SpankyMcFarland Posted October 3, 2015 Report Share Posted October 3, 2015 (edited) Oh yeesh. Can you get more dramatic? Lots of countries strip foreigners of their citizenship when they prove to be traitors.It's amazing the desperate sympathy the Left has for murderers, terrorists, and traitors. It may be difficult for you to understand. And, legally speaking, it is going to be an expensive learning experience for us all. Edited October 3, 2015 by SpankyMcFarland Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilber Posted October 3, 2015 Report Share Posted October 3, 2015 In the Gaya case, that is not even true. He is not a dual citizen. Maybe yes, maybe not. The legislation doesn't allow someone to be made stateless so whether he is actually a Pakistani citizen will have to be established before he can be deported. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted October 3, 2015 Report Share Posted October 3, 2015 Then one should assume prosecutors can't make a valid case for doing so. This short sentence implies a less severe crime making deportation even more harsh and unusual. No, the short sentence implies a crappy judicial system which is extremely lax on criminals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted October 3, 2015 Report Share Posted October 3, 2015 It may be difficult for you to understand. And, legally speaking, it is going to be an expensive learning experience for us all. I think it's going to be a learning experience for you and the other progressives when Quebec brings in its anti-niquab laws. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 3, 2015 Report Share Posted October 3, 2015 So someone who was born here and moved to some other country at age two and lived there for 30 years and then comes back and commits acts of terrorism should not be deported because he is Canadian, but I should be deported if I commit acts of terrorism because I moved here when I was 9 and have lived here for the last 20 years of my life? Once Canadian, always Canadian. Excellent point, along with your other one about being too young to take the oath. Still, it doesn't bother me in the slightest if the powers that be ignore such and deport them anyway. It's not perfect, but then, what is? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpankyMcFarland Posted October 3, 2015 Report Share Posted October 3, 2015 I think it's going to be a learning experience for you and the other progressives when Quebec brings in its anti-niquab laws. Maybe we should start the learning experience by spelling it correctly? Nothing Quebec could do would surprise a 'progressive' like me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted October 3, 2015 Report Share Posted October 3, 2015 I think it's going to be a learning experience for you and the other progressives when Quebec brings in its anti-niquab laws. I think it's going to tear the country apart when Quebec runs afoul of the SCC. I hope it tears the country apart I mean. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpankyMcFarland Posted October 3, 2015 Report Share Posted October 3, 2015 (edited) Maybe yes, maybe not. The legislation doesn't allow someone to be made stateless so whether he is actually a Pakistani citizen will have to be established before he can be deported.I suspect the defence will have something to say about that. This case does not have the proverbial snowball's chance in Hell of getting anywhere. It's pure Reform Party old style race and religion hysteria. We all know that, right? Far stronger cases have been rejected by the Supreme Court, if it ever gets that far, which I very much doubt. Edited October 3, 2015 by SpankyMcFarland Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilber Posted October 3, 2015 Report Share Posted October 3, 2015 I suspect the defence will have something to say about that. This case does not have the snowball's chance in Hell of getting anywhere. It's pure Reform Party old style race and religion hysteria. We all know that, right? Far stronger cases have been rejected by the Supreme Court, if it ever gets that far, which I very much doubt. I'm sure they will and the prosecution will have to convince a judge. Probably more than one judge but if the law itself is constitutional and he does have dual citizenship, he could be deported. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dre Posted October 3, 2015 Report Share Posted October 3, 2015 Maybe on your planet. Here on earth, 25,000 Muslim terrorist attacks in 14 years puts them way behind in terms of peace. That depends on what you count and what you ignore. My guess is that as many or more people have died by the hands of Christians in recent history. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Signals.Cpl Posted October 3, 2015 Report Share Posted October 3, 2015 If you are a dual citizen, you are also something other than a Canadian. I understand that and if the goal is to remove dual citizenship the by all means bring forth legislation to remove the possibility for dual citizenship just don't feed me BS about how my family and I are safer because of a law that is so easily circumvented. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angrypenguin Posted October 3, 2015 Report Share Posted October 3, 2015 I feel like a large public act of terrorism has to happen before people can agree on this issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Signals.Cpl Posted October 3, 2015 Report Share Posted October 3, 2015 Excellent point, along with your other one about being too young to take the oath. Still, it doesn't bother me in the slightest if the powers that be ignore such and deport them anyway. It's not perfect, but then, what is? So the only prerequisite to being Canadian is birth in Canada? And since I was young when I came to Canada why should my country of birth want me back if I become a terrorist? Instead of Marginalizing citizens, we need to fix the immigration and refugee system, hand out tougher sentences where terrorism is concerned and hunt down those who are doing the recruiting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted October 3, 2015 Report Share Posted October 3, 2015 I feel like a large public act of terrorism has to happen before people can agree on this issue. Nothing like fear and crisis to encourage people to make rational decisions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Signals.Cpl Posted October 3, 2015 Report Share Posted October 3, 2015 I feel like a large public act of terrorism has to happen before people can agree on this issue. And how would this prevent such an event if those responsible were born in Canada, their parents were born in Canada and they only have Canadian citizenship? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angrypenguin Posted October 3, 2015 Report Share Posted October 3, 2015 And how would this prevent such an event if those responsible were born in Canada, their parents were born in Canada and they only have Canadian citizenship? This would not. However, Australia is looking at precisely this issue. They want to remove the Australian citizenship even if they and their parents were born there. C24 is a step in the right direction. International law currently forbids what you are proposing, but it's a step in the right direction. Nobody conquered Rome in one day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 3, 2015 Report Share Posted October 3, 2015 (edited) So the only prerequisite to being Canadian is birth in Canada? And since I was young when I came to Canada why should my country of birth want me back if I become a terrorist? Instead of Marginalizing citizens, we need to fix the immigration and refugee system, hand out tougher sentences where terrorism is concerned and hunt down those who are doing the recruiting. Like you I'm a dual citizen, and there is no reason my country of birth would want me back if Canada decided to deport me. They wouldn't have a choice though, as British is the only nationality that can't be taken away from me. My Canadian nationality can, and I'm okay with that. I came here in good faith, and was accepted in good faith. If Canada messes up, I don't have to stick around. Likewise, if I mess up, Canada doesn't have to suffer me to stick around either. I'm in full agreement with your other points. Edited October 3, 2015 by bcsapper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angrypenguin Posted October 3, 2015 Report Share Posted October 3, 2015 Like you I'm a dual citizen, and there is no reason my country of birth would want me back if Canada decided to deport me. They wouldn't have a choice though, as British is the only nationality that can't be taken away from me. My Canadian nationality can, and I'm okay with that. I came here in good faith, and was accepted in good faith. If Canada messes up, I don't have to stick around. Likewise, if I mess up, Canada doesn't have to suffer me to stick aroung either. I'm in full agreement with your other points. Same here. My other passport is from a country that can't even rescind their own passport, so I'm good there. And international law prevents that. Citizenship is a privilege. I'm an immigrant and I realize that committing treason, an act of terror, or being convicted of a war crime are all things that should cause Canada to give me the boot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilber Posted October 3, 2015 Report Share Posted October 3, 2015 I understand that and if the goal is to remove dual citizenship the by all means bring forth legislation to remove the possibility for dual citizenship just don't feed me BS about how my family and I are safer because of a law that is so easily circumvented. I don't know if that is the goal or not but that is for people who hold more than one citizenship to consider. People who are against this claim it will make two classes of citizen. We already have two classes. People with one citizenship and people with more than one. Does it make you safer? Maybe not but it means we won't have to put up with some people who would do this country and their fellow Canadian citizens harm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angrypenguin Posted October 3, 2015 Report Share Posted October 3, 2015 I don't know if that is the goal or not but that is for people who hold more than one citizenship to consider. People who are against this claim it will make two classes of citizen. We already have two classes. People with one citizenship and people with more than one. Does it make you safer? Maybe not but it means we won't have to put up with some people who would do this country and their fellow Canadian citizens harm. We do have two classes. Terrorists and proper Canadians who don't threaten to blow this country to pieces! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilber Posted October 3, 2015 Report Share Posted October 3, 2015 We do have two classes. Terrorists and proper Canadians who don't threaten to blow this country to pieces! Proper Canadians who don't threaten to blow this country to pieces can hold as many citizenships as they want as far as I'm concerned. Otherwise, get rid of them if possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angrypenguin Posted October 3, 2015 Report Share Posted October 3, 2015 (edited) Proper Canadians who don't threaten to blow this country to pieces can hold as many citizenships as they want as far as I'm concerned. Otherwise, get rid of them if possible. Agreed. I didn't mean to come across in any other way. I know some on my team with 3/4 passports from different countries. If they threaten to blow up the UK, that passport should be revoked. If they threatened to blow up France, that one would be revoked. So on and so forth. EDIT: The Conservatives were asked today if they would include rapists, child molesters etc - and the answer was no. They simply wanted to include terrorist acts as grounds to remove citizenship. I'm definitely for that and appalled the NDP/Liberal disagree. Edited October 3, 2015 by angrypenguin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Signals.Cpl Posted October 3, 2015 Report Share Posted October 3, 2015 Same here. My other passport is from a country that can't even rescind their own passport, so I'm good there. And international law prevents that. Citizenship is a privilege. I'm an immigrant and I realize that committing treason, an act of terror, or being convicted of a war crime are all things that should cause Canada to give me the boot. And how would my country of birth feel when I spend the majority of my life in Canada? From their perspective I am Canadian and therefore Canada's problem. This seems like a non-existent solution to a serious problem, its not a solution because it easily manipulated, I forfeit my other citizenship and Canada is SOL. And my other question still stands, why would any country accept someone who has lived all of their adult life in Canada? IF Canada accepts you as a citizen, you are Canadian for better or for worse, if you lied when applying that is a different story. That is all, you are Canadian and your citizenship should be absolutely equal in every way and right to that of the other 35+ million Canadians. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angrypenguin Posted October 3, 2015 Report Share Posted October 3, 2015 (edited) And how would my country of birth feel when I spend the majority of my life in Canada? From their perspective I am Canadian and therefore Canada's problem. This seems like a non-existent solution to a serious problem, its not a solution because it easily manipulated, I forfeit my other citizenship and Canada is SOL. And my other question still stands, why would any country accept someone who has lived all of their adult life in Canada? IF Canada accepts you as a citizen, you are Canadian for better or for worse, if you lied when applying that is a different story. That is all, you are Canadian and your citizenship should be absolutely equal in every way and right to that of the other 35+ million Canadians. I'm sure they would be butthurt, but if they don't have a way of revoking my [insert country here] citizenship, then they should find a way. If they don't have adequate legislation to deal with me, too bad. To me, I am Canadian first, but if I choose to harm Canada and I lose my citizenship as a result, I am for that. Edited October 3, 2015 by angrypenguin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Signals.Cpl Posted October 3, 2015 Report Share Posted October 3, 2015 I don't know if that is the goal or not but that is for people who hold more than one citizenship to consider. People who are against this claim it will make two classes of citizen. We already have two classes. People with one citizenship and people with more than one. Does it make you safer? Maybe not but it means we won't have to put up with some people who would do this country and their fellow Canadian citizens harm. How so? By exporting those people to another country? They are Canadians and thus they are the problem of the government of Canada. Why should we destabilize another country because we don't want to deal with our own trash? And how would this make you safer when it is so easy to bypass? I forfeit my other citizenship and I become Canada's problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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