Hallaleujah Flash Mob in Welland, Ontario

[August1991]

Compare this:

... and this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bs5bnVoZK4Q&feature=related

[Michael Hardner]

Great. Too bad there was an ad at the end... ah well...

Edited December 16, 2010 by Charles Anthony
deleted re-copied Opening Post

[jbg]

I couldn't watch the second video. What's the story?

[Shakeyhands]

not getting the connection here August.... Flashmob 1941 (Hollywood Version) compared to FlashMob 2010 perhaps?

[waldo]

I couldn't watch the second video. What's the story?

embedding not allowed... just click the supplied link to watch it directly at youtube.

August1991 is presuming to draw a parallel between the two videos... perhaps foretelling a similar fate/outcome between a perceived 'inspirational & spiritual' mall food-court display and the influence on pre-WWII German society of youthful brownshirts carrying forward the National Socialist movement... either that or he just likes the tunes.

[jbg]

embedding not allowed... just click the supplied link to watch it directly at youtube.

August1991 is presuming to draw a parallel between the two videos... perhaps foretelling a similar fate/outcome between a perceived 'inspirational & spiritual' mall food-court display and the influence on pre-WWII German society of youthful brownshirts carrying forward the National Socialist movement... either that or he just likes the tunes.

Thanks for the tip.

On watching both videos there is not a hint that the charollers in the food court were going to attack, hurt or kill anyone. THere is hindsight evidence that the Nazi mob fictionalized in the second video had quite different intentions, and outcomes.

[Jack Weber]

The one in Welland must've been at the Seaway Mall...It looked familiar!

[August1991]

On watching both videos there is not a hint that the charollers in the food court were going to attack, hurt or kill anyone. THere is hindsight evidence that the Nazi mob fictionalized in the second video had quite different intentions, and outcomes.

But that's not the distinction.

In hindsight jbg, you note that "there is not a hint that the charollers in the food court were going to attack, hurt or kill anyone."

In hindsight.

----

I fear the song and emotional appeal to something that is "good". If it is truly good, then you should rejoice - if you freely choose so.

More broadly, it seems to me that it's a question of "fanboys" or shibboleths or gang membership. "Sony is good, Panasonic is bad." "Anne Hathaway? What a lame actress."

----

Bob Fosse knew exactly what he was doing in 1972 when he included this scene in Cabaret. And he was speaking directly to the people in Welland who made this 2010 youtube video.

Edited December 2, 2010 by August1991

[waldo]

spirited, individualist, free-thinker is good..... sheepish, peer-pressured, copier/follower is bad

[jbg]

Bob Fosse knew exactly what he was doing in 1972 when he included this scene in Cabaret. And he was speaking directly to the people in Welland who made this 2010 youtube video.

Not sure I follow.

[August1991]

Not sure I follow.

Bob Fosse was an individual.

You'll note, in the Cabaret video, the old man who turns his head and doesn't sing.

[waldo]

You'll note, in the Cabaret video, the old man who turns his head and doesn't sing.

who? You mean the curmudgeon?

[August1991]

who? You mean the curmudgeon?

Yes, with the hat.

[waldo]

You'll note, in the Cabaret video, the old man who turns his head and doesn't sing.

who? You mean the curmudgeon?

Yes, with the hat.

no, let me make it clearer... one could interpret his 'unwillingness' to participate in relation to his curmudgeon self... that is to say, he didn't exhibit a display of "spirited, individualism and free-thinking"... he was simply an old-fart - a curmudgeon! But then, I don't believe that fits your personal narrative here, does it?

[August1991]

... that is to say, he didn't exhibit a display of "spirited, individualism and free-thinking"... he was simply an old-fart - a curmudgeon!

Your choice of words.

I didn't make the movie, Bob Fosse did. And I understand Fosse's point as I think you do too.

[waldo]

Your choice of words.

I didn't make the movie, Bob Fosse did. And I understand Fosse's point as I think you do too.

of course... I was taking liberty... one could choose to interpret the Cabaret old man's reluctance to join, in different ways. Just as one could choose to interpret the mall food court responses, in different ways. But you've not attempted to make 'a case', either way... you've simply dropped a couple of video references and waited for responses. Perhaps you might indulge and offer your insight as to why you believe there to be some comparative value/link between the respective videos... what do you see as common ties/actions/attributions between those that join in and those that choose not to (join in). After all, you did suggest that, "Fosse was speaking directly to the food-court people in Welland".

[Jack Weber]

of course... I was taking liberty... one could choose to interpret the Cabaret old man's reluctance to join, in different ways. Just as one could choose to interpret the mall food court responses, in different ways. But you've not attempted to make 'a case', either way... you've simply dropped a couple of video references and waited for responses. Perhaps you might indulge and offer your insight as to why you believe there to be some comparative value/link between the respective videos... what do you see as common ties/actions/attributions between those that join in and those that choose not to (join in). After all, you did suggest that, "Fosse was speaking directly to the food-court people in Welland".

Let me get this straight...

Straight and Fosse

Someone thinks the choreographer of Broadway shows and director of films like All That Jazz is speaking to the munching down masses at the Seaway Mall food court,in scenic Welland,Ontario ,through an impromptu session of Handel's Messiah???

Edited December 4, 2010 by Jack Weber

[BubberMiley]

I don't think he was a curmudgeon so much as someone who didn't care for nazis. That was probably for reasons other than their tendency to break into song, however. They didn't get their bad reputation from spontaneous musical displays, so it's kind of unfiar to equate them with a small-town Ontario group because of that.

But I'm not surprised that the original poster would make that connection.

[August1991]

Someone thinks the choreographer of Broadway shows and director of films like All That Jazz is speaking to the munching down masses at the Seaway Mall food court,in scenic Welland,Ontario ,through an impromptu session of Handel's Messiah???

Yes, I think Fosse spoke in this way.

[August1991]

Perhaps you might indulge and offer your insight as to why you believe there to be some comparative value/link between the respective videos... what do you see as common ties/actions/attributions between those that join in and those that choose not to (join in). After all, you did suggest that, "Fosse was speaking directly to the food-court people in Welland".

Waldo, it's a good question that I have pondered in the past few days. I have no simple answer.

Nowadays, if Muslims sing in prayer, or respond to prayer, what would you say?

-----

I think Fosse was right. The old guy turns his head. If Fosse had had foresight, he would have doubled the scene with a chubby woman turning her head. But the scene itself shows our future.

As Galileo or Voltaire once did, who nowadays has the courage to defend our rights, or criticize women who cover their hair?

In a Muslim world, only men sing prayers.

Edited December 11, 2010 by August1991

[waldo]

there are action/response commonalities at play between the respective scenarios; however, I can't accept Fosse's intent was to extend beyond the strict confines of his film's historical reach... one can attempt to make that extension, as you have; however, for me, that extension only applies on the broadest of impacting interpretation, with response 'results' that might be either positive, negative, indifferent or not applicable. Interpretations like... 'follower-leader', peer pressure, ambition, risk behaviour, self-promotion, initiative, etc.

of course, you acknowledged historical hindsight in evaluating the impact and (negative) response determination for the Cabaret scene... my belaboring the point over the 'old man' was simply to suggest that the response determination, short of historical hindsight, would be one less easily made. On a different level and degree, we also have a manner of hindsight to apply in evaluating the food-court scene... but, of course, it's a hindsight fueled by personal experience/anecdote versus historical precedent.

I read your latest comments as pushing the scope/context considerably away from the loosest of connections that might exist between the Cabaret and food-court scenarios... defending rights or applying criticism presume on degrees of overt confrontation... I don't recognize confrontation within either of your two sample video scenarios. Of course, initiating and/or participating in confrontation, rely upon some of the above interpretations I spoke of... i.e., 'follower-leader', peer pressure, ambition, risk behaviour, self-promotion, initiative, etc.

[August1991]

I read your latest comments as pushing the scope/context considerably away from the loosest of connections that might exist between the Cabaret and food-court scenarios...

To use modern words, Fosse showed that political correctness is seductive. It takes courage/conviction/good sense to be true to one's beliefs and oppose conventional wisdom.

Not all Germans were swept up in the bubble madness of Hitler and Nazism. I think that's the point of the scene of Fosse.

(BTW, as Mordechai Richter often stated, Félix Leclerc wrote Demain nous appartient.)

----

Have I crossed the Godwin line?

Edited December 11, 2010 by August1991

[Jack Weber]

To use modern words, Fosse showed that political correctness is seductive. It takes courage/conviction/good sense to be true to one's beliefs and oppose conventional wisdom.

Not all Germans were swept up in the bubble madness of Hitler and Nazism. I think that's the point of the scene of Fosse.

(BTW, as Mordechai Richter often stated, Félix Leclerc wrote Demain nous appartient.)

----

Have I crossed the Godwin line?

August...

You've crossed the Mendoza Line...

[bill_barilko]

You Guys have NFC what a flash mob is-that's not surprising though.

[August1991]

August...

You've crossed the Mendoza Line...

Jack, I had to look that one up. According to wikipedia, I'm hitting below 0.200 which, if I understand properly, means that these posts are not getting me to base.

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I'm sorry if you people see a distinction between the Welland Flash Mob and the Cabaret scene but underneath all, I don't.

IMV, it is too easy to manipulate feelings.

I believe that there is "good" and "evil" in this universe but these two scenes, depending on circumstance, could portray either.