Smallc Posted April 12, 2011 Report Posted April 12, 2011 "And", this is a Canadian Politics forum. Other countries can go ahead and do what they do, doesn't make it "standard" here. I'm not sure what you're talking about. Our governing system didn't just materialize out of thin air. Quote
Bryan Posted April 12, 2011 Report Posted April 12, 2011 I'm not sure what you're talking about. Our governing system didn't just materialize out of thin air. The thread went like this: If the three parties gang up and defeat Harper on a confidence motion shortly after an election, then we could have a constitutional crisis. If Harper recommends dissolution (and another election) or a prorogue but the GG refuses and instead asks Ignatieff to form a government. That's not a constitutional crisis. It's standard convention. Standard? So it must happen all the time in Canada then, right? After which, you started talking about other countries. Harper and Ignatieff are running for government in Canada. What may be standard convention in another country doesn't necessarily fly here, regardless of those other countries' similar histories. Quote
Battletoads Posted April 12, 2011 Report Posted April 12, 2011 It is crazy because it presumes that Harper would piss away any opportunity for a second mandate by opening up divisive social issues. Harper has made his clear his 'right wing' agenda with a majority would be limited to any anti-crime bill and an end to the long gun registry. Stevie has been in there for 5 years at this point already. Something tells me if he isn't going to be running four years from now. Also I have no doubt he is going to subversively push his agenda. This will be done either by neglecting the issue as he has done with healthcare, or by slowly making cuts as he has done with the environment. Quote "You can lead a Conservative to knowledge, but you can't make him think."
Bryan Posted April 12, 2011 Report Posted April 12, 2011 It isn't just me calling Iggy a Liar now on his Red book it is 70% of Canada. http://www.vancouversun.com/Minority+Canadians+believe+Ignatieff+deliver+Family+Pack+promises+poll/4597406/story.html Interesting that the Vancouver Sun chose to only report on two of the questions asked by Ipsos-Reid for that poll. There's a lot more fun data in the rest of it: * Someone you can trust: 42% (no change since March) Stephen Harper, 36% (+2 points) Jack Layton, 17% (+2) Michael Ignatieff, 6% (-3) Gilles Duceppe. * Someone who will get things done: 46% (-1) Stephen Harper, 28% (+1) Jack Layton, 21% (+4) Michael Ignatieff, 5% (-3) Gilles Duceppe. * Someone who has what it takes to lead Canada: 46% (-4) Stephen Harper, 27% (+1) Jack Layton, 23% (+5) Michael Ignatieff, 4% (-2) Gilles Duceppe. * Someone who has a hidden agenda: 44% (-2) Michael Ignatieff, 41% (+2) Stephen Harper, 10% (no change) Jack Layton, 5% (no change) Gilles Duceppe. * Someone who is best to manage during tough economic times: 51% (-1) Stephen Harper, 23% (+1) Jack Layton, 22% (+4) Michael Ignatieff, 4% (-3) Gilles Duceppe. * Someone who wants to be Prime Minister for the right reasons: 41% (-3) Stephen Harper, 37% (+3) Jack Layon, 18% (+2) Michael Ignatieff, 4% (-2) Gilles Duceppe. * Someone who has a vision of Canada that you can support: 44% (-1) Stephen Harper, 31% (+1) Jack Layton, 20% (+2) Michael Ignatieff, 5% (-2) Gilles Duceppe. http://www.ipsos-na.com/news-polls/pressrelease.aspx?id=5196 The only category where Ignatieff doesn't come in third place is "Hidden Agenda" where he's in first place. The thing that I'm finding particularly interesting is how different the party leaders' scores are from their party. Harper's popularity is far higher than the Conservative Party itself, Layton's is better than the NDP too, but Ignatieff is polling well below the Liberals. The Harper numbers in particular are really fascinating. Not long ago, it was the opposite: CPC polled fair to middling, but Harper was the one people really disliked. I wonder if this is mostly a case of "the devil you know"? Quote
Bryan Posted April 12, 2011 Report Posted April 12, 2011 Stevie has been in there for 5 years at this point already. Something tells me if he isn't going to be running four years from now. Also I have no doubt he is going to subversively push his agenda. This will be done either by neglecting the issue as he has done with healthcare, or by slowly making cuts as he has done with the environment. Neglecting health care? What are you smoking? The Liberals cut health care spending, the Conservatives are the ones who increased health care transfers to the province. Quote
Harry Posted April 12, 2011 Report Posted April 12, 2011 Ever heard of this pollster http://www.robbinssceresearch.com/polls/poll_791.html Quote
Smallc Posted April 12, 2011 Report Posted April 12, 2011 After which, you started talking about other countries. Harper and Ignatieff are running for government in Canada. What may be standard convention in another country doesn't necessarily fly here, regardless of those other countries' similar histories. How in the world can you say that, though? This country has had coalitions before, and it will happen again. Quote
Harry Posted April 12, 2011 Report Posted April 12, 2011 (edited) Nanos - April 12 C - 39.7%, Down 1.5% L - 31.2%, Up 0.8% N - 16.8%, Up 1.6% B - 07.8%, No change G - 4.0%, Down 0.6% U - 17.5%, Down 0.6% http://www.nanosresearch.com/election2011/20110411-BallotE.pdf Edited April 12, 2011 by Harry Quote
Wild Bill Posted April 12, 2011 Report Posted April 12, 2011 How in the world can you say that, though? This country has had coalitions before, and it will happen again. Define coalition. If you mean minority governments, we've had all kinds. However, if you mean "coalition of the losers", that's very rare. So one can't assume that both kinds of coalitions would be equally well accepted by the population at large. I've been becoming more and more curious about such a situation, to the point where I almost want to see it happen! I'm a great believer in people having to "put their money where their mouth is!", so to speak. If the losing parties want to risk it, I would admire their courage. If it works with no negative consequences, I would salute them. However, if a large portion of the electorate grew angry and decided to never again vote for them as long as they were alive, I would be ROTF, LMAO! Quote "A government which robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul." -- George Bernard Shaw "There is no point in being difficult when, with a little extra effort, you can be completely impossible."
Harry Posted April 12, 2011 Report Posted April 12, 2011 (edited) Has anyone had a look at the Nanos regionals? Ontario C - 40.9%, Down 2.7% L - 38.9%, Up 2.3% N - 15.2%, Up 2.1% While little appears to have changed in the so-called horse-race numbers since the election began, the Tory lead is deceptive. http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/ottawa-notebook/tories-hold-on-to-single-digit-edge-canadians-hungry-for-policy-debate/article1981488/ Edited April 12, 2011 by Harry Quote
Bryan Posted April 12, 2011 Report Posted April 12, 2011 Has anyone had a look at the Nanos regionals? Ontario C - 40.9%, Down 2.7% L - 38.9%, Up 2.3% N - 15.2%, Up 2.1% Margin of error for Ontario is 5.7 percentage points. That's huge. All of the movement is within half of the MOE. In other words, no change at all. Quote
Harry Posted April 12, 2011 Report Posted April 12, 2011 (edited) Margin of error for Ontario is 5.7 percentage points. That's huge. All of the movement is within half of the MOE. In other words, no change at all. That is quite a shift, 5.1%, and obviously your interpretation of MOE is incorrect as you well know. Edited April 12, 2011 by Harry Quote
Harry Posted April 12, 2011 Report Posted April 12, 2011 (edited) This is indeed strange. Question #1If this current 41st federal general election in Canada were held tomorrow, based on your opinion today, for which leader and party would you caste your ballot? Stephen Harper the The Conservative Party of Canada 33.92 % Michael Ignatieff and The Liberal Party of Canada 29.68 % Jack Layton and The New Democratic Party of Canada 20.63 % Gilles Duceppe and The Bloc Quebecois 9.14 % Elizabeth May and The Green Party of Canada 6.63 % http://www.robbinssceresearch.com/polls/poll_791.html Edited April 12, 2011 by Harry Quote
William Ashley Posted April 12, 2011 Report Posted April 12, 2011 (edited) Harpers "trustworthyness" has dropped from --- what I think what in the 80's to under 25% "trustworthiness score on the Nanos Leadership Index dropped to 24.6 per cent" http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20110412/leadership-index-poll-110412/20110412?s_name=election2011 Edited April 12, 2011 by William Ashley Quote I was here.
Harry Posted April 12, 2011 Report Posted April 12, 2011 Harpers "trustworthyness" has dropped from --- what I think what in the 80's to under 25% "trustworthiness score on the Nanos Leadership Index dropped to 24.6 per cent" http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20110412/leadership-index-poll-110412/20110412?s_name=election2011 Layton pulls ahead and away from Ignatieff as Harper tumbles in Nanos Leadership Index Harper - 94%, down 15.6% Layton - 54.1%, Up 6.3% Ignatieff - 48.4%, up 3.7% http://www.nanosresearch.com/election2011/20110411-LeadershipE.pdf Quote
Smallc Posted April 12, 2011 Report Posted April 12, 2011 Define coalition. If you mean minority governments, we've had all kinds. However, if you mean "coalition of the losers", that's very rare. We've had federal and provincial coalitions. We've had minorities without coalitions too. All are a part of our system, no matter how many seats the primary governing party has (there are no losers in our form of government except for those who don't get elected). Quote
Harry Posted April 12, 2011 Report Posted April 12, 2011 (edited) Polls, polls, and more polls Innovative Research Group C- 39% L - 28% N - 17% B - 9% G - 7% Best PM Harper - 36% Ignatieff - 22% Layton - 19% Exclusive poll: Half of Canadians find Harper, Ignatieff 'unfavourable'Voters are well-aware of the controversies facing some of the federal party leaders from a Facebook-inspired rally ejection to racist candidate remarks -- but the survey results suggest the gaffes have done little to sway voters in the parties key support base. Still, among independent voters, 41 per cent said the Conservatives Facebook-rally gaffe has made them much less likely to vote for the party. The majority of Canadians (66 per cent, excluding Quebec) believe too much emphasis has been placed on campaign blunders. Some of the other results of the poll include: - 40 per cent of respondents, excluding Quebecers, said they have about the same level of interest in this election as they did in others. -64 per cent said the federal parties are talking about issues that matter to them during this campaign while 30 per cent said they werent. -39 per cent of Canadians, excluding Quebecers, said the Conservatives were addressing issues that matter most to them, compared to 29 per cent for the Liberals, 22 per cent for the NDP and 7 per cent for the Greens. -84 per cent of respondents said they were aware of the Conservatives kicking a woman out of a rally because of her Facebook profile. -75 per cent of respondents said they were aware the Liberals fired a candidate in the riding of Manicouagan because of racist remarks. Sixty-two per cent (excluding Quebec) said it would not affect how they vote. -More than one-third of respondents said the federal government isnt responsible for dealing with traffic congestion. -Majority of respondents (excluding Quebecers) strongly disagree that corporate taxes must be lowered to stimulate the economy. -About half of Canadians (45 per cent, excluding Quebecers) said corporations should be taxed more to raise money for social programs. http://www.citytv.com/toronto/citynews/news/national/article/124463--exclusive-poll-half-of-canadians-find-harper-ignatieff-unfavourable Edited April 12, 2011 by Harry Quote
Battletoads Posted April 13, 2011 Report Posted April 13, 2011 Neglecting health care? What are you smoking? The Liberals cut health care spending, the Conservatives are the ones who increased health care transfers to the province. "It's past time the feds scrapped the Canada Health Act" -Stephen Harper Quote "You can lead a Conservative to knowledge, but you can't make him think."
punked Posted April 13, 2011 Author Report Posted April 13, 2011 "It's past time the feds scrapped the Canada Health Act" -Stephen Harper Actions speak louder then words my friend. But on healthcare for words and action vote NDP. Quote
punked Posted April 13, 2011 Author Report Posted April 13, 2011 Poll numbers show that Layton improves his standing with voters, Iggy worsens and Harper stays the same after from the debates. http://www.globalnews.ca/decisioncanada/story.html?id=4604903 Quote
ToadBrother Posted April 13, 2011 Report Posted April 13, 2011 Poll numbers show that Layton improves his standing with voters, Iggy worsens and Harper stays the same after from the debates. http://www.globalnews.ca/decisioncanada/story.html?id=4604903 Maybe the French debate will be better, but the one I watched tonight didn't strike me as earthshattering, other than that Harper, I think, held is own very well. Quote
Evening Star Posted April 13, 2011 Report Posted April 13, 2011 I preferred the Liberal platform before the debate. The debate really nudged me back towards the NDP. Quote
Bryan Posted April 13, 2011 Report Posted April 13, 2011 Strange story with this Compas Poll: http://www.winnipegsun.com/news/decision2011/2011/04/12/17974236.html Tories destined for a majority They don't include the actual numbers, which leads me to believe that the first sentence of the article must be a typo: Stephen Harper's Conservatives have gained a massive 21-point lead over Michael Ignatieff's Liberals, according to a new COMPAS Research poll obtained exclusively by QMI Agency. 21 points? And they don't show the break down? Nothing on Compas' site yet either. Also claims to be the largest poll so far of the campaign. 2,300 polled, 2.1% MOE. Quote
TimG Posted April 13, 2011 Report Posted April 13, 2011 21 points? And they don't show the break down? Nothing on Compas' site yet either. Also claims to be the largest poll so far of the campaign. 2,300 polled, 2.1% MOE.Sounds like liberal support dropped to the low 20s with harper around 42-43. That would put the NDP around 18-20%. Quote
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