Close all Food Banks?

[Mr.Canada]

I always think about food banks around the holidays. We always give to the poor as much as we can through food banks. We give quite regularly when we've collected p enough to turn it in. We find it important to remember that it wasn't that long ago that I myself was living on the streets of Toronto and Calgary and needed social services and food banks in order to survive.

I was reading an article from last year that got me thinking. It was about closing all food banks. At first I was outraged and knew that they did do an important job in our community to single people, families and others who cannot make ends meet. Things are tough out there and I would never want a child to go hungry, ever.

Then this article was stating that other countries do not have food banks and instead the state provides a livable wage so people can buy the foods they need to survive.

Food banks can never solve the problem of poverty. It's time to hold our governments accountable to their obligation to ensure that all Canadians have a standard of living adequate for health and well-being.

I wonder what the cost is to the taxpayer either way. Status quo vs government giving more funds to the poor.

Food banks have become a serious obstacle in the fight against poverty. By promising to "end hunger" by feeding hungry Canadians, they provide a comforting illusion that no one is hungry - or if they are, it's their own fault. They shelter us from the harsh reality that millions lack the basic necessities of life.

This point is interesting as well. In stating that food banks will never end hunger and instead perpetuate a cycle of poverty. I do agree that food banks can never end hunger but I don't see how the government giving people more money is going to end hunger either.

I also don't see how giving more money will motivate people to get off assistance which is meant to be a stop gap measure and not a lifestyle choice. Of course the most in need that ave disabilities should always be protected and not removed from help if they truly need it.

No one wants to see Canadians go hungry. This reaction led to the creation of food banks in the first place. That was in the early 1980s, when a deep recession pushed up unemployment

Giving food to those who are hungry is a simple response that everyone supports. Tackling poverty means wrestling with diverse ideas about causes and solutions. It's time to begin that political conversation. But first we have to remove the obstacle that food banks have become.

Source for quotes.

I think food banks are a great idea and a concrete way of corporations to give large amounts of money and food directly to those who will be needing the assistance. They seem to be an example of successful private/public sponsorship. I don't see how cutting off the hand that feeds and depending on the government for everything will be better.

Edited October 5, 2012 by Mr.Canada

[Moonlight Graham]

Well it's right that food banks don't end poverty issues. But people who go to food banks (and I've worked at a food bank) can often be on welfare or unemployed. For the unemployed, disabled etc. a liveable wage doesn't exist. For single mothers/fathers with a minimum wage job it can be hard to make ends meet, so they go to food banks. The homeless, who have no address and therefore makes it virtually impossible for them to be sent government cheques etc., go to food banks.

Why not increase welfare benefits to those who need it? Some may be paranoid that a lot of "welfare bums" are cheating the system (and some people always do), but most people on welfare and disability benefits etc. do need those funds to just crape by.

Why not keep food banks, raise welfare benefits to those that really need it, and promote more social programs to get people on welfare better education/skilla and/or back to work? For low-income single-parents, how about more money for childcare so they can afford more time to work?

[TheNewTeddy]

Adjusting the way food banks work will not help people get off assistance.

[Jiblethead]

if you give people more free money instead of free food, whats to stop them from spending it on drugs and alcohol?

edit: yes, i know about food stamps, these could replace food banks, but honestly we probably need both

Edited October 6, 2012 by Jiblethead

[August1991]

I always think about food banks around the holidays. We always give to the poor as much as we can through food banks. We give quite regularly when we've collected p enough to turn it in. We find it important to remember that it wasn't that long ago that I myself was living on the streets of Toronto and Calgary and needed social services and food banks in order to survive.

WTF?

All things considered, Canada has a very efficient (private) food distribution system. Why would anyone want to create a parallel food distribution system? (IMHO, Gerard Kennedy is an idiot.)

Canada has a wonderful (private) food production/distribution system. Why create a parallel system? If you want to give food to poor people, give them money and let them go to grocery stores and buy food.

OTOH, we can argue about how well the Canadian food system notifies us about the quality of food. IMHO, I would prefer the French system where meat has a certificate of origin. All things considered, I agree with Greenspan (and France) that brands and reputation are the ultimate protection in this modern world.

In federal Canada, we have the incompetent CFIA - and the NDP wants us to hire more bureaucrats. The NDP sadly blames Harper for reducing federal bureaucrats when in fact, the Harper cuts have yet to take effect.

---

Sadly, Canada has a disastrous (State) health production/distribution system. Many of us would like to have a parallel system but idealogues prevent us.

Canada's health system is based on the mentality of food banks.

In stating that food banks will never end hunger and instead perpetuate a cycle of poverty. I do agree that food banks can never end hunger but I don't see how the government giving people more money is going to end hunger either.

And in Canada, with State health care, we will perpetuate a cycle of bad health. Edited October 6, 2012 by August1991

[guyser]

IMHO, I would prefer the French system where meat has a certificate of origin.

We do.

On every package of meat sold in a grocery store. Am I missing something or not understanding your message?

[wyly]

a combination of a living wage and social benfits...no one should have to rely on food banks...

I recall a local woman with two kids(husband walked out) had two minimum wage jobs and still had to make a choice between feeding her kids and a roof over their heads, churches gave her shelter and eventually she found a home she could afford .but this shouldn't be happening in our country...

as to those who abuse aid they will always be with us nothing will deter them... by trying to make it difficult the abusers we punish those who really do deserve assistance....

[Mr.Canada]

wyly, two minimum wage full time jobs? 80 x10.25 is $820. Minus 20% for taxes is $ 656 per week and $2624 per month. That is easily enough money to live on.

We have a duty to make sure the sentences for abuse are long and not just a slap on the wrist. At the same time the system seemingly treats most of the people in need as though something is wrong with them or that they are trying to scam. Keep in mind though that their are good workers too who really do care about people and truly want to help.

I do think that rates need to be raised but I don't think they should be raised by 40% as OCAP suggests. I think OW and ODSP should be raised by $100 across the board for everyone. That should be good enough.

I think that it certainly should help more people not have to use food banks and meal programs as much.

Edited October 10, 2012 by Mr.Canada

[cybercoma]

How does one schedule 2 minimum wage full-time jobs? If even one of those are retail, you don't have the luxury of telling your employer that you can only work particular hours (so as not to conflict with your other fulltime job). A lot of employers won't hire you if they know you have another fulltime job as well. More to the point, fulltime jobs aren't the easiest things to come across either. Most places only hire part-time and promote to fulltime from within.

[GostHacked]

Food banks need to exist in my view. Working for Canada largest grocer, we give a lot away to the food bank.

Wages have stagnated while the cost of everything including food, has drastically risen. IN many cases, people have to chose shelter or food. they cannot afford both.

That other thread where Canadians waste 27 billion dollars worth of food per year might have a part in this.

[August1991]

We do.

On every package of meat sold in a grocery store. Am I missing something or not understanding your message?

No, we don't have the French system.

Unlike in France, meat in Canada does not have a certificate of origin. Moreover in Canada, the term "Product of Canada" has no precise meaning.

----

When you buy a computer in Canada, is the brand identified? Do you know its origin?

When you buy meat in Canada, is the brand identified? Do you know its origin?

This is not a failure of the market, or failure of government regulation/bureaucracy; it's a failure of both. There are several ways to skin a cat and sadly in Canada, both failed.

Edited October 11, 2012 by August1991

[guyser]

No, we don't have the French system.

Ok

Unlike in France, meat in Canada does not have a certificate of origin. Moreover in Canada, the term "Product of Canada" has no precise meaning.

When you buy meat in Canada, is the brand identified? Do you know its origin?

When I buy packaged meat, the origin is posted on the package in the form of a number. It is on all packages.

At a butcher, it has to be marked by grade and country.

[cybercoma]

guyser, it's a lousy system in Canada. Consumers shouldn't need to decode the products they're purchasing. It's just like produce. If the PLU starts with 4 it's conventionally grown (with pesticides), 9 it's organically grown (without chemical pesticides or chemical fertilizers), and 8 means the product has been genetically modified.

Why do I need a guide to figure that out? The products should be clearly labelled "Conventional Crop," "Organic Crop," and "Genetically Modified Crop." It should also indicate the name and location of the farm.

The same goes for meat. The name and location of the farm and slaughterhouse should be on the label, as well as the grade of the cut.

I think a number of people would go out of their way to buy products that were farmed closer to home and with less chemicals or genetic modifications.

The problem now is that this information isn't clearly written on most products. It's written in some code that most people aren't aware of.

[guyser]

guyser, it's a lousy system in Canada. Consumers shouldn't need to decode the products they're purchasing.The same goes for meat. The name and location of the farm and slaughterhouse should be on the label, as well as the grade of the cut.

I think a number of people would go out of their way to buy products that were farmed closer to home and with less chemicals or genetic modifications.

The problem now is that this information isn't clearly written on most products. It's written in some code that most people aren't aware of.

Cannot argue with much of that.

My point was to counter that we do label where it was raised slaughtered and packed. This is the same as in Europe and France follows the EU requirements. I asked if I was missing something and it appears I wasnt.

http://www.spring.gov.sg/QualityStandards/etac/food/Documents/France.pdf

Go to page 4 , beef labeling.

ETA, if the label said Abbatoir Cybercoma, would that make any difference to anyone buying that product? I wouldnt think so, but could be wrong. The point after that is the code is there to trace a faulty meat purchase .

Abbatoir Cybercoma may be a premium brand and yet make lesser priced house brands and want to keep that quiet for obvious reasons.

Edited October 11, 2012 by guyser