Chretien says LPC and NDP should merge

[waldo]

the Canadian public isn't sophisticated enough to understand coalitions are viable working alternatives; clearly, the Harper Conservatives have done their "magic" to seriously undercut an acceptance of coalition government for some time. In any case, still effectively minority government... and yes, we've seen some minority governments work quite well. But in the political climate of today, and the relatively near future, I just don't see an ability to truly realize an alternate majority ruling government. It's equally clear that the Canadian public isn't sophisticated enough... perhaps isn't caring enough... to hold Harper Conservatives accountable for their past/current failings.

I wouldn’t paint the public’s political sophistication levels with such a wide brush…….At least not publicly…….I would opine that most tend to hold a negative view when it’s suggested they’re morons though……..Did you ever consider it was you? You know, the whole living in and believing in social democratic castles in the clouds………And you called me a pompous ass……Jesus Christ.

interesting... although my brush wasn't that wide - after all... was it? I qualified questioning sophistication with direct reference to two aspects: 1- understanding viable working coalition alternatives, and 2- holding Harper Conservatives accountable for past/current failings. Now, if you'd like to get into each of those qualifications I spoke to, bring it on.

as for calling you a "pompous ass", let the record show it was actually "pompous ***"... i.e., your inference, hey? In any case, I have no difficulty resurrecting that scenario, where you stated I dodged you based, in fact, on an actual subsequent edit you had made to your original post. Let me reacquaint you - you're welcome... carry on!

Nice dodge…….so……back to the real world example, "ripped from the Headlines":

dodge! You pompous *** - you added that quote, the following quote, as an edit:

To add, what would be demonstrated by the Italian police giving information to the RCMP?

This post has been edited by Derek L: Today, 10:01 PM

[Guest Derek L]

interesting... although my brush wasn't that wide - after all... was it? I qualified questioning sophistication with direct reference to two aspects: 1- understanding viable working coalition alternatives, and 2- holding Harper Conservatives accountable for past/current failings. Now, if you'd like to get into each of those qualifications I spoke to, bring it on.

as for calling you a "pompous ass", let the record show it was actually "pompous ***"... i.e., your inference, hey? In any case, I have no difficulty resurrecting that scenario, where you stated I dodged you based, in fact, on an actual subsequent edit you had made to your original post. Let me reacquaint you - you're welcome... carry on!

This post has been edited by Derek L: Today, 10:01 PM

[/indent]

So ones sophistication is a direct correlation of ones views towards the current Government?

[waldo]

So ones sophistication is a direct correlation of ones views towards the current Government?

well, at least this time you're half-correct in how you're reading/interpreting my latest post. Again, sophistication in understanding the viability of coalition government... relative to existing working governments... has nothing to do with the current Harper Conservative government. Oh, wait... I see your point. I get it! You're extending on the (lack of) sophistication in regards to the sheeple buying into the Harper Conservative, "Opposition coalitions bad", attack machine. Of course, the other half of my sophistication focus rests upon the understanding/recognition of the overt disdain and disrespect Harper Conservatives have shown for Parliament. But like I said, if you'd really like to get into the intricacies of both of these sophistication failings, we can certainly go there. Your choice...

[Guest Derek L]

well, at least this time you're half-correct in how you're reading/interpreting my latest post. Again, sophistication in understanding the viability of coalition government... relative to existing working governments... has nothing to do with the current Harper Conservative government. Oh, wait... I see your point. I get it! You're extending on the (lack of) sophistication in regards to the sheeple buying into the Harper Conservative, "Opposition coalitions bad", attack machine. Of course, the other half of my sophistication focus rests upon the understanding/recognition of the overt disdain and disrespect Harper Conservatives have shown for Parliament. But like I said, if you'd really like to get into the intricacies of both of these sophistication failings, we can certainly go there. Your choice...

I apologise for hovering on this point, but clearly the recent Majority mandate relied on these very “sheeple”, or the centrist Canadian voter, to have said mandate awarded….Now would it be a fair conclusion to assume the these very same voters would be required to form a Majority NDP or Liberal Government?

Would questioning their level of “sophistication” be a valid strategy during the next election campaign?

I think your camp should run with it.

[waldo]

I apologise for hovering on this point, but clearly the recent Majority mandate relied on these very “sheeple”, or the centrist Canadian voter, to have said mandate awarded….Now would it be a fair conclusion to assume the these very same voters would be required to form a Majority NDP or Liberal Government?

Would questioning their level of “sophistication” be a valid strategy during the next election campaign?

I think your camp should run with it.

well... there you go again! Hey now, didn't you just state you, "wouldn’t paint the public’s political sophistication levels with such a wide brush"? And didn't I narrow that brush for you by emphasizing the 2 aspects my sophistication comment was tagged against? And didn't I just (further) elaborate around the sheeple and 1 of those 2 aspects; i.e., coalitions? Why... yes I did!

but, like I said: "there you go again". Elevating my focused sheeple sophistication association comment to (not) understanding/recognizing working viable coalition governments... elevating it to your continued want to, "paint with a wide brush".

[Guest Derek L]

well... there you go again! Hey now, didn't you just state you, "wouldn’t paint the public’s political sophistication levels with such a wide brush"? And didn't I narrow that brush for you by emphasizing the 2 aspects my sophistication comment was tagged against? And didn't I just (further) elaborate around the sheeple and 1 of those 2 aspects; i.e., coalitions? Why... yes I did!

but, like I said: "there you go again". Elevating my focused sheeple sophistication association comment to (not) understanding/recognizing working viable coalition governments... elevating it to your continued want to, "paint with a wide brush".

So to clarify, only “left leaning”, non-Conservative voters have the sophistication to understand how Parliament works?

[waldo]

So to clarify, only “left leaning”, non-Conservative voters have the sophistication to understand how Parliament works?

how obtuse are you, truly? Again, you've extended upon a most direct reference to coalition governing and made a wholesale, across-the-board, extension of that to "Parliament at large". There you go again! I also said nothing about Conservative voters... or non-Conservative voters - my target was initially described as, "the Canadian public", which was further extended upon when you began your banal obtuseness, to the, "sheeple" who, again, know nothing of the viable working alternative coalition governments throughout the world. Those who can't think beyond the Harper Conservative "coalition bad" attack machine.

Edited April 19, 2012 by waldo

[Guest Derek L]

how obtuse are you, truly? Again, you've extended upon a most direct reference to coalition governing and made a wholesale, across-the-board, extension of that to "Parliament at large". There you go again! I also said nothing about Conservative voters... or non-Conservative voters - my target was initially described as, "the Canadian public", which was further extended upon when you began your banal obtuseness, to the, "sheeple" who, again, no nothing of the viable working alternative coalition governments throughout the world. Those who can't think beyond the Harper Conservative "coalition bad" attack machine.

I see my error, the “sheeple” are those who have fallen pray to the snake oil sales pitch by the Harper machine on coalitions....IOW PM Harper has got their collective noses...

Just putting this out there, what if they understand the viability of a coalition Government and are just not interested?

[Tilter]

I see my error, the “sheeple” are those who have fallen pray to the snake oil sales pitch by the Harper machine on coalitions....IOW PM Harper has got their collective noses...

Just putting this out there, what if they understand the viability of a coalition Government and are just not interested?

"sheeple" should be reserved for only those who would foster the idea of Kreetin as leader of the LDP merger.

As to a coalition Government, Prime Minister (and he is a Prime Minister) Harper is the Prime Minister, and he has more votes in Parliament--- we have a government & don't need a minority coalition.

[waldo]

I see my error, the “sheeple” are those who have fallen pray to the snake oil sales pitch by the Harper machine on coalitions.

yes, I wholly accept your snake oil sales pitch characterization

Just putting this out there, what if they understand the viability of a coalition Government and are just not interested?

ah yes... aided and abetted by the Harper Conservative caucus beating the anti-coalition drum in their home ridings, your 'not interested' took the form of raucous protestations that a coalition would "steal democracy" and deny a 'rightfully elected' Harper Conservative government. Is that the, "understanding viability" and, "not interested", that you're speaking to?

[WLDB]

Polling among NDP members?

I think not!

WWWTT

Im an NDP member and I'm for a merger, or at the very least talking about it. Neither the NDP nor the Liberals alone stand a chance against the Conservatives.

[WWWTT]

Im an NDP member and I'm for a merger, or at the very least talking about it. Neither the NDP nor the Liberals alone stand a chance against the Conservatives.

At the next NDP convention forward a motion for the NDP to enter merger talks with the liberals.Or have it done through your riding association.Either way get ready for a huge fight when debate opens on the floor!

Good luck!

WWWTT

[eyeball]

I don't care what they call it as long as it's un-conservative - a far more natural governing ideology than we're being subjected to.

[Newfoundlander]

I don't care what they call it as long as it's un-conservative - a far more natural governing ideology than we're being subjected to.

"natural governing ideology" what's that mean?

[madmax]

"natural governing ideology" what's that mean?

I think he means UNREPUBLICAN, as the current government seems more in tune with the antics of Newt Gingrich then of Sir John A MacDonald.

Edited April 26, 2012 by madmax

[PIK]

Classic chretien, all about him, the only reason he is saying that, because in his head he was the ''liberal party'' and with out him, they will never win again, that what it is all about, chretien.

[Fletch 27]

All this whining about "we dont have enough parties to vote for"... "we need to be more like Europe"... Blah Blah Blah.. Maybe your just upset that the majority of Canadians want the Tories to stay..

You could simply choose from the Animal Alliance-Environment Voters ·Canadian Action ·Christian Heritage ·Communist ·First Peoples ·Libertarian ·Marxist–Leninist ·Marijuana ·Pirate ·Progressive Canadian ·Rhinoceros ·United ·Western Block... Oh, maybe your just dont have a party that is "your" choice".. Dont like it? Form a party...

This Merger talk??? A "Merger" between the LPC and NDP is ONLY about being in power... The ideologies between the 2 are so far apart, the suggestion to for a viable party with the interest of Canadians in mind is laughable.. It would be a race to demolish Canada the fastest..

[madmax]

Classic chretien, all about him, the only reason he is saying that, because in his head he was the ''liberal party'' and with out him, they will never win again, that what it is all about, chretien.

I think so...

[madmax]

All this whining about "we dont have enough parties to vote for"... "we need to be more like Europe"... Blah Blah Blah.. Maybe your just upset that the majority of Canadians want the Tories to stay..

A plurality not a majority. A majority do not want the Tories to stay.

You could simply choose from the Animal Alliance-Environment Voters ·Canadian Action ·Christian Heritage ·Communist ·First Peoples ·Libertarian ·Marxist–Leninist ·Marijuana ·Pirate ·Progressive Canadian ·Rhinoceros ·United ·Western Block... Oh, maybe your just dont have a party that is "your" choice".. Dont like it? Form a party...

Aye

This Merger talk??? A "Merger" between the LPC and NDP is ONLY about being in power... The ideologies between the 2 are so far apart,

Correct..that is why its Liberals that mention it...

the suggestion to for a viable party with the interest of Canadians in mind is laughable.. It would be a race to demolish Canada the fastest..

Conservatives will have accomplished that by then...

[cybercoma]

Classic chretien, all about him, the only reason he is saying that, because in his head he was the ''liberal party'' and with out him, they will never win again, that what it is all about, chretien.

I think this is the first time I have ever agreed with PIK.

[Newfoundlander]

I have to agree with Chretien that the Liberals and NDP basically ask the same questions, with the same concerns.

[dre]

All this whining about "we dont have enough parties to vote for"... "we need to be more like Europe"... Blah Blah Blah.. Maybe your just upset that the majority of Canadians want the Tories to stay..

You could simply choose from the Animal Alliance-Environment Voters ·Canadian Action ·Christian Heritage ·Communist ·First Peoples ·Libertarian ·Marxist–Leninist ·Marijuana ·Pirate ·Progressive Canadian ·Rhinoceros ·United ·Western Block... Oh, maybe your just dont have a party that is "your" choice".. Dont like it? Form a party...

This Merger talk??? A "Merger" between the LPC and NDP is ONLY about being in power... The ideologies between the 2 are so far apart, the suggestion to for a viable party with the interest of Canadians in mind is laughable.. It would be a race to demolish Canada the fastest..

Maybe your just upset that the majority of Canadians want the Tories to stay..

Last poll I saw said 40%. Almost the same percentage of people want the NDP to have a shot.

[PIK]

I think this is the first time I have ever agreed with PIK.

You should try it more often. lol

[PIK]

Last poll I saw said 40%. Almost the same percentage of people want the NDP to have a shot.

Not even close. Had a election today you would know that.