bleeding heart Posted July 14, 2012 Report Posted July 14, 2012 (edited) All I got to say is that when you get scientists protesting in the streets, it's time to stare a little more unflinchingly at the Government. The scientists of Canada are revolting. They marched through Ottawa in their thousands on Tuesday, a sea of white coats making its way up Parliament Hill, carrying tombstones and a coffin to symbolise the "death of evidence", chanting "What do we want? SCIENCE! When do we want it? After peer review!"Scientists seem to be forever complaining they're marginalised so, it might be tempting to roll your eyes. When a group from the UK drove a coffin down Westminster last May they were described as "childish". This recent Canadian action might look similar, but it was far from childish. They weren't simply sticking up for their pay cheques, they were sticking up for the right to ask difficult questions and provide uncomfortable knowledge, in particular when it comes to the Arctic. They were sticking up for the things they research as well as the right to keep doing their research. They were sticking up for the planet. The Canadian scientists who spoke to the Guardian were keen to stress this is less about research budgets versus the rest of the economy, and more simply evidence versus ideology. http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2012/jul/11/canada-scientists-strike-protests Edited July 14, 2012 by bleeding heart Quote “There is a limit to how much we can constantly say no to the political masters in Washington. All we had was Afghanistan to wave. On every other file we were offside. Eventually we came onside on Haiti, so we got another arrow in our quiver." --Bill Graham, Former Canadian Foreign Minister, 2007
bleeding heart Posted July 14, 2012 Author Report Posted July 14, 2012 (edited) They should stfu and get real jobs. Yes, I'm sick of their entitlement mentality and their Harper derangement syndrome. They're spoiled kids who don't appreciate the way real scientists are suffering elsewhere, without Mommy and Daddy to help them out..... Edited July 14, 2012 by bleeding heart Quote “There is a limit to how much we can constantly say no to the political masters in Washington. All we had was Afghanistan to wave. On every other file we were offside. Eventually we came onside on Haiti, so we got another arrow in our quiver." --Bill Graham, Former Canadian Foreign Minister, 2007
cybercoma Posted July 14, 2012 Report Posted July 14, 2012 Maybe if they would get a job with a corporation doing research & development creating things that are actually useful in a free market, we wouldn't need to subsidize these lazy bastards. Quote
bush_cheney2004 Posted July 14, 2012 Report Posted July 14, 2012 They should stfu and get real jobs. Many do/did: Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
Peter F Posted July 14, 2012 Report Posted July 14, 2012 (edited) Wasted effort. Chocolate Bars! The present 500 types bore me. We need new Chocolate Bars! Edited July 14, 2012 by Peter F Quote A bayonet is a tool with a worker at both ends
cybercoma Posted July 14, 2012 Report Posted July 14, 2012 Wasted effort. Chocolate Bars! The present 500 types bore me. We need new Chocolate Bars! Complete nonsense. We'll get new chocolate bars when the free market shows we need new chocolate bars! Quote
Canuckistani Posted July 14, 2012 Report Posted July 14, 2012 If they would just quit spreading lies like climate change and other claims that directly contradict the truth as received by Stephen Harper, maybe he'd leave them alone. But they'd have to get off their pampered little assess and invent something useful, like drugs that allow the population to free their minds and open to the greatness that is Harper. Or ones that instill an autonomic bowing reflex when a 1 percenter happens to be unfortunate enough to find himself among them. Quote
cybercoma Posted July 14, 2012 Report Posted July 14, 2012 If they would just quit spreading lies like climate change and other claims that directly contradict the truth as received by Stephen Harper, maybe he'd leave them alone. But they'd have to get off their pampered little assess and invent something useful, like drugs that allow the population to free their minds and open to the greatness that is Harper. Or ones that instill an autonomic bowing reflex when a 1 percenter happens to be unfortunate enough to find himself among them. You win at this game. I concede! Quote
Shady Posted July 14, 2012 Report Posted July 14, 2012 Yes, I'm sick of their entitlement mentality and their Harper derangement syndrome. They're spoiled kids who don't appreciate the way real scientists are suffering elsewhere, without Mommy and Daddy to help them out..... Well said! Everybody has to tigthen their belts a little these days. They're no exception. Quote
bleeding heart Posted July 14, 2012 Author Report Posted July 14, 2012 Well said! Everybody has to tigthen their belts a little these days. They're no exception. I'm trying to decipher whether you're pretending to know something about a subject of which you have no knowledge...or if you're conceding in a mildly mischievous manner that you do not. Since you plainly didn't read the linked article, I'm inclining towards the latter. Quote “There is a limit to how much we can constantly say no to the political masters in Washington. All we had was Afghanistan to wave. On every other file we were offside. Eventually we came onside on Haiti, so we got another arrow in our quiver." --Bill Graham, Former Canadian Foreign Minister, 2007
Shady Posted July 14, 2012 Report Posted July 14, 2012 I'm trying to decipher whether you're pretending to know something about a subject of which you have no knowledge...or if you're conceding in a mildly mischievous manner that you do not. Since you plainly didn't read the linked article, I'm inclining towards the latter. Nope. I read the link. They're not too happy with funding cuts. Well, too bad. Like I said, everyone has to tighten their belts right now. They're no exception. Quote
bleeding heart Posted July 14, 2012 Author Report Posted July 14, 2012 (edited) Nope. I read the link. They're not too happy with funding cuts. Well, too bad. Like I said, everyone has to tighten their belts right now. They're no exception. They're worried about scientific assessments being downplayed and ignored by the Government. "Tightening belts" doesn't mean we have to deny scientific assessments. But then, how can one expect a serious and intelligent discussion from an elitist who thinks that only property owners should even get the vote! Too good. Edited July 14, 2012 by bleeding heart Quote “There is a limit to how much we can constantly say no to the political masters in Washington. All we had was Afghanistan to wave. On every other file we were offside. Eventually we came onside on Haiti, so we got another arrow in our quiver." --Bill Graham, Former Canadian Foreign Minister, 2007
Shady Posted July 14, 2012 Report Posted July 14, 2012 They're worried about scientific assessments being downplayed and ignored by the Government. Of course they are. It's just a coincidence that it's directly related to their paychecks. They only want what's best for Canada. Quote
capricorn Posted July 14, 2012 Report Posted July 14, 2012 It's just a coincidence that it's directly related to their paychecks. On top of which, there are lucrative research federal grants at stake. Gone, gone, gone... Quote "We always want the best man to win an election. Unfortunately, he never runs." Will Rogers
waldo Posted July 14, 2012 Report Posted July 14, 2012 On top of which, there are lucrative research federal grants at stake. Gone, gone, gone... to accept your flippant and callous, 'scientists self-serving' premise, one would (also) need to accept that all research being shut down is irrelevant, unnecessary, unwarranted, ill-conceived, etc., etc., etc. Do you feel you're on top of this issue to assert such a premise... or do you simply not care about scientific endevour/pursuit? Quote
Shady Posted July 14, 2012 Report Posted July 14, 2012 On top of which, there are lucrative research federal grants at stake. Gone, gone, gone... How dare you! They only want what's best for Canada! Just like when teachers protest, they just want what's best for the children. And when Canada Post protests, they just want what's best for the mail, etc, etc. Quote
waldo Posted July 14, 2012 Report Posted July 14, 2012 How dare you! They only want what's best for Canada! Just like when teachers protest, they just want what's best for the children. And when Canada Post protests, they just want what's best for the mail, etc, etc. to accept your flippant and callous, 'scientists self-serving' premise, one would (also) need to accept that all research being shut down is irrelevant, unnecessary, unwarranted, ill-conceived, etc., etc., etc. Do you feel you're on top of this issue to assert such a premise... or do you simply not care about scientific endevour/pursuit? Quote
TwoDucks Posted July 14, 2012 Report Posted July 14, 2012 The truth costs money, whereas misinformation generates it. Thus it's good for the economy. Get with the program, nerds! Quote
bleeding heart Posted July 15, 2012 Author Report Posted July 15, 2012 So Shady and Capricorn are taking it as a given--based on studious and sober assessment, rather than "Harper rocks!" partisanship--that for ther scientists, it's all about the money. Per Waldo's timely rebuttal, it would be nice to see them expound on this: what makes them think that genuine scientific concern is not at least part of the story? Put it this way; let's take an anti-Conservative approach, and assume that human motivations are complex, and sometimes varied. Given that (mostly) uncontroversial assumption, let's assume that the scientists in question really do have some concerns that are fundamentally about cash for cash's sake. But how does that undermine genuine concern? I think these two should offer us some data proving that Harper's cuts to scientific assessments are not at issue, and that the science is a massive waste of money (flowing into the fat-cat scientists' pockets, of course). Further, they have to explain why scientists from elsewhere--who receive not a penny from the Canadian taxpayer--also think this a bad idea and a dangerous precedent...and who point to current and important scientific work that is directly and immediately harmed by the cuts. What do they have to gain? After all, if it's all about the money , as Materialists Shady and Capricorn believe (and they are explicit about it, unaware of the existence of any other motivations, by anybody, for anything)...then Shady and Capricorn might explain for us the foreign scientists' deep concerns about this. We'll patiently await the parsing out of hidden international scientific finance that makes sense of their initial (and reflexive?) arguments. Quote “There is a limit to how much we can constantly say no to the political masters in Washington. All we had was Afghanistan to wave. On every other file we were offside. Eventually we came onside on Haiti, so we got another arrow in our quiver." --Bill Graham, Former Canadian Foreign Minister, 2007
WWWTT Posted July 15, 2012 Report Posted July 15, 2012 Maybe if they would get a job with a corporation doing research & development creating things that are actually useful in a free market, we wouldn't need to subsidize these lazy bastards. That's harsh buddy! WWWTT Quote Maple Leaf Web is now worth $720.00! Down over $1,500 in less than one year! Total fail of the moderation on this site! That reminds me, never ask Greg to be a business partner! NEVER!
WWWTT Posted July 15, 2012 Report Posted July 15, 2012 So Shady and Capricorn are taking it as a given--based on studious and sober assessment, rather than "Harper rocks!" partisanship--that for ther scientists, it's all about the money. You forgot cybercoma. From the way cyber is talking on this thread you would think he has already burned his NDP membership card and already signed up online for the conservative party! WWWTT Quote Maple Leaf Web is now worth $720.00! Down over $1,500 in less than one year! Total fail of the moderation on this site! That reminds me, never ask Greg to be a business partner! NEVER!
bleeding heart Posted July 15, 2012 Author Report Posted July 15, 2012 You forgot cybercoma. From the way cyber is talking on this thread you would think he has already burned his NDP membership card and already signed up online for the conservative party! WWWTT Cybercoma was joking. He was stating the opposite of what he really thinks about the matter. If you look at my post #3, I did the same thing. Quote “There is a limit to how much we can constantly say no to the political masters in Washington. All we had was Afghanistan to wave. On every other file we were offside. Eventually we came onside on Haiti, so we got another arrow in our quiver." --Bill Graham, Former Canadian Foreign Minister, 2007
GostHacked Posted July 15, 2012 Report Posted July 15, 2012 Nope. I read the link. They're not too happy with funding cuts. Well, too bad. Like I said, everyone has to tighten their belts right now. They're no exception. So when do politicians take a pay cut? When do the bankers go to jail? I don't see the fat cats tightening their belts at all. Quote
WWWTT Posted July 15, 2012 Report Posted July 15, 2012 Cybercoma was joking. He was stating the opposite of what he really thinks about the matter. If you look at my post #3, I did the same thing. I don't know if I should apologize or say "Off with his head!" because he got right into that one? WWWTT Quote Maple Leaf Web is now worth $720.00! Down over $1,500 in less than one year! Total fail of the moderation on this site! That reminds me, never ask Greg to be a business partner! NEVER!
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