Canada's immigration policy.

Machjo · May 19, 2009

And why would that be?
Borg

Lack of moral education?

wyly · May 19, 2009

Since you clearly aren't old enough to know anything about what life was like back then why do you call it ridiculous? Making definite statements about things of which you are in clear ignorance is unlikely to impress anyone here as to the expected value of your contributions. Perhaps the reason no one is posting or even asking for "evidence" of the homogenous nature of Canadian society pre-Trudeau is because everyone else here knows that to be the case.
What were you saying about ignorance again?

since I am an immigrant from pre Trudeau days I know the discrimination that was here and it was very real...Canada was very much a 2 even 3 class society...

CANADIEN · May 19, 2009

There is one thing that does bother me about immigrants, and that is bringing their problems here. It matters not to me what they are you understand, I just don't like it when folks move here and then want this nation to do something about the nation they came from.

Actually, nothing new there. Past generations of immigrants did it too.

Fact is, if you had a cousin, a former neighbour, you old high-school teacher, stuck in a war zone, you'dwant to do something too. As long as the people do it in a fashion respectful of the laws of this end, they have the right to express their concern, and their opinion.

CANADIEN · May 19, 2009

I on the other hand favour a "DIRECT DEMOCRACY" where the politicians merely propose and the people ratify.

Let's look at the home of direct democracy... Switzerland...

Where they will have popular votes on everything, from membership in international organizations to how much allowance is to be paid to employees of a local train station for cleaning their unorm (!).

The vast majority of voters don't bother most of the time. And one Swiss canton holds the dubious distinction of being the last place in Europe where women got the right to vote... the (male) voters kept beating the idea over and over gain until the country's highest court ordered the canton to ignore the vote's result in 1990.

I'll pass.

Smallc · May 19, 2009

Why do you think he's an idiot for describing people as not Canadians yet you are insightful for saying the same to him?

Anybody who talks about one of the founding provinces of this country in the way that he does is worthy of very little respect. Anyone who sees fellow Canadians as he does is worthy of very little respect. If he is a Canadian, he isn't a very nice one...and is certainly not one that loves his country as he claims to.

Why am I explaining myself to you? You're just as bad as he is in this regard, claiming to be some kind of proud Canadian while at the same time hating at least half the country.

Edited May 19, 2009 by Smallc

CANADIEN · May 19, 2009

2. I believe most Canadians are racist.

I don't. And I find that comment little better than what is being served by the anti-immigrant fruitcases on this site.

Edited May 20, 2009 by CANADIEN

CANADIEN · May 20, 2009

Making definite statements about things of which you are in clear ignorance is unlikely to impress anyone here as to the expected value of your contributions.

Well, it seems to work when you do it.

Edited May 20, 2009 by CANADIEN

CANADIEN · May 20, 2009

We are talking about judging a good or service we want to obtain.

I know your idea about slavery is stuck on your brain, but PEOPLE are not goods, and they're not services.

Prior to Wilson refugees applied, had a hearing, and then, if they were unable to convince us they met the criteria, were sent back. After Wilson, refugees were guaranteed years and years of appeals no matter how clearly their failure to meet the criteria. Needless to say this has inspired far more refugees to come here. A former Liberal immigration minister lamented the shocking increases to refugee claims, all the way up to something like 3,000 claims per year. Now they're more like 37,000, many from countries like Mexico and Columbia - and the United States. The word has gotten out that if you step off a plane and say the magic word you're guaranteed to be allowed to stay, and be given welfare, for years of hearing and appeals. There is no way of changing that without getting rid of the lawyers.

Access to legal consel is still a cornerstone of our law system.

Edited May 20, 2009 by CANADIEN

CANADIEN · May 20, 2009

Anybody who talks about one of the founding provinces of this country in the way that he does is worthy of very little respect. Anyone who sees fellow Canadians as he does is worthy of very little respect. If he is a Canadian, he isn't a very nice one...and is certainly not one that loves his country as he claims to.
Why am I explaining myself to you? You're just as bad as he is in this regard, claiming to be some kind of proud Canadian while at the same time hating at least half the country.

Hear Hear

Smallc · May 20, 2009

And why would that be?
Borg

Because some people are small minded and intolerant.

Borg · May 20, 2009

Lack of moral education?

What makes you think their moral education is lacking compared to yours?

Borg

Borg · May 20, 2009

Because some people are small minded and intolerant.

Your opinion - why is yours better than others?

Borg

Smallc · May 20, 2009

Why do you think that you're better than others?

Argus · May 20, 2009

I wasn;t comaring it to any other country in particular. I'm sure it's quite high in other countries too. But the fact that it's high abroad still doesn't make it right.

You cannot say it is "high" without something to compare it to. I would think on the world scale, racism in Canada is exceedingly low.

Argus · May 20, 2009

since I am an immigrant from pre Trudeau days I know the discrimination that was here and it was very real...Canada was very much a 2 even 3 class society...

Well that's an interesting perspective, but has no relation whatever to your comments about my posts. I don't believe I ever discussed class divisions, or suggested life here was good, bad, or in between for immigrants who arrived before Trudeau. All I said was there were damned few of them from other than our traditional source countries, and that statistically, they were, within ten years, earning better than their Canadian born counterparts.

Argus · May 20, 2009

Anybody who talks about one of the founding provinces of this country in the way that he does is worthy of very little respect. Anyone who sees fellow Canadians as he does is worthy of very little respect. If he is a Canadian, he isn't a very nice one...and is certainly not one that loves his country as he claims to.
Why am I explaining myself to you? You're just as bad as he is in this regard, claiming to be some kind of proud Canadian while at the same time hating at least half the country.

Your claim to have some insight into my emotional state is interesting, but seems to have little basis for other than laughter in response. Would you care to tell me who I hate, and why, you who can't even understand your own politics clearly enough to name yourself properly?

Argus · May 20, 2009

Well, it seems to work when you do it.

I don't actually do it, but I do sympathise that your knowledge base and life experiences are so limited, and your ideological and linguistic politics so confused that you don't realize it.

benny · May 20, 2009

I don't actually do it, but I do sympathise that your knowledge base and life experiences are so limited, and your ideological and linguistic politics so confused that you don't realize it.

A border is limiting too.

Argus · May 20, 2009

I know your idea about slavery is stuck on your brain, but PEOPLE are not goods, and they're not services.

Does it turn your crank to argue about semantics? Because I find it a dreary intellectual exercise.

Access to legal consel is still a cornerstone of our law system.

For those charged with a crime. If I want to sue the government to provide me with some service or let me do something or other I need to hire my own lawyer. They won't supply one for me.

Yet we supply lawyers to foreigners demanding the government let them in, and challenging the decisions of hearings officers and judges, again and again and again and again and again and again.

benny · May 20, 2009

Yet we supply lawyers to foreigners demanding the government let them in, and challenging the decisions of hearings officers and judges, again and again and again and again and again and again.

Gross exaggeration to say the least.

Machjo · May 20, 2009

I don't. And I find that comment little better than what is being served by the anti-immigrant fruitcases on this site.

I'm just going by my own personal obsevations of Canadian society. I coud be wrong, but I don't believe that we need to sensor our beleifs about our society just to show our false sense of patriotism. That's not what patriotism is about.

Machjo · May 20, 2009

What makes you think their moral education is lacking compared to yours?
Borg

I wasn't referring to me specifically, but rather general education concerning respect for all peoples regardless of race. I've had black family in law, and the horror stories I'd heard from just one family, along with my own witnessing of some events, along with stories I'd hear from their friends, along with racist comments I've heard about immigrants over the years, leads me to believe that the majority of Canadians are probably at least moderately racist.

Machjo · May 20, 2009

You cannot say it is "high" without something to compare it to. I would think on the world scale, racism in Canada is exceedingly low.

Fair enough. On a world scale, it might or might not be. I've witnessed various manifestations of racism abroad too. However, I can still say that, high or low, probaly a majority of Canadians are racist. Majority has a clear definition, more than 50%. Also, I dont think we should compare ourselves to other countries. If we do that, then we drop to their level. Look what happened in the US in their war on terror, with imprsonment without trials, torture, etc. If our goal is to be little better than the rest, then we'll soon follow a race to the bottom.

As far as I'm concerned, one instance of racism is one too many.

Machjo · May 20, 2009

Well that's an interesting perspective, but has no relation whatever to your comments about my posts. I don't believe I ever discussed class divisions, or suggested life here was good, bad, or in between for immigrants who arrived before Trudeau. All I said was there were damned few of them from other than our traditional source countries, and that statistically, they were, within ten years, earning better than their Canadian born counterparts.

But why should it matter that they come from a 'source' country? An immigrant is an immigant, and even the Chinese labourers on the Trans-Canada railway had worked hard to put their mark on history. Are they to be any less recognized than the Jesuit immigrants who led to the establishment of the residential schools? I'd they they should be much more respected. Country of origin has nothing to do with it.

Machjo · May 20, 2009

Does it turn your crank to argue about semantics? Because I find it a dreary intellectual exercise.
For those charged with a crime. If I want to sue the government to provide me with some service or let me do something or other I need to hire my own lawyer. They won't supply one for me.

Yet we supply lawyers to foreigners demanding the government let them in, and challenging the decisions of hearings officers and judges, again and again and again and again and again and again.

Ifwe had clearly-defined objectively measurable criteria posted on-line, we could likely end this problem. All one would have to do is look at the site and check off all the criteria he can prove to meet one by one. If any can't be checked, that's it. He can't get in.