DogOnPorch Posted June 30, 2011 Author Report Posted June 30, 2011 Although he's right that water security was an important issue contributing to the Six-Day War, he is ridiculously reductionist when describing the wars. As if issues of independence, religion, territory, security, and historical tensions are irrelevant or even secondary concerns. And moreover, it's always Israel's fault. The "Palestinians" are always non-actors who are victimized by circumstances beyond their control. Funny...I don't recall the Mufti's call to war involving "water"...just Jewish blood. Same with Nasser...Sadat...etc. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
Bob Posted June 30, 2011 Report Posted June 30, 2011 Funny...I don't recall the Mufti's call to war involving "water"...just Jewish blood. Same with Nasser...Sadat...etc. I was gonna say that, too, that I must've missed "water" as a driver of these conflict when reading historical statements from political/military leadership of the time. Still, the Arabs were conducting attacks on water-infrastructure (as well as other infrastructure) for many years before 1967, and also there were Syrian plans and undertakings to divert water from rivers that supply the Galilee and Jordan River. Water's an issue, but of course this conflict would exist with or without water scarcity concerns in this area. Reading dre's posts, however, one would be left with the impression that if this region was as abundant in water as Canada, that these conflicts wouldn't exist. Of course that is a particularly stupid position. Quote My blog - bobinisrael.blogspot.com - I am writing on it, again!
DogOnPorch Posted June 30, 2011 Author Report Posted June 30, 2011 I was gonna say that, too, that I must've missed "water" as a driver of these conflict when reading historical statements from political/military leadership of the time. Still, the Arabs were conducting attacks on water-infrastructure (as well as other infrastructure) for many years before 1967, and also there were Syrian plans and undertakings to divert water from rivers that supply the Galilee and Jordan River. Water's an issue, but of course this conflict would exist with or without water scarcity concerns in this area. Reading dre's posts, however, one would be left with the impression that if this region was as abundant in water as Canada, that these conflicts wouldn't exist. Of course that is a particularly stupid position. There's one Journeyman Pictures doc on the Jordan River showing Arabs urinating into the waters upstream from all the Christians doing the "John the Baptist" thingy. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
Bob Posted June 30, 2011 Report Posted June 30, 2011 There's one Journeyman Pictures doc on the Jordan River showing Arabs urinating into the waters upstream from all the Christians doing the "John the Baptist" thingy. Well, the Muslims around this part of the world often hold strong contempt towards Jews, Christians, and other minority faiths in the region. That's the kinda thing I expect from them. I should find that Journeyman video, they have lots of interesting stuff online. Quote My blog - bobinisrael.blogspot.com - I am writing on it, again!
DogOnPorch Posted June 30, 2011 Author Report Posted June 30, 2011 Well, the Muslims around this part of the world often hold strong contempt towards Jews, Christians, and other minority faiths in the region. That's the kinda thing I expect from them. I should find that Journeyman video, they have lots of interesting stuff online. It's a sewer for the most part except the upper reaches. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
Bob Posted June 30, 2011 Report Posted June 30, 2011 It's a sewer for the most part except the upper reaches. Remember the name of the video? Quote My blog - bobinisrael.blogspot.com - I am writing on it, again!
DogOnPorch Posted June 30, 2011 Author Report Posted June 30, 2011 Remember the name of the video? 'Saving the Jordan' I believe. There was also one on the Dead Sea being polluted. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
dre Posted June 30, 2011 Report Posted June 30, 2011 I was gonna say that, too, that I must've missed "water" as a driver of these conflict when reading historical statements from political/military leadership of the time. Still, the Arabs were conducting attacks on water-infrastructure (as well as other infrastructure) for many years before 1967, and also there were Syrian plans and undertakings to divert water from rivers that supply the Galilee and Jordan River. Water's an issue, but of course this conflict would exist with or without water scarcity concerns in this area. Reading dre's posts, however, one would be left with the impression that if this region was as abundant in water as Canada, that these conflicts wouldn't exist. Of course that is a particularly stupid position. Israel was attacking Arab water infrastructure as well, and competing Israeli and Arab projects to divert water lead directly to the 1967 war. And when the war started Israeli militarized water management and sent the IDF directly to strategic locations with instructions to secure water sources. Superimpose a map of Israeli troop movements during the 67 war, with a map of Israeli pumping stations, pipelines, and wells today... youll find it rather interesting. In fact Israelis at the time refered to the period prior to the 6 day war as "HaMilhama al HaMaim". Water IS a major driver of the conflict, and in fact will probably cause further escalations and wars, as the asshole of the planet (the middle east) continues to dry up. Palestinians live under strict and crippling quotas that have prevented it from building an agrarian economy. They cant even drill a well on their own land without permissions from the IDF, which to my knowledge is the only military in the world that has water management under its jurrisdiction. In fact. Israel threatened war with Lebanon in 2003 over the pumping of water from the Wazzani to arid Lebanese villages. But no! Resource scarcity surely cant drive conflicts! Quote I question things because I am human. And call no one my father who's no closer than a stranger
GostHacked Posted June 30, 2011 Report Posted June 30, 2011 As with dre...so with Gosthacked. The Mufti never existed...Yasser Arafat wasn't Egyptian...Hamas/PLO/Hezbollah aren't really giving the Nazi salute. Oh...and Israeli settlers should get the Hell out of Gaza...lol. Maybe you can point out where I claimed the Mufti did not exist? Yeah thought so. Quote
dre Posted June 30, 2011 Report Posted June 30, 2011 Maybe you can point out where I claimed the Mufti did not exist? Yeah thought so. Poor DOP... Quote I question things because I am human. And call no one my father who's no closer than a stranger
GostHacked Posted June 30, 2011 Report Posted June 30, 2011 There's video that shows the painball guns. But...sure...believe what you want to. Meanwhile the video clearly shows 'activists' shooting 30lb slingshots into the helicopter's rotors...carrying chains...clubs, etc. BTW: When/If the police pull you over, do you reach for your tire iron? Why not? Sure I agree it shows paintball gun action, however, once again, why set yourself up for failure buy using paintball guns? Tell me the purpose of the paintball gun? Quote
dre Posted June 30, 2011 Report Posted June 30, 2011 Sure I agree it shows paintball gun action, however, once again, why set yourself up for failure buy using paintball guns? Tell me the purpose of the paintball gun? The paintball guns were clearly used to "mark" the targets so that the guys with real guns would know who to shoot. Quote I question things because I am human. And call no one my father who's no closer than a stranger
GostHacked Posted June 30, 2011 Report Posted June 30, 2011 The paintball guns were clearly used to "mark" the targets so that the guys with real guns would know who to shoot. Alright, I guess I can buy that as a tactic. Never thought of it that way. Shows up real nice on a sniper scope I bet. Quote
jbg Posted June 30, 2011 Report Posted June 30, 2011 Remember when dealing with dre he thinks the Arab-Israeli Wars were all about water. The one area were I agree with dre on is that Syria's decision to attempt to interdict Israel's water supply in the mid-1960's made a conclusive victory in whatever war to come essential. Quote Free speech: "You can say what you want, but I don't have to lend you my megaphone." Always remember that when you are in the right you can afford to keep your temper, and when you are in the wrong you cannot afford to lose it. - J.J. Reynolds. Will the steps anyone is proposing to fight "climate change" reduce a single temperature, by a single degree, at a single location? The mantra of "world opinion" or the views of the "international community" betrays flabby and weak reasoning (link).
Bob Posted June 30, 2011 Report Posted June 30, 2011 The paintball guns were clearly used to "mark" the targets so that the guys with real guns would know who to shoot. I love how you just make shit up and get fellow fools to buy into it. Quote My blog - bobinisrael.blogspot.com - I am writing on it, again!
DogOnPorch Posted June 30, 2011 Author Report Posted June 30, 2011 The one area were I agree with dre on is that Syria's decision to attempt to interdict Israel's water supply in the mid-1960's made a conclusive victory in whatever war to come essential. Water is a factor in the 1967 War...but it wasn't the casus belli of the Arab-Israeli conflict. For example...point out where water is a factor in this exchange. Minutes of the meeting with Hitler and Husseini.Source: Documents on German Foreign Policy 1918-1945, Series D, Vol XIII, London, 1964, pp.881 ff. ---------- German Chancellor Adolf Hitler and Grand Mufti Haj Amin al-Husseini: Zionism and the Arab Cause (November 28, 1941) Haj Amin al-Husseini, the most influential leader of Palestinian Arabs, lived in Germany during the Second World War. He met Hitler, Ribbentrop and other Nazi leaders on various occasions and attempted to coordinate Nazi and Arab policies in the Middle East. Record of the Conversation between the Fuhrer and the Grand Mufti of Jerusalem on November 28, 1941, in the Presence of Reich Foreign Minister and Minister Grobba in Berlin. The Grand Mufti began by thanking the Fuhrer for the great honor he had bestowed by receiving him. He wished to seize the opportunity to convey to the Fuhrer of the Greater German Reich, admired by the entire Arab world, his thanks of the sympathy which he had always shown for the Arab and especially the Palestinian cause, and to which he had given clear expression in his public speeches. The Arab countries were firmly convinced that Germany would win the war and that the Arab cause would then prosper. The Arabs were Germany's natural friends because they had the same enemies as had Germany, namely the English, the Jews, and the Communists. Therefore they were prepared to cooperate with Germany with all their hearts and stood ready to participate in the war, not only negatively by the commission of acts of sabotage and the instigation of revolutions, but also positively by the formation of an Arab Legion. The Arabs could be more useful to Germany as allies than might be apparent at first glance, both for geographical reasons and because of the suffering inflicted upon them by the English and the Jews. Furthermore, they had had close relations with all Moslem nations, of which they could make use in behalf of the common cause. The Arab Legion would be quite easy to raise. An appeal by the Mufti to the Arab countries and the prisoners of Arab, Algerian, Tunisian, and Moroccan nationality in Germany would produce a great number of volunteers eager to fight. Of Germany's victory the Arab world was firmly convinced, not only because the Reich possessed a large army, brave soldiers, and military leaders of genius, but also because the Almighty could never award the victory to an unjust cause. In this struggle, the Arabs were striving for the independence and unity of Palestine, Syria, and Iraq. They had the fullest confidence in the Fuhrer and looked to his hand for the balm on their wounds, which had been inflicted upon them by the enemies of Germany. The Mufti then mentioned the letter he had received from Germany, which stated that Germany was holding no Arab territories and understood and recognized the aspirations to independence and freedom of the Arabs, just as she supported the elimination of the Jewish national home. A public declaration in this sense would be very useful for its propagandistic effect on the Arab peoples at this moment. It would rouse the Arabs from their momentary lethargy and give them new courage. It would also ease the Mufti's work of secretly organizing the Arabs against the moment when they could strike. At the same time, he could give the assurance that the Arabs would in strict discipline patiently wait for the right moment and only strike upon an order form Berlin. With regard to the events in Iraq, the Mufti observed that the Arabs in that country certainly had by no means been incited by Germany to attack England, but solely had acted in reaction to a direct English assault upon their honor. The Turks, he believed, would welcome the establishment of an Arab government in the neighboring territories because they would prefer weaker Arab to strong European governments in the neighboring countries and, being themselves a nations of 7 million, they had moreover nothing to fear from the 1,700,000 Arabs inhabiting Syria, Transjordan, Iraq, and Palestine. France likewise would have no objections to the unification plan because she had conceded independence to Syria as early as 1936 and had given her approval to the unification of Iraq and Syria under King Faisal as early as 1933. In these circumstances he was renewing his request that the Fuhrer make a public declaration so that the Arabs would not lose hope, which is so powerful a force in the life of nations. With such hope in their hearts the Arabs, as he had said, were willing to wait. They were not pressing for immediate realization for their aspirations; they could easily wait half a year or a whole year. But if they were not inspired with such a hope by a declaration of this sort, it could be expected that the English would be the gainers from it. The Fuhrer replied that Germany's fundamental attitude on these questions, as the Mufti himself had already stated, was clear. Germany stood for uncompromising war against the Jews. That naturally included active opposition to the Jewish national home in Palestine, which was nothing other than a center, in the form of a state, for the exercise of destructive influence by Jewish interests. Germany was also aware that the assertion that the Jews were carrying out the functions of economic pioneers in Palestine was a lie. The work there was done only by the Arabs, not by the Jews. Germany was resolved, step by step, to ask one European nation after the other to solve its Jewish problem, and at the proper time to direct a similar appeal to non-European nations as well. Germany was at the present time engaged in a life and death struggle with two citadels of Jewish power: Great Britain and Soviet Russia. Theoretically there was a difference between England's capitalism and Soviet Russia's communism; actually, however, the Jews in both countries were pursuing a common goal. This was the decisive struggle; on the political plane, it presented itself in the main as a conflict between Germany and England, but ideologically it was a battle between National Socialism and the Jews. It went without saying that Germany would furnish positive and practical aid to the Arabs involved in the same struggle, because platonic promises were useless in a war for survival or destruction in which the Jews were able to mobilize all of England's power for their ends. The aid to the Arabs would have to be material aid. Of how little help sympathies alone were in such a battle had been demonstrated plainly by the operation in Iraq, where circumstances had not permitted the rendering of really effective, practical aid. In spite of all the sympathies, German aid had not been sufficient and Iraq was overcome by the power of Britain, that is, the guardian of the Jews. The Mufti could not but be aware, however, that the outcome of the struggle going on at present would also decide the fate of the Arab world. The Fuhrer therefore had to think and speak coolly and deliberately, as a rational man and primarily as a soldier, as the leader of the German and allied armies. Everything of a nature to help in this titanic battle for the common cause, and thus also for the Arabs, would have to be done. Anything however, that might contribute to weakening the military situation must be put aside, no matter how unpopular this move might be. Germany was now engaged in very severe battles to force the gateway to the northern Caucasus region. The difficulties were mainly with regard to maintaining the supply, which was most difficult as a result of the destruction of railroads and highways as well as the oncoming winter. If at such a moment, the Fuhrer were to raise the problem of Syria in a declaration, those elements in France which were under de Gaulle's influence would receive new strength. They would interpret the Fuhrer's declaration as an intention to break up France's colonial empire and appeal to their fellow countrymen that they should rather make common cause with the English to try to save what still could be saved. A German declaration regarding Syria would in France be understood to refer to the French colonies in general, and that would at the present time create new troubles in western Europe, which means that a portion of the German armed forces would be immobilized in the west and no longer be available for the campaign in the east. The Fuhrer then made the following statement to the Mufti, enjoining him to lock it in the uttermost depths of his heart: 1. He (the Fuhrer) would carry on the battle to the total destruction of the Judeo-Communist empire in Europe. 2. At some moment which was impossible to set exactly today but which in any event was not distant, the German armies would in the course of this struggle reach the southern exit from Caucasia. 3. As soon as this had happened, the Fuhrer would on his own give the Arab world the assurance that its hour of liberation had arrived. Germany's objective would then be solely the destruction of the Jewish element residing in the Arab sphere under the protection of British power. In that hour the Mufti would be the most authoritative spokesman for the Arab world. It would then be his task to set off the Arab operations, which he had secretly prepared. When that time had come, Germany could also be indifferent to French reaction to such a declaration. Once Germany had forced open the road to Iran and Iraq through Rostov; it would be also the beginning of the end of the British World Empire. He (the Fuhrer) hoped that the coming year would make it possible for Germany to thrust open the Caucasian gate to the Middle East. For the good of their common cause, it would be better if the Arab proclamation were put off for a few more months than if Germany were to create difficulties for herself without being able thereby to help the Arabs. He (the Fuhrer) fully appreciated the eagerness of the Arabs for a public declaration of the sort requested by the Grand Mufti. But he would beg him to consider that he (the Fuhrer) himself was the Chief of State of the German Reich for five long years during which he was unable to make to his own homeland the announcement of its liberation. He had to wait with that until the announcement could be made on the basis of a situation brought about by the force of arms that the Anschluss had been carried out. The moment that Germany's tank divisions and air squadrons had made their appearance south of the Caucasus, the public appeal requested by the Grand Mufti could go out to the Arab world. The Grand Mufti replied that it was his view that everything would come to pass just as the Fuhrer had indicated. He was fully reassured and satisfied by the words which he had heard form the Chief of the German State. He asked, however, whether it would not be possible, secretly at least, to enter into an agreement with Germany of the kind he had just outlined for the Fuhrer. The Fuhrer replied that he had just now given the Grand Mufti precisely that confidential declaration. The Grand Mufti thanked him for it and stated in conclusion that he was taking his leave from the Fuhrer in full confidence and with reiterated thanks for the interest shown in the Arab cause. SCHMIDT Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
DogOnPorch Posted June 30, 2011 Author Report Posted June 30, 2011 Sure I agree it shows paintball gun action, however, once again, why set yourself up for failure buy using paintball guns? Tell me the purpose of the paintball gun? Here...stand still and let me shoot one at you and you'll find out what their purpose is. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=auZsa7WssK8 Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
dre Posted June 30, 2011 Report Posted June 30, 2011 I love how you just make shit up and get fellow fools to buy into it. It was a joke and Ghost Hacked didnt buy into it for a second. Quote I question things because I am human. And call no one my father who's no closer than a stranger
DogOnPorch Posted June 30, 2011 Author Report Posted June 30, 2011 It was a joke and Ghost Hacked didnt buy into it for a second. Of course it was...and of course he didn't. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
dre Posted June 30, 2011 Report Posted June 30, 2011 Of course it was...and of course he didn't. Wow... Quote I question things because I am human. And call no one my father who's no closer than a stranger
DogOnPorch Posted June 30, 2011 Author Report Posted June 30, 2011 Wow... At least you're not denying the Holocaust. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
dre Posted June 30, 2011 Report Posted June 30, 2011 The one area were I agree with dre on is that Syria's decision to attempt to interdict Israel's water supply in the mid-1960's made a conclusive victory in whatever war to come essential. Syrias water diversion project was instigated by Israels own water diversion project. Both sides were trying to fuck with each other and take more than their share. Picture two belligerent retarded kids in the same piece of crap sandbox that want to play with the same dinky cars... Yup! Thats CONFLICT: DIRTFARM. Quote I question things because I am human. And call no one my father who's no closer than a stranger
DogOnPorch Posted June 30, 2011 Author Report Posted June 30, 2011 Syrias water diversion project was instigated by Israels own water diversion project. Both sides were trying to fuck with each other and take more than their share. Picture two belligerent retarded kids in the same piece of crap sandbox that want to play with the same dinky cars... Yup! Thats CONFLICT: DIRTFARM. ...and dre actually thinks that's what caused...for example...the 1929 Pogrom. Wow. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
Bob Posted July 1, 2011 Report Posted July 1, 2011 ...and dre actually thinks that's what caused...for example...the 1929 Pogrom. Wow. And the "both sides" argumentation continues, his desperate attempts to cast both Israel and the Arabs in the same light are never-ending. We are the moral equivalents of the Arabs, apparently. I guess it's an easier sell than portraying the Arabs as having the moral high ground! Quote My blog - bobinisrael.blogspot.com - I am writing on it, again!
bud Posted July 1, 2011 Report Posted July 1, 2011 At least you're not denying the Holocaust. who is this clown? where do you get off with these types of comments? you're like a foxnews pundit, jacked up on retard. Quote http://whoprofits.org/
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