Smallc Posted March 14, 2010 Report Share Posted March 14, 2010 I don't think you understand the impact of taxes on retail prices. Go buy some gas and report back. I'm talking about the retail price before tax. That is higher in Canada. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted March 14, 2010 Report Share Posted March 14, 2010 I'm talking about the retail price before tax. That is higher in Canada. No kidding...but wait...its gets worse: the federal government and some provincial governments (Newfoundland and Labrador, Nova Scotia, and Quebec) collect sales tax (GST and PST) on top of the retail price and the excise taxes There is rumour of a "carbon tax" in BC as well! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted March 14, 2010 Report Share Posted March 14, 2010 I'm not sure what your point is. Canadians all know about the tax that we pay. My point was that wages and income tax are coming into Canada's favour. The same is true for corporate tax. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted March 14, 2010 Report Share Posted March 14, 2010 I'm not sure what your point is. Canadians all know about the tax that we pay. My point was that wages and income tax are coming into Canada's favour. The same is true for corporate tax. Of course...for you...there is always getting better....each day....little by little. Pay no attention to the many years of disparity in the past...look only...to tomorrow. This makes sense for a 21 year old.....but doesn't work so well for everybody with more time in the pond. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted March 14, 2010 Report Share Posted March 14, 2010 Ah, so that's what this is all about; your insecurity about the future of the US. Nice for you to let everyone know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyly Posted March 14, 2010 Report Share Posted March 14, 2010 US rates (including coming increases) for comparison. What makes the differences is the lower state rates, but that does not take into consideration the differences in service. If I were living in Alberta, talking simply about taxes, I would have paid as much in total tax (both federal and provincial) as I would have paid in the US federal tax alone: but if you lived in Alberta you wouldn't pay any sales tax...and that's a good point about quality of service...I don't object to paying tax if I'm getting something back be it better schools, highway upkeep or whatever...I could move to some 3rd world country and pay no tax but there wouldn't be schools/universities for my kids, paved roads, sanitation systems, healthcare, security or what I consider basic standards of living.... I've done a bit of traveling and from what I've seen we have a very good return on our tax dollar... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted March 14, 2010 Report Share Posted March 14, 2010 Ah, so that's what this is all about; your insecurity about the future of the US. Nice for you to let everyone know. No, I am quite secure in the future (and past) of the "US". But it has become clear to me that you only have a very short time horizon, through no fault of your own. It affects your perspective on things, having never really faced uncertainty as an adult. For instance, we know that Canada sat at the brink of fiscal collapse long before Greece or Iceland...back in the ancient decade of the 90's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted March 14, 2010 Report Share Posted March 14, 2010 (edited) Even in the early 90's, Canada didn't have the debt burden of Greece or Italy. At 70% of GDP, it was much closer to what the US is currently facing....the difference is, we raised taxes and cut spending to fix it. I don't see the political will for either thing in the US right now. Don't think just because I look at the future with optimism, I'm somehow ignorant of history. Edited March 14, 2010 by Smallc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted March 14, 2010 Report Share Posted March 14, 2010 Even in the early 90's, Canada didn't have the debt burden of Greece or Italy. At 70% of GDP, it was much closer to what the US is currently facing....the difference is, we raised taxes and cut spending to fix it. I don't see the political will for either thing in the US right now. No matter....the point being that you are conditioned to embrace such taxes and defend them vigorously without having experienced the full burden on income and spending over a lifetime. Others have, and it influences their choices. Raising taxes would be consistent with Canadians paying more, as we have asserted all along. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted March 14, 2010 Report Share Posted March 14, 2010 Don't think just because I look at the future with optimism, I'm somehow ignorant of history. Ignorance of history is different from an ignorance of experience. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wild Bill Posted March 14, 2010 Report Share Posted March 14, 2010 No matter....the point being that you are conditioned to embrace such taxes and defend them vigorously without having experienced the full burden on income and spending over a lifetime. Others have, and it influences their choices. Raising taxes would be consistent with Canadians paying more, as we have asserted all along. The emotional tone of some arguments is starting to get rather sad, BC! Once again, Canadian pride excuses evidence or reason. Another page or two of posts and we'll have some folks claiming we Canadians have a HIGHER living standard than the Americans! Or MORE disposable income! Meanwhile, I suggest you would get a truer opinion from any of the thousands of housewives who regularly crossborder shop. While you're talking to them, please note that the American customs agents searching cars coming INTO the USA find very few groceries, or new Canadian tires on the car, or Canadian gas in the tank, or shoes, or power tools, or tvs and dvd players, or booze, or disposable diapers...on and on and on! Somehow, you can be well-versed in history but you need the actual life experience of having to pay for feeding and raising a family to appreciate these matters in your gut! It's the difference between someone schooled in the real world and an academic. The academic might have similar amounts of items of data but hasn't the same sense of the intensity of how some data bits affect one's life compared to others. I still remember in the early 90's going with my wife on one of her trips. While there I bought some pipe tobacco, given that was one of my vices, long ago. At the time I was paying nearly $12 Cdn for a 1 ounce pouch. I bought a couple of 12 ounce bulk packages for $11 each American! I couldn't help but laugh at the irony. Do the math. There was far more profit in smuggling that pipe tobacco than marijuana, given the prices at the time! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted March 14, 2010 Report Share Posted March 14, 2010 (edited) Another page or two of posts and we'll have some folks claiming we Canadians have a HIGHER living standard than the Americans! Or MORE disposable income! Not today, but if the trend holds, then it won't be long until we do.....standard of living is rather fuzzy though seeing as we don't have a poverty line. The reality is, the gap in prices between Canada and the US is shrinking. The reality is Canadians are getting richer faster. I'm not using an emotional tone, I've read every one of these things and I can find cites for most of them.....you're basing things on your experience. and that sounds far more emotional to me. And I really don't care how high our sin taxes are.... Edited March 14, 2010 by Smallc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Born Free Posted March 14, 2010 Report Share Posted March 14, 2010 ....I wonder what Sarah Palin would have to say about all this banter.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daniel Posted March 14, 2010 Report Share Posted March 14, 2010 ....I wonder what Sarah Palin would have to say about all this banter.... I think she would say something like "it's my body and my health and I have the right to choose without any third party dictating what I should do." I think Sarah is now pro-choice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyly Posted March 14, 2010 Report Share Posted March 14, 2010 And I really don't care how high our sin taxes are.... I'm all for raising sin taxes...same for gas tax, I don't like it but the less I drive the less I pay... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Born Free Posted March 14, 2010 Report Share Posted March 14, 2010 (edited) I think she would say something like "it's my body and my health and I have the right to choose without any third party dictating what I should do." I think Sarah is now pro-choice. Does that mean she gets to choose what "death panel" she wants? Edited March 14, 2010 by Born Free Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest American Woman Posted March 14, 2010 Report Share Posted March 14, 2010 Not today, but if the trend holds, then it won't be long until we do.....standard of living is rather fuzzy though seeing as we don't have a poverty line. The reality is, the gap in prices between Canada and the US is shrinking. The reality is Canadians are getting richer faster. I'm not using an emotional tone, I've read every one of these things and I can find cites for most of them.....you're basing things on your experience. and that sounds far more emotional to me. And I really don't care how high our sin taxes are.... For the record, basing things on experience isn't "emotional," it's reality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted March 14, 2010 Report Share Posted March 14, 2010 ....I still remember in the early 90's going with my wife on one of her trips. While there I bought some pipe tobacco, given that was one of my vices, long ago. At the time I was paying nearly $12 Cdn for a 1 ounce pouch. I bought a couple of 12 ounce bulk packages for $11 each American! Now that's what I'm talkin' 'bout....how do the kids say....keepin' it real! Yours is a perspective that is richer because of time and experience...as is mine (near International Falls)....Canadians with money to spend are always welcomed. Border communities have their own micro economies that persist because real people want to make smart consumer choices....the border is just an annoying pain in the ass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted March 14, 2010 Report Share Posted March 14, 2010 For the record, basing things on experience isn't "emotional," it's reality. It's a very narrow circumstantial reality...and experience often has a great deal of emotion attached, something that raw data does not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest American Woman Posted March 14, 2010 Report Share Posted March 14, 2010 It's a very narrow circumstantial reality...and experience often has a great deal of emotion attached, something that raw data does not. And reality often has a great deal of reality attached, something that raw data does not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted March 14, 2010 Report Share Posted March 14, 2010 (edited) Experience is all about one person's perceptions. I would say it isn't about reality at all, and if it is, it's about a very particular reality. Making an argument about an entire system from a single person's (or even multiple people's) experience isn't really much of an argument. Edited March 14, 2010 by Smallc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest American Woman Posted March 14, 2010 Report Share Posted March 14, 2010 (edited) Experience is all about one persons perceptions. I would say it isn't about reality at all, and if it is, it's about a very particular reality. That's where you're wrong. People here have lived a variety of "realities," and while you have never been anything but 21 or younger, we have been 21 and younger and older. I don't fault you for it. With age comes wisdom. But if you're not willing to listen to experience, you'll be the loser for it. Edited March 14, 2010 by American Woman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted March 14, 2010 Report Share Posted March 14, 2010 That's where you're wrong. People here have lived a variety of "realities," and while you have never been anything but 21 or younger, we have been 21 and younger and older. I don't fault you for it. With age comes wisdom. But if you're not willing to listen to experience, you'll be the loser for it. Save the condescending attitude. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest American Woman Posted March 14, 2010 Report Share Posted March 14, 2010 Save the condescending attitude. Nothing condescending about it. It's the truth. If you see it as condescending, you have more to learn than I would have thought. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted March 14, 2010 Report Share Posted March 14, 2010 No, it is condescending...well, you're only 21, so you don't know any better, is what you're telling me. No matter what I argue, you can tell me that I simply don't know because I haven't experienced it. I don't accept that in this case. I've provided income information. I've provided taxation information. I've provided (right now) price differential information. You've dismissed most of it, but it's the only thing we have to go on, other than...experience. Quite frankly, when I provide hard facts that tell me something, I don't really put much stock in the experience of others, because against such facts, it's meaningless. That's not to say that experience is unimportant, but in the face of actual hard data, when we are discussing an entire system or indeed in this case, an entire society, it's rather meaningless. Price differential info: http://www.thestar.com/Business/article/673837 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.