Veterans ombudsman not going quietly;

[msdogfood]

see this!!

Is the pmo & the CPC trying to destroy them self or what!!??.

Edited August 18, 2010 by msdogfood

[Jack Weber]

Standard Operating Procedure for this government...

Unfortunately,if you tell people what is really going on,you get fired.

Of course in this case,Mr.Stogran was really throwing a wrench in the Conservative "Stand Up for Canada" empty bumper sticker sloganeering because it shed's a little light on how they like to show the phony Con toughness,but don't have the courage of their convictions in taking care of those wounded in battle.No money for vets,but,tax cuts and subsidies for the oil sector ar A-OK,though...

And what exaclty did Blackburn mean by "a new person arrives with new ideas and brings a different perspective."?I suspect it's con code for being a yes man,but we shall see...

Edited August 17, 2010 by Jack Weber

[Topaz]

I have a topic on this forum and if you scroll down 7, I hope you will read of what I heard on the Senate Committee hearings on this. As the Corporal said, by going in the direction the Tories want to go, it is sending the Vets backwards. It hard not to be on the Vets side, especially when there's tears in their eyes when they are trying to tell the senate why this is wrong.

[Keepitsimple]

And what exaclty did Blackburn mean by "a new person arrives with new ideas and brings a different perspective."?I suspect it's con code for being a yes man,but we shall see...

Which I guess brings the question - should an ombudsman be appointed for life? If not, when is it EVER the right time to "refresh" the position? Ombudsmen, by the nature of the position are strong advocates and can be seen to be at odds with the bureaucracy. I'll bet that the next ombudsman will just as strong an advocate. People by nature are resistant to change....but lets see what the Veterans think of the next appointment before we pass judgement.

[msdogfood]

I have a topic on this forum and if you scroll down 7, I hope you will read of what I heard on the Senate Committee hearings on this. As the Corporal said, by going in the direction the Tories want to go, it is sending the Vets backwards. It hard not to be on the Vets side, especially when there's tears in their eyes when they are trying to tell the senate why this is wrong.

Ok for anyone who has not seen it go NOW!!

Thank you Topaz'!!!!.

[msdogfood]

Which I guess brings the question - should an ombudsman be appointed for life? If not, when is it EVER the right time to "refresh" the position? Ombudsmen, by the nature of the position are strong advocates and can be seen to be at odds with the bureaucracy. I'll bet that the next ombudsman will just as strong an advocate. People by nature are resistant to change....but lets see what the Veterans think of the next appointment before we pass judgement.

Well All of the Veterans are VERY UNHAPPY with the PMO!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!.

[Topaz]

I think its safe to say most Canadians are outrage at what is happening to the Vets coming home but, also the other Vets from the others wars. Both, the Libs and the Tories are at fault but, now the Libs are behind the Vets, so where are the Tories? The Tories are the ones in control and if they don't side on the Vets then that bad news for them. http://www.atory01.com/blog/2010/8/18/stand-up-for-our-vets.html

[Jack Weber]

I think its safe to say most Canadians are outrage at what is happening to the Vets coming home but, also the other Vets from the others wars. Both, the Libs and the Tories are at fault but, now the Libs are behind the Vets, so where are the Tories? The Tories are the ones in control and if they don't side on the Vets then that bad news for them. http://www.atory01.com/blog/2010/8/18/stand-up-for-our-vets.html

What's worse is that the Con's always use the quasi military/nationalist angle to sell themselves.They are the ones who claim to support the Armed Forces the most.They used the borrowed sloganeering of "Cut and Run" and the election sign sloganeering of "Standing up for Canada!"...

They have used these things because they seems to have thought it gave them some sort of moral high ground...

They simply can't anymore....

[msdogfood]

I think its safe to say most Canadians are outrage at what is happening to the Vets coming home but, also the other Vets from the others wars. Both, the Libs and the Tories are at fault but, now the Libs are behind the Vets, so where are the Tories? The Tories are the ones in control and if they don't side on the Vets then that bad news for them. http://www.atory01.com/blog/2010/8/18/stand-up-for-our-vets.html

Look at this ASAP read All of it!!.

http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/canada/ombudsman-slams-treatment-of-war-veterans-100963399.html

[eyeball]

What's worse is that the Con's always use the quasi military/nationalist angle to sell themselves.They are the ones who claim to support the Armed Forces the most.They used the borrowed sloganeering of "Cut and Run" and the election sign sloganeering of "Standing up for Canada!"...

They have used these things because they seems to have thought it gave them some sort of moral high ground...

They simply can't anymore....

This is why I keep saying soldiers should be asking for a unequivocal mandate directly from the people through a referendum before they're ever sent abroad. Please note I'm not suggesting we should vote before defending ourselves from an invasion. I am specifically talking about engagements in other countries.

Given the need to ensure that mandate will see them through the long haul the referendum should require at least 65% of voters perhaps more, especially in those cases that involve our joining some ally. 50% + 1 commitment just won't cut it.

[charter.rights]

What's worse is that the Con's always use the quasi military/nationalist angle to sell themselves.They are the ones who claim to support the Armed Forces the most.They used the borrowed sloganeering of "Cut and Run" and the election sign sloganeering of "Standing up for Canada!"...

They have used these things because they seems to have thought it gave them some sort of moral high ground...

They simply can't anymore....

True...but then the Reformers also believe that the army is a socialist organization, and that veterans were on the dole.

Of course we knew before that Harper was trying to usurp the role of Commander in Chief, and his temper tantrums at getting opposition tends to make him lash out in unusual ways. Maybe we should lobby government for a "time-out" room at Centre Block. I'm sure it will be filled constantly; a worthwhile investment don't you think?

Edited August 19, 2010 by charter.rights

[madmax]

This is a great omsbudman. He is speaking up for Veterans while the Conservatives pay lip service and undermine Veteran Needs. There is a reason the Cons want this guy out. There is a reason why Cons are hiding from this thread. However its nothing new, Peter Stoffer has called the government out on their treatment of Veterans for years. The Cons are all hat no horse but full of manure.

Cons will be back, speaking boldly, once they get their YESman in place

[nicky10013]

This is a great omsbudman. He is speaking up for Veterans while the Conservatives pay lip service and undermine Veteran Needs. There is a reason the Cons want this guy out. There is a reason why Cons are hiding from this thread. However its nothing new, Peter Stoffer has called the government out on their treatment of Veterans for years. The Cons are all hat no horse but full of manure.

Cons will be back, speaking boldly, once they get their YESman in place

Yep. The whole notion that the Conservatives are good for the military is just message politics and nothing more than utter garbage. I was watching a Rick Mercer Report rerun last night which originally aired at the time of the Haiti Earthquake. His main point was that soldiers are the babies of this generation, in that instead of politicians kissing babies, it's now politically convenient to get as close to the troops as possible. He came across an anecdote of the CPC buying new armoured vehicles the military so desperately needs. McKay got a bunch of uniformed people out into the middle of the field to announce the project. Yet, the second day of the disaster in Haiti, the defence department announced the placing of the armoured vehicle programme on "permanent hold." Pure photo op. Now that the news came out a month or two ago that the first plane load to Haiti wasn't food, medicine or troops but reporters, I wonder how ANYONE can EVER trust ANYTHING this government has to say regarding the military.

[eyeball]

I wonder how ANYONE can EVER trust ANYTHING this government has to say regarding the military.

Given this, shouldn't the uses to which governments put our military be just as suspect? I'm amazed how ANYONE could argue for continuing to leave it entirely up to our government alone to decide when, where, why, how and especially what our military is sent abroad for.

What really amazes me is that soldiers seem to be the amongst the strongest supporters of doing so.

[Smallc]

Yet, the second day of the disaster in Haiti, the defence department announced the placing of the armoured vehicle programme on "permanent hold."

As far as I know, that program is no longer on hold, since it appears to be moving forward (or at least 2/3 or it are...the other one is moving more slowly).

[PIK]

If this all true ,then it is disgusting, but I am going to wait a little more, rumours have it ,strogan can't talk to anybody without blowing up. So lets wait abit and see what comes out of this. But no matter what we must do EVERYTHING for them.

[eyeball]

If this all true ,then it is disgusting, but I am going to wait a little more, rumours have it ,strogan can't talk to anybody without blowing up. So lets wait abit and see what comes out of this. But no matter what we must do EVERYTHING for them.

Somebody better do something soon if the veterans comments I heard on the news the other night are anything to judge by.

"if the government won't stand behind the troops then it should stand in front of them"...and..."I'm getting hyper-radicalized"

I have to say I'm probably not going to lose much sleep if someone decides to blow up Parliament.

[msdogfood]

Yep. The whole notion that the Conservatives are good for the military is just message politics and nothing more than utter garbage. I was watching a Rick Mercer Report rerun last night which originally aired at the time of the Haiti Earthquake. His main point was that soldiers are the babies of this generation, in that instead of politicians kissing babies, it's now politically convenient to get as close to the troops as possible. He came across an anecdote of the CPC buying new armoured vehicles the military so desperately needs. McKay got a bunch of uniformed people out into the middle of the field to announce the project. Yet, the second day of the disaster in Haiti, the defence department announced the placing of the armoured vehicle programme on "permanent hold." Pure photo op. Now that the news came out a month or two ago that the first plane load to Haiti wasn't food, medicine or troops but reporters, I wonder how ANYONE can EVER trust ANYTHING this government has to say regarding the military.

I watched the same episode to i had missed that fact originally.. i could NOT believe they did that!!!

GRRR!

[msdogfood]

Somebody better do something soon if the veterans comments I heard on the news the other night are anything to judge by.

"if the government won't stand behind the troops then it should stand in front of them"...and..."I'm getting hyper-radicalized"

I have to say I'm probably not going to lose much sleep if someone decides to blow up Parliament.

I emailed the PMO about this ishu to I AM Very UNHAPPY with the pmo now!!

This is going to bite the PMO in the ASS!!!!!!!!!!!!!.

[msdogfood]

What do you think of this??.

"it's better for the country if soldiers die in Afghanistan rather than come home wounded to be a burden on the treasury."

Veterans ombudsman.

[segnosaur]

Yep. The whole notion that the Conservatives are good for the military is just message politics and nothing more than utter garbage. I was watching a Rick Mercer Report rerun last night

Ummm... you do realize that Rick Mercer Report is a comedy show, not a news program, right? (Not that political satire can't be accurate, but given a choice between laughs and accuracy, laughs will often win out.)

He came across an anecdote of the CPC buying new armoured vehicles the military so desperately needs. McKay got a bunch of uniformed people out into the middle of the field to announce the project. Yet, the second day of the disaster in Haiti, the defence department announced the placing of the armoured vehicle programme on "permanent hold." Pure photo op.

As another poster indicated, the government is now going ahead with at least some of the work on the armored vehicle program... See: http://news.gc.ca/web/article-eng.do?m=/index&nid=546469

As for other parts of the program, it appears that the main cause of the delay may be the lack of experienced procurement officers within the Department of Defense. (Since the military doesn't make large purchases very often, they didn't have people with the background in handling thins like requirements documents.) See: http://www.montrealgazette.com/news/armoured+army+vehicles+make+Canadian/3415534/story.html

Now that the news came out a month or two ago that the first plane load to Haiti wasn't food, medicine or troops but reporters, I wonder how ANYONE can EVER trust ANYTHING this government has to say regarding the military.

Not exactly true... The plane contained some reporters, but it also contained troops and much needed supplies and equipment. The biggest problem doesn't appear to be the government's desire for a photo-op, but the general disorganization of the disaster relief team. Now, whether it was the fault of the Conservative government is debatable (and some might think that it should be the job of the government to set overall policy, not micromanage troop deployments.)

[Topaz]

Here's what a report says about the Feds not going against the Vets of this country. It explains how some need the old rules brought back. http://www.calgaryherald.com/news/Fighting+feds/3428505/story.html

[Fortunata]

Harper likes to use the military as props for his and his cabinet's photo-ops. Other than that they should shut up and do as they are told. McKay wears a CF uniform (where's the outrage in that Harper followers?) to show how he is "as one" with the troops. Harper is going to buy billions of dollars worth of fighter jets, billions of dollars worth of ships (still no ice breaker though), he's going to protect our Arctic (with what?) but he won't support those veterans in need. It has to be a high-profile, attention and vote getter for his support.

Harper is as narcissistic as any leader in any country ever. He doesn't mind using anyone but don't let them get in his way.

[msdogfood]

Harper likes to use the military as props for his and his cabinet's photo-ops. Other than that they should shut up and do as they are told. McKay wears a CF uniform (where's the outrage in that Harper followers?) to show how he is "as one" with the troops. Harper is going to buy billions of dollars worth of fighter jets, billions of dollars worth of ships (still no ice breaker though), he's going to protect our Arctic (with what?) but he won't support those veterans in need. It has to be a high-profile, attention and vote getter for his support.

Harper is as narcissistic as any leader in any country ever. He doesn't mind using anyone but don't let them get in his way.

Harper is a control freak!!!!!!!!!!!.