Another man dead under taser

[bjre]

http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/article/828615--man-dies-after-being-tasered-at-group-home-in-collingwood

Man dies after being Tasered at group home in Collingwood

COLLINGWOOD, ONT.—A man has died after being Tasered by provincial police in Collingwood, Ont.

Police were called to a group home Thursday afternoon and say they used a Taser on a 27-year-old man because he was combative and assaulted an officer.

The man was pronounced dead at hospital.

An officer was treated for minor injuries.

The province's Special Investigations Unit has identified the victim as Aron Firman, and say he lived at the group home.

The SIU investigates reports involving police where there has been death, serious injury or allegations of sexual assault.

The question is:

Why Canadian education system can do nothing but just left this kind of man in group homes to spend our tax dollars?

[charter.rights]

http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/article/828615--man-dies-after-being-tasered-at-group-home-in-collingwood

The question is:

Why Canadian education system can do nothing but just left this kind of man in group homes to spend our tax dollars?

What a ffing remark to make. Are you really all there?

[segnosaur]

Why Canadian education system can do nothing but just left this kind of man in group homes to spend our tax dollars?

Umm.... what exactly does this have to do with the 'education system'? Sadly, this article doesn't have enough information to draw any sort of conclusions. However, if this is a group home for people who are mentally disabled, then the educational system would not have been able to help him. (In that case a 'group home' might have been the best option.)

[Topaz]

I've always thought that the police who have these tasers, should ask the person they are going to taser if they are on drugs or have any health problems. Now, some may think this is stupid, but if a person has heart problems or is on medication that could trigger a heart then shouldn't they ask first? Even before they draw the tasers out they could ask this question.

[kimmy]

http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/article/828615--man-dies-after-being-tasered-at-group-home-in-collingwood

The question is:

Why Canadian education system can do nothing but just left this kind of man in group homes to spend our tax dollars?

I think the question is:

What the hell did you just say?

I am going to write to your boss at the Ministry of Truth to ask if they can replace you with a propagandist who can actually read and write English. Hopefully they will recall you to Beijing and spare us any more of your idiocy.

-k

[kimmy]

I've always thought that the police who have these tasers, should ask the person they are going to taser if they are on drugs or have any health problems. Now, some may think this is stupid, but if a person has heart problems or is on medication that could trigger a heart then shouldn't they ask first? Even before they draw the tasers out they could ask this question.

Ok, so let's say a deranged miscreant is smashing windshields with a hockey stick in downtown Toronto, and a policeman orders him to put down the hockey stick and put his hands on the hood of the car. The man refuses, and begins pointing the hockey stick threateningly at the police officer. The officer thinks back to his training and things "yes, this would be a good time for me to use the tazer."

So this guy is advancing with a hockey stick, and you want the officer to ask if he is on drugs or has any health problems.

Constable Jones: "Sir, are you on drugs or do you have any health issues?"

Deranged Miscreant: "YEAH MAN I'M HIGH RIGHT NOW AND I HAVE HIGH BLOOD PRESSURE"

Ok, now what? The officer should now I guess not use the taser because the deranged miscreant says he is on drugs and has heart attack risks. Ok, what does Constable Jones do then?

Constable Jones: "Ok, I can't tazer you because you're a heart attack risk. So I'm just going to beat your face in with my night-stick, alright, sir?"

Deranged Miscreant: "YEAH OK MAN JUST DON'T TAZE ME BRO"

-k

[wyly]

I've always thought that the police who have these tasers, should ask the person they are going to taser if they are on drugs or have any health problems. Now, some may think this is stupid, but if a person has heart problems or is on medication that could trigger a heart then shouldn't they ask first? Even before they draw the tasers out they could ask this question.

if they are at the point of tasering someone that someone isn't likey to be to rational...and if they were they would just lie and claim they're on medication and have cardiac issues to escape the tazer...

[wyly]

unless there video's of the inicident showing otherwise this seems like a just application of the tazer....

[bjre]

I think the question is:

What the hell did you just say?

I am going to write to your boss at the Ministry of Truth to ask if they can replace you with a propagandist who can actually read and write English. Hopefully they will recall you to Beijing and spare us any more of your idiocy.

-k

I am the one who find the problem and try to let others think about solution for so many poor people the country have.

You are the one who think all problem as blame who looks like really a poor culture victim.

You look really like a person who have mental problem that try to add irrelevant information regularly to all what you failed to argue.

Edited June 26, 2010 by bjre

[Topaz]

if they are at the point of tasering someone that someone isn't likey to be to rational...and if they were they would just lie and claim they're on medication and have cardiac issues to escape the tazer...

Ok, but if the person is already out of control that means their heart is racing and to hit someone with a taser, would have a greater chance of that person having a heart attack. Do the police know martial arts? Using this doesn't mean your going to kill them.

[wyly]

Ok, but if the person is already out of control that means their heart is racing and to hit someone with a taser, would have a greater chance of that person having a heart attack.

possibly but it avoids more deadly options...we don't know what happened as yet, an officer was attacked, we don't know how badly injured he was, were there weapons involved?...

Do the police know martial arts? Using this doesn't mean your going to kill them.

martial arts not a requirement, I've personally known a number of cops in my life and none knew marital arts other than basic police training....one of my jobs in my younger days was as a bouncer/doorman unlike what you see in the movies controling someone who is intent on hurting you(or someone else) and not hurt them is extremelydifficult to do, and I know martial arts....

[bjre]

Umm.... what exactly does this have to do with the 'education system'? Sadly, this article doesn't have enough information to draw any sort of conclusions. However, if this is a group home for people who are mentally disabled, then the educational system would not have been able to help him. (In that case a 'group home' might have been the best option.)

Some mentally disabled are caused by being mis-treated with bully for long time. A person live with kind person turned to become a kind person. If more kindness in everyday environment, and less bully in everyday life, less people will have mental problems that need to be sent to group home.

Current law system is a cruel attacking system, it don't encourage kindness, the lawyers and crowns do as what they can try to accuse others with the most ugly thing they can imagine. Their behavior reinforce people to be as evil as they can. The system make people attack weak, kind person and convert them into strong, evil person. In this system you have to be strong if you don't want to become a loser.

And group homes are also filled with youth that robbed by CAS and have not find a foster family.

I don't think every care giver in group home with a kind heart and has a psychology degree.

[Wilber]

Ok, but if the person is already out of control that means their heart is racing and to hit someone with a taser, would have a greater chance of that person having a heart attack. Do the police know martial arts? Using this doesn't mean your going to kill them.

Of course the possibility that this person may be trying it kill the police officer at the time is of no importance.

[Sir Bandelot]

This demonstrates that the taser is a dangerous device, and although the polce need to use such devices sometimes against dengerous persons, death is not necessary in cases like this. There should be additional trainng and resources implemented when an officer is issued a taser. Part of their training should include appropriate life saving measures, CPR, even cardiac resusitators might have to become standard equipment.

Attacking the original poster for their poor language skills, or because of cultural misunderstanding is simply ignorant, but also quite typical in these forums. If anything, attack the idea not the person. If you can't attack the idea, you know...

[kimmy]

How retarded is this thread? Everybody in this thread thinks the OP is trying to talk about Tasers, and he's actually trying to talk about "group homes", "education", and his bizarre fixation with "CAS".

That's pretty retarded, IMO.

-k

[Jack Weber]

How retarded is this thread? Everybody in this thread thinks the OP is trying to talk about Tasers, and he's actually trying to talk about "group homes", "education", and his bizarre fixation with "CAS".

That's pretty retarded, IMO.

-k

Of course,in the PRC they don't use tasers...

They simply "re-educate" the populous by shooting the deranged loon and charge the family for the bullet....

[bjre]

Of course,in the PRC they don't use tasers...

They simply "re-educate" the populous by shooting the deranged loon and charge the family for the bullet....

In Canada, they use residential schools to "educate" people, and kill thousands, rape countless.

In North America, they killed 100 million native people since Colombus came.

Edited June 26, 2010 by bjre

[Wild Bill]

How retarded is this thread? Everybody in this thread thinks the OP is trying to talk about Tasers, and he's actually trying to talk about "group homes", "education", and his bizarre fixation with "CAS".

That's pretty retarded, IMO.

-k

Agreed! And that's not all that's retarded!

Where is it written that there MUST be a completely safe method of stopping someone who is being violent, for whatever reason? The reality is that at present, WE HAVE NO PHASER WITH A STUN SETTING!

Tazers never came with an iron clad guarantee. Leaving aside the stupidity of cops piling on multiple tazer hits, even one hit can kill someone with a weak heart or other medical problem, but what's the alternative?

If you have someone acting in a violent manner where he poses a threat to himself and/or others, the police have to do SOMETHING! Before tazers they had only their guns and their nightsticks. A nightstick can be swung hard or soft, at any number of body areas, to inflict differing amounts of pain depending on what was necessary in an officer's judgement. Of course, there will always be those "Deputy Dawg" types who are sadistic enough to indulge in overkill but most cops don't fall into that category. You will never have a perfect world.

No, a tazer is just another option that while not guaranteed to be absolutely safe is still likely to be a better choice in most cases than a billyclub or a bullet! In the real world, what more can we expect?

[bjre]

You will never have a perfect world.

That is not the reason to enjoy ugliness.

In the real world, what more can we expect?

If we could have better law system -- less greedy oriented laws, less people would feel mis-treated, less people would have anger, less people would have to be sent to group homes, less people would have "mental problems", less violence would exits, less chance would tasers be used.

[Molly]

It's not uncommon in some areas to hire the local roping club to run security. Drop a lasso on a troublemaker, and walk your horse away... the excitement is over without anyone getting hurt.

-------------------------------------------------

A 27-year-old in a group home is more likely to be a patient than a criminal.

It's not so long ago in the same region, that a young fellow who was completely peaceful but mentally challenged was shot to death by police, for the horrible crime of being excited about seeing a uniformed officer.

Clearly there's room for improvement in procedure. Harmless folk and people in need of assistance just shouldn't be ending up dead.

[Oleg Bach]

You would not use a cattle prod on a f**KING DOG! To use electric shock on people, degrades the dignity of all humans including the cops using them - either shoot the bastards dead on the spot or use your mind to contain a situation.

[Molly]

Anyone who has ever used a cattle prod knows that it's not an effective calming tool, and if that's what you expect when you use it, you are in for a dirty surprise.

[Wild Bill]

Here's another example of police stupidity with tazers:

http://rawstory.com/rs/2010/0625/officers-taser-86yearold-disabled-woman-bed-lawsuit/

"When Lonnie Tinsley of El Reno, Oklahoma, called 911 to ask for medical assistance for his disabled, bed-ridden grandmother, he couldn't have dreamed it would end with police tasering the 86-year-old woman twice, stepping on her oxygen hose until she couldn't breathe, and sending her to a psychiatric hospital for six days."

Yep, Oklahoma's finest tazered an 86 year old grannie in her bed!

Forget about the tool. Sometimes the craftsman needs meds!

[eyeball]

Of course,in the PRC they don't use tasers...

They make these net-guns in the PRC.

Perhaps these are too soft an approach for the excitable classes in Canada that are apparently clamoring for a meaner tougher vengeance-based criminal 'justice' system. Something that really cracks down on people as well as taking them down.

[Guest American Woman]

Here's another example of police stupidity with tazers:

http://rawstory.com/rs/2010/0625/officers-taser-86yearold-disabled-woman-bed-lawsuit/

"When Lonnie Tinsley of El Reno, Oklahoma, called 911 to ask for medical assistance for his disabled, bed-ridden grandmother, he couldn't have dreamed it would end with police tasering the 86-year-old woman twice, stepping on her oxygen hose until she couldn't breathe, and sending her to a psychiatric hospital for six days."

Yep, Oklahoma's finest tazered an 86 year old grannie in her bed!

Forget about the tool. Sometimes the craftsman needs meds!

Yeah, she looks pretty threatening, eh? pic

Unbelievable.

According to police, she pulled a kitchen knife from underneath her pillow. Of course the threat of her leaping out of bed and viciously attacking them with it was really scary, I'm sure.

I can't believe the family is only suing for $75,000. This is one instance where I think the cop should have the book thrown at him.