olp1fan Posted October 12, 2011 Report Posted October 12, 2011 Why do conservatives think they can still mention the liberals sponsorship scandal when their party has governed the country for the last 5 years and now has a majority for 4 more? Add on to that they ran on transparency and accountability but in reality are just like the liberal party they killed... I just don't understand .. Every chance they get they talk about Liberal corruption yet when its their own party they are silent or try to bring up the liberals Quite pathetic if you ask me Quote
jacee Posted October 12, 2011 Report Posted October 12, 2011 That's Canadian politics as played by Libs and Cons since Canada began. They publicly challenge each other, but privately go about doing things the same way - using public money and contracts to payoff their political financers. They are the enablers of the 1%. Quote
Boges Posted October 12, 2011 Report Posted October 12, 2011 Can you cite a source of recent example of the Harper government bringing up the sponsorship scandal? They have a majority and the Liberals are the third party. I doubt Harper will give them much thought until they elect a new leader. Quote
Topaz Posted October 12, 2011 Report Posted October 12, 2011 Can you cite a source of recent example of the Harper government bringing up the sponsorship scandal? They have a majority and the Liberals are the third party. I doubt Harper will give them much thought until they elect a new leader. The Tories do bring up about the Libs scandal, everytime the NDP or Libs bring up Tony Clements scam, and I even heard it in the committee hearings yesterday. The Tory just could resist and smiled at the Libs across the room. This must prove the Tories still feel threaten by the Libs or they are just doing it because the NDP haven't reached the PMO as yet, so they have to attack the liberals, it makes them feel good and powerful. Quote
olp1fan Posted October 12, 2011 Author Report Posted October 12, 2011 Can you cite a source of recent example of the Harper government bringing up the sponsorship scandal? They have a majority and the Liberals are the third party. I doubt Harper will give them much thought until they elect a new leader. Watch Question Period, happens usually once a day...plus you read forums like this and cbc.ca and globe and mail and national post and it seems to be fairly common Quote
Wild Bill Posted October 12, 2011 Report Posted October 12, 2011 Why do conservatives think they can still mention the liberals sponsorship scandal when their party has governed the country for the last 5 years and now has a majority for 4 more? Add on to that they ran on transparency and accountability but in reality are just like the liberal party they killed... I just don't understand .. Every chance they get they talk about Liberal corruption yet when its their own party they are silent or try to bring up the liberals Quite pathetic if you ask me Quite right! It's even worse here in Ontario. Mike Harris has been gone for 20 years or so yet you'd never have known it this last election! The Liberals and the NDP were constantly invoking his name as a shot at Tim Hudak. It just proves that many people of ALL parties have no brains to speak of! Quote "A government which robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul." -- George Bernard Shaw "There is no point in being difficult when, with a little extra effort, you can be completely impossible."
Battletoads Posted October 12, 2011 Report Posted October 12, 2011 Your vaunted liberals always brought up the fiscally inept PCs... just kidding. Quote "You can lead a Conservative to knowledge, but you can't make him think."
segnosaur Posted October 12, 2011 Report Posted October 12, 2011 Why do conservatives think they can still mention the liberals sponsorship scandal when their party has governed the country for the last 5 years and now has a majority for 4 more? Yes, the conservatives have had a significant amount of time in power, and yes, there is a limit to how far back you can refer to various scandals. However, it should be noted that many of the individuals who were in power during the time of the Liberal's sponsorship scandal were candidates in the 2011 election. Examples: Gerry Byrne (first elected 1996), Lawrence MacCauly (1988), Wayne Easter (1993), Roger Cuzner (2000), Geoff Reagan (2000), Mark Eyking (2000), Dominic Leblanc (2000), Denis Coderre (1997), Irwin Cotler (1999), Stephan Dion (1996), Gurbax Malhi (1993), Bob Speller (1988), Karen Redman (1997), Andrew Telegdi (1993), John McCallum (2000), Mauril Belanger (1995), Dan McTeague (2000). All of these individuals (and many more) were all Liberal Candidates in the 2011 election. And every one of them was an MP during at least part of the Liberal sponsorship scandal. And while its possible that they were unaware of what was going on, they were still willing to vote for the legislation that allowed the sponsorship scandal to happen. Of course, I do find it ironic how people criticize the conservatives for bringing up the sponsorship scandal, when Liberal supporters are often eager to bring up "Lyin' Brian" and other conservative ghosts. Quite pathetic if you ask me So, are you going to be just as vocal if the Liberals should ever get into power and start using past conservative problems? Quote
August1991 Posted October 12, 2011 Report Posted October 12, 2011 (edited) Your vaunted liberals always brought up the fiscally inept PCs...just kidding. "Tory times are bad times". (Or so the saying goes. When pressed, you play the cards you have.)That's Canadian politics as played by Libs and Cons since Canada began.Life is like that.Blondes are stupid, people that use big words are smart and women don't like short men. They publicly challenge each other, but privately go about doing things the same way - using public money and contracts to payoff their political financers.They are the enablers of the 1%. Ah yes, the New Kid is different. (Socialists - Tommy Douglas et al - always claim that "This time! It's different!")---- It's hard not to conclude that people choose political parties the way they choose clothing or style, both underwear and overwear. It identifies them to others, and to themselves. Smart politicians slightly shift the identification. Edited October 12, 2011 by August1991 Quote
olp1fan Posted October 12, 2011 Author Report Posted October 12, 2011 (edited) Quite right! It's even worse here in Ontario. Mike Harris has been gone for 20 years or so yet you'd never have known it this last election! The Liberals and the NDP were constantly invoking his name as a shot at Tim Hudak. It just proves that many people of ALL parties have no brains to speak of! You do have a good point there Its too bad that the PCs picked someone as pathetic as Tim Hudak though the man came across almost as bad as Ford does in Toronto which is why they didn't win a single seat in Toronto Edited October 12, 2011 by olp1fan Quote
olp1fan Posted October 12, 2011 Author Report Posted October 12, 2011 So, are you going to be just as vocal if the Liberals should ever get into power and start using past conservative problems? Actually when the Libs were turfed I thought the future looked good with the new Conservative government who campaigned on transparency, I was pretty excited But that quickly changed Quote
Wild Bill Posted October 12, 2011 Report Posted October 12, 2011 You do have a good point there Its too bad that the PCs picked someone as pathetic as Tim Hudak though the man came across almost as bad as Ford does in Toronto which is why they didn't win a single seat in Toronto If that's true, then how did Ford win his election? SOMEBODY must have liked him! Quote "A government which robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul." -- George Bernard Shaw "There is no point in being difficult when, with a little extra effort, you can be completely impossible."
olp1fan Posted October 12, 2011 Author Report Posted October 12, 2011 If that's true, then how did Ford win his election? SOMEBODY must have liked him! And now they regret electing him Otherwise how do you explain them all voting Liberal? Quote
Boges Posted October 12, 2011 Report Posted October 12, 2011 And now they regret electing him Otherwise how do you explain them all voting Liberal? Utter Bullshit. Similar voters voted for the Harper Conservatives in May. The Liberals maintaining the 416 and much of the 905 last week has more to do with the fact Hudak ran a shitteh campaign. Quote
olp1fan Posted October 12, 2011 Author Report Posted October 12, 2011 Utter Bullshit. Similar voters voted for the Harper Conservatives in May. The Liberals maintaining the 416 and much of the 905 last week has more to do with the fact Hudak ran a shitteh campaign. Harpers campaign was COALITION COALITION COALITION not a very good camapaign either I don't think Ontarions like conservatives running the province Quote
Boges Posted October 12, 2011 Report Posted October 12, 2011 I don't think Ontarions like conservatives running the province Signed, 8 years under Harris and 30+ years before the Peterson coalition? Harper's campaign also was about a steady hand through troubling financial times. Sound similar to some Liberal premier some of us might know? Quote
olp1fan Posted October 12, 2011 Author Report Posted October 12, 2011 (edited) Signed, 8 years under Harris and 30+ years before the Peterson coalition? Harper's campaign also was about a steady hand through troubling financial times. Sound similar to some Liberal premier some of us might know? i don't know, there is some reason Mcguinty is on his 3rd term Forbes did rank Ontario HST as one of the reasons why Canada made it to #1 in their top country for businesses and Ontario is near the top in Canada for education and Ontario does have the lowest crime rate in Canada can't say Mcguinty hasn't been doing his job Edited October 12, 2011 by olp1fan Quote
Boges Posted October 12, 2011 Report Posted October 12, 2011 (edited) i don't know, there is some reason Mcguinty is on his 3rd term Forbes did rank Ontario HST as one of the reasons why Canada made it to #1 in their top country for businesses and Ontario is near the top in Canada for education and Ontario does have the lowest crime rate in Canada can't say Mcguinty hasn't been doing his job Well McGuinty was bribed to put in the HST by . . . The Harper government. McGuinty won again but he took a massive beating in victory. The Conservatives gained 12 seats and the NDP gained 10. Now he doesn't have the ability to do whatever he wants. This seems similar to what happened to the Chretien/Martin Liberals. Look at where they are now. Edited October 12, 2011 by Boges Quote
olp1fan Posted October 12, 2011 Author Report Posted October 12, 2011 (edited) Well McGuinty was bribed to put in the HST by . . . The Harper government. McGuinty won again but he took a massive beating in victory. The Conservatives gained 12 seats and the NDP gained 10. Now he doesn't have the ability to do whatever he wants. This seems similar to what happened to the Chretien/Martin Liberals. Look at where they are now. Kudos to Harper then..but just like Harper takes credit for Martins fiscalness Mcguinty takes credit for the HST see how that works? Mcguinty is 1 short of a majority, he only needs 1 more person to vote with him not a hard task Edited October 12, 2011 by olp1fan Quote
Boges Posted October 12, 2011 Report Posted October 12, 2011 Kudos to Harper then..but just like Harper takes credit for Martins fiscalness Mcguinty takes credit for the HST see how that works? Mcguinty is 1 short of a majority, he only needs 1 more person to vote with him not a hard task Not if votes are whipped. I'm sure he'll be fine for much of his mandate. But he can't just approved drastic increases in hydro rates like he has in the past. BTW Regarding Martin's "fiscalness" Funny how it wasn't considered a good thing when Mike Harris used similar measures to get Ontario's books back in order. Quote
segnosaur Posted October 12, 2011 Report Posted October 12, 2011 So, are you going to be just as vocal if the Liberals should ever get into power and start using past conservative problems? Actually when the Libs were turfed I thought the future looked good with the new Conservative government who campaigned on transparency, I was pretty excited But that quickly changed I somehow doubt that you were ever a supporter of the conservatives in any way. In fact, the way that you regularly direct cheap shots at the conservatives, the way you totally ignored the point I made (where the sponsorship scandal is still partially relevant because many Liberals from time of the sponsorship scandal are still involved with the party and were candidates in the 2011 election), suggests that you are a supporter of either the Liberals, NDP, or other party that's ideologically opposed to the conservatives. Forbes did rank Ontario HST as one of the reasons why Canada made it to #1 in their top country for businessesand Ontario is near the top in Canada for education and Ontario does have the lowest crime rate in Canada can't say Mcguinty hasn't been doing his job Ummm... what makes you think that McGuinty is responsible for any of those successes? After all, according to statistics Canada, the crime rate in Ontario had been falling pretty steadily since the early 1990s. (See: http://www.johnhoward.on.ca/pdfs/fctsh-22.pdf) And the fact that "Ontario is near the top for education" might have something to do with our larger population base, which lends to "economies of scale". (It should also be noted that federal transfers to provinces have increased under Harper, which gave the province a bit more money to spend on education.) The only think that he actually was responsible for was the HST, and while Forbes is trumpeting it as a reason for making Canada "better for business", keep in mind that what's good for business may not necessarily be what's best for the economy (or Canadians) as a whole. Quote
capricorn Posted October 12, 2011 Report Posted October 12, 2011 Harper's campaign also was about a steady hand through troubling financial times. Sound similar to some Liberal premier some of us might know? It's significant that McGuinty reverted to that message toward the tail end of the campaign. Lucky for him he did. The election results show only 2% of the popular vote separated the Liberals and the PCs. Quote "We always want the best man to win an election. Unfortunately, he never runs." Will Rogers
capricorn Posted October 12, 2011 Report Posted October 12, 2011 McGuinty won again but he took a massive beating in victory. The Conservatives gained 12 seats and the NDP gained 10. Now he doesn't have the ability to do whatever he wants. This seems similar to what happened to the Chretien/Martin Liberals. Look at where they are now. The shrinking Liberal support syndrome hits Ontario. McGuinty must have serious concerns about that. Time for McGuinty to polish his resume. Quote "We always want the best man to win an election. Unfortunately, he never runs." Will Rogers
MiddleClassCentrist Posted October 12, 2011 Report Posted October 12, 2011 (edited) The shrinking Liberal support syndrome hits Ontario. McGuinty must have serious concerns about that. Time for McGuinty to polish his resume. I hope you meant to say retire with a fat gubment pension, smiling to the bank. As conservatives also retire with said fat gubment pension, and slander him all the way to the bank Edited October 12, 2011 by MiddleClassCentrist Quote Ideology does not make good policy. Good policy comes from an analysis of options, comparison of options and selection of one option that works best in the current situation. This option is often a compromise between ideologies.
Topaz Posted October 13, 2011 Report Posted October 13, 2011 Quite right! It's even worse here in Ontario. Mike Harris has been gone for 20 years or so yet you'd never have known it this last election! The Liberals and the NDP were constantly invoking his name as a shot at Tim Hudak. It just proves that many people of ALL parties have no brains to speak of! The difference is that Hudak was PART of the Harris era and voted for everything Harris did so there's a connection. Quote
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