Canadian Political Polls

[wyly]

And now we have the race to Google. Nothing in any of that polling suggested the West was going to split away if the Coalition took over. I realize this was one of your vapid talking points during that period, but come on, it's time to admit there ain't the numbers to secede. Time to get off that fantasy cloud of yours.

any visit to google and you find all this supposed support come from sites pushing for independence, wacko's...they've done very unscientific polls by visting ultra conservative rural hamlets where the support lies among the poorly educated...among the more worldly sophisticated urbanites it's not even a topic of discussion...in the 10 years I've lived in Calgary I've never once heard it mentioned in daily coffeeshop chatter, it's just not on the radar at all...

[Alta4ever]

And now we have the race to Google. Nothing in any of that polling suggested the West was going to split away if the Coalition took over. I realize this was one of your vapid talking points during that period, but come on, it's time to admit there ain't the numbers to secede. Time to get off that fantasy cloud of yours.

You don't seem to get it do you this isn't about whether or not its going to happen now, its about whether that feeling lingers. I have proven the sentiment is here and that it isn't just a fringe group that thinks this way. Depending on how and what the future brings will dictate which way that support goes up or down. The fact that 40%+ of the Alberta population would even consider separation is a devastating number.

So again this is the message we are tired of being the Countries slaves we want this country to be amended so that it is not ruled by the tyranny of the majority, we want every region to have an equal say in government. We want each province to have the same per capita representation. AS it sits right now, Quebec and Ontario have the seats to dictate their will on the rest of Canada. Their is no check to this power.

[ToadBrother]

any visit to google and you find all this supposed support come from sites pushing for independence, wacko's...they've done very unscientific polls by visting ultra conservative rural hamlets where the support lies among the poorly educated...among the more worldly sophisticated urbanites it's not even a topic of discussion...in the 10 years I've lived in Calgary I've never once heard it mentioned in daily coffeeshop chatter, it's just not on the radar at all...

Instead he picks a National Post article that just talks about Westerners being angry. He knows enough not to feed us one of those whacky Western separatist websites, so he's stuck trying to make an article that says one thing sound like it's insinuating another.

That's Google's big flaw. It won't invent information for you

[Smallc]

I can't find any poll since then.

The last two Globe and Mail Canada Day polls. in 2008, Albertan's rated Canada 9 out of 10, the highest in Canada.

I can't find that poll, but the 2009 question related to Canada being the best country in the world is interesting. So is the one about being more united...a majority agree with both...especially when it comes to being best in the world.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/canada-day-poll/article1202798/

Edited February 4, 2010 by Smallc

[wyly]

Instead he picks a National Post article that just talks about Westerners being angry. He knows enough not to feed us one of those whacky Western separatist websites, so he's stuck trying to make an article that says one thing sound like it's insinuating another.

That's Google's big flaw. It won't invent information for you

ya...I had teacher growing up in Sask and he was big on teaching us about the evil easterners, I believed it...growing up I figured out it was irrational petty politics, people love to whine about anything it's human nature...

[Alta4ever]

any visit to google and you find all this supposed support come from sites pushing for independence, wacko's...they've done very unscientific polls by visting ultra conservative rural hamlets where the support lies among the poorly educated...among the more worldly sophisticated urbanites it's not even a topic of discussion...in the 10 years I've lived in Calgary I've never once heard it mentioned in daily coffeeshop chatter, it's just not on the radar at all...

Have I linked to any of those sites..... no

Have you brought the subject up. I have heard it in Calgary, I have heard it in rural alberta, how often do you travel this province how often do you leave your bubble. I am in Edmonton and Calgary on a bi weekly basis, I am in Central Alberta Almost as often Southern Alberta by monthly and Norther Alberta Semi Annually, just how in touch are you? Hell I even get to hear what neighboring provinces think semi annually since I am each of the western provinces every six months. I also get to see all types and ages since my job has me interacting with many people. I need to know whats going on politically and economically as both have a substantial impact on my industry, and ultimately my job.

So take your condescending attitude and shove it.

[Smallc]

We want each province to have the same per capita representation. AS it sits right now, Quebec and Ontario have the seats to dictate their will on the rest of Canada. Their is no check to this power.

What? You say one thing, and then the opposite. With the same per capita representation, Quebec and Ontario should have the most say, and as I said already, Ontario doesn't have enough.

[Smallc]

ya...I had teacher growing up in Sask and he was big on teaching us about the evil easterners, I believed it...growing up I figured out it was irrational petty politics, people love to whine about anything it's human nature...

Couldn't agree more. I had the same exact experiences.

[ToadBrother]

Have I linked to any of those sites..... no

Have you brought the subject up. I have heard it in Calgary, I have heard it in rural alberta, how often do you travel this province how often do you leave your bubble. I am in Edmonton and Calgary on a bi weekly basis, I am in Central Alberta Almost as often Southern Alberta by monthly and Norther Alberta Semi Annually, just how in touch are you? Hell I even get to hear what neighboring provinces think semi annually since I am each of the western provinces every six months. I also get to see all types and ages since my job has me interacting with many people. I need to know whats going on politically and economically as both have a substantial impact on my industry, and ultimately my job.

So take your condescending attitude and shove it.

And now, having had Google fail him so much, he resorts to anecdotes that, he assures us in the strongest terms, represent the majority of Alberta's feelings on Confederation.

I mean, where do you guy from here, Alta4ever? An alien abduction where Elvis assures you during the anal probe that Alberta wants out of Canada?

[Alta4ever]

Look, you're the one that made daft claims about Alberta seceding by 2015. Don't get all sore because folks called your bluff. If you think the only way you can win an argument is by getting all red faced, tears welling in your eyes as you declare "You guys are jerks, I'm goin' home and never playin' with you again", waddya expect?

Grow up. Harper ain't Jesus Christ and Alberta ain't separating.

Its not about winning an argument you moron its about having your voice heard and not having opinions just dismissed.

As for your comments on Harper being Christ get bent. No one here has made that statement.

Go on be fool and keep feeding the fires of discontent in Alberta. For being on the open minded side of political spectrum you people seem to be very close minded, unenlightened, ignorant, condescending fools. But you know a national Day care program will solve all of the countries regional problems.

[Smallc]

So, no comment on the Canada Day polls then...interesting.

[Alta4ever]

What? You say one thing, and then the opposite. With the same per capita representation, Quebec and Ontario should have the most say, and as I said already, Ontario doesn't have enough.

No I don't each province should have equal per capita representation meaning each riding no matter where in Canada should be made up for example of 100,000 people. Our second house ie the senate should be the balance against the tyranny of majority ie each region gets 30 elected senators. Example Atlantic Canada 30 senators, the west 30 senators, central Canada 30 senators. Now you have a balance of power. Those with the Majority of the people have a say that reflects the will of the popluation, then in the senate you have the balance against that tyranny of majority.

Or do we not understand what the tyranny of a majority is, but I would think that such good students of Canadian Charter of Rights would understand this conept, as the charter was suppose to be designed to take the tyranny of majoirty away so that the rights of an indivdual would not be impeded.

What do you they teach in school now? Since you can't get such simple concepts.

[ToadBrother]

Its not about winning an argument you moron its about having your voice heard and not having opinions just dismissed.

As for your comments on Harper being Christ get bent. No one here has made that statement.

Go on be fool and keep feeding the fires of discontent in Alberta. For being on the open minded side of political spectrum you people seem to be very close minded, unenlightened, ignorant, condescending fools. But you know a national Day care program will solve all of the countries regional problems.

And to close off this delightful non-debate on Alberta separatism, Alta4ever wings out that "When we leave, it'll be all your fault!", along with some strange non sequitur about National Day Care, a program I don't recall ever having commented on. Worse of all, Alta4ever, being in the "Harper is my personal Jesus" camp, is incapable of seeing any criticism of his positions coming from anyone but a Liberal (or possibly an NDPer).

As I have repeatedly pointed out, I don't belong to any political party, don't really support any of them (for various reasons), and I can assuredly tell you that I'm not anxious to see my tax bill hiked to pay for a program that no one saw fit to put in place when my kids were young, and my wife and I could have used it (that goes for that stupid daycare credit the Tories pushed through too).

[Alta4ever]

So, no comment on the Canada Day polls then...interesting.

It showed Albertans at 42% support of separation it was interesting. 35% of Western Canada if favour of separating, it was very interesting indeed, but thewn again that was the poll It was referring too in the beginning. IF Western Canada is so happy about confederation wouldn't the separation question generate less then ten percent support that would then leave only the wacky fringe wouldn't it. Or is anything less then 50% wacky fringe support.

[Smallc]

Example Atlantic Canada 30 senators, the west 30 senators, central Canada 30 senators. Now you have a balance of power. Those with the Majority of the people have a say that reflects the will of the popluation, then in the senate you have the balance against that tyranny of majority.

Or, we could just leave it like it is. The West 24, Ontario 24, Quebec 24, Maritime 24....and Newfoundland and Labrador (the only real problem) 6. The effort required to make the very small change you're asking for (which will only take away power from Quebec and Ontario, which seems to be your purpose) is not worth what may be a negative outcome.

[Smallc]

IF Western Canada is so happy about confederation

Western Canada is. They rate Canada as the best country in the world with an overwhelming majority.

[ToadBrother]

Or do we not understand what the tyranny of a majority is, but I would think that such good students of Canadian Charter of Rights would understand this conept, as the charter was suppose to be designed to take the tyranny of majoirty away so that the rights of an indivdual would not be impeded.

Alberta isn't an individual. It's a province. Unless, of course, your saying Alberta is populated by some sort of hive mentality species of hominid, in which case, yes, I suppose you could get probably get the drones to all get together as a single mind and lodge a human rights complaint against the rest of Canada. You could mention NEP, and maybe add on "f---ing without even giving a cigarette!"

Edited February 4, 2010 by ToadBrother

[Smallc]

Or do we not understand what the tyranny of a majority is, but I would think that such good students of Canadian Charter of Rights would understand this conept, as the charter was suppose to be designed to take the tyranny of majoirty

And because of the Charter and the current Senate, you don't have to worry about the tyranny of the Majority. You just do for some reason.

[Dave_ON]

Have you brought the subject up. I have heard it in Calgary, I have heard it in rural alberta, how often do you travel this province how often do you leave your bubble. I am in Edmonton and Calgary on a bi weekly basis, I am in Central Alberta Almost as often Southern Alberta by monthly and Norther Alberta Semi Annually, just how in touch are you? Hell I even get to hear what neighboring provinces think semi annually since I am each of the western provinces every six months. I also get to see all types and ages since my job has me interacting with many people. I need to know whats going on politically and economically as both have a substantial impact on my industry, and ultimately my job.

So take your condescending attitude and shove it.

Wow who's living in a bubble now? How often do you leave Alberta or even travel east of the SK boarder? You do realize there is another part of the country right? I suppose you wouldn't want to be raped by one of those dirty central Canadians, or pan handled by those soul sucking, money grubbing Maritimers.

It has been my experience as I travel all over Canada for my job that this "western" outrage translates to certain demographics in Alberta. You don't hear people in BC droning on about their lot in life, nor do you hear those of SK complaining about the evil that exist west of MB. No it seems that AB is the epicentre of a discontented minority. Truth is even your closest neighbours SK and BC feel pretty much the same way the rest of us do. AB is a nice place to visit, unique scenery, some good people, interesting culture, the only real down side is it's chalked full of Albertans.

[wyly]

Couldn't agree more. I had the same exact experiences.

what's dumb is there aren't any real problems they can point to now that Trudeau is long dead, they just blame those evil easterners for anything and everything...Alberta's problems now are of it's own doing, poor finacial planning by a conservative government that thought the the big oil payday would never end

in regards wanting to leave they just get all pissed because their politcal leanings aren't shared by others but that's what you get in a democracy...

[wyly]

AB is a nice place to visit, unique scenery, some good people, interesting culture, the only real down side is it's chalked full of Albertans.

from my experience I'd be surprised if it least half the population wasn't from elsewhwere...Sask Roughriders view McMahon stadium almost as another home game...

[Alta4ever]

Wow who's living in a bubble now? How often do you leave Alberta or even travel east of the SK boarder? You do realize there is another part of the country right? I suppose you wouldn't want to be raped by one of those dirty central Canadians, or pan handled by those soul sucking, money grubbing Maritimers.

More then you get out of your province I bet. Manitoba semi anually, the east coast, and Ontario Annually.

It has been my experience as I travel all over Canada for my job that this "western" outrage translates to certain demographics in Alberta. You don't hear people in BC droning on about their lot in life, nor do you hear those of SK complaining about the evil that exist west of MB. No it seems that AB is the epicentre of a discontented minority. Truth is even your closest neighbours SK and BC feel pretty much the same way the rest of us do. AB is a nice place to visit, unique scenery, some good people, interesting culture, the only real down side is it's chalked full of Albertans.

Yep here we go the 42% is the lunatic fringe, the fact that the number is this high should be troubling, it was to Preston Manning in the eighties when the seperation sentiment was on the rise here, his Reform party (for all the negativity it received from Ont. east) was one of the contributing reasons why separatist movement did not gain traction here in the late eighties.

.

[Jerry J. Fortin]

what's dumb is there aren't any real problems they can point to now that Trudeau is long dead, they just blame those evil easterners for anything and everything...Alberta's problems now are of it's own doing, poor finacial planning by a conservative government that thought the the big oil payday would never end

in regards wanting to leave they just get all pissed because their politcal leanings aren't shared by others but that's what you get in a democracy...

No real problems? The budget looks great, right on target! Debt levels are fine, no problem there. Cuts to social programs are on the way, and Ontario is juggling the books to become a have not province...its all wonderful.

I will leave this place when I retire, because you folks will have it your way.

[waldo]

what's dumb is there aren't any real problems they can point to now that Trudeau is long dead, they just blame those evil easterners for anything and everything...Alberta's problems now are of it's own doing, poor finacial planning by a conservative government that thought the the big oil payday would never end

in regards wanting to leave they just get all pissed because their politcal leanings aren't shared by others but that's what you get in a democracy...

it truly boggles the mind - separatism in Alberta is such a non-starter. To give it even passing consideration in a discussion forum is completely unwarranted. Every time it comes up, one only has to remind the fringe Alberta separatist that his province pissed away it's revenue windfall... now 3 times over - leaving relatively insignificant trust & contingency funds. That it has little if any diversification, in a world 'shifting (relatively) rapidly' away from fossil fuels. Riding the high-horse today - looking at a big fall down the road... but no worries! Of course, there's the core of the fringe separatists that dream of being the 51st state... or presumptively forming a country with other western provinces. I just wonder what consideration they'd be willing to offer Albertan's that didn't want to separate.

[wyly]

More then you get out of your province I bet. Manitoba semi anually, the east coast, and Ontario Annually.

Yep here we go the 42% is the lunatic fringe, the fact that the number is this high should be troubling, it was to Preston Manning in the eighties when the seperation sentiment was on the rise here, his Reform party (for all the negativity it received from Ont. east) was one of the contributing reasons why separatist movement did not gain traction here in the late eighties.

yup looney...there was poll by the western standard(wacko) that said 42% should look at separation, but that's hardly the same as actually doing so, it also claimed 35% support in Sask which interesting since there was a separatist party there and where they now? in spite of all this supposed support not a single person advocating this has been elected in any western province...

Dick Culver of Saskatchewan Progressive Conservative Party decided once elected to create a new Unionest party (2 members) to separate from canada, once he did that his political days were numbered...he's never been heard from since...