Internet Abuse and Mental Health

[Argus]

Why do people participate on opinion boards?

Well, evidently, some people are frustrated preachers and feel the need to regularly deliver what I like to call 'sermons on the mount'. They assume a noble stance, nose held aloft, and then sanctimoniously deliver their sermon in classical passive-aggressive fashion towards those they regard as their moral inferiors.

Usually, in order to to avoid having their posts deleted they try to walk the fine line of making sure those they're trying to insult know who they're addressing, while pretending to speak generally. This too is classic passive aggression derived from malice and anger.

I have recently been surprised by the negativity, name calling and aggressiveness by some posters on this board.

Recently? It's my impression you have expressed yourself unhappy about posters who fail to measure up to your ideals on many, many occasions for quite some time now, all while proclaiming yourself entirely above the behaviour you denounce – even while engaging in it, as you are here, of course. In fact, I don't know of anyone else who habitually puts so much time and effort into trying to insult other posters.

http://www.mapleleafweb.com/forums/topic/24008-shots-fired-on-parliament-hill/page-43#entry1006626

These unhappy participants are described as people who are characterized by personality traits that fall ... blah blah blah

I've noticed that since the moderators decided that calling people racist, bigot and xenophobe would no longer be allowed certain people, no doubt thinking themselves wonderfully clever, have instead taken to suggesting people who disagree with them suffer from mental ailments instead.

http://www.mapleleafweb.com/forums/topic/23434-moderating-mapleafwebs-moderation/page-99#entry1111994

One such post was deleted the other day, which is no-doubt why someone decided to start an entire topic on the same theme as the deleted post.

Let's start by getting our definitions straight: “An Internet troll is someone who comes into a discussion and posts comments designed to upset or disrupt the conversation.

You mean like these? More sermons from the mount? Note it fails to address the actual discussions, but instead takes a classic passive-aggressive stance in attacking other posters. It's another example of how some people put enormous effort into long-winded antagonistic attacks on other posters.

http://www.mapleleafweb.com/forums/topic/24210-islamophobia/page-15#entry1026580

http://www.mapleleafweb.com/forums/topic/24654-immigration/page-7#entry1079020

I have no doubt that at least one of them will soon be posting here to blame Big Guy or others for their behavior. Denial seems to be one of the symptoms.

That's awfully amusing. One wonders whether certain people could examine their own behaviour and see how closely their own words describe it. But of course, that would take a degree of self-awareness which seems unlikely to be achieved in this case.

Edited May 28, 2016 by Argus

[Argus]

Judging by your "list" it seems to me you may be doing a little trolling yourself.

He had a similar post deleted by the moderators the other day and is apparently furious about it. Having put such extensive time and effort into it he decided to refashion it as a topic instead.

[Argus]

Seems to me that this is just a thinly veiled attempt to trash some unnamed posters which could speak to a borderline narcissistic personality disorder in itself, something more than one poster seems to suffer from.

Bingo. Got it in one.

[waldo]

you first write:

Point taken, but there are some, well one one in particular who is just so supercilious and rude there's no point in reading or responding.

subsequently followed by this: did you see it... did you catch what I did there highlighting (verbatim) your posts?

Seems to me that this is just a thinly veiled attempt to trash some unnamed posters which could speak to a borderline narcissistic personality disorder in itself

"supercillious" - I've noticed you using that word repeatedly of late... why... you used it to refer to me in a status update. Thanks for your consideration.
.

[Big Guy]

I wonder why Argus assumed that it was him/her to which I was referring to as someone with mental health and anger issues? I was clear in referring to a large group including trolls and sociopaths.

Well , if HE believes he fits the criteria then ...

The negativity continues, the slagging continues, the accusations continue - supporting my premise that it is the socially inept sadists who are drawn to these boards. These boards become their reality and they spend (waste) hours daily reading, commenting and insulting in all threads and issues gaining satisfaction and pleasure through the process.

I guess it could be worse. At least we know where they are and it is keeping them from doing too much damage in the real world.

From Psychology To-day:

"An Internet troll is someone who comes into a discussion and posts comments designed to upset or disrupt the conversation. Often, in fact, it seems like there is no real purpose behind their comments except to upset everyone else involved. Trolls will lie, exaggerate, and offend to get a response."

Finally:

1. The next time you encounter a troll online, remember:

2. These trolls are some truly difficult and maladjusted people.

It is your suffering that brings them pleasure, so the best thing you can do is ignore them.

That sounds like good advice.

Edited May 28, 2016 by Big Guy

[herples]

I believe very few people actually troll. I think most are just incredibly stubborn in their position. A troll could care less about their position only the effect their posting will have on others.

Edited May 28, 2016 by herples

[Big Guy]

I believe very few people actually troll. I think most are just incredibly stubborn in their position. A troll could care less about their position only the effect their posting will have on others.

At what point does the passion of defending a position on an issue cross the line into demeaning those who oppose you?

[herples]

At what point does the passion of defending a position on an issue cross the line into demeaning those who oppose you?

I guess when the passionate defender starts demeaning those who oppose him. But is a poster demeaning others necessarily trolling or a lack of maturity on that posters part?

[scribblet]

He had a similar post deleted by the moderators the other day and is apparently furious about it. Having put such extensive time and effort into it he decided to refashion it as a topic instead.

Right... as you say 'have instead taken to suggesting people who disagree with them suffer from mental ailments instead'... the object of this thread is not so thinly veiled.

[Argus]

I wonder why Argus assumed that it was him/her to which I was referring to as someone with mental health and anger issues?

Gee, because you posted the same thing to me yesterday in the post which was deleted by the moderators?

The negativity continues,

Do you mean posting links to your own sermons and insults is 'negativity'? Maybe you should examine why you insist on posting such long-winded insulting posts before marveling at other people responding negatively.

[Argus]

I guess when the passionate defender starts demeaning those who oppose him.

And yet, as I've posted, the OP does that all the time. So surely he doesn't see it that way.

[waldo]

Right... as you say 'have instead taken to suggesting people who disagree with them suffer from mental ailments instead'... the object of this thread is not so thinly veiled.

neither you or the (significantly protesting) MLW member Argus have been singled out negatively directly by name. I recognize the OP post (and other past related thoughts), as an opportune time for introspection, rather than as some perceived personal affront. I know it helps me put your/Argus' board presence in perspective.

.

[Big Guy]

I guess when the passionate defender starts demeaning those who oppose him. But is a poster demeaning others necessarily trolling or a lack of maturity on that posters part?

Could be both. Either way it is not a sign of normal behavior. Is sitting at a keyboard for hours a day arguing with anonymous people from an anonymous position normal?

I believe that where it gets clinical is when it becomes the norm for the individual to interact in that manner. That is, he/she is in constant disagreement with many others, insulting and upsetting many other posters.

This from Media and Tech Network:

"First, trolls are more likely to display noxious personality characteristics, that is, traits that impair one’s ability to build relations and function in a civilised or pro-social way. In a comprehensive examination of their psychological profile, trolls were found to be more Machiavellian (impulsive and charming manipulators), psychopathic (cold, fearless and antisocial), and especially sadist than the overall population. Trolls enjoy harming and intimidating others, so much so that the authors of this study concluded that trolls are “prototypical everyday sadists”, and that trolling should be regarded as online sadism. This is in line with the view of trolling as a form of cyberbullying.

Second, trolling – like other forms of computer-mediated communication – unleashes people’s impulses by providing anonymity and temporary identity loss. This phenomenon, called deindividuation, is well known to psychologists and has been found to emerge in several areas of interpersonal relations, such as gaming, role-playing and crowd behaviours, particularly hooliganism. Thus even when we are not naturally sadistic, trolling may bring out the worst side in us, by lifting the moral constrains and social etiquette that regulates our behaviour in normal situations, and by fuelling dissent and triggering abrasive reactions.

Third, trolling is a status-enhancing activity: by attracting readers’ attention, upsetting people, sparking heated debates, and even gaining approval from others, trolls can feel important, perhaps much more than they are in their real lives. Thus trolling is yet another internet activity that promotes narcissistic motives, since trolls may be expected to be far less successful in attracting people’s attention in the physical world. The only effective antidote to their tactics is to ignore them, but even then trolls won’t suffer a public humiliation because nobody knows who they are. This is what makes trolling so ubiquitous – it requires no skills other than the ability to be obnoxious."

I believe that we have seen these traits in a few of our posters.

[Argus]

neither you or the (significantly protesting) MLW member Argus have been singled out negatively directly by name.

You write like a lawyer quibbling over minute technical aspects of the law, rather than someone who cares about the truth.

[Argus]

I believe that we have seen these traits in a few of our posters.

Certainly seen them in many of your posts.

[WestCoastRunner]

I became more interested via the internet in the larger issues outside our region that were affecting things here and in much the same manner everywhere. The internet is definitely a lot more uncivil and I suspect maybe another reason local meetings are kind of passe is that people are afraid at how uncivil things might get if we all started going back to face to face discussions in the real world. When I do engage in or overhear a discussion about things we go on about here I detect a lot of the same arguments being used and originality either just confuses or pisses people off.

I don't see a whole lot to feel hopeful about regarding civil discourse in any forum moving forward myself when opinions matter more than facts and motives and character are more of an issue than the issue.

Especially on this forum opinions seems to have a higher relevance than facts.

[-1=e^ipi]

At what point does the passion of defending a position on an issue cross the line into demeaning those who oppose you?

Maybe you should ask the person accusing other members of being sociopaths.

[Big Guy]

Maybe you should ask the person accusing other members of being sociopaths.

I assume that you are referring to Big Guy. Then I will ask myself:

Hey Big Guy, why are you accusing other members of being sociopaths?

Thanks for asking, the definition I would use for a sociopath is - a person with a psychopathic personality whose behavior is antisocial, often criminal, and who lacks a sense of moral responsibility or social conscience.

I have done no such thing. I have suggested, as have most of my references, that if a person spends hours a day, of their free time, interacting on an anonymous opinion board, demeaning, insulting and baiting other anonymous members then that behavior is not normal.

You may disagree.

If a person spend most of their free time on opinions boards, arguing, insulting, demeaning and baiting other anonymous posters - do you consider that to be normal and healthy behavior?

There are other posters on this board who I consider to have difficulties in the real world and that is why they spend time here creating difficulty for others. But that is only what I think. If you feel that I am mistaken then please ignore my statements. I am an anonymous avatar on an anonymous opinion board of other anonymous avatars. Why would you care what I think?

Unless it strikes a nerve.

BTW - Would you agree or disagree with the following:

http://www.newyorker.com/tech/elements/the-psychology-of-online-comments

Edited May 29, 2016 by Big Guy

[?Impact]

At what point does the passion of defending a position on an issue cross the line into demeaning those who oppose you?

Going back to what I said earlier, I see it as the interaction between people. Yes there are a few truly self motivated trolls out there, but often I see a conversation as "my way", "no, my way", etc. Very little new arguments, just two or more people bickering back and forth without any progress. It is the quest to get the last word, because obviously that is the winner.

[Argus]

I assume that you are referring to Big Guy. Then I will ask myself:

Hey Big Guy, why are you accusing other members of being sociopaths?

Thanks for asking, the definition I would use for a sociopath is - a person with a psychopathic personality whose behavior is antisocial, often criminal, and who lacks a sense of moral responsibility or social conscience.

It's really rather sad to be so determined to find a reason why others disagree with you - other than them being right and you being wrong. I suppose if you get all your information from Russia TV and Al Jazeera that would give you a different worldview. But to ascribe other people disagreeing with you as either guilty of moral failings or psychologically damaged shows a desperation to be right that is... well... kinda pathetic.

[Michael Hardner]

[Big Guy]

neither you or the (significantly protesting) MLW member Argus have been singled out negatively directly by name. I recognize the OP post (and other past related thoughts), as an opportune time for introspection, rather than as some perceived personal affront. I know it helps me put your/Argus' board presence in perspective.

.

I am glad to see that you understand my OP. I do find it enlightening that somebody evaluates their own behavior as being sadist, assumes then that the post is directed at them and then starts to defend themselves. How revealing is that?

I believe that there are many positive ways to react to those unhappy sadists:

Big Guy has been accused of anti-Semitism, Jew hating, Muslim loving, terrorist supporting, Putin loving, terrorist enabling, aggressive passive behaviour, passive aggressive behaviour, aggressive behaviour, trolling, supporting Arab interests over Canada (one of the more mild ones) , Jew baiter, ISIL supporter, liar, freedom hater, bigot, racist, arrogant, self serving, intolerant, dishonest, demeaning and has bad breath (just to name a few). I resent that – I do not have bad breath!

Those kind of statements might effect the mental health of someone not accustomed to the sadists who lurk on these boards

For the rest of those accusations, I note where they come from, evaluate the credibility of the source and generally dismiss them, giving them the reaction they deserve. I have never “reported” anyone. I would recommend others use the same tactic.

[Big Guy]

It's really rather sad to be so determined to find a reason why others disagree with you - other than them being right and you being wrong. I suppose if you get all your information from Russia TV and Al Jazeera that would give you a different worldview. But to ascribe other people disagreeing with you as either guilty of moral failings or psychologically damaged shows a desperation to be right that is... well... kinda pathetic.

Thank you for your post. I assume that I may now add "pathetic" to my growing data base of descriptions of Big Guy. It does sound familiar so I will have to check if you have not used that one before.

People spend their free time on these boards for pleasure. They enjoy the participation. There are those who continually bait, tease, demean and do anything within the guidelines to instill either fear, discomfort or pain in others. One would have to assume that they enjoy what they are doing.

In this thread, I have given references to many psychiatric periodicals in which professionals ascribe this kind of behavior to mentally disturbed individuals who lurk on these boards. "Dark Tetrad: Machiavellianism (willingness to manipulate and deceive others), narcissism (egotism and self-obsession), psychopathy (the lack of remorse and empathy), and sadism (pleasure in the suffering of others)." You may reject those reference findings and good for you.

For some reason, you have attributed these characteristics and behavior to your own posts and participation. I have no control over that. You now appear to have established yourself as the spokesperson for those to whom I was referring – they might not accept your leadership but I have no control over that either.

Canada, what a wonderful place to live!

[Argus]

Thank you for your post. I assume that I may now add "pathetic" to my growing data base of descriptions of Big Guy.

No fear. That was among the first descriptions which came to mind as soon as you started posting.

There are those who continually bait, tease, demean and do anything within the guidelines to instill either fear, discomfort or pain in others.

I've pointed out the frequency with which you do this fairly often. Are you finally engaging in some self-examination?

In this thread, I have given references to many psychiatric periodicals in which professionals ascribe this kind of behavior to mentally disturbed individuals who lurk on these boards.

It's certainly a good sign that you've found something other than Al Jazeera to quote. But you might be careful, some of those psychiatrists are probably Jews. I trust you have checked to ensure that doesn't happen?

[Big Guy]

No fear. That was among the first descriptions which came to mind as soon as you started posting.

I've pointed out the frequency with which you do this fairly often. Are you finally engaging in some self-examination?

It's certainly a good sign that you've found something other than Al Jazeera to quote. But you might be careful, some of those psychiatrists are probably Jews. I trust you have checked to ensure that doesn't happen?

I assume you posted this as an example of attempting of demeaning. I think your choice is a good one.

Why would a person spend part of his/her free time on a Sunday afternoon to try to aggravate somebody unless they took pleasure in the process. Really sad is it not?

I assume that the person you took this quote from had a rush of pleasure after posting. Perhaps you could ask him/her if it was comparable to a sexual rush? If you read some of the materials I suggested you would understand that to be one of the traits for satisfaction for these afflicted people.

If you have other examples then please share with us in this thread.