Hamas Violating Rules of War

[Shady]

JERUSALEM — Human Rights Watch charged Friday that Hamas militants are violating the rules of war by prohibiting a captive Israeli soldier from having contact with his family and the Red Cross.

The treatment of the 23-year-old soldier, captured exactly four years ago by Hamas, is "cruel and inhuman" and matches a U.N. definition of torture

AP

I thought the most damning comment was the fact that Human Rights Watch insists that Hamas' actions match the U.N. definition of torture. Although the fact that Hamas violates human rights shouldn't really be a shock to most people. This is the same group that straps explosives on children to have them march into Israel and blow themselves up in an effort to kill Israelis.

[M.Dancer]

I thought the most damning comment was the fact that Human Rights Watch insists that Hamas' actions match the U.N. definition of torture. Although the fact that Hamas violates human rights shouldn't really be a shock to most people. This is the same group that straps explosives on children to have them march into Israel and blow themselves up in an effort to kill Israelis.

Naomi has made no mention of this so it didn't happen.

[naomiglover]

I thought the most damning comment was the fact that Human Rights Watch insists that Hamas' actions match the U.N. definition of torture. Although the fact that Hamas violates human rights shouldn't really be a shock to most people.

It's not to anyone.

It's a good thing no one here has tried to excuse Hamas' violations of human rights.

It's too bad yourself, Dancer and many others have tried justifying and excusing human rights violations committed by Israel. Many of these violations have been reported by HRW.

Edited June 25, 2010 by naomiglover

[dre]

There must be some mistake! You guys always go on about how groups like HRW, the UN, etc are terrorist loving jew haters, that only see one side.

[bloodyminded]

There must be some mistake! You guys always go on about how groups like HRW, the UN, etc are terrorist loving jew haters, that only see one side.

Yes, but not many people, in the larger scheme, take such paranoid conspiracy theories seriously.

[segnosaur]

There must be some mistake! You guys always go on about how groups like HRW, the UN, etc are terrorist loving jew haters, that only see one side.

Yes, but not many people, in the larger scheme, take such paranoid conspiracy theories seriously.

Ummm... how about the comments by Robert Bernstien:

Human Rights Watch has lost critical perspective on a conflict in which Israel has been repeatedly attacked by Hamas and Hezbollah, organizations that go after Israeli citizens and use their own people as human shields. These groups are supported by the government of Iran, which has openly declared its intention not just to destroy Israel but to murder Jews everywhere.

...

Leaders of Human Rights Watch know that Hamas and Hezbollah chose to wage war from densely populated areas, deliberately transforming neighborhoods into battlefields. They know that more and better arms are flowing into both Gaza and Lebanon and are poised to strike again. And they know that this militancy continues to deprive Palestinians of any chance for the peaceful and productive life they deserve. Yet Israel, the repeated victim of aggression, faces the brunt of Human Rights Watch’s criticism.

(From: http://www.nytimes.com/2009/10/20/opinion/20bernstein.html?_r=2&em)

And who is Robert Bernstien? Some paranoid conspiracy believer? Some Israeli government mouthpiece? Well, actually he was one of the founders of Human Rights watch. Now, if the person who actually started HRW is the one criticizing it, people should take at least some notice.

Edited June 25, 2010 by segnosaur

[Guest American Woman]

There must be some mistake! You guys always go on about how groups like HRW, the UN, etc are terrorist loving jew haters, that only see one side.

If you google "Hamas violating human rights," this one incident is invariably what comes up. Then google "Israel violating human rights" and see what comes up. Then compare the two search results, and what you say "you guys always go on about" is pretty much confirmed as reality.

[dre]

If you google "Hamas violating human rights," this one incident is invariably what comes up. Then google "Israel violating human rights" and see what comes up. Then compare the two search results, and what you say "you guys always go on about" is pretty much confirmed as reality.

Then compare the two search results, and what you say "you guys always go on about" is pretty

much confirmed as reality.

Did you post that by accident? Heres my quote re: "you guys always go on about".

You guys always go on about how groups like HRW, the UN, etc are terrorist loving jew haters, that only see one side.

Is it SERIOUSLY your position that the comparison of the two internet searches you provided confirms that HRW are "terrorist loving jew haters" ?.

And both Israel and Hamas violate the EVER LOVING FUCK out of human rights.

[Jack Weber]

Ummm... how about the comments by Robert Bernstien:

Human Rights Watch has lost critical perspective on a conflict in which Israel has been repeatedly attacked by Hamas and Hezbollah, organizations that go after Israeli citizens and use their own people as human shields. These groups are supported by the government of Iran, which has openly declared its intention not just to destroy Israel but to murder Jews everywhere.

...

Leaders of Human Rights Watch know that Hamas and Hezbollah chose to wage war from densely populated areas, deliberately transforming neighborhoods into battlefields. They know that more and better arms are flowing into both Gaza and Lebanon and are poised to strike again. And they know that this militancy continues to deprive Palestinians of any chance for the peaceful and productive life they deserve. Yet Israel, the repeated victim of aggression, faces the brunt of Human Rights Watch’s criticism.

(From: http://www.nytimes.com/2009/10/20/opinion/20bernstein.html?_r=2&em)

And who is Robert Bernstien? Some paranoid conspiracy believer? Some Israeli government mouthpiece? Well, actually he was one of the founders of Human Rights watch. Now, if the person who actually started HRW is the one criticizing it, people should take at least some notice.

Whoa!!!!!

Wait a minute!!!!

I was upbraided by Ms.Glover,after I said that Hamas and Hezbollah(I also said Islamic Jihad..But...Y'know...Who's counting?)were being funded and armed by Iran.I was told that I was making no sense and that this was'nt happening...

And now I'm being informed,by Human Rights Watch no less,that this actually IS the case...

I was told that Iran and Syria were'nt using these organizations as proxies to fight a war with Israel...Yet it seems that Human Rights Watch has confirmed these things...

Curious....

[Guest American Woman]

Did you post that by accident? Heres my quote re: "you guys always go on about".

You guys always go on about how groups like HRW, the UN, etc are terrorist loving jew haters, that only see one side.

Is it SERIOUSLY your position that the comparison of the two internet searches you provided confirms that HRW are "terrorist loving jew haters" ?.

And both Israel and Hamas violate the EVER LOVING FUCK out of human rights.

I have to admit, I gave you the benefit of the doubt and didn't take your hyperbole at face value. Now I'm wondering if you actually SERIOUSLY meant what you said, and I'm afraid you did. In which case, your post didn't deserve a response.

But have an EVER LOVING FUCK of a good day all the same.

[bloodyminded]

Ummm... how about the comments by Robert Bernstien:

Human Rights Watch has lost critical perspective on a conflict in which Israel has been repeatedly attacked by Hamas and Hezbollah, organizations that go after Israeli citizens and use their own people as human shields. These groups are supported by the government of Iran, which has openly declared its intention not just to destroy Israel but to murder Jews everywhere.

...

Leaders of Human Rights Watch know that Hamas and Hezbollah chose to wage war from densely populated areas, deliberately transforming neighborhoods into battlefields. They know that more and better arms are flowing into both Gaza and Lebanon and are poised to strike again. And they know that this militancy continues to deprive Palestinians of any chance for the peaceful and productive life they deserve. Yet Israel, the repeated victim of aggression, faces the brunt of Human Rights Watch’s criticism.

(From: http://www.nytimes.com/2009/10/20/opinion/20bernstein.html?_r=2&em)

And who is Robert Bernstien? Some paranoid conspiracy believer? Some Israeli government mouthpiece? Well, actually he was one of the founders of Human Rights watch. Now, if the person who actually started HRW is the one criticizing it, people should take at least some notice.

I think you missed the argument here, and my response to it. I sure hope so, because otherwise we're in a real ugly fanatsy world, certainly not of my choosing.

Are you really going to insist, and using Bernstien's criticisms as evidence, that HRW is a bunch of "terrorist-loving Jew-haters"?

Because that's what we were talking about, and that's the hilarious premise which you are now defending.

[Borg]

I thought the most damning comment was the fact that Human Rights Watch insists that Hamas' actions match the U.N. definition of torture. Although the fact that Hamas violates human rights shouldn't really be a shock to most people. This is the same group that straps explosives on children to have them march into Israel and blow themselves up in an effort to kill Israelis.

No - tell me it ain't so!

Well I am sure there will be many apologists here that will categorically state it is ok because Israel ... blah, blah, blah.

However when the shoe is on the other foot they scream foul.

After all it is the canucklehead way

Borg

[Machjo]

It's not to anyone.

It's a good thing no one here has tried to excuse Hamas' violations of human rights.

It's too bad yourself, Dancer and many others have tried justifying and excusing human rights violations committed by Israel. Many of these violations have been reported by HRW.

I think this is precisely the issue. Most agree that Hamas ought to abide by international law, such such threads really become a non-issue, preaching to the quire so to speak.

The reason Israel threads abound though is because so many actually defend Israel's right to defy international law, usually on ostentatiously religious grounds which in reality have no foundation in religion but rather in blind nationalism.

Certainly to be fair, all ought to abide by the same rules of international law, no? So just as we must applaud any critical report on Hamas violating international law, so we must do the same for Israel if we are in fact fair and balanced. Unfortunately though that's seldom the case.

[Machjo]

There must be some mistake! You guys always go on about how groups like HRW, the UN, etc are terrorist loving jew haters, that only see one side.

Oops!

[Machjo]

No - tell me it ain't so!

Well I am sure there will be many apologists here that will categorically state it is ok because Israel ... blah, blah, blah.

However when the shoe is on the other foot they scream foul.

After all it is the canucklehead way

Borg

I have come across people who will defend Hamas' violations of international law against Israel on the grounds that if Israel can do so, then why not Hamas? And I've come across many defending Israel's violations of international law against Palestinians on the same grounds. I say both sides are wrong and I'm also a 'Canucklehead'. go figure.

In my view, two wrongs don't make a right. Israel's violations of international law are wrong regardless of what Hamas is doing. And Hamas' violations of human rights are wrong regardless of what Israel is doing. In the end, they are both wrong, and neither should wait for the other to abide by international law before it does. Instead, they should both be racing to be the first to abide by international laws. The first to do so will win the moral war, after which the second would quickly feel the heat. The problem is there are too many on both sides defending the illegal acts of their favorite side.

[bush_cheney2004]

.... The first to do so will win the moral war, after which the second would quickly feel the heat. The problem is there are too many on both sides defending the illegal acts of their favorite side.

No, the reality is that your "moral war" doesn't count for much in this conflict. But I realize that "moral wars" are paramount to "Canuckleheads", even when they are anything but.

[Machjo]

No, the reality is that your "moral war" doesn't count for much in this conflict. But I realize that "moral wars" are paramount to "Canuckleheads", even when they are anything but.

So you think it's OK for Israel to violate international law because Hamas does so? I'd say it's not Ok for either to do so. But that's just me.

[bush_cheney2004]

So you think it's OK for Israel to violate international law because Hamas does so? I'd say it's not Ok for either to do so. But that's just me.

"International law" means next to nothing in this specific context, not only because of what such law actually is/is not, but how it is enforced. Trying to moderate Israel's actions by saying Hamas is a "bad dog" too is laughable.

[Guest American Woman]

So you think it's OK for Israel to violate international law because Hamas does so? I'd say it's not Ok for either to do so. But that's just me.

Yeah, and I'd say sometimes you have to fight fire with fire, "international law" be damned.

I used to be all about international law and the UN, until I realized what the UN has ignored and what the UN has prioritized. It's bull.

[dre]

Yeah, and I'd say sometimes you have to fight fire with fire, "international law" be damned.

I used to be all about international law and the UN, until I realized what the UN has ignored and what the UN has prioritized. It's bull.

Its true. The UN has been incredibly bias towards Israel and hasnt done a gawd damn thing to help the palestinians.

[naomiglover]

Yeah, and I'd say sometimes you have to fight fire with fire, "international law" be damned.

So then you are okay with Hamas' rocket attacks and suicide bombings in the past.

Thank you for giving your position.

[Guest American Woman]

Its true. The UN has been incredibly bias towards Israel and hasnt done a gawd damn thing to help the palestinians.

It's not all about the Israel-Palestine conflict, believe it or not. I was referring to all of the atrocities that have gone on in the world, and continue to go on. It's bull, as I said, and I have no faith in the organization nor in a world court/international law. I can now understand why some would want nothing to do with any of it.

[segnosaur]

Its true. The UN has been incredibly bias towards Israel and hasnt done a gawd damn thing to help the palestinians.

How can you say that?

The U.N. gave a job to Awad al-Qiq, a respected Palestinian educator!

Of course, al-Qig also spent his free time building rockets to fire at Israeli schools and other civilians, but he was an employed terrorist gosh darn it! Shouldn't that count for something?

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSL05686115

[Guest American Woman]

So then you are okay with Hamas' rocket attacks and suicide bombings in the past.

Thank you for giving your position.

I didn't say I was "okay" with any of what's taken place, but thanks for drawing your usual moronic conclusions regarding what MY position is.

[dre]

How can you say that?

The U.N. gave a job to Awad al-Qiq, a respected Palestinian educator!

Of course, al-Qig also spent his free time building rockets to fire at Israeli schools and other civilians, but he was an employed terrorist gosh darn it! Shouldn't that count for something?

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSL05686115

Because its blatantly true. The UN is probably the most anti-palestinian group in the world. Time after time they proclaim that its illegal for Israel to occupy palestinian land, build their own settlements, and pump out 80% of their valuable natural resources. But at the end of the day they do absolutely nothing to enforce their own laws. They just sit on their hands while more land gets colonized and thats about the most anti palestinian thing possible.

The UN helped create Israel, and since then as given them a FREE PASS and let them do whatever they want. I dont even think its possible for UN to act in a MORE pro-Israeli position than they have.