Wynne's Solar Energy Plan - Unbelievable Bid Rigging and Bribes

[Keepitsimple]

Will there be no end to the corruption and incompetence of the Wynne Government? The Toronto Star - historically a lover of all things Liberal - allowed this opinion piece to be published. It's an incredible piece - almost unbelievable. Do you really think that Justin Trudeau will want Wynne campaigning beside him in Ontario?

As a part of the Wynne government’s plan for solar electricity generation, industrial-scale solar factories covering thousands of acres with hundreds of thousands of panels are going to be installed in Ontario’s rural-residential areas against the wishes of the overwhelming majority of the affected areas’ residents. The problem is like something dreamt up by a Hollywood scriptwriter.

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The government’s underhanded fix comes in the terms of the subsequent “bid process.” It’s been deliberately rigged by the government in favour of multi-billion-dollar energy companies against the vast majority of affected local residents. The energy company must hold a single public “briefing,” one in which they choose what information they want to reveal, and they then seek approval not from the affected residents, but the municipal council.

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To ensure municipal approval, if the council votes in favour of the energy company, the municipality is promised millions of dollars to be voluntarily “donated” by the company over the project’s lifetime. On an individual basis this would constitute criminal bribery.

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The Liberal government hasn’t stopped there. Even if the municipality has the backbone to refuse the bribe, it has set the rules so that without explanation the government can still award the energy company the contract. If that happens, the energy company gets to despoil the rural area without paying the municipality a cent. The bribe is now tinged with blackmail.

Link: http://www.thestar.com/opinion/commentary/2015/06/25/wynne-government-creates-yet-another-energy-mess.html

[Topaz]

Didn't you know that is already been in play for years? The region of Chatham-Kent has the largest area of wind Turbines in ONTARIO, if not Canada. Although, there had to be a willing farmer to allow the wind turbines and rent the land out for 20 years for $15,000-20,000 yearly and not all farm land qualified, depending on the location. Today, there are still more to come, I think, something like around 100-200, within the next year. The C-K gets about money from the companies which they need because its very high in unemployment and they have Tories as MP and MPP and they can't get businesses to come and people are leaving the area. You'll also see some solar panels also.

[Shady]

Didn't you know that is already been in play for years? The region of Chatham-Kent has the largest area of wind Turbines in ONTARIO, if not Canada. Although, there had to be a willing farmer to allow the wind turbines and rent the land out for 20 years for $15,000-20,000 yearly and not all farm land qualified, depending on the location. Today, there are still more to come, I think, something like around 100-200, within the next year. The C-K gets about money from the companies which they need because its very high in unemployment and they have Tories as MP and MPP and they can't get businesses to come and people are leaving the area. You'll also see some solar panels also.

What does that have to do with bid rigging and bribes?

[Big Guy]

I am one of those who is a proponent of solar and wind energy. I guess because of that position, I see what the green energy corporations are doing as the cost of doing business.

We live in an area where the wind turbine issue continues to be controversial with passionate views on both sides. It is creating problems with those who are leasing their previously farmed land (tobacco) for turbines and their neighbors. The health issue is also pitting neighbor against neighbor.

I do disagree with some of the assertions in the Star article. In our area, the majority of people support green energy.

Those bordering on lands that are being used do complain. But people complain of cattle manure, ginseng spraying and many other things that happen on farms.

Municipal councils represent the views of their constituents - how does the Star feel that the energy companies get the views of the residents?

It is nothing new for a business to promise assets to a municipality for rezoning - and vice-versa. They promise anything from commercial taxes, to hiring locally, to using local resources. Municipalities make "arrangements" for easy acquisition to land needed, deals are made about infrastructure provisions, deals are made of energy provisions and rate for electricity etc. These are considered business practices and certainly not bribes. A county next to ours was promised over $20 million "donation" to infrastructure spending for the acceptance of 20 more wind turbines.

Whether these turbines "despoil" the landscape is a matter of aesthetics and personal taste. The Ontario government considers the energy decisions to be a provincial mandate and not municipal responsibility like education, transportation etc. While municipalities are "consulted", the final decision is made by the province. This was the same relationship between the province and municipalities as was under Mike Harris when the Conservatives were in power.

What the Star did do was publish an OPINION. An opinion just as valid as every other opinion of people involved in this issue.

[msj]

It's not unheard of for BC First Nations to turn down bribes from the LNG industry to the tune of $1.15 billion.

People should see how "despoiled" the landscape becomes when these things break. It's not even a matter of personal taste.

[Argus]

It's not unheard of for BC First Nations to turn down bribes from the LNG industry to the tune of $1.15 billion.

People should see how "despoiled" the landscape becomes when these things break. It's not even a matter of personal taste.

What do you think the landscape is like living next to one of those huge solar farms?

[msj]

Not pretty I'm sure.

Haven't seen a really big one yet.

But better than the smell of sour gas though.

Better than feeling the impact of an exploding train with inadequate regulation enforcement.

Etc, etc, whatever the sins of the wind/solar sector the O&G&C have done far far better (which is to say, worse).

[AngusThermopyle]

Not pretty I'm sure.

Haven't seen a really big one yet.

But better than the smell of sour gas though.

Better than feeling the impact of an exploding train with inadequate regulation enforcement.

Etc, etc, whatever the sins of the wind/solar sector the O&G&C have done far far better (which is to say, worse).

Well that's a truly outstanding example of an overblown melodramatic post that manages to convey no coherent message at all. Well done!

[PrimeNumber]

What do you think the landscape is like living next to one of those huge solar farms?

I've seen plenty . They can be arranged to look pretty cool actually..

looks better than this..

[Big Guy]

Our area has a number of solar farms. Most cannot be seen from the road since part of the rezoning of the land requires creation of hedgerows or mounding of soil around the site so that it cannot be seen from the road.

[ironstone]

I am one of those who is a proponent of solar and wind energy. I guess because of that position, I see what the green energy corporations are doing as the cost of doing business.

We live in an area where the wind turbine issue continues to be controversial with passionate views on both sides. It is creating problems with those who are leasing their previously farmed land (tobacco) for turbines and their neighbors. The health issue is also pitting neighbor against neighbor.

I do disagree with some of the assertions in the Star article. In our area, the majority of people support green energy.

Those bordering on lands that are being used do complain. But people complain of cattle manure, ginseng spraying and many other things that happen on farms.

Municipal councils represent the views of their constituents - how does the Star feel that the energy companies get the views of the residents?

It is nothing new for a business to promise assets to a municipality for rezoning - and vice-versa. They promise anything from commercial taxes, to hiring locally, to using local resources. Municipalities make "arrangements" for easy acquisition to land needed, deals are made about infrastructure provisions, deals are made of energy provisions and rate for electricity etc. These are considered business practices and certainly not bribes. A county next to ours was promised over $20 million "donation" to infrastructure spending for the acceptance of 20 more wind turbines.

Whether these turbines "despoil" the landscape is a matter of aesthetics and personal taste. The Ontario government considers the energy decisions to be a provincial mandate and not municipal responsibility like education, transportation etc. While municipalities are "consulted", the final decision is made by the province. This was the same relationship between the province and municipalities as was under Mike Harris when the Conservatives were in power.

What the Star did do was publish an OPINION. An opinion just as valid as every other opinion of people involved in this issue.

I just have two questions:1-Can solar and wind energy projects survive without massive subsidies from taxpayers?

2-Can solar and wind energy projects produce power on demand?

[Big Guy]

I do not know. I do believe that there is very little pollution from these forms of producing electrical power. I also believe that the cost of electricity produced by nuclear and burning of resources is increasing every year. Meanwhile, with the evolution of technologies, the production of electricity from green sources continues to come down.

Many years ago, we decided that it would cost a lot of money to process our waste before dumping it into our waterways. The cost of doing that might be seen as a subsidy of producing clean water.

I am of an age where I believe pollution and by products of things to make them cheaper is killing us. I am prepared to pay more for something if it means that I am not poisoning the earth for future generations. Being on the other side of 70 years old, I am not going to be around here very much longer and I do not want to leave this place in worse shape than when it was handed to my generation.

But that is just my opinion.

[msj]

I just have two questions:1-Can solar and wind energy projects survive without massive subsidies from taxpayers?

2-Can solar and wind energy projects produce power on demand?

I think #1 will be a yes within 5 to 10 years but we will have to wait and see if prices continue to decline for solar (some say low interest rates have created a bubble in solar power so who knows).

As for #2 - clearly no, but solar/wind has already killed peak demand prices from coal/natural gas so it already is beneficial for consumers.

That is, when it gets hot and sunny in various places in the US, NG used to spike up big time as people used their A/C units and drew electricity from the grid. Those spikes aren't happening to the same extent now.

Fossil fuels will always be with us - but with technology improvements hopefully we won't need to use them nearly as much and will hopefully pollute less (or pollute differently and then deal with those new problems in 50 years time).

[Bonam]

Fossil fuels will always be with us - but with technology improvements hopefully we won't need to use them nearly as much and will hopefully pollute less (or pollute differently and then deal with those new problems in 50 years time).

My bet is that fossil fuels will be largely irrelevant within 100 years.

To make solar viable for primary generation, all you need is a worldwide superconducting power grid (sun is always shining somewhere). Sounds far-fetched now but I'd be amazed if within 100 years we hadn't discovered a room temperature superconductor that can be manufactured cheaply and abundantly.

The other alternative is improved energy storage technologies. Energy storage costs are orders of magnitude off right now from what they'd need to be... but within 100 years? I bet they'll get there. There's all kinds of ways to exploit quantum properties of materials to store energy more densely than with traditional chemical means, lots of research on it out there already, and much of it will have been put into practice within that time frame.

Then there's future iterations of fission reactors, hybrid fission/fusion reactors, and fusion energy.

[Big Guy]

I pray that you are correct Bonam. I am now more optimistic for the future. I believe that we owe to the next generation to leave this planet in as good as or better condition than when it was given to us.

[ironstone]

I look at what is happening in Ontario so far with this Green Energy Act and I see nothing positive for consumers.Skyrocketing electricity prices,forcing more and more people into energy poverty.Kathleen Wynne's solution?Add on even more fees to our hydro bills to help pay for those who can't afford to pay theirs.Truly idiotic.

Who in their right mind would want to invest in Ontario with such a high cost of electricity?Is it any wonder so many businesses are leaving?

[Bob Macadoo]

I look at what is happening in Ontario so far with this Green Energy Act and I see nothing positive for consumers.Skyrocketing electricity prices,forcing more and more people into energy poverty.Kathleen Wynne's solution?Add on even more fees to our hydro bills to help pay for those who can't afford to pay theirs.Truly idiotic.

Who in their right mind would want to invest in Ontario with such a high cost of electricity?Is it any wonder so many businesses are leaving?

Green energy is not the reason grid market value is high and expected to climb.......that's managerial incompetance and political grift.........a perpetual energy source in this country unfortunately.