Guest American Woman Posted December 12, 2011 Report Share Posted December 12, 2011 Canada is now requiring Muslim women to remove their veils when taking the oath of Citizenship. link We want women to be full and equal members of Canadian society and certainly when they're taking the citizenship oath, that's the right place to start I wonder if this will be accepted or if there will be a court case arguing that it violates the Charter of Rights and Freedoms? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GostHacked Posted December 12, 2011 Report Share Posted December 12, 2011 Show the face or you should be shown the door. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest American Woman Posted December 12, 2011 Report Share Posted December 12, 2011 Show the face or you should be shown the door. I agree. But I can't see this going unchallenged. I also wonder if this is the beginning of banning the veil in other circumstances. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted December 12, 2011 Report Share Posted December 12, 2011 To what end? It's completely unnecessary that they show their face in public for this reason, when it is forbidden by their religion. There's absolutely no reason that this is necessary, such that it would be worth violating their Charter Rights. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olp1fan Posted December 12, 2011 Report Share Posted December 12, 2011 Ban anything that covers the face ..like what France did We have no need for that there are no deserts here! Unless its winter and snow is blowing in your eyes there is no need to cover your face Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted December 12, 2011 Report Share Posted December 12, 2011 Canada is now requiring Muslim women to remove their veils when taking the oath of Citizenship. link We want women to be full and equal members of Canadian society and certainly when they're taking the citizenship oath, that's the right place to start I wonder if this will be accepted or if there will be a court case arguing that it violates the Charter of Rights and Freedoms? “I tell you again that the niqab has nothing to do with Islam and it is only a mere custom. I understand the religion better than you and your parents.” - An old man ordering a young schoolgirl to remove her face covering. Guess who it was. Hint, not Jason Kenney. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyly Posted December 12, 2011 Report Share Posted December 12, 2011 Show the face or you should be shown the door. that would be equal to religious persecution...simple solution is for all those present for the oath be only women... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olp1fan Posted December 12, 2011 Report Share Posted December 12, 2011 To what end? It's completely unnecessary that they show their face in public for this reason, when it is forbidden by their religion. There's absolutely no reason that this is necessary, such that it would be worth violating their Charter Rights. They are more than welcome to return to where they've come from where they can practice this "right" freely Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest American Woman Posted December 12, 2011 Report Share Posted December 12, 2011 (edited) that would be equal to religious persecution... Not according to the article: Kenney said he doesn't accept that it's a religious obligation to wear the veil, explaining that when Muslim women perform the hajj, the pilgrimage to Mecca required by their faith, they are required not to cover their faces. "It's a cultural tradition...." Edited December 12, 2011 by American Woman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty Posted December 12, 2011 Report Share Posted December 12, 2011 that would be equal to religious persecution...simple solution is for all those present for the oath be only women... Answer to my question above: “I tell you again that the niqab has nothing to do with Islam and it is only a mere custom. I understand the religion better than you and your parents.” The head of Al-Azhar, the highest seat of learning in the Sunni world, Grand Mufit Sheikh Mohamed Sayyed Tantawi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest American Woman Posted December 12, 2011 Report Share Posted December 12, 2011 Answer to my question above: “I tell you again that the niqab has nothing to do with Islam and it is only a mere custom. I understand the religion better than you and your parents.” The head of Al-Azhar, the highest seat of learning in the Sunni world, Grand Mufit Sheikh Mohamed Sayyed Tantawi Interesting. And it certainly confirms Kenney's belief. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GostHacked Posted December 13, 2011 Report Share Posted December 13, 2011 that would be equal to religious persecution...simple solution is for all those present for the oath be only women... So how do you verify who is who? They can wear the veil anytime after, I don't care. They would need to take the veil off to get a drivers license right?? During the ceremony it should be off, after that, wear it all you want. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dre Posted December 13, 2011 Report Share Posted December 13, 2011 To what end? It's completely unnecessary that they show their face in public for this reason, when it is forbidden by their religion. There's absolutely no reason that this is necessary, such that it would be worth violating their Charter Rights. I dont really think its forbidden by their religion. These are customs to which some muslims adhere to and some dont. Will there be a charter case? Quite possibly. Whether or not its successfull will probably depend on whether or not theres a real tangible reason to lift the veil... so to speak. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Peeves Posted December 13, 2011 Report Share Posted December 13, 2011 To what end? It's completely unnecessary that they show their face in public for this reason, when it is forbidden by their religion. There's absolutely no reason that this is necessary, such that it would be worth violating their Charter Rights. Canadians, honest Canadians don't wear masks. Not forbidden at all. There is no stipulation in Islam -Koran, to wear a veil. It is a custom in some sects, but up until the 50,s-60's in very few. There would be no violation of religious freedoms since the veil is by choice, not by religious order. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olp1fan Posted December 13, 2011 Report Share Posted December 13, 2011 wear it all you want. Would I be allowed to wear a ski mask while walking in a mall during April? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyly Posted December 13, 2011 Report Share Posted December 13, 2011 Not according to the article: Kenney said he doesn't accept that it's a religious obligation to wear the veil, explaining that when Muslim women perform the hajj, the pilgrimage to Mecca required by their faith, they are required not to cover their faces. "It's a cultural tradition...." kenny i an expert on religious obligation??? what arrogance...the countless christian sects each with their own peculiar quirks, what religious doctrine requires amish, hutterites, mormons, Sikhs, Hasidic jews, catholic nuns and priests to dress in the way they do, did they get kenney's expert approval?...this is religious persecution... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dre Posted December 13, 2011 Report Share Posted December 13, 2011 So how do you verify who is who? They can wear the veil anytime after, I don't care. They would need to take the veil off to get a drivers license right?? During the ceremony it should be off, after that, wear it all you want. Well, I assume that by the time a person is reading the oath their ID has already been verified. Presumably by having the person remove their face coverings. If thats the case then its of little importance whether or not they cover their face or not. But if theres a real tangible reason such as identification purposes then my guess is the courts will uphold the ban. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest American Woman Posted December 13, 2011 Report Share Posted December 13, 2011 So how do you verify who is who? They can wear the veil anytime after, I don't care. They would need to take the veil off to get a drivers license right?? During the ceremony it should be off, after that, wear it all you want. According to the article, swearing the oath is a requirement for citizenship and the veil prevents the citizenship judges from being able to see if they are reciting the oath or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olp1fan Posted December 13, 2011 Report Share Posted December 13, 2011 this is religious persecution... Canadian values are not Muslim values to begin with so who cares Here in Canada we don't kill or maim people because they are gay and when that happens here its usually an immigrant from specific countries Here in Canada we don't honour kill people (but when it happens it is usually an immigrant from specific countries) Here in Canada women are free to do what they want and are allowed to wear what they want (unless they are immigrant women from specific countries) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyly Posted December 13, 2011 Report Share Posted December 13, 2011 (edited) Interesting. And it certainly confirms Kenney's belief. that's brilliantly shallow thinking...does the catholic church speak for every christian sect?...no birth control permitted for any christian sect because the pope said so? only the pope speaks for all christians regardless of differences.... Edited December 13, 2011 by wyly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyly Posted December 13, 2011 Report Share Posted December 13, 2011 Canadian values are not Muslim values to begin with so who cares Here in Canada we don't kill or maim people because they are gay and when that happens here its usually an immigrant from specific countries Here in Canada we don't honour kill people (but when it happens it is usually an immigrant from specific countries) Here in Canada women are free to do what they want and are allowed to wear what they want (unless they are immigrant women from specific countries) canadian values include freedom of religion, freedom from religious persecution...show me where it says otherwise ....if you have a problem with basic freedoms maybe it should be you that leaves... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olp1fan Posted December 13, 2011 Report Share Posted December 13, 2011 (edited) canadian values include freedom of religion, freedom from religious persecution...show me where it says otherwise ....if you have a problem with basic freedoms maybe it should be you that leaves... Oh please, born in Canada Canadians are becoming less religious by the year, its the minorities that are getting into the country that give a crap about religious freedom How can a liberal be pro muslim when muslim faith in the mid east violates everything a liberal is for Edited December 13, 2011 by olp1fan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest American Woman Posted December 13, 2011 Report Share Posted December 13, 2011 It's already getting a negative reaction from some Muslims: The Canadian Council on American-Islamic Relations said Kenney's move questioned the sincerity and good faith of some citizenship applicants and not others. "This decision will have a damaging effect on our democracy because it forces those who wear the niqab to choose between their religious convictions and adopting Canadian citizenship," said Ihsaan Gardee, the council's acting executive director. link I don't understand that mindset - how is it questioning the sincerity and faith of just some citizenship applicants and not others it applies to all applicants? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GostHacked Posted December 13, 2011 Report Share Posted December 13, 2011 Would I be allowed to wear a ski mask while walking in a mall during April? Relevance? Ever get robbed by anyone in a veil? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GostHacked Posted December 13, 2011 Report Share Posted December 13, 2011 According to the article, swearing the oath is a requirement for citizenship and the veil prevents the citizenship judges from being able to see if they are reciting the oath or not. Good enough for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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