Bob Macadoo Posted February 20, 2015 Report Posted February 20, 2015 No more protest that brings traffic to a halt. They should be charged under terrorist statutes? Kinda like sex offender charges for a 18 y.o. with his 15 y.o. girlfriend. Quote
Smallc Posted February 20, 2015 Report Posted February 20, 2015 They should be charged under terrorist statutes? I doubt that's what the charge would be. Quote
Keepitsimple Posted February 21, 2015 Author Report Posted February 21, 2015 So no actual evidence, just a vague sense of fear and unease. Just out of curiosity, does the Harper government have any plans to reach out to communities that are vulnerable to terrorist recruitment to work with them to staunch the flow of recruits or nah? Obviously you won't believe it - but yes. Quote Back to Basics
Keepitsimple Posted February 21, 2015 Author Report Posted February 21, 2015 The 18% are very vocal. As with other issues where they are in the minority, these close-minded know-it-alls are not satisfied to state their opinions - which they are entitled to......they demean and scoff at the other 82% of Canadians who disagree with them. Even when people agree with additional oversight - which most have - they continue to rant and rave - and rail against the fictitious Harper "hidden agenda'. Tiresome. It really does get old. Meanwhile, the votes keep piling up. Gosh, if he gets more than 50%, our proportional representation thread loses a lot of luster. Quote Back to Basics
On Guard for Thee Posted February 21, 2015 Report Posted February 21, 2015 I doubt that's what the charge would be. Thats exactly what the charge could be. Read the god damn thing before you post! Quote
eyeball Posted February 21, 2015 Report Posted February 21, 2015 (edited) There are none so blind as those who will not see. Paris subway bombings, Charlie Hebdo, Spanish train attacks, recent Belgium attacks, last years Sydney hostage killings, 9/11 of course - and our own brush with lone-wolf attacks. 9/11...of course... There are none so stupid as those who insist on being so. Recall that you were warned, by the blind, repeatedly, that the War of Terror would continue to expand and come to haunt you at home almost 14 years ago now due to the reaction to 9/11. Now I'm going to make another blind guess that we'll still be fighting the War of Stupidity at the conclusion of all our lives and our grand-kids will be lucky if they live to see their grand-kids ever living in peace. Of course even before 9/11... there were people who were warning the West that western governments were recklessly endangering their civilian populations if not world peace. WHEN the Central Intelligence Agency helped overthrow Mohammed Mossadegh as Iran's prime minister in 1953.... ...But in a section on what could be learned from the experience, the history also drew lessons for future conspirators, and today reads as a prescient warning of the political and strategic risks that similar covert operations would pose for the United States. Source Note the date of the article cited. Edited February 21, 2015 by eyeball Quote I said now watch what you say they'll be calling you a radical, a liberal, oh fanatical criminal
Smallc Posted February 21, 2015 Report Posted February 21, 2015 Thats exactly what the charge could be. Read the god damn thing before you post! I'm sure you know the difference between could and would. Quote
On Guard for Thee Posted February 21, 2015 Report Posted February 21, 2015 I'm sure you know the difference between could and would. WILL becomes MAY in the actual language. That may seem minor to you, but if you decipher it, it is quite a difference. Its arguable whether this new language might have stopped Bibeau but could it be used for political purposes, you bet. Quote
jacee Posted February 21, 2015 Report Posted February 21, 2015 No more protest that brings traffic to a halt.Protests always stop traffic. Tens of thousands of protesters will always stop traffic. . Quote
jacee Posted February 21, 2015 Report Posted February 21, 2015 I'm sure you know the difference between could and would. And who are we supposed to trust to make those decisions? Harper? :/ The RCMP? :/ . Quote
Smallc Posted February 21, 2015 Report Posted February 21, 2015 Protests always stop traffic. Tens of thousands of protesters will always stop traffic. . Not when it's done properly it doesn't. And who are we supposed to trust to make those decisions? Harper? :/ The RCMP? :/ . The RCMP and the Crown already make that decision now. Quote
jacee Posted February 21, 2015 Report Posted February 21, 2015 (edited) Not when it's done properly it doesn't.Kinda has to block roads when thousands are walking on the road! We tried the sidewalks but the store owners get p'd and we're whacking pedestrians with our signs!Roads will be blocked. Does that make us 'terrorists'? NO Does make us subject to arrest under the anti-terror act? YES. When citizens are subject to arrest for protesting peacefully in the streets, DISSENT IS CRIMINALIZED. The RCMP and the Crown already make that decision now.The RCMP make no decisions until they get their ORDERS from Harper.. Edited February 21, 2015 by jacee Quote
Smallc Posted February 21, 2015 Report Posted February 21, 2015 Kinda has to when thousands are walking on the road! We tried the sidewalks but the store owners get p'd and we're whacking pedestrians with our signs! Roads will be blocked. Does that make us 'terrorists'? NO But that does make us subject to arrest under the anti-terror act. It's very unlikely that would happen. Of course, there are times when an actual blockade could be labelled a terrorist act. It is most definitely not the peaceful protest you make it out to be. When citizens are subject to arrest for protesting peacefully in the streets, DISSENT IS CRIMINALIZED. That's not the aim and won't be the result. In fact, it would go against the Charter. The aim is to stop actual blockades of roads, which are already illegal. The RCMP make no decisions until they get their ORDERS from Harper. That's a bunch of tinfoil hat nonsense. Quote
Keepitsimple Posted February 21, 2015 Author Report Posted February 21, 2015 9/11...of course... There are none so stupid as those who insist on being so. Recall that you were warned, by the blind, repeatedly, that the War of Terror would continue to expand and come to haunt you at home almost 14 years ago now due to the reaction to 9/11. Now I'm going to make another blind guess that we'll still be fighting the War of Stupidity at the conclusion of all our lives and our grand-kids will be lucky if they live to see their grand-kids ever living in peace. Thank you - and if you are even partially accurate, it's exactly why we need enhanced legislation. While you would have preferred a Chamberlain-esque appeasement approach to the lead-up to 9?11 and 9/11 itself - the fact is we are where we are - it is what it is - and you can argue its genesis until the cows come home. You can choose to ignore reality and find some non-existent road back to appeasement - or you take some incremental steps to protect Canadians. Quote Back to Basics
jacee Posted February 21, 2015 Report Posted February 21, 2015 (edited) It's very unlikely that would happen.It will happen if Harper wants it too.It did happen at the G20, over a thousand peaceful protesters detained, arrested, incarcerated in inhumane conditions. It will happen. So take it out of Bill C51: Change the word "lawful" to "peaceful". Of course, there are times when an actual blockade could be labelled a terrorist act. It is most definitely not the peaceful protest you make it out to be.Blockades are peaceful ... until the police go on a rampage.Tell me: What requirements are in Bill C51 for the police to PROVE that a particular blockade is a serious threat to national security? Any? That's not the aim and won't be the result.Yes it will.In fact, it would go against the Charter.Precisely. So it shouldn't be allowed by Bill C51 ... but it is. Harper likes thumbing his nose at the Charter. The aim is to stop actual blockades of roads, which are already illegal.Public dissent cannot be criminalized.It is essential to a FUNCTIONING democracy. The RCMP oath requires them to follow orders from on high. Their responsibility to protect rights of citizens is minimal. . Edited February 21, 2015 by jacee Quote
cybercoma Posted February 21, 2015 Report Posted February 21, 2015 No more protest that brings traffic to a halt.Aww. It's so inconvenient to have your commute delayed by people standing up for your rights and freedoms. What hassle. Quote
cybercoma Posted February 21, 2015 Report Posted February 21, 2015 Not when it's done properly it doesn't."Proper" protests. What a god damned joke. Quote
eyeball Posted February 21, 2015 Report Posted February 21, 2015 Thank you - and if you are even partially accurate, it's exactly why we need enhanced legislation. While you would have preferred a Chamberlain-esque appeasement approach to the lead-up to 9?11 and 9/11 itself - the fact is we are where we are - it is what it is - and you can argue its genesis until the cows come home. You can choose to ignore reality and find some non-existent road back to appeasement - or you take some incremental steps to protect Canadians. Yes it certainly is what it is now - I'm not ignoring reality at all, I'm watching it unfold as predicted, marvelling at the accuracy of the predictions, making pop-corn and more predictions. It's almost like a game now. Where do you see the process of galvanizing events and incremental steps followed by more events and more steps taking us? As for Chamberlain and more enhanced legislation pffft...what you need is to enculturate our society with the sort of hatred and vilification for your enemy that the enemy is harnessing against you. We don't need a Churchill we need a Dr Strangelove. Quote I said now watch what you say they'll be calling you a radical, a liberal, oh fanatical criminal
Smallc Posted February 21, 2015 Report Posted February 21, 2015 It will happen if Harper wants it too. It did happen at the G20, over a thousand peaceful protesters detained, arrested, incarcerated in inhumane conditions. And that wasn't right. No one has said that it was. It will happen. So take it out of Bill C51: Change the word "lawful" to "peaceful". Blockades are peaceful ... until the police go on a rampage. Blockades are not a peaceful act by nature. Harper likes thumbing his nose at the Charter. And when he does, the courts shoot him down, as it should be. That's why it's there. Public dissent cannot be criminalized. It is essential to a FUNCTIONING democracy. No one is doing that. The RCMP oath requires them to follow orders from on high. Their responsibility to protect rights of citizens is minimal. Not from politicians. Aww. It's so inconvenient to have your commute delayed by people standing up for your rights and freedoms. What hassle. Basically, yes. Also, it impedes commerce. "Proper" protests. What a god damned joke. Legal ones that don't interrupt the normal flow of society. Fight the power has gotten old and tired. No one is listening. They just want to get on with their day. Quote
poochy Posted February 21, 2015 Report Posted February 21, 2015 "Proper" protests. What a god damned joke. I wish people like you would just draw the lines for us then, tell us, how many burning police cars is acceptable during a protest, im going to say 0, lets negotiate. Quote
Keepitsimple Posted February 21, 2015 Author Report Posted February 21, 2015 (edited) Yes it certainly is what it is now - I'm not ignoring reality at all, I'm watching it unfold as predicted, marvelling at the accuracy of the predictions, making pop-corn and more predictions. It's almost like a game now. Where do you see the process of galvanizing events and incremental steps followed by more events and more steps taking us? As for Chamberlain and more enhanced legislation pffft...what you need is to enculturate our society with the sort of hatred and vilification for your enemy that the enemy is harnessing against you. We don't need a Churchill we need a Dr Strangelove. Sarcasm, right? While there's a lot of attention over Islamic Extremism's war on the West, you and I both know that Muslims killing Muslims dwarfs the attacks on Western countries. Hundreds - if not thousands of bombings in Mosques, at funerals - anywhere where there are lots of people. Killing Muslims at prayer. Killing first responders. We're protecting ourselves from this scourge. But who protects peace-loving Muslims? Islam is at war with itself. As much as it sells on the News - we're an afterthought in this struggle for some sort of twisted Islamic dominance. I don't claim to understand it at all - and we may well have contributed along the way - but they are killing each other - thousands and thousands, year after year......and that has very little to do with "us". Edited February 21, 2015 by Keepitsimple Quote Back to Basics
poochy Posted February 21, 2015 Report Posted February 21, 2015 (edited) Such people would be dumb, but fortunately they don't exist except in the fevered swamps of your imagination. So from what i gather, you don't think it's possible for another attack of that scale, or frankly, one much worse to occur, that isn't possible, or lets be generous, more likely to occur because of you know, the actual evidence. I can only assume then that you don't believe that, for example, some people wanted to derail a passenger train as an act of terrorism, competent or not the point is that there are people who might want to do those things and someday, they might be successful, and they aren't just random acts. If the government created this new law without any reason then you would be right. But that is not what has happened, I know, you're wishing so hard for it to be true, you're wishing so hard that a lifetime of brainwashing wasn't coming crashing down around the cavern of your mind, but none of those wishes will change the world you actually live in. Edited February 21, 2015 by poochy Quote
Bob Macadoo Posted February 21, 2015 Report Posted February 21, 2015 It's very unlikely that would happen. Of course, there are times when an actual blockade could be labelled a terrorist act. ... That's not the aim and won't be the result. Please describe a situation that the legislation proposed would stop an organization planning a blockade that you would consider to be a terrorist act. IMO anything you would propose would be "minority report" type situations. Pre-emptive molotov cocktails with no evidence of it......unless you count a few empty vodka bottles lying around. Quote
GostHacked Posted February 21, 2015 Report Posted February 21, 2015 I'm pretty sure we have laws that deal with that. Obviously we must do more. Quote
eyeball Posted February 21, 2015 Report Posted February 21, 2015 Sarcasm, right? While there's a lot of attention over Islamic Extremism's war on the West, you and I both know that Muslims killing Muslims dwarfs the attacks on Western countries. Hundreds - if not thousands of bombings in Mosques, at funerals - anywhere where there are lots of people. Killing Muslims at prayer. Killing first responders. We're protecting ourselves from this scourge. But who protects peace-loving Muslims? Islam is at war with itself. As much as it sells on the News - we're an afterthought in this struggle for some sort of twisted Islamic dominance. I don't claim to understand it at all - and we may well have contributed along the way - but they are killing each other - thousands and thousands, year after year......and that has very little to do with "us". Yeah, it's like no one saw an Islamic civil war coming at all. WW3 is more like it. Quote I said now watch what you say they'll be calling you a radical, a liberal, oh fanatical criminal
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