Harper blames Israeli stance for UN snub

[KeyStone]

Harper has just come out saying that Canada's staunch support for Israel is the reason that we did not get the rotating seat on the UN security council.

http://www.nationalpost.com/news/Harper+says+Canada+will+stand+Israel/3794912/story.html

In the article, he uses some pretty strong language, to make Canada's position unambiguous.

"Canada has refused to 'pretend' it is being an honest broker on Israel"

"anti-Semitic ideologies target the Jewish people in their “homeland” of Israel and uses the “language of human rights to do so.”"

"as long as I am prime minister, ....Canada will take that stand, whatever the cost."

"there are those who would “choose evil” and would launch another Holocaust, if left unchecked."

"is particularly disturbing that anti-Semitism has gained a place at “our universities,” where at times, it is not the “mob who are removed, but the Jewish students under attack"

"Jews today in many parts of the world and many different settings are increasingly subjected to vandalism, threats, slurs, and just plain, old-fashioned lies"

This comes just two weeks after Ignatieff condemned a fellow Liberal for suggesting that we should not be afraid to criticize Israel. He seemed to imply that there was never any reason to criticize Israel, and that we stand shoulder to shoulder with them at all times.

The pandering for the support of the Jewish lobby in Canada has reached unprecedented levels.

[charter.rights]

Harper has just come out saying that Canada's staunch support for Israel is the reason that we did not get the rotating seat on the UN security council.

http://www.nationalpost.com/news/Harper+says+Canada+will+stand+Israel/3794912/story.html

In the article, he uses some pretty strong language, to make Canada's position unambiguous.

"Canada has refused to 'pretend' it is being an honest broker on Israel"

"anti-Semitic ideologies target the Jewish people in their “homeland” of Israel and uses the “language of human rights to do so.”"

"as long as I am prime minister, ....Canada will take that stand, whatever the cost."

"there are those who would “choose evil” and would launch another Holocaust, if left unchecked."

"is particularly disturbing that anti-Semitism has gained a place at “our universities,” where at times, it is not the “mob who are removed, but the Jewish students under attack"

"Jews today in many parts of the world and many different settings are increasingly subjected to vandalism, threats, slurs, and just plain, old-fashioned lies"

This comes just two weeks after Ignatieff condemned a fellow Liberal for suggesting that we should not be afraid to criticize Israel. He seemed to imply that there was never any reason to criticize Israel, and that we stand shoulder to shoulder with them at all times.

The pandering for the support of the Jewish lobby in Canada has reached unprecedented levels.

Harper has lots to blame.... Too bad he doesn't blame the real culprit...the guy between his two ears.

[William Ashley]

Harper has just come out saying that Canada's staunch support for Israel is the reason that we did not get the rotating seat on the UN security council.

Stephen Harper ought to have a cold shower and come out of the closet of referencing his and his parties beliefs to equate Canada's beliefs. 'Canada' is the people and the country, not whatever he thinks, his job is not dictator, it is Prime Minister - the role of running government not the state, and not the will of the people.

The reason why they don't like you Stephen is because you arn't giving them what they want, why would they put someone in the UNSEC who doesn't help them out? Clue in much?

There is nothing wrong in supporting your allies, but don't expect their enemies to buff you nice and shiny after the fact.

BTW most of the Middle East is SEMITIC. If you mean ANTIJEW say it. If you mean ANTIISRAELI say it, the two are not equal. Israel is not all Jewdom, it is simply a Jewish state. A highly racist Jewish state, that subjects all other citizens to place Jews as the master race. Sound familiar? Not all Jews are Semitic. On the contrary there are many many Jews who are not Semitic and many Semites more than those who are Jews that are not Jews.

If he is trying to win Jewish votes maybe he can make intelligent commentary rather than spouting uneducated nonsense. It shows him as really not having a clue about the people he is trying to be buddy buddy with.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semitic

Do unto others as you would have them do unto you. Israel should take note.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Golden_Rule

http://www.rostau.org.uk/ep/EPAlign/MJPeasant.pdf

read it

Edited November 8, 2010 by William Ashley

[PIK]

This shows the difference between the 2. Harper willing to put it all on the line for a democratic country surrounded by dictators, where the liberals will as usual, throw thier support behind the dictators.

Edited November 8, 2010 by PIK

[nicky10013]

This shows the difference between the 2. Harper willing to put it all on the line for a democratic country surrounded by dictators, where the liberals will as usual, throw thier support behind the dicators.

Hahahahahahahahaha.

[scribblet]

This shows the difference between the 2. Harper willing to put it all on the line for a democratic country surrounded by dictators, where the liberals will as usual, throw thier support behind the dictators.

Exactly, he has the guts to stand up for what is right.

[KeyStone]

This shows the difference between the 2. Harper willing to put it all on the line for a democratic country surrounded by dictators, where the liberals will as usual, throw thier support behind the dictators.

Say what?

Harper is pandering to Israel simply because he understands and respects the power of Jewish lobby groups in Canada.

Ignatieff is pandering just as hard, and I'm not sure what dictators you think he is supporting.

Harper is basically daring Ignatieff to criticize him for losing the UN seat, now that he is using defense of Israel as a reason.

Being a democracy does not always mean that a country is in the right. Not having democracy does not always mean a country is in the wrong. To suggest that either side is blameless in this conflict is absurd. Unfortunately, none of the Canadian politicians are able to recognize that.

[KeyStone]

Exactly, he has the guts to stand up for what is right.

If by right, you mean obtaining the support of Canadian Jews, then yes he is quite courageous.

It doesn't take a lot of courage to stand up for Canadian Jews these days. In fact quite the opposite.

Would love to see a politician stand up for the Roma for a change.

There is a group that was exterminated, just like the Jews, but they weren't given a homeland and continue to be persecuted around the world. Where are the politicians standing up for them?

[Topaz]

You can watch Harper speech over on C-pac and Harper has to stand up for Israel because the Jewish Society has given him awards for being their friend. Having the Jewish votes here in Canada always helps too and maybe that's why he comes off anti -Muslim. The games politicians play! When a leader stands up for one peculiar group, resentment is bound to appear and that is not a good thing. After being the PM of Canada, will Harper try to be the PM of Israel, because he come across as if he was.

[dre]

Harper has it exactly backwards. If hes worried about anti-semetism that LAST thing he should do is give Israel a free pass for its transgressions... that will encourage MORE of them, which will result in MORE anti-semitism, and anti-Israel sentiment.

But yeah... it'll get him some votes!

[capricorn]

Harper is pandering to Israel simply because he understands and respects the power of Jewish lobby groups in Canada.

Harper has taken a principled stand and he is willing to take the hits for it.

Let me draw your attention to some particularly disturbing trends.

Anti-Semitism has gained a place at our universities, where at times it is not the mob who are removed, but the Jewish students under attack. And, under the shadow of a hateful ideology with global ambitions, one which targets the Jewish homeland as a scapegoat, Jews are savagely attacked around the world – such as, most appallingly, in Mumbai in 2008.

We have seen all this before. And we have no excuse to be complacent. In fact we have a duty to take action. And for all of us, that starts at home.

In Canada, we have taken a number of steps to assess and combat anti-Semitism in our own country. But of course we must also combat anti-Semitism beyond our borders, – an evolving, global phenomenon. And we must recognize, that while its substance is as crude as ever, its method is now more sophisticated.

---

We must be relentless in exposing this new anti-Semitism for what it is. Of course, like any country, Israel may be subjected to fair criticism. And like any free country, Israel subjects itself to such criticism – healthy, necessary, democratic debate. But when Israel, the only country in the world whose very existence is under attack – Is consistently and conspicuously singled out for condemnation, I believe we are morally obligated to take a stand. Demonization, double standards, delegitimization, the 3 D’s, it is a responsibility, to stand up to them.

And I know, by the way, because I have the bruises to show for it, that whether it is at the United Nations, or any other international forum, the easy thing to do is simply to just get along and go along with this anti-Israeli rhetoric, to pretend it is just being even-handed, and to excuse oneself with the label of “honest broker.” There are, after all, a lot more votes, a lot more, in being anti-Israeli than in taking a stand. But, as long as I am Prime Minister, whether it is at the UN or the Francophonie or anywhere else, Canada will take that stand, whatever the cost. Not just because it is the right thing to do, but because history shows us, and the ideology of the anti-Israeli mob tells us all too well, that those who threaten the existence of the Jewish people are, in the longer term, a threat to all of us.

http://news.nationalpost.com/2010/11/08/excerpt-harpers-speech-on-israel-anti-semitism/

Harper's position is unambiguous, unequivocal and nuance-free. His speech is in the public domain domestically and internationally. He knows his comments will draw compliments and condemnations but obviously that did not stand in his way to be clear about where he stands. It took a lot of guts to speak as he did about what's happening in our universities and at the UN.

Here is a Prime Minister that has laid out in frank terms how he sees it, the consequences to his administration be damned. I hope everyone will read his speech. Seldom do we hear a leader speak so candidly.

[Saipan]

Harper has lots to blame.... Too bad he doesn't blame the real culprit...the guy between his two ears.

Aah, them poor terrorists

[capricorn]

Having the Jewish votes here in Canada always helps too and maybe that's why he comes off anti -Muslim.

I heard his speech and he didn't refer to Muslims once, not even in veiled terms.

When a leader stands up for one peculiar group, resentment is bound to appear and that is not a good thing.

My goodness yes! We must have a politically correct Prime Minister at all times to match our politically correct Canadian society.

After being the PM of Canada, will Harper try to be the PM of Israel, because he come across as if he was.

Well one thing we know for sure. He ain't gettin' a job at the UN any time soon.

[Saipan]

Would love to see a politician stand up for the Roma for a change.

Milosovic did. But after they were unable to sentence him at the Kangaroo court they had to whack him.

Albanians were not only exterminating Serbs but Gypsies too, out of Kosovo.

It's why Gen. Lewis Mckenzie said we joined the wrong side there.

[nicky10013]

Milosovic did. But after they were unable to sentence him at the Kangaroo court they had to whack him.

Albanians were not only exterminating Serbs but Gypsies too, out of Kosovo.

It's why Gen. Lewis Mckenzie said we joined the wrong side there.

You're defending Milosevic?

[Saipan]

You're defending Milosevic?

No. He was a Communist and his regime screwed up my first attempt to escape.

I was just stating the OBVIOUS - which went right over your head.

[KeyStone]

"Harper has taken a principled stand and he is willing to take the hits for it."

That's certainly how he is trying to sell it.

I suppose if you believe that Israel represents all that is good and decent in the world, that's accurate.

My suspicion is that it will help Harper in terms of voters, donations and influential allies.

It certainly raises the bar in terms of pandering to Israel, not sure if Iggy can top that.

"Harper's position is unambiguous, unequivocal and nuance-free. His speech is in the public domain domestically and internationally. He knows his comments will draw compliments and condemnations but obviously that did not stand in his way to be clear about where he stands. It took a lot of guts to speak as he did about what's happening in our universities and at the UN."

Well, it was a calculated risk. Let's not confuse personal integrity with tactical political ambition.

"Here is a Prime Minister that has laid out in frank terms how he sees it, the consequences to his administration be damned. I hope everyone will read his speech. Seldom do we hear a leader speak so candidly.

Stop painting him out to be a hero. The pro-Israel lobby groups have huge power in Canada and he has just solidified their support for the next election and beyond. This is a tactical move all the way. Those that do not support everything Israel does are unlikely to be Conservative supporters, so he loses nothing. The Liberals on the other hand have been able to retain some moderates. Iggy now has to either concede the Israeli lobby to the Conservatives, or step up his own Israeli pandering to such a degree as to ostracize the remaining moderates loyal to the Liberals.

[Saipan]

The pro-Israel lobby groups have huge power in Canada

And like Hitler said, they are trying to take over.

Half the world already speaks Hebrew.

Here we can see the vast teritorries and colonies of Israel. All across the Middle East and elsewhere.

http://crudeoilcrisis.com/t4_shite_suni_files/image002.jpg

[capricorn]

Iggy now has to either concede the Israeli lobby to the Conservatives, or step up his own Israeli pandering to such a degree as to ostracize the remaining moderates loyal to the Liberals.

Since you mention Iggy, here goes. He too spoke at the same conference as Harper. In his usual "not white, not black, but gray" approach, Iggy appears to pander to all sides in one fell swoop.

Ignatieff wanted the audience to know that he repudiated and condemned anti-Semitism and intolerance. But he also wanted them to know that it was important to preserve the right to criticize Israel. Ignatieff conceded that anti-Israel criticism might get out of hand, at the UN for example. But he expressed this concern primarly in terms of the harm this one-sidedness did to “the UN system,” rather than to the unfairness to Israel.

The most disturbing thing the Liberal leader had to say was this: He suggested that global anti-Semitism would be reduced by a settlement of the Arab-Israeli dispute.

As a matter of analysis, this statement is at best arguable: You could equally say that but for the horrible Jew hatred that has been fomented in the Islamic world this past half century, the Arab-Israeli dispute would have been settled long ago.

But think about Ignatieff’s words as a matter of moral principle. If Ignatieff were attending a conference on violence against women, would he dare suggest that there might be less such violence if women nagged their husbands less? Of course not. That would be outrageous. Yet that is what he had to say here.

Forced even-handedness suffused the speech.

Ignatieff talked movingly of visiting the firebombed Talmud Torah dayschool in Montreal in 2006. Fine. Good. He then immediately mentioned that he had also visited a mosque that had its windows broken. Also fine, we can all agree it’s wrong to vandalize mosques too. OK. But why mention the one immediately after the other? What relationship did these two events have to each other?

I may be very wrong about this, but to the ears of a former speechwriter, Ignatieff’s speech sounded very like it had been worked on by at least two authors. One author wished to sound a strong message of support to the Jewish community. The other author wanted to pull back.

Ignatieff reiterated his condemnations of the “Israel Apartheid Week” held on some university campuses as an attempt to “delegitimize a democracy.” Those are welcome words. But along the way, he had this to say: “Israel is Israel. Apartheid South Africa was a crime against humanity.”

Say that aloud. Weird, right? It’s Rhetoric 101: parallel sentences share a parallel construction. It makes you think that the first sentence originated as “Israel is the Middle East’s only democracy.” Or: “Israel is the historical homeland of the Jewish people.” Then somebody decided such a statement was too controversial, and so emended it to the baldly undeniable statement “Israel is Israel.” That’s certainly accurate — but it’s something less than a ringing endorsement.

http://fullcomment.nationalpost.com/2010/11/08/david-frum-ignatieffs-confused-pointless-thoughts-on-why-anti-semitism-is-bad/

Sounds like a speech loaded with nuance from the King of Nuances.

I looked for Ignatieff's speech but I can't find it anywhere, not even on Liberal.ca. I'd like to read the whole thing. Anyone have a link?

[capricorn]

And like Hitler said, they are trying to take over.

Half the world already speaks Hebrew.

Here we can see the vast teritorries and colonies of Israel. All across the Middle East and elsewhere.

http://crudeoilcrisis.com/t4_shite_suni_files/image002.jpg

[jbg]

The pandering for the support of the Jewish lobby in Canada has reached unprecedented levels.

Would you prefer Canada have values and conditions closer to those of Israel or of Gaza? Hey, gays risk getting their heads cut off in Gaza. So much for same sex marriage and other liberal shibboleths.

[Battletoads]

Supporting a terrorist state loses you votes?

Alert the media.

/end sarcasm

It's sad but Canada's loss can't solely be attributed to Harper's stance on Israel. The fact is Harper and his government have done serious, maybe irreparable, damage to Canada's reputation on many fronts. From his continued show of disdain for the UN, his lack of belief in women's rights, his government's environmental polices, ect ect ect. It seems every decision Harper has made has blackened our reputation, and events like this are the result.

Edited November 9, 2010 by Battletoads

[Battletoads]

Would you prefer Canada have values and conditions closer to those of Israel or of Gaza? Hey, gays risk getting their heads cut off in Gaza. So much for same sex marriage and other liberal shibboleths.

Firstly Gaza =/= All of the Palestinian Territories.

and why is it that Canada should pick a side when neither side is anywhere near being reputable?

Edited November 9, 2010 by Battletoads

[KeyStone]

And like Hitler said, they are trying to take over.

Half the world already speaks Hebrew.

Here we can see the vast teritorries and colonies of Israel. All across the Middle East and elsewhere.

http://crudeoilcrisis.com/t4_shite_suni_files/image002.jpg

Ahh, the common tactic of decrying any recognition of the power of the Jewish lobby as anti-semitic conspiracy theories.

How insightful and unexpected.

[KeyStone]

Since you mention Iggy, here goes. He too spoke at the same conference as Harper. In his usual "not white, not black, but gray" approach, Iggy appears to pander to all sides in one fell swoop.

http://fullcomment.nationalpost.com/2010/11/08/david-frum-ignatieffs-confused-pointless-thoughts-on-why-anti-semitism-is-bad/

Sounds like a speech loaded with nuance from the King of Nuances.

I looked for Ignatieff's speech but I can't find it anywhere, not even on Liberal.ca. I'd like to read the whole thing. Anyone have a link?

Interesting, in the game of chicken to see just how far each one will go to win Jewish support in Canada, it appears that Harper has won the game of chicken, and Ignatieff is backing off, and going for a more moderate approach. Very inconsistent, but that's the Liberals for you.