Racism or Secularism? Quebec looking to ban all religious garb.

[DogOnPorch]

Sure, but why let facts get in the way of delusional opinions.

http://blogs.vancouversun.com/2011/01/27/despite-fears-muslims-growing-only-modestly-in-world-and-canada/

Did you hear that Canada's aboriginal population is also growing? Does this concern you?

Again, I'm not concerned with Islam's growth. It is growing...will continue to grow, One day Islam WILL dominate. There's nothing to be done about it. Quebec is fighting against the current.

What does Canada's Native Indian population have to do with Islam? Islam is an ideology and a religion. Not a race.

[Black Dog]

Again, I'm not concerned with Islam's growth. It is growing...will continue to grow, One day Islam WILL dominate. There's nothing to be done about it. Quebec is fighting against the current.

then why are you talking about it?

[DogOnPorch]

Islam isn't here for anything. It has no will of its own or desires.

But you are free to repeat silly catchphrases ad nauseum.

Islam most certainly has it's own 'will and desires' as written in the Quran and the Hadiths. The VERY word of God. But, you're free to believe that individual Muslims do not take the Quran (et al) seriously.

[DogOnPorch]

then why are you talking about it?

It's like being concerned about changing seasons. Again...I'm not concerned. But, you're in denial. Islam is very clear about its goals as an ideology/faith. It's not to exist as a partner to other faiths and beliefs...quite the opposite.

[Black Dog]

Islam most certainly has it's own 'will and desires' as written in the Quran and the Hadiths. The VERY word of God.

It's an ideology, not a living thing. And, as you've stated (but seem to fail to actually understand) there are a variety of interpretations. It is not a monolith.

But, you're free to believe that individual Muslims do not take the Quran (et al) seriously.

LOL. Who said that?

[DogOnPorch]

It's an ideology, not a living thing. And, as you've stated (but seem to fail to actually understand) there are a variety of interpretations. It is not a monolith.

LOL. Who said that?

If Islam is to be taken seriously, then, it clearly states its goals. Unless you don't take it seriously...then...oh, well. I never said Islam is a living thing, btw. But like any idea...good luck trying to ban it, destroy it, change it or whatever it. And it's here in Canada to stay...not just until it becomes inconvenient to our current values.

[Black Dog]

If Islam is to be taken seriously, then, it clearly states its goals. Unless you don't take it seriously...then...oh, well. I never said Islam is a living thing, btw. But like any idea...good luck trying to ban it, destroy it, change it or whatever it. And it's here in Canada to stay...not just until it becomes inconvenient to our current values.

You're not actually saying anything here. It's just...background noise.

[DogOnPorch]

You're not actually saying anything here. It's just...background noise.

Then post elsewhere.

[TimG]

At what point does "secularism" become an ideology/religion itself requiring a ban from public institutions?

[cybercoma]

At what point do hamburgers become an ideology/religion themselves requiring a ban from public institutions?

[Black Dog]

Then post elsewhere.

I would suggest the same for you, since opinion and discussion boards are a weird place for someone with no opinions and nothing to discuss to frequent.

Edited August 26, 2013 by Black Dog

[DogOnPorch]

At what point do hamburgers become an ideology/religion themselves requiring a ban from public institutions?

Already happened...oddly.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/12/10/rare-burger-ban-london_n_2271131.html

I would suggest the same for you, since opinion and discussion boards are a weird place for someone with no opinions and nothing to discuss to frequent.

You misunderstand...I have no interest in discussing issues with YOU. I could say the sky is blue and you'd disagree.

[TimG]

At what point do hamburgers become an ideology/religion themselves requiring a ban from public institutions?

Secularism is an ideology. Hamburgers is just a random word you picked because you don't understand the difference between an ideology and a thing.

[Black Dog]

You misunderstand...I have no interest in discussing issues with YOU.

Not true, you have the same oblique posting style with everyone (as your exchange with cybercoma shows). Perhaps you're just looking for people to pat you on the head?

I could say the sky is blue and you'd disagree.

On the contrary: I'd be too surprised that you'd make an obviously factual claim for once.

[DogOnPorch]

Secularism is an ideology. Hamburgers is just a random word you picked because you don't understand the difference between an ideology and a thing.

Secularism is more a lack of a religious ideology rather than an ideology of its own. At least in my opinion.

[Black Dog]

At what point does "secularism" become an ideology/religion itself requiring a ban from public institutions?

Pray tell what would that look like?

[TimG]

Secularism is more a lack of a religious ideology rather than an ideology of its own. At least in my opinion.

Yes - the "black is an absence of light rather than a color on its own" argument.

The dictionary definition of ideology is:

"the body of doctrine, myth, belief, etc., that guides an individual, social movement, institution, class, or large group."

I believe that when secularism is used as a rationalization for laws then it is an ideology.

Now there are arguments to be made for a common social ideology but let's not pretend that secularism ideology is some how special compared to religious ideologies. The only thing special about the secularism ideology is it currently has the most political support in Canada.

Edited August 26, 2013 by TimG

[DogOnPorch]

In your opinion, is science an ideology?

[carepov]

Again, I'm not concerned with Islam's growth. It is growing...will continue to grow, One day Islam WILL dominate. There's nothing to be done about it. Quebec is fighting against the current.

When will Islam "dominate"?

[DogOnPorch]

When will Islam "dominate"?

When it has the political clout. Just like everywhere else on the planet.

[TimG]

In your opinion, is science an ideology?

The scientific method is an ideology. Ideology is not a bad word. Enforcement of ideologies for the sake of ideology by the state usually leads to bad things.

So a government can and should mandate that all employees where appropriate professional attire. Some religious attire does fit within this definition. Some does not. The distinction can be arbitrary but the basis for the rule makes sense. Claiming that any religious attire is not appropriate is an ideologically driven rule that makes no sense.

Edited August 26, 2013 by TimG

[TimG]

When it has the political clout. Just like everywhere else on the planet.

Islam appears to be growing because it is a failure.

i.e. successful societies (largely but not exclusively Christian) have brought enough wealth to their members that they stop growing. Islamic societies have largely failed to do this so they continue to grow.

The status quo cannot continue.

Either Islam and Islamic societies must change or they will collapse under their own weight.

Islam won't be 'taking over the world'.

Edited August 26, 2013 by TimG

[DogOnPorch]

Islam appears to be growing because it is a failure.

i.e. successful societies (largely but not exclusively Christian) have brought enough wealth to their members that they stop growing. Islamic societies have largely failed to do this so they continue to grow.

The status quo cannot continue. Either Islam and Islamic societies must change or they will collapse under there own weight.

They won't be 'taking over the world'.

Thanks for your opinion.

The scientific method is an ideology. Ideology is not a bad word. Enforcement of ideologies for the sake of ideology by the state usually leads to bad things.

So a government can and should mandate that all employees where appropriate professional attire. Some religious attire does fit within this definition. Some does not. The distinction can be arbitrary but the basis for the rule makes sense. Claiming that any religious attire is not appropriate is an ideologically driven rule that makes no sense.

If the scientific method is an ideology, are there other ways to conduct the scientific method? It is my understanding that there's ONLY one method.

[carepov]

When it has the political clout. Just like everywhere else on the planet.

At what point, or range in time, will Islam will "dominate" Canada?

[TimG]

If the scientific method is an ideology, are there other ways to conduct the scientific method? It is my understanding that there's ONLY one method.

No. That is what we are taught. But in the real world forming a falsifiable hypothesis is difficult so working scientists eschew that approach in many fields and instead determine "truth" by looking for a consensus among people who study a topic (i.e. something is true because enough scientists believe it to be true). Edited August 26, 2013 by TimG