Yesterday Posted June 10, 2010 Report Posted June 10, 2010 I said Medical insurance maybe put your reading glasses on, it is called Medicare you might want to read about it. The government took it over in ever province following the CCF's (NDP's) example in Saskatchewan. It is like you live in 1940 or missed the last 60 years. The conservatives support it (In fact they help bring it in with Diefenbaker) so if you think it is socialism I suggest you leave the party. I've definately missed most of the last 60 years. Giggle. Quote
Jack Weber Posted June 10, 2010 Report Posted June 10, 2010 OK reading Punked last message, I am still missing something. Brains, maybe....perhaps I should ask where on the grid does the Social Credit Theory sit. I realize that I am being redundant with this theory but it is the only socialist platform I am at all familiar with so it is my starting point in understanding the Canadian version of Socialism. Sort of a mixture of socialism and democracy touted by both the Liberals and the NDP and the Green Party too at varying degrees. Are the Liberals merely demanding the NDP adhere to their own version of socialism or what are the Liberals? The Social Credit party is'nt socialist,or on the left...It's a form of conservativism...Right of centre... Quote The beatings will continue until morale improves!!!
M.Dancer Posted June 10, 2010 Author Report Posted June 10, 2010 Dancer...You just entered Joe McCarthy Whackville.... Give it a rest. Taking away the rights of propert owners is a real policy that the NDP still clings to and one that does not endear itself to mainstream canadians. Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
Jack Weber Posted June 10, 2010 Report Posted June 10, 2010 Give it a rest. Taking away the rights of propert owners is a real policy that the NDP still clings to and one that does not endear itself to mainstream canadians. You give it a rest with the Chavez/Commie crap... It's over the top and you know it.... Quote The beatings will continue until morale improves!!!
punked Posted June 10, 2010 Report Posted June 10, 2010 Nationalizing private property is not repudiating socialism...nor is it particularly Canadian...unless Huga chaxez is now a Blue Jays booster... So you will not be voting for the Conservatives this time around because they support Medicare, and Nationalized health insurance plan? The NDP also helped "nationalize" car insurance in many provinces and the Conservatives which came after them (Social Credit, Conservatives, Liberal and Sask Party) all support those industries. Those are Canadian and if you don't like it again their are countries out their where the public does not have ownership of industry. The public owning or operating industry is not inherently Socialist and that seems like an idea you don't understand. Maybe it is because you refuse to or that you are stuck in 1940 and know nothing of what has happened in this country over the last 70 years but you are being silly. Quote
punked Posted June 10, 2010 Report Posted June 10, 2010 Give it a rest. Taking away the rights of propert owners is a real policy that the NDP still clings to and one that does not endear itself to mainstream canadians. The conservatives did it with their National hospitable plan under Deif, they must be Socialists. That is seriously your argument. You think Canada is Socialist because you have no concept of what it means. Canada has a mixed economy get over it. Quote
M.Dancer Posted June 10, 2010 Author Report Posted June 10, 2010 The conservatives did it with their National hospitable plan under Deif, they must be Socialists. That is seriously your argument. You think Canada is Socialist because you have no concept of what it means. Canada has a mixed economy get over it. How many hospitals did they nationalize? Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
Yesterday Posted June 10, 2010 Report Posted June 10, 2010 The Social Credit party is'nt socialist,or on the left...It's a form of conservativism...Right of centre... Well, my goodness, this most definately clears some fog. Thank-you. I can not believe that what I read in that journal is conservative. I can't see any connection with that to Harper's government. You know, I feel like I can go back and read a few things with pleasure because now it might make more sense. Really? Conservative? Although, now that you mention it the Dollar Refunding Program and the Federal Counsel on Climate Change seem to make alot more sense as to direction and Harper is all over those. Can you smell the gear oil? Giggle. Thanks. Quote
M.Dancer Posted June 10, 2010 Author Report Posted June 10, 2010 Canada has a mixed economy get over it. Yes we have a mixed economy....resources, financial services, agriculture.... Aside from the CBC, VIA and the post office, how many businesses that could be private are owned by the government? As a % of the GDP.... Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
Jack Weber Posted June 10, 2010 Report Posted June 10, 2010 Yes we have a mixed economy....resources, financial services, agriculture.... Aside from the CBC, VIA and the post office, how many businesses that could be private are owned by the government? As a % of the GDP.... Mixed economy does'nt just mean public ownership...certain regulatory intervention into the free market is another form of this... Quote The beatings will continue until morale improves!!!
punked Posted June 10, 2010 Report Posted June 10, 2010 How many hospitals did they nationalize? That is not what we are talking about. You said this statement is socialist. "extend public ownership wherever it is necessary for the achievement of these objectives." NO WHERE IN THE WINNIPEG Declaration does it talk about Nationalization. You can't change the words written by a party you don't belong to and know nothing about 55 years ago SORRY. You are dead wrong. No one wants to nationalize anything. Only three times has industry been nationalized in Canada as far as I know. Once under Robert Bordon and the Conservatives. When they had to buy the rail road because it went bankrupt, once by the Liberals in Quebec with Hydro-Québec, and once by the NDP in Sask with Pot Ash. So don't play high and mighty. Quote
M.Dancer Posted June 10, 2010 Author Report Posted June 10, 2010 (edited) Mixed economy does'nt just mean public ownership...certain regulatory intervention into the free market is another form of this... That is sort of a non sequitor...governments regulating enterprise predates socialism by about 2500 years... mixed economy doesn't necessarily mean public ownership and private enterprise...that's a canard..like the NDP calling itself progressive Edited June 10, 2010 by M.Dancer Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
Jack Weber Posted June 10, 2010 Report Posted June 10, 2010 That is sort of a non sequitor...governments regulating enterprise predates socialism by about 2500 years... mixed economy doesn't necessarily mean public ownership and private enterprise...that's a canard..like the NDP calling itself progressive Wait a minute...Banking regulation could be construed as intervention into the free market,yet one would be hard pressed to call it socialism... Quote The beatings will continue until morale improves!!!
M.Dancer Posted June 10, 2010 Author Report Posted June 10, 2010 That is not what we are talking about. You said this statement is socialist. "extend public ownership wherever it is necessary for the achievement of these objectives." Correct NO WHERE IN THE WINNIPEG Declaration does it talk about Nationalization. What, pray tell does extend punlic ownership mean then if not nationalization? Habe I misunderstood this for so long, that the NDP have really been talking about increasing the number of IPO and multiplying the number of public companies on the TSX? Try to answer that without sophistry....and I await the citation regarding the % of our GDP derived form state owned industry... Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
punked Posted June 10, 2010 Report Posted June 10, 2010 Yes we have a mixed economy....resources, financial services, agriculture.... Aside from the CBC, VIA and the post office, how many businesses that could be private are owned by the government? As a % of the GDP.... Are you kidding me? No one said that government should own all business. The less the better but their are something that are so big and that are so tied to the public good the government should own them. In every province all power corps started out as crown investments and most provinces still own them. Pot ash, Canadian energy (or what every the atomic nuclear thing is called), Car insurance, Farm credit, the list is pretty long. In fact EXPORT DEVELOPMENT CANADA which is crown crop does business which is directly responsible for roughly 4% of Canada's GDP. Quote
Yesterday Posted June 10, 2010 Report Posted June 10, 2010 Thank-you for humouring my slightly off topic questions. I end this day knowing more than when it started. Good night folks. Quote
M.Dancer Posted June 10, 2010 Author Report Posted June 10, 2010 Wait a minute...Banking regulation could be construed as intervention into the free market,yet one would be hard pressed to call it socialism... Correct. The NDP at one time wanted to nationalize a bank....some in the NDP still do... Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
Topaz Posted June 10, 2010 Report Posted June 10, 2010 Correct... But,Layton and the current Dip braintrust,feels that things like the same sex marriage issue is a "human right"...No it's not!...It's a choice between a heterosexual man and woman. Hey, did you know that there is a high up Tory that believes in same -sex marriage and vote in a provincial government for that freedom? Quote
Jack Weber Posted June 10, 2010 Report Posted June 10, 2010 Thank-you for humouring my slightly off topic questions. I end this day knowing more than when it started. Good night folks. No problemo.... Quote The beatings will continue until morale improves!!!
M.Dancer Posted June 10, 2010 Author Report Posted June 10, 2010 Potash, insurance are two that should be privatized immediatley. Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
punked Posted June 10, 2010 Report Posted June 10, 2010 Correct What, pray tell does extend punlic ownership mean then if not nationalization? Habe I misunderstood this for so long, that the NDP have really been talking about increasing the number of IPO and multiplying the number of public companies on the TSX? Try to answer that without sophistry....and I await the citation regarding the % of our GDP derived form state owned industry... The problem is you aren't reading. It doesn't say extend public ownership it says, "extend public ownership wherever it is necessary for the achievement of these objectives." Which is different. We did "extend public ownership wherever it is necessary for the achievement of these objectives." It was called Medicare. It was the right thing to do and Canadians support the Conservative party supports it. Sometimes public ownership needs to be extended, sometimes the government getting involved is a good thing. That is not socialism. Please read the whole Winnipeg declaration not 4 words in the middle of sentence with out paying any attention to the sentence or the paragraph or the paper it is in. Quote
Jack Weber Posted June 10, 2010 Report Posted June 10, 2010 Correct. The NDP at one time wanted to nationalize a bank....some in the NDP still do... "sigh" Are you suggesting the current banking regulatory regime in place in this country is inherently Socialist? Because that is an intervention into the free market.... Quote The beatings will continue until morale improves!!!
Jack Weber Posted June 10, 2010 Report Posted June 10, 2010 Hey, did you know that there is a high up Tory that believes in same -sex marriage and vote in a provincial government for that freedom? Not a Tory.... Don't care.... Quote The beatings will continue until morale improves!!!
punked Posted June 10, 2010 Report Posted June 10, 2010 Mixed economy does'nt just mean public ownership...certain regulatory intervention into the free market is another form of this... It certainly does mean public ownership. Quote
punked Posted June 10, 2010 Report Posted June 10, 2010 Potash, insurance are two that should be privatized immediatley. Great call the CONSERVATIVE government in Sask who supports the crown corp and tell them. Quote
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