dre Posted December 14, 2011 Report Share Posted December 14, 2011 (edited) .if the oath is important why doesn't every canadian take it?? wedding vows are meaningless that's why we get written/signed documents and the same applies to citizenship, the oath taking is ceremonial formality for public Kum ba yah moment...oaths prevent no one from lying never have never will, the only people believe otherwise live in world with pink skies and never ending rainbows and unicorns.. if the oath is important why doesn't every canadian take it?? Jesus Wyly shut up . Dont give people any more bright ideas... I could actually see that catching on. Edited December 14, 2011 by dre Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dre Posted December 14, 2011 Report Share Posted December 14, 2011 Are there not reasonable limits to religious freedoms? Should we allow female circumcision in Canada based on religious tradition? Should I be able to rape or slap my baby, or urinate on my baby if it's part of my religion? Of course there is. That could even be why I wrote a half dozen posts, pointing out that very thing BTW, all of those things are violations of the criminal code, and they clearly would not be covered by "Reasonable Accomodation". The "veiled oath" case is a little different though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted December 14, 2011 Report Share Posted December 14, 2011 We need to see their mouths speak the words of the oath to this country. I suppose this would make some sort of sense if the magic words actually had the physical effect of warding off evil or guaranteeing good fortune... Is there a new force or law of nature or something I'm not aware of? How does it work? triggered or revealed to us through sound waves from a human voice? No that can't be it because apparently we have to actually see their mouth parts move. So this phenomenon involves the visual cortex of witnesses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilber Posted December 14, 2011 Report Share Posted December 14, 2011 .if the oath is important why doesn't every canadian take it?? Perhaps they should but if you were born here, you are a citizen whether you like it or not. You don't get a choice. Immigrants do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted December 14, 2011 Report Share Posted December 14, 2011 Excuse me? I will pledge allegience to absolutely god damn nothing. My allegience to the government is a PRIVILEGE that they must continue to EARN on an ongoing basis. It doesnt get "pledged". Ah...so you are not a citizen of Rome but rather Rome is a servant of you. So, when's the next big dam project, mighty Caesar? wyly: wedding vows are meaningless that's why we get written/signed documents and the same applies to citizenship. Cheat much? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilber Posted December 14, 2011 Report Share Posted December 14, 2011 I suppose this would make some sort of sense if the magic words actually had the physical effect of warding off evil or guaranteeing good fortune... Is there a new force or law of nature or something I'm not aware of? How does it work? triggered or revealed to us through sound waves from a human voice? No that can't be it because apparently we have to actually see their mouth parts move. So this phenomenon involves the visual cortex of witnesses. People take a verbal oath to tell the truth before giving evidence in a court room. There are legal consequences to breaking that oath and knowingly telling a lie to the court. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted December 14, 2011 Report Share Posted December 14, 2011 People take a verbal oath to tell the truth before giving evidence in a court room. There are legal consequences to breaking that oath and knowingly telling a lie to the court. What about oath givers who are mute? Does the process of witnessing the oath preclude using witnesses that are deaf or blind? Would a person have to be unveiled even to write their oath or use sign language? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilber Posted December 14, 2011 Report Share Posted December 14, 2011 What about oath givers who are mute? Does the process of witnessing the oath preclude using witnesses that are deaf or blind? Would a person have to be unveiled even to write their oath or use sign language? I don't know whether a written oath would be satisfactory or not but a person would not be exempt from taking an oath. My point was that verbal oaths before witnesses have legal weight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dre Posted December 14, 2011 Report Share Posted December 14, 2011 Ah...so you are not a citizen of Rome but rather Rome is a servant of you. So, when's the next big dam project, mighty Caesar? Absolutely. The government is there to serve the citizens not the other way around. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted December 14, 2011 Report Share Posted December 14, 2011 I don't know whether a written oath would be satisfactory or not but a person would not be exempt from taking an oath. My point was that verbal oaths before witnesses have legal weight. I'm betting written oaths are perfectly acceptable in court. So can witnesses be veiled? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilber Posted December 14, 2011 Report Share Posted December 14, 2011 I'm betting written oaths are perfectly acceptable in court. So can witnesses be veiled? Don't know but you would have to be able to identify them. Could be anyone under there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilber Posted December 14, 2011 Report Share Posted December 14, 2011 (edited) Absolutely. The government is there to serve the citizens not the other way around. The oath doesn't require allegiance to a government. Edited December 14, 2011 by Wilber Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evening Star Posted December 14, 2011 Report Share Posted December 14, 2011 .if the oath is important why doesn't every canadian take it?? As I said already, I'm not opposed to this! American kids recite a pledge of allegiance every day in school! I really like your idea of making every Canadian pass the citizenship test too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonlight Graham Posted December 14, 2011 Report Share Posted December 14, 2011 .if the oath is important why doesn't every canadian take it?? Yes, not a bad idea at all... wedding vows are meaningless that's why we get written/signed documents and the same applies to citizenship, the oath taking is ceremonial formality for public Kum ba yah moment...oaths prevent no one from lying never have never will, the only people believe otherwise live in world with pink skies and never ending rainbows and unicorns.. The oath is a verbal legal agreement. Y'know, like taking an oath in court. Signed documents are just as legal, but are easier to record and store. Oaths don't prevent anyone from lying, but neither does a signed document. If you don't follow your legally binding oath that's your choice, but you can get in legal troubles for it. See: lying in court. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olp1fan Posted December 14, 2011 Report Share Posted December 14, 2011 As I said already, I'm not opposed to this! American kids recite a pledge of allegiance every day in school! I really like your idea of making every Canadian pass the citizenship test too. what happens if Canadians fail? do you take their citizenship away? fine them? that is a bit too draconian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted December 14, 2011 Report Share Posted December 14, 2011 what happens if Canadians fail? do you take their citizenship away? fine them? that is a bit too draconian What if Canadians tell you to take your oath and stick it where the sun doesn't shine? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olp1fan Posted December 14, 2011 Report Share Posted December 14, 2011 What if Canadians tell you to take your oath and stick it where the sun doesn't shine? prison or fines? I bet hitler did something like that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted December 14, 2011 Report Share Posted December 14, 2011 Do you have any idea how sexist that outlook is? Any at all?? Yes, I do. That's been my entire point all along. Our society is sexist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olp1fan Posted December 14, 2011 Report Share Posted December 14, 2011 Yes, I do. That's been my entire point all along. Our society is sexist. because of people like you ...I do not share your view on women Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evening Star Posted December 14, 2011 Report Share Posted December 14, 2011 what happens if Canadians fail? do you take their citizenship away? fine them? that is a bit too draconian You could make it a prerequisite for voting perhaps... I'm kind of riffing here, admittedly. I haven't really thought it through... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted December 14, 2011 Report Share Posted December 14, 2011 What's odd, too, is that he is saying women are second class citizens because of his belief that women's self worth is tied up in their looks; because that's all women are appreciated for. Talk about sexist! Not to mention ignorant - that he has the gall to tell me, a woman in this society, that my value, that my daughters' value, is based on our looks - that that's all we are appreciated for - that that's what we place our self worth on - is disgusting to the core. Screw you! How DARE you say that this is MY belief in women. This is how SOCIETY treats women and it's absolutely disgusting that you're so brainwashed by it that you have the audacity to say that this is MY BELIEF because I'm pointing out the oppression. And I'm not alone in the view that women are oppressed in society this way: Watch the video, don't watch the video. I don't care. But, how dare you say that these are MY VIEWS. I'm the one trying to draw attention to how the media and society "treats women like $#!+" as Margaret Cho says in the video above. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evening Star Posted December 14, 2011 Report Share Posted December 14, 2011 (edited) She misses being hot because she can't be appreciated for anything else. Our society doesn't allow it. Her value is tied to her appearance. Sorry, you're losing me, cc. I'll never deny that our culture places a lot of importance on women's looks but it's definitely going too far to say that women can't be appreciated for anything else. I appreciate women for other things, for starters. (I definitely don't mark my female students based on their looks, for one thing.) I'm sure you do. And I mean, many men appreciate being seen as good-looking/attractive. Who doesn't? It doesn't mean it's the only thing someone can be appreciated for. (I have thought this through, btw.) Edited December 14, 2011 by Evening Star Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olp1fan Posted December 14, 2011 Report Share Posted December 14, 2011 You could make it a prerequisite for voting perhaps... what does Canada's past have to do with voting in the present? Is that supposed to encourage the 39 % of eligible Canadians who don't normally vote? All that is going to do is discourage people to vote and you'll have a much worse turn out X that plan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted December 14, 2011 Report Share Posted December 14, 2011 because of people like you ...I do not share your view on women Because of people like me pointing out that society is sexist and raising consciousness about it? Screw you too! It's because of people like you that would rather ignore it and keep it in the dark that it still happens! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted December 14, 2011 Report Share Posted December 14, 2011 Sorry, you're losing me, cc. I'll never deny that our culture places a lot of importance on women's looks but it's definitely going too far to say that women can't be appreciated for anything else. I appreciate women for other things, for starters. (I definitely don't mark my female students based on their looks, for one thing.) I'm sure you do. And I mean, many men appreciate being seen as good-looking/attractive. Who doesn't? It doesn't mean it's the only thing someone can be appreciated for. (I have thought this through, btw.) Watch the trailer above and if you can find the movie, watch the entire thing. You'll see what I mean. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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