Amanda Lindhout's ransom paid by family

[msj]

Decided to put this under Moral & Ethical issues - we can't be paying them kidnappers now, can we?

So, Amanda Lindhout was kidnapped in Somalia and her parents mortgage the house to pay the ransom.

Anyone know of a trust fund where I can donate some money to them? (Them being the family)

Edited November 26, 2009 by msj

[kimmy]

I think the "moral" here is "don't go to Somalia."

-k

[wyly]

Decided to put this under Moral & Ethical issues - we can't be paying them kidnappers now, can we?

I don't think they have a high opinion of our morality.

[msj]

Ok, the usual banal comments are already out.

So, really, does anyone know of a trust fund set up for the family?

[bush_cheney2004]

No...but here's one for the Romano toddler who tested gravity at the airport:

http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/breakingnews/Trust-fund-created-for--73800187.html

...also...my PayPal account could use more funds!

[Riverwind]

So, really, does anyone know of a trust fund set up for the family?

I am curious why you feel this particular victim of crime is any more worthy of support than another? I don't mean to suggest that you shouldn't be doing it if that is what you feel is right. Just curious why.

[msj]

I am curious why you feel this particular victim of crime is any more worthy of support than another? I don't mean to suggest that you shouldn't be doing it if that is what you feel is right. Just curious why.

Part of it is time of year. Despite my atheism I still partake in the good parts of Christmas while ignoring the religious part.

I also feel bad for the family. No family should have to go through this kind of thing and I'm not one to simply blame Lindhout for bringing on her own fate.

If we all thought this way the world would be a nasty nasty place. My signature line may indicate that I'm a nasty person but it is really related to running races and is a joke about being faster than most of the field so I hurdle and trample - not literally, of course.

As for other victims that I could support - I suppose I would have to take a look at a list and compare it to my charity budget.

Once again, this is the time of year where I compare my budget to what I've already given away and then find worthy causes to give it to (and they don't have to be registered charities).

[Argus]

I also feel bad for the family. No family should have to go through this kind of thing and I'm not one to simply blame Lindhout for bringing on her own fate.

Jane Creba was shot to death on a Toronto street corner outside the Eaton Centre. Her parents didn't even get a chance to say goodbye, much less put up money to bring her back. I bet they don't feel too sorry for this family.

I can't say I blame the family, as I'd have done the same. At the same time, what they've done is made the people who victimized their daughter very rich. And when those rich men are lording it up over the others around them some of those others are going to be casting furtive eyes around looking to see what westerners they can grab so they can now be rich too.

The reason westerners keep getting kidnapped is because its risk free and we keep paying the kidnappers.

Edited November 26, 2009 by Argus

[wyly]

The reason westerners keep getting kidnapped is because its risk free and we keep paying the kidnappers.

are saying we should let kidnap victims die? the reason westerners are kidnapped is because they stupidly go to areas where they shouldn't...

[wyly]

Part of it is time of year. Despite my atheism I still partake in the good parts of Christmas while ignoring the religious part.

I also feel bad for the family. No family should have to go through this kind of thing and I'm not one to simply blame Lindhout for bringing on her own fate.

If we all thought this way the world would be a nasty nasty place. My signature line may indicate that I'm a nasty person but it is really related to running races and is a joke about being faster than most of the field so I hurdle and trample - not literally, of course.

As for other victims that I could support - I suppose I would have to take a look at a list and compare it to my charity budget.

Once again, this is the time of year where I compare my budget to what I've already given away and then find worthy causes to give it to (and they don't have to be registered charities).

the financial devastation to her family sucks and I feel for them but this her own doing and don't see how you think they're more in need of help than thousands of others...if I end up in bankruptcy because of something my kids have brought upon themselves and me I don't expect anyone to bail me out...

[msj]

the financial devastation to her family sucks and I feel for them but this her own doing and don't see how you think they're more in need of help than thousands of others...if I end up in bankruptcy because of something my kids have brought upon themselves and me I don't expect anyone to bail me out...

Sure, you don't expect to be bailed out.

It appears that the Lindhout's don't expect that either.

I really don't think Amanda had any desire to be kidnapped just like I don't think a woman walking home late at night and wearing a short skirt expects to be raped.

I put the blame on the perpetrators rather than the victim.

If I want to give them a few hundred bucks on my own accord rather than give it to some Christian charity that will just waste the money defending pedophile priests, well, that's just what I prefer to do with my money.

Still haven't found any fund yet.

[msj]

Jane Creba was shot to death on a Toronto street corner outside the Eaton Centre. Her parents didn't even get a chance to say goodbye, much less put up money to bring her back. I bet they don't feel too sorry for this family.

I bet they wish they could be so fortunate as to have their daughter alive.

My gawd people on this site are heartless pricks.

Oh, you shouldn't have any sympathy for Amanda because I can come up with examples for better uses for your money - see this person who was killed etc....

Sorry I brought it up at all.

Edited November 26, 2009 by msj

[wyly]

Sure, you don't expect to be bailed out.

It appears that the Lindhout's don't expect that either.

I really don't think Amanda had any desire to be kidnapped just like I don't think a woman walking home late at night and wearing a short skirt expects to be raped.

I put the blame on the perpetrators rather than the victim.

If I want to give them a few hundred bucks on my own accord rather than give it to some Christian charity that will just waste the money defending pedophile priests, well, that's just what I prefer to do with my money.

Still haven't found any fund yet.

no woman deserves to be raped and yes women should be safe to walk anywhere in safety(I have 3 daughters)but hell don't go walking through dark parks and questionable neighborhoods late at night, I don't even do anything that stupid and I can take care of myself very well...

[wyly]

I bet they wish they could be so fortunate as to have their daughter alive.

My gawd people on this site are heartless pricks.

Oh, you shouldn't have any sympathy for Amanda because I can come up with examples for better uses for your money - see this person who was killed etc....

Sorry I brought it up at all.

I'm not heartless just cynical, the media decides who is to be pitied and who is to be ignored and I resent that, everyone has an equally sad story...

[msj]

I'm not heartless just cynical, the media decides who is to be pitied and who is to be ignored and I resent that, everyone has an equally sad story...

Ah, yes, the cynical "everyone has an equally sad story" so I don't have to do anything for anybody, routine.

Well, I don't have a sad story and I have a few bucks left in the charity budget to give out - hence the question.

Anyway, forget about it - I'm taking the question to a different forum where the people are more giving than the pricks here.

[Gabriel]

My local rabbi once told me something about charity that I hope I can articulate here. It went along the lines of a good deed is a good deed is a good deed. For example, if you accidentally lose a bill on the street and it is found by a person in need, you have fulfilled a righteous obligation of charity (tzedaka). So although the intent wasn't the there, the act itself still has an outcome, and therefore has meaning. it may not be the full power of consciously giving, but there is still an effect via the outcome. Kind of like the difference between murder and manslaughter. There is responsibility and significance to the act, although the intent varies between the two cases. There is still responsibility and ownership in both cases. The same applies to righteous acts.

What's my point? Well, msj, if you want to do a good deed it's a good deed regardless of how 'worthy' we may deem the recipient. I don't think there's any doubt that this family that undergone serious hardship (emotionally and financially), and perhaps could benefit from help. If you want to extend assistance to this family, then you are engaging in a righteous act. I would never criticize someone's good deeds.

With respect to the responsibility of Amanda Lindhout for her own circumstances, there is no debating that she and her partner behaved wholly irresponsibly. To young persons who I'm certain had NO experience in necessary skills to be safe in dangerous environment embarked on a dangerous endeavour. A responsible person would not go to Somalia to do 'freelance reporting' without proper preparations. Journalists who belong to reputable companies are under severe risk, and they have much more support available to them (bodyguards, contacts, training, etc). These two who got kidnapped are two kids who went on a stupid adventure, and they suffered greatly as a results of their irresponsibility. They also caused great pain to their loved ones and possibly even grief for their countries, assuming there are some sort of diplomatic operation in effect behind the scenes. That being said, I can still sympathize with fools. Just because these two did something unbelievably stupid doesn't mean I can't be horrified at what they went through and relieved that they are now ok. I can only hope that these two will take ownership of their gross negligence and apologize for being so negligent (going to a dangerous place completely unprepared) and causing so much grief to others.

It's as wyly in here has already said, we are responsible for our own circumstances to a reasonable degree. A reasonable 20-some-year-old who knows nothing about being in a dangerous environment DOES NOT go to a dangerous environment unprepared. It was an incredibly stupid thing to do. I wonder what degree of support or resistance she encountered from her loved ones. Her and her partner's behaviour is akin to any other manner of stupid behaviour, i.e walking through a dangerous part of town at night.

Anyways, it's still righteous of msj to donate to the families of the victims if there is a way to do so.

Edited November 26, 2009 by Gabriel

[msj]

Well, I went to an athletic forum that I occasionally post on and now have a contact name.

If I get some kind of link from her I will post it here just in case some lurker is interested.

[msj]

Well, that was fast:

Go to any Bank of Montreal and make your cheque payable to the "Amanda Lindhout trust."

----------------------------

Hmmm, to be fair, my posting on that athletic forum was based on my experience of dealing with the pricks in this thread so... on the one hand I tailored my post better to only request the information above.

On the other hand, the people on that forum seem to be a lot nicer in the first place (perhaps because we are all cardiovascular machines trying to, metaphorically speaking, hurdle dead and trample the weak?) so maybe that's why my question was answered within minutes while the question was cynically nit picked to death over here.

Anyway, I think I will spend more time over there and less time with the turds (well, except for Riverwind and Gabriel) here so bye bye... and if the door hits my ass on the way out, well, my butt's in better shape than yours anyway

[August1991]

Hmmm, to be fair, my posting on that athletic forum was based on my experience of dealing with the pricks in this thread so... on the one hand I tailored my post better to only request the information above.

It is churlish and somehow hypocritical to describe posters on this forum as uncharitable and then call them "pricks".

From the link above:

Just a month ago, Ms. Lindhout's father, John, took a short drive from his home in Sylvan Lake to Red Deer to amend his mortgage, indebting himself by an additional $145,100.

So, the ransom was at least $145,000.

What's my point? Well, msj, if you want to do a good deed it's a good deed regardless of how 'worthy' we may deem the recipient.

Here's my little charity anecdote.

Years ago, I was waiting for a bus in a nice neighbourhood of Colombo, Sri Lanka when a young woman with a baby in her arms came up to me and begged for money. Now, anyone who has been to India or Sri Lanka knows that beggars are a constant feature of urban life. I gave her a few rupees. A few moments later, a young man came up and begged some money but I refused him. A well-dressed older Singhalese woman, also waiting for the bus, stepped forward and gave the man some money. I turned to her and said: "I prefer to give money to young women with children. She may be alone to raise the child." The older women answered, "Those young girls just go and get pregnant. If a young man begs for money, he really needs it."

I realized then that charity is in the eye of the donor. We give for our own benefit and according to what we think is right.

I will add one other point, that seems pertinent to this Amanda Lindhout case. The older Singhalese woman understood that charity can create incentives. I'm happy that the Canadian government refused to pay any ransom. As a minimum, that discourages other young Canadian women from running off to be "free-lance journalists" in places where things can go wrong.

Edited December 2, 2009 by August1991

[Argus]

I bet they wish they could be so fortunate as to have their daughter alive.

My gawd people on this site are heartless pricks.

Oh, you shouldn't have any sympathy for Amanda because I can come up with examples for better uses for your money - see this person who was killed etc....

Sorry I brought it up at all.

I don't have much sympathy for her. She was, fom reports, a dilettante looking for thrills and excitement who stupidly decided to visit one of the most dangerous and lawless parts of the world. That was a moronic decision and she paid the price for it - as did her family. I can think of far more people meritting my sympathy.

[Black Dog]

I don't have much sympathy for her. She was, fom reports, a dilettante looking for thrills and excitement who stupidly decided to visit one of the most dangerous and lawless parts of the world. That was a moronic decision and she paid the price for it - as did her family. I can think of far more people meritting my sympathy.

And I'm sure the family is just devastated that you feel that way.

[Argus]

And I'm sure the family is just devastated that you feel that way.

I doubt the family gives a damn about me, no more than I give a damn about them. This entire topic is pointless, and seems to have been inspired by one poster's infatuation with a pretty girl. Had this supposed journalist been a fat girl, or a man, he wouldn't have had the slightest interest.