The TTC thread

[Black Dog]

Well Ford ran on Subways so his stubbornness can be seen as understandable. But it's the other councillors that said "NO WAY" to a Scarborough subway 2 years ago and are now for them, they're the ones that are really embarrassing themselves.

Sure, but his ignorance is inexcusable.

My theory is Ford doesn't really give a crap about subways or transit except as a wedge issue. Even he can't be so dumb as to think they can build them without jacking taxes or adopting other revenue measures. Can he?

[cybercoma]

Did anyone post video of this debate yet? It's astonishing how clueless Ford is here. The least he can do is acknowledge the facts, then make a sound argument for why a subway line is better than LRT. He doesn't have a clue what he's talking about and what's worse is that he doesn't care.

[guyser]

It got posted in the Rob Ford thread yesterday.

It clearly shows he is ignorant of many things, including but not limited to english and public speaking.

Love how some can still swoon over a bloated ignorant person prone to ridiculous notions.

[tonywilson]

Hello! I am following the forum for two months and now recently joined the forum because it seems me interesting * informative.

[Boges]

Only a public service union would bitch about something like this.

http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/transportation/2013/08/20/ttc_workers_say_new_uniform_colours_are_too_habslike.html

Toronto transit workers are irked over proposed new uniforms that would see operators decked out in the colours of the Montreal Canadiens.

Photos of a red, white and blue colour scheme on golf shirts and ball caps have circulated among TTC staff, some of whom complain the designs too closely reflect the Toronto Maple Leafs’ rival hockey team.

Bob Kinnear, president of the union that represents TTC operators, told CBC the colours are “very dissatisfying to our members here in Toronto” and that if the transit commission imposed them, workers would likely boycott the shirts.

TTC CEO Andy Byford said in a statement the uniforms are nothing more than a proposal and a final design hasn’t been agreed on yet.

You sure it's not cuz it looks American Bob?

[Black Dog]

Only a public service union would bitch about something like this.

http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/transportation/2013/08/20/ttc_workers_say_new_uniform_colours_are_too_habslike.html

You sure it's not cuz it looks American Bob?

Well, colours notwithstanding, the designs are ugly.

[Boges]

Well, colours notwithstanding, the designs are ugly.

Perhaps but this was just a mock-up and in what other job does the employee have any say in what their uniform is?

Do Hockey players protest is their uniform is changed?

[Black Dog]

Perhaps but this was just a mock-up and in what other job does the employee have any say in what their uniform is?

Seems to me that giving the people who are going to be wearing these things the chance to weigh in would be the kind of thing smart management would do. I don't see the issue here.

Do Hockey players protest is their uniform is changed?

Funny you should say that: the Sharks just changed their jerseys and teh team says they based the changes on consultations with the players. And this happened too.

[Boges]

So the Fed are going to kick in some cake.

http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/transportation/2013/09/23/ottawa_pledges_660m_for_scarborough_subway.html

Make Glen Murray look like an absolute fool for what he did last month.

[cybercoma]

The federal government has absolutely no right to use people's federal income taxes from Lethbridge AB, Moncton, NB, or Saskatoon, SK to fund public transit in the Toronto Metropolitan. This isn't something that benefits Canadians. It benefits a single city and not even that, but only a single part of that city. This is nothing more than bribing Canadians with their own money for votes. Conservatives should be embarrassed to support this kind of spending by the federal government.

[Boges]

The federal government has absolutely no right to use people's federal income taxes from Lethbridge AB, Moncton, NB, or Saskatoon, SK to fund public transit in the Toronto Metropolitan. This isn't something that benefits Canadians. It benefits a single city and not even that, but only a single part of that city. This is nothing more than bribing Canadians with their own money for votes. Conservatives should be embarrassed to support this kind of spending by the federal government.

Glen Murray thought that was their attitude. Turned out to completely wrong.

[guyser]

The federal government has absolutely no right to use people's federal income taxes from Lethbridge AB, Moncton, NB, or Saskatoon, SK to fund public transit in the Toronto Metropolitan. This isn't something that benefits Canadians. It benefits a single city and not even that, but only a single part of that city. This is nothing more than bribing Canadians with their own money for votes. Conservatives should be embarrassed to support this kind of spending by the federal government.

Oh of course! Agreed !

Its not like TO sends billions to Ottawa and only gets a pittance back in return.

[Michael Hardner]

The federal government has absolutely no right to use people's federal income taxes from Lethbridge AB, Moncton, NB, or Saskatoon, SK to fund public transit in the Toronto Metropolitan. This isn't something that benefits Canadians. It benefits a single city and not even that, but only a single part of that city. This is nothing more than bribing Canadians with their own money for votes. Conservatives should be embarrassed to support this kind of spending by the federal government.

How about using money from Toronto to fund Toronto transit ? During the Miller era, he was quite vocal about the net outflow of federal dollars from this city.

[guyser]

How about using money from Toronto to fund Toronto transit ? During the Miller era, he was quite vocal about the net outflow of federal dollars from this city.

With the $4B shortfall between what is sent to Ott from TO this city could extend the subway system from Oshawa to Mississuaga. and up to Richmond Hill or Aurora

[cybercoma]

Oh of course! Agreed !

Its not like TO sends billions to Ottawa and only gets a pittance back in return.

Money that goes to Ottawa should not be earmarked for municipal matters. The money that goes to Ottawa is to support national interests. A flipping subway in Toronto is not a national interest. Federal employees in Toronto, healthcare support, postal service, etc. are of national interest and also benefit Torontonians. This subway has sweet flip all to do my interests as someone living in the Maritimes. It does nothing to improve or benefit the nation.

Edited September 23, 2013 by cybercoma

[Boges]

Money that goes to Ottawa should not be earmarked for municipal matters. The money that goes to Ottawa is to support national interests. A flipping subway in Toronto is not a national interest. Federal employees in Toronto, healthcare support, postal service, etc. are of national interest and also benefit Torontonians. This subway has sweet flip all to do my interests as someone living in the Maritimes. It does nothing to improve or benefit the nation.

I know you're trolling but the money the Feds agreed to provide is Infrastructure money any community is eligible to apply for.

[cybercoma]

How about using money from Toronto to fund Toronto transit ? During the Miller era, he was quite vocal about the net outflow of federal dollars from this city.

Absolutely not. Public transit is not federal jurisdiction. Nor should it be. A net outflow of money from Toronto is meaningless when talking about national tax revenue. Military bases, for example, cost a crapload of money to run and operate. The amount of federal money collected from Oromocto, New Brunswick, where CFB Gagetown is partially located, certainly doesn't cover the maintenance and operation of one of Canada's largest military training sites. So the notion that geographic locations should get all of their money back from the fed or that the fed should support local projects that serve no national purpose is wrong, imo.

[cybercoma]

I know you're trolling but the money the Feds agreed to provide is Infrastructure money any community is eligible to apply for.

How about they start worrying a bit more about the infrastructure in places that are actually under their jurisdiction: reserves. Here's millions of dollars out of nowhere for your subway, while kids on reserves are living without heat and running water and have rats scurrying around their classrooms.

[Boges]

How about they start worrying a bit more about the infrastructure in places that are actually under their jurisdiction: reserves. Here's millions of dollars out of nowhere for your subway, while kids on reserves are living without heat and running water and have rats scurrying around their classrooms.

You should ask the Chiefs of those reserves that roll in Cadillacs.

[cybercoma]

Yes. Their multi-million dollar Cadillacs.

[Boges]

The Feds can't govern how the money they give is spent.

Regardless that doesn't have anything to do with the Scarborough Subway. I'll conceded the Feds are simply looking to help their man Robbie Ford out.

[guyser]

Money that goes to Ottawa should not be earmarked for municipal matters. The money that goes to Ottawa is to support national interests. A flipping subway in Toronto is not a national interest. Federal employees in Toronto, healthcare support, postal service, etc. are of national interest and also benefit Torontonians. This subway has sweet flip all to do my interests as someone living in the Maritimes. It does nothing to improve or benefit the nation.

except when it does.

Billions are lost from traffic tie ups, slowdowns and so on.

[cybercoma]

So fund your own damn infrastructure properly. Raise taxes. Ford wants his cake and eat it too, all while preaching about stopping the gravy train. Meanwhile, he's perfectly ok with the rest of Canada being taxed for his pet projects, as though that were free money.

[guyser]

So fund your own damn infrastructure properly. Raise taxes.

And that is likely to occur

Ford wants his cake and eat it too, all while preaching about stopping the gravy train.

Well, there is no gravy train and it will become apparent to his Honour that taxes will and should rise to fund the shortfall on this transit plan.

Meanwhile, he's perfectly ok with the rest of Canada being taxed for his pet projects, as though that were free money.

With or without this funding, the taxes would still come in and of course no tax is paid refencing this subway/trnasit system.

But hey, the Confederation Bridge got $1.45B and there are 140,000 people. Why pay for it, the Constitution only said that Canada had to provide a ferry service (funded by Feds too)

Scarborough has 625,000 people.

What good did the bridge do?

Apart from....

1)increased productivity

2) increased farming production

3)increased visitors

4)increased private (tourist etc) spending

5)lower costs for Islanders.

The above, not including #'s 2 and 5, hold true for TO.

[cybercoma]

Your example would be perfect if a Scarborough subway was even remotely close to a bridge built over a federally controlled waterway and extending between provinces.