ToadBrother Posted September 9, 2010 Report Share Posted September 9, 2010 Maybe not. But it takes political skills to know when the time is right for the take down, even when others disagree. In this case, it isn't skill, it's balls. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capricorn Posted September 9, 2010 Report Share Posted September 9, 2010 In this case, it isn't skill, it's balls. Chretien sure had 'em, and some to spare. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msdogfood Posted September 9, 2010 Report Share Posted September 9, 2010 Harris/Decima Gender Gap Limiting Both Parties Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicky10013 Posted September 9, 2010 Report Share Posted September 9, 2010 If you think people will forget or not blame you are silly. If you think that Ignatieff can say 10 minutes before a vote on a money bill "Yep we will support it" to a camera then go in a vote it down, you are the worst political analyst in the world. I would love to have Ignatieff on record Lying to the Canadian people 10 minutes before an election is called. It would the Liberals biggest down fall. To assume that he'd actually say he was supporting a bill before voting against it is pretty naive. Secondly, how many elections in Canadian history have been decided by who pulls the plug? People do forget. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicky10013 Posted September 9, 2010 Report Share Posted September 9, 2010 Harris/Decima Gender Gap Limiting Both Parties I don't see that as a limit to both parties. Liberals have generally been elected due to the large numbers of women numbers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waldo Posted September 9, 2010 Report Share Posted September 9, 2010 from today's Nanos poll: National * Liberals: 33% * Conservatives: 33% * NDP: 16% * BQ: 12% * Green: 6% Ontario * Liberals: 43.2% * Conservatives: 36.2% * NDP: 13.2% * BQ: - * Green: 7.4% Quebec * Liberals: 27.3% * Conservatives: 15.6% * NDP: 10.8% * BQ: 40.7% * Green: 5.5% about the NDP's so-called 'Layton gun-registry compromise'... Nanos offers comment/warning on the NDP (in)action relative to urban voters: The poll suggests that because of divisions within their caucus over the long-gun registry issue, support has fallen from 21 per cent to 16 per cent. While the Liberals want to save the registry and will vote against an upcoming private member's bill to scrap it, NDP Leader Jack Layton says he prefers to seek a compromise. New Democrats will be able to vote independently on the bill, and some have suggested they will support the Conservatives to kill the registry. "The long-gun registry is political poison for the NDP," said Nanos. "Our polling indicates that urban NDP voters are very dismayed with the perception of division within the New Democrats." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
punked Posted September 9, 2010 Report Share Posted September 9, 2010 To assume that he'd actually say he was supporting a bill before voting against it is pretty naive. Secondly, how many elections in Canadian history have been decided by who pulls the plug? People do forget. So when the media asks how he will vote and he wont say Boo you don't think the Cons will figure it out? I mean what world do you live in seriously? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicky10013 Posted September 9, 2010 Report Share Posted September 9, 2010 So when the media asks how he will vote and he wont say Boo you don't think the Cons will figure it out? I mean what world do you live in seriously? "Our response to the bill is still being debated internally in caucus." Wow. That was hard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
punked Posted September 9, 2010 Report Share Posted September 9, 2010 "Our response to the bill is still being debated internally in caucus." Wow. That was hard. Really they will be "debating the bill internally" 10 minutes before the vote. Those are great optics to go into an election with. What country do you live in? The press will push to know if they are going to an election every second they wont let that stuff slide. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted September 9, 2010 Report Share Posted September 9, 2010 Punked, I'm sorry, but you aren't making any sense. The Liberals don't have to take an official public position on any vote. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
punked Posted September 10, 2010 Report Share Posted September 10, 2010 (edited) Punked, I'm sorry, but you aren't making any sense. The Liberals don't have to take an official public position on any vote. Yah the cons wont see through that. Again the media will ask right up until there is a vote and if they want to go with no comment that is fine but the Cons will get it. Edited September 10, 2010 by punked Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted September 10, 2010 Report Share Posted September 10, 2010 And so what if they do? The government might fall, and it might not. It isn't going to be up to the CPC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keepitsimple Posted September 10, 2010 Report Share Posted September 10, 2010 As much as the Liberals have tried to deflect the vote on the Long Gun Registry over to the NDP, it will truly be a test of Ignatieff's leadership (he's failed most other tests). He has publicly proclaimed a whipped vote - so we'll have to see if everyone shows up and indeed, will they vote it down? Layton has been true to democracy so we all know that his members will vote independently - as they should. I'll be curious to see if Mr. Ignatieff can command the respect of his party. We'll know soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
punked Posted September 10, 2010 Report Share Posted September 10, 2010 As much as the Liberals have tried to deflect the vote on the Long Gun Registry over to the NDP, it will truly be a test of Ignatieff's leadership (he's failed most other tests). He has publicly proclaimed a whipped vote - so we'll have to see if everyone shows up and indeed, will they vote it down? Layton has been true to democracy so we all know that his members will vote independently - as they should. I'll be curious to see if Mr. Ignatieff can command the respect of his party. We'll know soon. I think a few Liberals don't show up and it dies because of that. The Liberals will then point the finger at the NDP screaming if they just could have got a few more ignoring the fact some Liberals didn't show up to vote. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msdogfood Posted September 10, 2010 Report Share Posted September 10, 2010 I think a few Liberals don't show up and it dies because of that. The Liberals will then point the finger at the NDP screaming if they just could have got a few more ignoring the fact some Liberals didn't show up to vote. Its going to be a wip vote for the Liberals!. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msdogfood Posted September 10, 2010 Report Share Posted September 10, 2010 I don't see that as a limit to both parties. Liberals have generally been elected due to the large numbers of women numbers. Yes i agree I just posted the link to it because i did not see that particular one in the thread thats all! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shakeyhands Posted September 10, 2010 Report Share Posted September 10, 2010 You cannot excuse a bad action by pointing out that someone else does it to! I've read many times, over and over again, Conservative supporters on this very site excusing behaviour and actions by claiming that the Liberals did this or that... Glad that at least you see the light. I guess I'm referring to the difference between politics and statesmanship. One is for the good of the party. The other is for the good of the country. This line made me think of the article earlier this week in the news about the Economic Action Plan signs, link below. For the Good of the Country! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wild Bill Posted September 10, 2010 Report Share Posted September 10, 2010 I've read many times, over and over again, Conservative supporters on this very site excusing behaviour and actions by claiming that the Liberals did this or that... Glad that at least you see the light. This line made me think of the article earlier this week in the news about the Economic Action Plan signs, link below. For the Good of the Country! I like to think that I never lost the light! I have been a Conservative supporter only because the present crop of Liberals seem so inept. I have voted Liberal before in my life and it's possible I will again some day. Juat not likely for Ignatieff. As for your link, I just can't take anything seriously from the Star! I swear, they would champion Charles Manson if he was a Liberal. What's more, if a Conservative discovered a cure for cancer the Star would report it as an attack on doctors' jobs! The Star makes the Toronto Sun look like Awake or WatchTower magazine! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bloodyminded Posted September 10, 2010 Report Share Posted September 10, 2010 It seems to come up a lot. People say Conservatives are supported by the uneducated, and while I think the Conservatives are bad for many reasons it support base not always having a formal education is not one of them. Like I have said I have been to school, I am still in school, I work a well paying job that however does not make me better OR smarter then someone with out even a high school education. End of story. Hear, hear. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicky10013 Posted September 10, 2010 Report Share Posted September 10, 2010 I like to think that I never lost the light! I have been a Conservative supporter only because the present crop of Liberals seem so inept. I have voted Liberal before in my life and it's possible I will again some day. Juat not likely for Ignatieff. As for your link, I just can't take anything seriously from the Star! I swear, they would champion Charles Manson if he was a Liberal. What's more, if a Conservative discovered a cure for cancer the Star would report it as an attack on doctors' jobs! The Star makes the Toronto Sun look like Awake or WatchTower magazine! So, you won't believe the story because it was in the star, despite it being in every other paper? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
punked Posted September 10, 2010 Report Share Posted September 10, 2010 Its going to be a wip vote for the Liberals!. Ohhhh NOES some how 3-8 Liberal members have the 24 hour flu and we just found out, if only the NDP swung more votes it is all their fault. You wait and see, and People in this forum will eat that up and accuse the NDP of everything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicky10013 Posted September 11, 2010 Report Share Posted September 11, 2010 Ohhhh NOES some how 3-8 Liberal members have the 24 hour flu and we just found out, if only the NDP swung more votes it is all their fault. You wait and see, and People in this forum will eat that up and accuse the NDP of everything. Well maybe if Jack had any principles he'd actually whip the vote. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evening Star Posted September 11, 2010 Report Share Posted September 11, 2010 Well maybe if Jack had any principles he'd actually whip the vote. Why would it be unprincipled for him to allow his caucus members to vote according to their consciences and their constituents' wishes? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Weber Posted September 11, 2010 Report Share Posted September 11, 2010 Well maybe if Jack had any principles he'd actually whip the vote. What do you mean by "principles"? The NDP have urban and rural members who line up on both sides of this issue.Even Andrew Coyne said last night on the At Issue panel that Layton and the NDP should'nt be vilified for allowing members to vote their conscience... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Molly Posted September 11, 2010 Report Share Posted September 11, 2010 Maybe not, but they will be. They'll be damned by both sides, no matter which way any individuals vote. What's even worse is that there'll be a ton of behind the scenes arm-twisting, much of which will be based on 'good of the party' arguments (as opposed to 'what your constituents want'), AND, whipped or not, the ones who dare vote to end the registry- even if good sense and their constituents demand it- will pay a price for it within the party. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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