Smallc Posted April 9, 2011 Report Posted April 9, 2011 which validates the point I was making, claiming the NDP would be irresposible spenders...there is no basis to that claim there is no evidence to support that claim... I'm just saying that (according to them) they wouldn't trade defence spending for anything. Quote
wyly Posted April 9, 2011 Report Posted April 9, 2011 Wyly, NDP provincial government's did not campaign on promises to tax and spend to anywhere near the degrees that they do federally. it's never that simple as the conservative propaganda of opponents make it out to be...I noticed a conservative attack add the other day on libs "tax, tax, tax, tax, tax!" was the entire message eww scary tax word no explanation just "tax,tax,tax" hilariously stupid but there's plenty of stupid people that will buy into it without questioning it ...any NDP budget will always balance spending with taxation on the direction of the spending changes and where the revenue is sourced from but do you even bother to look into that? unlikely...and now we have the conservatives suddenly finding billions of unspent dollars while in their budget there was nothing?...what kind of money management is that? none of these financial clowns would ever hold a job in the real world with that kind of ineptitudeWe do know, however, that the provincial NDP here in Manitoba have a proven track record of spending far more than their predecessors with little to nothing to show for it. Fiscally, the difference between the NDP and the PC's here in Manitoba is staggering. no worse than any conservative government yet the conservatives get a phony reputation for being great money managers...Mulroney government had to be the worst of all time federally and Grant Devine the worst provincially...It's probably going to take 10 years to recover from the damage Seligner did.what the recession was his fault?... Quote “Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives.”- John Stuart Mill
wyly Posted April 9, 2011 Report Posted April 9, 2011 I'm just saying that (according to them) they wouldn't trade defence spending for anything. are they holding the line or increasing spending?...they have said they prefer to improve the navy vs star wars jets... Quote “Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives.”- John Stuart Mill
Smallc Posted April 9, 2011 Report Posted April 9, 2011 are they holding the line or increasing spending?...they have said they prefer to improve the navy vs star wars jets... They said they would continue the defence levels outlined for this year. Whether that means continuing the increases (they pretty much have to, but they may not) or not, I'm not sure. At current, the NDP is actually my second voting choice. Quote
Jack Weber Posted April 9, 2011 Report Posted April 9, 2011 (edited) They said they would continue the defence levels outlined for this year. Whether that means continuing the increases (they pretty much have to, but they may not) or not, I'm not sure. At current, the NDP is actually my second voting choice. I'm shocked the Dips have come up with a relatively cogent Defence platform.. The Naval angle is very intriguing,not only from the necessity angle,but from the employment perspective... Edited April 9, 2011 by Jack Weber Quote The beatings will continue until morale improves!!!
Smallc Posted April 9, 2011 Report Posted April 9, 2011 The Naval angle is very intriguing,not only from the necessity angle,but from the employment perspective... I think so too....it's too bad that they're vote is collapsing. Quote
Jack Weber Posted April 9, 2011 Report Posted April 9, 2011 I think so too....it's too bad that they're vote is collapsing. We can only hope that one of the other party's realizes the dire situation in shipbuilding in this country... Because it's a huge job creator and it's becoming an acute problem,not just with the Navy,but the merchant fleet on the Great Lakes also... Quote The beatings will continue until morale improves!!!
bloodyminded Posted April 9, 2011 Report Posted April 9, 2011 which validates the point I was making, claiming the NDP would be irresposible spenders...there is no basis to that claim there is no evidence to support that claim... It's a belief that has achieved the level of orthodoxy. Apparently, when Conservatives and Liberals are accused of overspending--which they always are, without exception--these overspending controversies are deviations from their "normal" behaviour...normal behaviour which never occurs. Quote As scarce as truth is, the supply has always been in excess of the demand. --Josh Billings
Smallc Posted April 9, 2011 Report Posted April 9, 2011 We can only hope that one of the other party's realizes the dire situation in shipbuilding in this country... I think that the Conservatives do. I think that they knew an election was coming, and they didn't want to risk losing support in the three areas of the country that aren't going to get the contract (Either Quebec or BC, and definitely Southern Ontario and Newfoundland and Labrador). The NSPS will be signed shortly after the election. Quote
Jack Weber Posted April 9, 2011 Report Posted April 9, 2011 I think that the Conservatives do. I think that they knew an election was coming, and they didn't want to risk losing support in the three areas of the country that aren't going to get the contract (Either Quebec or BC, and definitely Southern Ontario and Newfoundland and Labrador). The NSPS will be signed shortly after the election. The supply ships are'nt that big.... I mean,they're important,but they will go to the yards that are generally busy on either coast because that's where the Navy wants new vessels built. There just is'nt that much steelwork to put them together...If you've ever been beside a Lake Freighter and a Frigate you would be able to see an obvious difference. The merchant fleet is where the real work is and that's where we need to see some sort of legislation. Quote The beatings will continue until morale improves!!!
Smallc Posted April 9, 2011 Report Posted April 9, 2011 The supply ships are'nt that big.... No, but they give the yards the infrastructure they need in order build ships, something that most are lacking right now, other than Irving. Quote
Jack Weber Posted April 9, 2011 Report Posted April 9, 2011 No, but they give the yards the infrastructure they need in order build ships, something that most are lacking right now, other than Irving. Right,but the real steelwork is in the merchant fleet and nothing is being done about that right now. And they should because most of the ships trading on the Great Lakes through CSL,Algoma Central Marine,or,Upper Lakes are pushing 40 years old... They need to be replaced and there would be alot of work... We'll see if the Conservatives,or any other party,will really "Stand Up for Cnanada!"... Quote The beatings will continue until morale improves!!!
Bryan Posted April 9, 2011 Report Posted April 9, 2011 no worse than any conservative government Exponentially worse than the PCs have been in Manitoba. We have balanced budget legislation here in Manitoba, yet the NDP managed to put us almost a billion in the hole before the recession even started. They raided billions from Manitoba Hydro and turned them from a tremendous asset to a liability. Healthcare and family services are the worst they've ever been in Manitoba. WRHA, and the Community Access Centres have been a total disaster. Family services has especially been a huge money pit that keeps reducing services while ramping up costs. The whole thing needs to be gutted. Quote
Smallc Posted April 9, 2011 Report Posted April 9, 2011 Exponentially worse than the PCs have been in Manitoba. We have balanced budget legislation here in Manitoba, yet the NDP managed to put us almost a billion in the hole before the recession even started. That's only because the NDP moved the debt of Hydro onto the books. They raided billions from Manitoba Hydro and turned them from a tremendous asset to a liability. Yes, they took money that belongs to Manitobans and spent it on them. The other part is just ludicrous. There's no evidence that Manitoba Hydro is a liability. Healthcare and family services are the worst they've ever been in Manitoba. Based on what? Healthcare is orders of magnitude better than it was during the PC years. That comes as a result of an NDP focus, a good economy, and increased transfers. WRHA, and the Community Access Centres have been a total disaster. Again, there's no evidence for that at all. As for Family Services, there are more and more children in care. What do you expect to happen? Quote
Harry Posted April 10, 2011 Report Posted April 10, 2011 Interesting analysis of the respective campaigns by the author of Pundits Guide National Poll Bump Masks Liberal Organizational Weakness on the Groundhttp://www.punditsguide.ca/2011/04/national-poll-bump-masks-liberal-organizational-weakness-on-the-ground/ Quote
Harry Posted April 10, 2011 Report Posted April 10, 2011 (edited) It sure seems like the NDP and the Liberals are fighting for distant second, at least at this point in the camapign Poll numbers for parties standing still after two weeks of campaigninghttp://www.canada.com/news/Poll+numbers+parties+standing+still+after+weeks+campaigning/4585113/story.html Edited April 10, 2011 by Harry Quote
Harry Posted April 10, 2011 Report Posted April 10, 2011 Here's the latest Nanos Leadership Index Harper leads, Layton six points ahead of Ignatieff on Indexhttp://www.nanosresearch.com/election2011/20110408-LeadershipE.pdf Quote
August1991 Posted April 10, 2011 Report Posted April 10, 2011 It is just the sample size is 1/5th of a normal poll so it is crazy wild. I put more stock in the larger polls even EKOS. I would also like to point out the polls out this week with the largest sample sizes put the numbers more in line with pre election polls.The Ontario sample is about 300. The margin of error is very large. With a rolling three day sample, this possible outlier will show up tommorrow too.In general, I trust polls if they are consistent over time with repeated different samples. And to me, this is the great disconnect of this campaign: the Conservatives are consistently polling in the high 30s or low 40s. Normally, this would indicate a majority government. But reading the Anglo/Franco MSM, I get the impression that Harper is having a terrible campaign and Ignatieff is the striving underdog. In some ways, the federal campaign ressembles Toronto's recent mayoralty race. The elite refuses to believe the polls. At key moments in the campaign, Harper will have to over the MSM heads and speak to directly to potential voters. In the US, this is called a dog whistle and Harper knows how to do it. ---- A Conservative majority is dependent on riding-level vote splits. The one detail that I find striking is the fall in NDP support. This seems most apparent in Ontario. Ignatieff was apparently wise to tack left to push the anti-Harper Ontario voter on the NDP/Liberal cusp toward the Liberal side. In the debates next week, I expect to see Harper present the coalition as a way for NDP voters to vote their conscience. He'll want to split the anti-Harper vote. Quote
ToadBrother Posted April 10, 2011 Report Posted April 10, 2011 In the debates next week, I expect to see Harper present the coalition as a way for NDP voters to vote their conscience. He'll want to split the anti-Harper vote. I actually tend to agree with this. I think pro-Coalition sentiment is probably highest among the NDP. Quote
Harry Posted April 10, 2011 Report Posted April 10, 2011 (edited) And the trend continues against Harper. On March 15th Nanos had the gap between Harper and Ignatieff at 11%, and it is now only 7.9%. If this trend continues could the Liberals win more seats than the Conservatives? Nanos C - 39.5%, Down 1.0% L - 31.6%, Down 0.1% N - 14.7%, Up 1.5% B - 8.1%, Down 1.1% G - 4.8%, Up 0.8% U - 15.7%, Down 0.1% http://www.nanosresearch.com/election2011/20110409-BallotE.pdf Edited April 10, 2011 by Harry Quote
Smallc Posted April 10, 2011 Report Posted April 10, 2011 Actually, despite the lower national number, that polls is far better than yesterday. Quote
Smallc Posted April 10, 2011 Report Posted April 10, 2011 (edited) The new poll also shows the Liberals at a point where they are nearly overtaking the Bloc in Quebec. They have gone straight up there in the last few days. This may be a break in the campaign, and if the momentum holds, it may mean that the Liberals can form government without a coalition (if the trend continues to Ontario, the Atlantic provinces, and BC). Alternatively, because of vote splitting, it could mean more rural seats for the Conservatives in Quebec. Edited April 10, 2011 by Smallc Quote
punked Posted April 10, 2011 Author Report Posted April 10, 2011 (edited) The new poll also shows the Liberals at a point where they are nearly overtaking the Bloc in Quebec. They have gone straight up there in the last few days. This may be a break in the campaign, and if the momentum holds, it may mean that the Liberals can form government without a coalition (if the trend continues to Ontario, the Atlantic provinces, and BC). Alternatively, because of vote splitting, it could mean more rural seats for the Conservatives in Quebec. Orrrr the Nanos numbers and this tracking poll could be completely off as it has been the whole election. On a side note a non tracking poll came out yesterday showing C:41 L:26 N:19 http://www.vancouversun.com/news/canada/Liberals+gaining+Tories+stay+poll/4584984/story.html I just find it odd we are only seeing these numbers in a crazy tracking poll which only asks 400 Canadians a night. Edited April 10, 2011 by punked Quote
Smallc Posted April 10, 2011 Report Posted April 10, 2011 (edited) I just find it odd we are only seeing these numbers in a crazy tracking poll which only asks 400 Canadians a night. The Quebec numbers are a trend though. You also have to realize that they use averaged numbers from three nights, not just one. Edited April 10, 2011 by Smallc Quote
Harry Posted April 10, 2011 Report Posted April 10, 2011 The Quebec numbers are a trend though. You also have to realize that they use averaged numbers from three nights, not just one. Maybe. Usually though it is CROP and Leger Marketing more than other polling firms that seem to have their pulse on the situation in Quebec. Quote
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