny various communities in Ontario have tried to battle WalMart in court, when all they needed to do was set up a union at the store to get rid of them.

GostHacked · December 24, 2009

Of course, this ignores the fact that while they have "cheap" merchendise, they also have stuff which is identical to what is found in other stores.

How exactly is the DVD I bought at Wal-mart different than the one I might by at the video store?

You don't get half the selection you would get at a video store. Also you'd get X rated stuff at the video store!

Yes, and sometimes people don't necessarily want/need/can afford the "most durable" goods.

I'd rather pay a little more for something that is going to last me longer. I don't like buying an item and needing to replace it a year later because of it's cheapness. For me it's been about quality.

Ummm... just wondering.... if you don't have a single location to do your shopping in for your major purposes/staple items, wouldn't that actually mean you'd have to do more travelling in order to actually buy the items you need, this increasing the need for a car?

OR, you can go to a shopping mall to do all that? Or another department store? One does not go to walmart to buy quality items.

How about because if you forced people to go to individual stores to do their shopping, they may end up needing cars more to get to the various places they need to go?

OMG !!!! How did we EVER survive without Walmart. You know the concept of department stores has been around for quite some time. That seems to be fading. I'll tell you one thing, I was without a car for about 10 years. That never stopped me from going out and shopping from store to store. Indeed it takes longer, but if you plan your trip properly, all will be good.

M.Dancer · December 24, 2009

You don't get half the selection you would get at a video store. Also you'd get X rated stuff at the video store!

I think he's talking about DVD players....you want real crap? Go to Crappy Tire. They have no name one on sale now for $19.00.

I'd rather pay a little more for something that is going to last me longer. I don't like buying an item and needing to replace it a year later because of it's cheapness. For me been about quality. quote

So? buy a name brand...just like the ones at another store, just 10% less...

One does not go to walmart to buy quality items.

You have never been to a Walmart, have you?

OMG !!!! How did we EVER survive without Walmart.

Crappy Tire, Zellers, Woolworths, Woolco, rossy, Army Navy...

I was without a car for about 10 years. That never stopped me from going out and shopping from store to store. Indeed it takes longer, but if you plan your trip properly, all will be good.

Do that with kids in tow...

segnosaur · December 28, 2009

Of course, this ignores the fact that while they have "cheap" merchendise, they also have stuff which is identical to what is found in other stores.
How exactly is the DVD I bought at Wal-mart different than the one I might by at the video store?

You don't get half the selection you would get at a video store.

First of all, the issue that was raised was the quality of merchandise, not in the number of titles available. I used DVDs as just one example (I could have used Toothpaste, cat food, or any one of a number of items where the item you get at Wal-mart is identical to the one you get at Zellers, Loblaws, Shoppers Drug mart, etc.)

Secondly, not sure why exactly you think video stores have a bigger selection of titles available for sale than Wal-Mart. Most video stores I've been in may rent a lot of different movies, but they only have a couple of racks of movies available for sale. Wal-Mart typically has 2 complete rows, plus the stand-up displays in front of their electronics section, plus their "bargin bins". You may not be able to get any movie you want, but you can get a whole lot.

Also you'd get X rated stuff at the video store!

My local Blockbuster and Rogers' video do not stock X-rated stuff either.

Yes, and sometimes people don't necessarily want/need/can afford the "most durable" goods.

I'd rather pay a little more for something that is going to last me longer. I don't like buying an item and needing to replace it a year later because of it's cheapness. For me it's been about quality.

That's perfectly fine, except go back and read what I wrote. I specifically said "Sometimes" people don't necessarily want/need/can afford the "most durable" goods.

I think I mentioned this particular story before... a few years ago, I decided to try my hand at camping. I had no idea about whether I would enjoy it, or how often I would be able to. So, rather than buying a top quality tent from the local Mountain Equipment Co-op, I decided to buy a low-end tent from Wal-Mart. If I enjoyed camping, I could eventually buy better gear. If I didn't like it (or didn't get the chance to use it), I'd only be out $20.

I think there's a place in our consumer society for a wide range of prices/quality. Criticizing Wal-mart for filling one of those ranges is silly, since other stores also provide stuff that fills that particular consumer niche.

Ummm... just wondering.... if you don't have a single location to do your shopping in for your major purposes/staple items, wouldn't that actually mean you'd have to do more travelling in order to actually buy the items you need, this increasing the need for a car?

OR, you can go to a shopping mall to do all that? Or another department store? One does not go to walmart to buy quality items.

Actually, go back and read my original post...

My statement (about needing a car to do shopping) was made in response to the following statement:

I don't find it convenient to have a 1,700-space parking lot near Lake Ontario, I find it repellent. It would be lovely to have picnic grounds or dog runs, restaurants, stores or something lively in an area where, magically, we can actually live well without owning cars

So, the author wasn't discussing merchandise quality, they were complaining about "big shopping centers" and how they'd rather have pretty picnic grounds instead of big parking lots.

In that case, suggesting they could go to a shopping mall or another department store doesn't negate the need for a "big ugly parking lot".

OMG !!!! How did we EVER survive without Walmart.

Simple... we just paid more for stuff, leaving us with less disposable income.

You know the concept of department stores has been around for quite some time. That seems to be fading. I'll tell you one thing, I was without a car for about 10 years. That never stopped me from going out and shopping from store to store. Indeed it takes longer, but if you plan your trip properly, all will be good.

Well, good for you.

On the other hand, some of us would rather spend our time, you know, expanding our horizons and enjoying life (by going to museums and concerts, reading books, etc.) rather than going from store to store in our quest to do our basic shopping.

Whether a person has a car or not, they will probably always be able to complete their shopping faster if they have only one store to visit/shop at. That leaves more time to do things that are more productive.

Hydraboss · December 28, 2009

You don't get half the selection you would get at a video store. Also you'd get X rated stuff at the video store!

Wrong. And wrong.

I'd rather pay a little more for something that is going to last me longer. I don't like buying an item and needing to replace it a year later because of it's cheapness. For me it's been about quality.

I agree. That's why I don't buy my TV's or clothes there. (The TV thing is pretty specific, so only ask if you actually want to know.) However, the second XBOX 360, games, etc I bought there are EXACTLY the same as the ones I bought at Future Shop. The Shimano fishing gear I bought there is IDENTICAL to the items at The Fishin Hole but for around 70% of the price. Same with both Minn Kota electric motors. Pedigree dog food (canned and dry) is waaaayy less coin for exactly the same product. Try and buy Tide for high efficiency units at Walmart and at Safeway and see what happens (almost 50% less at Wally World).

OR, you can go to a shopping mall to do all that? Or another department store? One does not go to walmart to buy quality items.

You are aware that "big shopping malls" started going out at the end of the 80's, right? They now put up these "commons" where ten billion stores in one billion little strip malls spread out over 6 or 8 city blocks with every one of them having their own little parking lot, etc. Funny thing though, they're never built until at least one of the big box stores goes in first. Usually a Home Depot and/or Walmart (at least in Alberta).

OMG !!!! How did we EVER survive without Walmart. You know the concept of department stores has been around for quite some time. That seems to be fading. I'll tell you one thing, I was without a car for about 10 years. That never stopped me from going out and shopping from store to store. Indeed it takes longer, but if you plan your trip properly, all will be good.

One questions for you: Do you shop at a Safeway, Loblaws, IGA, etc or do you go to a butcher, a baker, a farmer's market for vegetables, etc? You are aware that the aforementioned stores are "grocery stores" and really put the small independants out of business, right?

cybercoma · December 28, 2009

One questions for you: Do you shop at a Safeway, Loblaws, IGA, etc or do you go to a butcher, a baker, a farmer's market for vegetables, etc? You are aware that the aforementioned stores are "grocery stores" and really put the small independants out of business, right?

The difference between that groceries from Superstore, Sobeys, Safeway, Loblaws, and IGA are way more expensive than buying your food from the baker, butcher, and farmers.

segnosaur · December 29, 2009

One questions for you: Do you shop at a Safeway, Loblaws, IGA, etc or do you go to a butcher, a baker, a farmer's market for vegetables, etc? You are aware that the aforementioned stores are "grocery stores" and really put the small independants out of business, right?

The difference between that groceries from Superstore, Sobeys, Safeway, Loblaws, and IGA are way more expensive than buying your food from the baker, butcher, and farmers.

First of all, you DO realize that the question that was asked by the previous poster was DO you shop at Safeway, Loblaws, etc. Even if there were cheaper options, people may still shop at grocery stores due to the convenience or selection of products available.

So, we're still left with the question: to anyone who has criticized wal-mart, do you ever shop at "grocery stores", and do you do so with the knowledge that you might be putting your local butcher or baker out of business.

Secondly, I find it rather ironic... this thread gets started over the issue of Wal-mart taking steps to prevent the unionization of its workforce. Now, here you're pointing out how 'cheap' you can get food from bakers, butchers, etc. I wonder just how many of those small bakeries, butcher shops, etc. actually employ unionized workers.

Lastly, I do have to question your claim that grocery stores are "way more" expensive than small bakeries/butcher shops/etc. Some items may be cheaper, but other stuff is more expensive.

cybercoma · December 29, 2009

I'm sorry, but what exactly are you crying about? I'm not really sure what everyone is up in arms about. All I'm saying is that buying produce, baked goods, meat, and dairy from the farmers' market is significantly cheaper than buying them at the grocery store. At least where I live it is.

William Ashley · December 29, 2009

I'm sorry, but what exactly are you crying about? I'm not really sure what everyone is up in arms about. All I'm saying is that buying produce, baked goods, meat, and dairy from the farmers' market is significantly cheaper than buying them at the grocery store. At least where I live it is.

even cheaper to raise it yourself!

Jerry J. Fortin · December 29, 2009

markets are growing in size and number.

M.Dancer · December 29, 2009

The difference between that groceries from Superstore, Sobeys, Safeway, Loblaws, and IGA are way more expensive than buying your food from the baker, butcher, and farmers.

You might think so but once you factor in the gas and the trouble of either buying a walk in freezer or finding a rancher who will sell you a steak instead of the whole moo..not to mention that the time it takes in January to fly down to mexico to pick up fresh produce...

Oleg Bach · December 30, 2009

So once they are unionized does that mean that the corporate slaves will stop calling themselves "accociates"? It's so cute the way a Walmart lacky is given a sense of importance and belonging...not to mention a feeling of ownership...with the tag "accociate". By the time unions put a dent in the Walmart bottom line it will be the year 3000...for god's sake the corporation is so huge at this point they could pay their people 100 bucks an hour and still come out ahead. Unions are the last of this monsters worries.

segnosaur · December 30, 2009

I'm sorry, but what exactly are you crying about? I'm not really sure what everyone is up in arms about.

Well, in particular my "complaint" is that your statement was totally irrelevant, and didn't address the issue that was raised.

Once again... just so you understand:

- It has been suggested (by anti-Walmart people) that wal-mart somehow "destroys small businesses"

- It was pointed out that people who shop at grocery stores (for whatever reason) are also taking away from "small business", since they could be going to butcher shops/bakers/etc. instead of a grocery store

So, anyone who complains about Wal-mart and their effect on business yet shops at Loblaws, Sobeys, etc. is basically being a giant hypocrite.

If you don't have anything to address that issue, then fine. (Although I'd have to wonder why you'd even bother responding...) Talking about how cheap your local butcher shop is doesn't address the fact that the existence of your local super market takes customers away from your local shops.

All I'm saying is that buying produce, baked goods, meat, and dairy from the farmers' market is significantly cheaper than buying them at the grocery store. At least where I live it is.

Ummm... just out of curiosity, when you make that particular comparison, are you actually comparing apples with apples, or apples with oranges?

For example, if you try to buy fresh baked, high quality bread your local bakery may offer a good price. However, I doubt most 'local bakeries' offer the mass-produced breads (e.g. wonderbread, country harvest, etc.) that are available in your grocery stores.

segnosaur · December 30, 2009

By the time unions put a dent in the Walmart bottom line it will be the year 3000...for god's sake the corporation is so huge at this point they could pay their people 100 bucks an hour and still come out ahead.

Just to remind you...

Wal-mart does earn billions of dollars per year... however, its profit margins are only around 3.5% (which is actually pretty close to the industry average profit margin of 3.3%). The only reason it generates such tremendous revenue is due to the total number of stores/sales, not because they magically make huge profits on everything they sell.

cybercoma · December 30, 2009

You might think so but once you factor in the gas and the trouble of either buying a walk in freezer or finding a rancher who will sell you a steak instead of the whole moo..not to mention that the time it takes in January to fly down to mexico to pick up fresh produce...

Or.. on Saturday morning, I go to this crazy place called the Farmers' Market. You'll never believe this, but farmers get together there and sell their products to the general public. And guess what? It's closer to my home than the nearest grocery store. I know it's crazy, but they even have produce through the winter. Remarkable, I know. I don't know how they do it. Some wild "green house" technology or something that I commoner like me couldn't possibly understand. God bless those farmers though.

cybercoma · December 30, 2009

Sorry, segnosaur. Let me spell it out clearly for you: People shop at Walmart because it offers lower prices than small local businesses. The grocery store comparison doesn't work because the small local businesses have lower prices than chain grocers. My apologies for not drawing a picture with crayons. The function has been disabled on these forums.

segnosaur · December 30, 2009

Sorry, segnosaur. Let me spell it out clearly for you: People shop at Walmart because it offers lower prices than small local businesses.

Overly broad assumption.

Yes, Wal-mart does get a lot of customers due to its low prices. That doesn't mean that it is the only motivation for all customers.... Many sales may be generated due to factors such as product availability, store hours, return policies, etc.

The grocery store comparison doesn't work because the small local businesses have lower prices than chain grocers.

Once again, that is a statement of yours for which, at this point, you have not provided evidence. (At the very least, you have done absolutely nothing to address the issue that your local bakery/butcher shop may not have the same selection of mass produced items.)

My apologies for not drawing a picture with crayons. The function has been disabled on these forums.

You know, perhaps before you get on your high horse, you should actually try to understand a few basic concepts:

- People shop at grocery stores for whatever reason

- Grocery stores sell some of the same products that bakeries/butcher shops sell

- Since some people shop at grocery stores for meat/bakery products, those bakeries/butcher shops loose customers

- Therefore, anyone who complains about wal-mart "destroying business", yet who still shops at Sobeys/Loblaws/etc. is a hypocrite.

Why exactly do you think that bringing up irrelevant (and possibly incorrect) information) is actually useful? If you want to appear relevant, why don't you try dealing with the issues that were raised?

Or.. on Saturday morning, I go to this crazy place called the Farmers' Market. You'll never believe this, but farmers get together there and sell their products to the general public. And guess what? It's closer to my home than the nearest grocery store. I know it's crazy, but they even have produce through the winter. Remarkable, I know. I don't know how they do it. Some wild "green house" technology or something that I commoner like me couldn't possibly understand. God bless those farmers though.

So, I guess because you live closer to a farmer's market than a grocery store, then everyone in Canada similarly lives close to a farmer's market (one that actually has fresh produce available year round).

Oh, and nice that you have your Saturday's available for going to do your shopping. Some of us find it more intellectually rewarding being able to spend our Saturdays going to museums, reading books, etc. and doing things to expand our minds.

cybercoma · December 30, 2009

I have no idea why you've chosen to be such a pedantic twit with me, but you're the one that needs to get over yourself. Provide evidence that buying directly from farmers at the market is cheaper than buying from grocery stores? Are you trolling? You've got to be kidding, right? Moreover, you're suggesting I read instead of buying groceries on Saturday mornings, or do you think there's a better day and time for me to get my groceries? Get over yourself.

segnosaur · December 30, 2009

I have no idea why you've chosen to be such a pedantic twit with me....

Probably because you decided to bring up some useless irrelevant topic which has absolutely nothing to do with the issue that was raised, and even after this fact has been pointed out to you multiple times, you still refuse to acknowledge the subject.

Provide evidence that buying directly from farmers at the market is cheaper than buying from grocery stores?

Actually, keep in mind that at no point did I suggest farmer's markets were more expensive than grocery stores. What I've pointed out was that bakeries and butcher shops likely do not have the same choice of "basic" low end merchendise that is available in grocery stores. (Farmers markets may indeed sell produce cheaper than supermarkets, but the number of people who have convenient access to such produce year round is very very small.)

I can get a loaf of no-name white bread at my local grocery store pretty darn cheap. The last time I was in a bakery, I could not do that. Why? Because they specialize in higher-end goods. (There's nothing wrong with that, but it means you can't compare what you get at supermarkets and bakeries/butchers.)

You made the claim that Butchers/bakers are cheaper than supermarkets... those who make the claims are generally responsible for providing evidence.

You've got to be kidding, right? Moreover, you're suggesting I read instead of buying groceries on Saturday mornings, or do you think there's a better day and time for me to get my groceries?

Hey, if you want to pattern your life around the procurement of basic food, it is well within your right. But that's what you ARE doing... Some of us don't actually see having to arrange our schedules to fit in with the limited opening times of some farmer's market as a "good thing".

As for a better time/day to get your groceries, how about, oh, on your way home after work? Or Sunday afternoons? Heck, there are some 24 hour supermarkets near me... I've actually done my grocery shopping at 1am on a Saturday night. The point is, I do it when I choose. I don't have a desire to set my schedule so that I can only get my groceries on a particular day of the week because "that's when the farmer's market is open". (Heck, assuming the farmer's market actually would be open... any ones I've seen around here aren't open in the winter.)

Oleg Bach · December 30, 2009

Just to remind you...

Wal-mart does earn billions of dollars per year... however, its profit margins are only around 3.5% (which is actually pretty close to the industry average profit margin of 3.3%). The only reason it generates such tremendous revenue is due to the total number of stores/sales, not because they magically make huge profits on everything they sell.

Oleg Bach · December 30, 2009

WHY did the hick that started Walmart want to grow so big with out any real purpose to expansion? I met a farmer who sold his land off to walmart - a real eccentric guy who imagined himself as an artist or something - He drove a rusty old car and sent second hand books to some third world country - a cheap old man...but with the selling of his land he escalated the destruction of the culture and buisness of the small town he liked to visit and show his really bad un-original paintings... walmart reminds me of wealth with no purpose - You don't have to be smart to be rich.

Oleg Bach · December 30, 2009

Walmart is the personification of the merchant class that has taken over the world - It use to be that aristocrats ruled - now those with the mentality of a hardware store clerk - who have expanded in buisness to the point of being kazillionares rule the world - imagine ---the merchants simply starved out the nobles and here you have it - inbred hicks running nations and hating art - music and anything that is culture....you can make billions but you can not buy class.

M.Dancer · December 31, 2009

Or.. on Saturday morning, I go to this crazy place called the Farmers' Market. You'll never believe this, but farmers get together there and sell their products to the general public. And guess what? It's closer to my home than the nearest grocery store. I know it's crazy, but they even have produce through the winter. Remarkable, I know. I don't know how they do it. Some wild "green house" technology or something that I commoner like me couldn't possibly understand. God bless those farmers though.

We also have farmer's markets..they sell veg from latin america and New Zealand lamb...which is a lot cheaper than Canada produced hot house veg and far cheaper than Canadian lamb...I know it's crazy but some people even think the vendors are farmers... :lol:

Jerry J. Fortin · December 31, 2009

We also have farmer's markets..they sell veg from latin america and New Zealand lamb...which is a lot cheaper than Canada produced hot house veg and far cheaper than Canadian lamb...I know it's crazy but some people even think the vendors are farmers...

Our farmers markets out here demand local production. The exception being BC produce is okay for sale.

M.Dancer · December 31, 2009

Our farmers markets out here demand local production. The exception being BC produce is okay for sale.

Consumers demand local production too....they alos demand zuchinni in January...

I mean, we go to the "farmers markets" too. They have them across from the St Lawrence market on Saturdays. Sometimes even, they are cheaper than buying at loblaws...