Venezuela taxes GM... a lot

[betsy]

Venezuela has become an example for survivalists.

 

 

Quote

 

Venezuelans Ransack Stores as Hunger Grips the Nation

CUMANÁ, Venezuela — With delivery trucks under constant attack, the nation’s food is now transported under armed guard. Soldiers stand watch over bakeries. The police fire rubber bullets at desperate mobs storming grocery stores, pharmacies and butcher shops. A 4-year-old girl was shot to death as street gangs fought over food.

Venezuela is convulsing from hunger.

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2016/06/20/world/americas/venezuelans-ransack-stores-as-hunger-stalks-crumbling-nation.html?_r=0

 

 

 

Edited April 21, 2017 by betsy

[Michael Hardner]

1 hour ago, betsy said:

 

Do you know the reason why Venezuela seized the GM plant?

I assume the reason is that they wanted it. 

[Michael Hardner]

6 minutes ago, betsy said:

 

1) When government takes over and controls businesses - we've officially become socialists.

 

2) Who says everything in life is fair?   What's the point of trying to invest time, money and energy in finding cancer cure if the person who finds the cure cannot have any say in his property?  Is it fair to him to have his property stolen?

3) A nation has to have sufficient laws to avoid exploitation by greedy entrepreneurs, and to ensure that the laws are being followed.

 

1) Yes, I mostly agree that's a clear line.

2) Nobody says it's fair, and so maybe the person who gets their product stolen shouldn't complain ?

3) Laws to ensure laws are being followed sounds like a snake eating its tail.

[betsy]

1 minute ago, Michael Hardner said:

I assume the reason is that they wanted it. 

 

If GM had broken any serious laws, I suppose the government can seize it.  What's the difference between that and our government seizing assets of racketeers?

[Michael Hardner]

Just now, betsy said:

 

If GM had broken any serious laws, I suppose the government can seize it.  What's the difference between that and our government seizing assets of racketeers?

If some actual crime was underway by GM then maybe it's the same.

[betsy]

6 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

2) Nobody says it's fair, and so maybe the person who gets their product stolen shouldn't complain ?

3) Laws to ensure laws are being followed sounds like a snake eating its tail.

 

2)  What's complaining got to do with that?  That would be like saying people who are starving shouldn't cry out.

3)  That's why I said, it's a big risk for investors to go to places like Venezuela, where the playing field can easily change at the drop of a hat.  One day you're in a semi-democratic landscape, and next week - thanks to a coup - you're suddenly in the midst of communists.

 

GM wasn't the only one, btw who's had problems in Venezuela.

 

 

Edited April 21, 2017 by betsy

[Michael Hardner]

2) You said yourself that 'life isn't fair'.  It sounded like you were making a point against striving for justice in such laws.

3) Agreed.  

[betsy]

4 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

2) You said yourself that 'life isn't fair'.  It sounded like you were making a point against striving for justice in such laws.

 

 

It's just stating a fact.  And I pointed out "unfairness" in the cancer-cure, from the pov of the person who discovered it! 

 

Life being unfair doesn't mean you can't moan, and complain about life.  It doesn't mean that you cannot, and you shouldn't ask for help either.

Edited April 21, 2017 by betsy

[blackbird]

Argentina is having demonstrations now as well.  Governments that seize companies and intervene in the economy in a drastic way seem to have more trouble  than others that let the free market run freely.  I think it said on the news that Venezuela has at least 25% unemployment.  Marxism, socialism (state intervention in the economy) has proven to be a failure where ever it is attempted.  I see the problem as boiling down to respect for private ownership of property and private investment.  Governments that do not respect this principle seem to create chaos and social unrest.  The marxist revolution in Cuba 57 years ago may have had a temporary effect of spreading the poverty around to everyone.  But the lasting effect has been a much lower standard of living and loss of freedom and repression of tens of thousands of people.  Only lately have things improved marginally because the government is allowing people to have small businesses and operate some free enterprise.  This all comes down to biblical principles of respect for private property, respect for individuals efforts and respect for individual rights.  Once government tramples on those rights, people lose hope and despair sets in, distrust of government because they see those in authority lining their own pockets at the expense of the general population.

[cannuck]

On 4/22/2017 at 5:09 PM, blackbird said:

Argentina is having demonstrations now as well.  Governments that seize companies and intervene in the economy in a drastic way seem to have more trouble  than others that let the free market run freely.  I think it said on the news that Venezuela has at least 25% unemployment.  Marxism, socialism (state intervention in the economy) has proven to be a failure where ever it is attempted.  I see the problem as boiling down to respect for private ownership of property and private investment.  Governments that do not respect this principle seem to create chaos and social unrest. 

I think you may be confusing the ideology of socialist revolutions with the reality of the reasons why.   The business of government in any system or country is to dispense privilege.   That is diametrically opposite of what a genuine Marxist economy would ideologically be.  In fact, if you remove privilege, it really doesn't matter WHAT system you install, it has a very good chance to succeed and be sustainable.

What is unique about most of the socialist proponents, is that they see the even distribution of misery to the population a mere side-effect of granting them the huge privilege of gaining access to the resources of the country - to their own benefit.  Russia, Nigeria, China - you name it, this is the status quo of dictatorships and pseudo-elected socialist governments.  Kings and Czars have known this for centuries, and these guys and gals are just learning a lesson from history.

Maduro learned from Chavez (all understudies to the current champion Uncle Vlad) to reward your minions well for carrying out your orders and putting in place the infrastructure to make you a VERY wealthy individual.  Where these two goons failed was in leaving in place enough of the hated capitalist businesses to feed the people who they are robbing blind.