Obama's Bow to King Abdullah of Saudi Arabia

[Gabriel]

If it's something you would not do yourself, why do you think it's ok when the President does it. Remember he (at the time) represents your whole ass grabbin country.

Well, first of all, he's not representing my country as I'm a Canadian. It's entirely possible to like a characteristic or feature or another person that is a component of oneself. Not that I don't consider myself to be a genuine person, but I feel like that incident was a down-to-earth moment for Bush and not a poor tact Michael Scott (a la the American version of the TV show "The Office") moment as some others would perceive it. Again, just because I wouldn't do it doesn't mean I can't be cool with someone else doing it. Although I see and appreciate American Woman's perspective of this moment, I simply disagree. I think some folks are just way too uptight, and Merkel's shocked response to me illustrates someone who's too uptight. My advice to her - relax, Bush ain't gonna bite you. That moment looks like Bush is comfortable with himself, and Merkel isn't. Perhaps I'm reading too much into it, but I'm only sharing what my instincts tell me when watch that clip.

Edited February 2, 2010 by Gabriel

[Guest American Woman]

Well, first of all, he's not representing my country as I'm a Canadian. It's entirely possible to like a characteristic or feature or another person that is a component of oneself. Not that I don't consider myself to be a genuine person, but I feel like that incident was a down-to-earth moment for Bush and not a poor tact Michael Scott (a la the American version of the TV show "The Office") moment as some others would perceive it. Again, just because I wouldn't do it doesn't mean I can't be cool with someone else doing it. Although I see and appreciate American Woman's perspective of this moment, I simply disagree. I think some folks are just way too uptight, and Merkel's shocked response to me illustrates someone who's too uptight. My advice to her - relax, Bush ain't gonna bite you.

Perhaps she doesn't like Bush and didn't want his hands on her. Perhaps she did like Bush, but still didn't want his hands on her. It was highly unprofessional of him and completely out of line. She was not too uptight. She was not the one acting inappropriately. There was nothing wrong with her behavior. There was something wrong with Bush's behavior. Bush was acting inappropriately and she reacted to it.

That moment looks like Bush is comfortable with himself, and Merkel isn't. Perhaps I'm reading too much into it, but I'm only sharing what my instincts tell me when watch that clip.

I'm sure you're right, since Bush was the one coming up behind her and laying his hands on her. It was his decision to do so, he knew it was coming, no one was invading his private space, so why wouldn't he be more comfortable with it than she was? It was out of line. Plain and simple. And her discomfort with is is not a sign that she is "too uptight." I suppose every woman in the work place who doesn't want every tom, dick and harry coming up and putting their hands on them and giving them a massage whenever the mood hits them is simply "too uptight."

Btw, I have to say, the most interesting part of your response is how you make no mention of how Obama was simply being chivalrous with his bow. No response to Shady's criticism of a simple bow. Guess there's nothing "endearing" about that, eh?

[Shady]

I love how our Obama ass-kisser forumers turn this into a bash on George Bush.

American Woman has absolutely no idea what Bush and Merkel's personal or professional relationship is like. She has no idea what's said or not said behind closed doors. She has no idea what their face to face meetings were like, and she has no idea what their phone conversations consisted of. She's once again talking out of her ass, using the same type of psychic abilities used to determine how funny or unfunny certain video clips are, without watching them.

However, what George Bush did several years ago, has nothing to do with President Obama. Nor does it, in any way, defend Obama's world tour of bowing, in many cases, to people who don't deserved to be bowed to. Case in point, the Tampa mayor. This is ridiculous.

[Gabriel]

Perhaps she doesn't like Bush and didn't want his hands on her. Perhaps she did like Bush, but still didn't want his hands on her. It was highly unprofessional of him and completely out of line. She was not too uptight. She was not the one acting inappropriately. There was nothing wrong with her behavior. There was something wrong with Bush's behavior. Bush was acting inappropriately and she reacted to it.

I'm sure you're right, since Bush was the one coming up behind her and laying his hands on her. It was his decision to do so, he knew it was coming, no one was invading his private space, so why wouldn't he be more comfortable with it than she was? It was out of line. Plain and simple. And her discomfort with is is not a sign that she is "too uptight." I suppose every woman in the work place who doesn't want every tom, dick and harry coming up and putting their hands on them and giving them a massage whenever the mood hits them is simply "too uptight."

Btw, I have to say, the most interesting part of your response is how you make no mention of how Obama was simply being chivalrous with his bow. No response to Shady's criticism of a simple bow. Guess there's nothing "endearing" about that, eh?

I disagree. I understand where you're coming from, and maybe you're right about Bush being out-of-line. All I'm saying is that my instincts tell me otherwise.

With respect to me not addressing the OP, I honestly didn't even read it. I don't think Obama bowing to King Abdullah is a big deal one way or the other. The distasteful part of it is simply that this is the top man of a country that doesn't reflect many American values - specifically civil liberties and freedoms. It's awkward for the head of the world's freest country to show this type of respect to the head of a very repressive theocracy, but whatever. With respect to endearing qualities of Obama, he has many. I'm not an Obama fanboy, but I always tune in when I can to watch him speak. I also feel that he comes across as extremely genuine and down-to-earth, a very important quality for the President. I'm not sure if you were trying to imply that I'm highly partisan with respect to American politics, but if that's what your were suggesting, let me assure you that I am most definitely not.

[Shady]

The distasteful part of it is simply that this is the top man of a country that doesn't reflect many American values - specifically civil liberties and freedoms.

Exactly.

Although I found his bow to Putin's puppet Medvedev to be more distasteful.

Hey Obama! Stop f'ing bowing!

[Chrissy1979]

Hey Obama! Stop f'ing bowing!

You think Obama reads your posts?

[Guest American Woman]

I disagree. I understand where you're coming from, and maybe you're right about Bush being out-of-line. All I'm saying is that my instincts tell me otherwise.

It doesn't matter what your instincts tell you. He was out of line. Try working for a large corporation and going up behind a female CEO at your whim at a corporate meeting, and start massaging her, and see where it gets you. It was out of line, pure and simple, "instincts" aside. It was inappropriate.

With respect to me not addressing the OP, I honestly didn't even read it.

Shady didn't link to an OP. He linked to a picture and insulted Obama for bowing to a female mayor. If that's something to be critical of, Bush's behavior is most definitely something to be critical of.

I don't think Obama bowing to King Abdullah is a big deal one way or the other. The distasteful part of it is simply that this is the top man of a country that doesn't reflect many American values - specifically civil liberties and freedoms. It's awkward for the head of the world's freest country to show this type of respect to the head of a very repressive theocracy, but whatever.

Shady's comment wasn't in regards to bowing to the King, and therefore my response wasn't in reference to that.

With respect to endearing qualities of Obama, he has many. I'm not an Obama fanboy, but I always tune in when I can to watch him speak. I also feel that he comes across as extremely genuine and down-to-earth, a very important quality for the President. I'm not sure if you were trying to imply that I'm highly partisan with respect to American politics, but if that's what your were suggesting, let me assure you that I am most definitely not.

It certainly appeared as if you're partisan, defending Bush for his inappropriate behavior while not commenting on Shady's post that I was clearly responding to.

I don't find Obama's bowing to a king "endearing," but as a woman, I would find the POTUS bowing to me endearing and chivalrous -- and that's what my response was in regards to; his taking the mayor's hand and bowing to her. However, I would find the POTUS coming up behind me to massage my back in a group of male peers out of line. You say she was uptight, but what was she supposed to do in that setting, give in to a back rub? -- In front of all the other leaders? You don't see how that could be demeaning/out of place? Her response was totally understandable under the circumstances.

Edited February 2, 2010 by American Woman

[Gabriel]

It doesn't matter what your instincts tell you. He was out of line. Try working for a large corporation and going up behind a female CEO at your whim at a corporate meeting, and start massaging her, and see where it gets you. It was out of line, pure and simple, "instincts" aside. It was inappropriate.

Well clearly Bush misjudged was Merkel's response would be. As I've already said, it's not something I would do, and I can assure you that I understand professionalism in the North American context. As an aside, although not relevant to this situation given the origins of Bush and Merkel, what is defined as professionalism varies between different countries. In meeting I've have and meetings I've heard of involving professionals from far-away places, the demeanour differs. I'm sure you already know this, though, but I can tell you that my experiences with Israeli professionals, for example, illustrate a much more informal business culture. Untied top buttons, often no tie, louder conduct which some would describe as more honest and other as more abrasive. Depends who you ask.

Shady didn't link to an OP. He linked to a picture and insulted Obama for bowing to a female mayor. If that's something to be critical of, Bush's behavior is most definitely something to be critical of.

See what I mean? I didn't even read any of those posts so I'm not sure what you're referring to. You can't fault me for not replying to things I haven't even read.

Shady's comment wasn't in regards to bowing to the King, and therefore my response wasn't in reference to that.

It certainly appeared as if you're partisan, defending Bush for his inappropriate behavior while not commenting on Shady's post that I was clearly responding to.

Like I said, I didn't read it - my bad.

I don't find Obama's bowing to a king "endearing," but as a woman, I would find the POTUS bowing to me endearing and chivalrous -- and that's what my response was in regards to; his taking the mayor's hand and bowing to her. However, I would find the POTUS coming up behind me to massage my back in a group of male peers out of line. You say she was uptight, but what was she supposed to do in that setting, give in to a back rub? -- In front of all the other leaders? You don't see how that could be demeaning/out of place? Her response was totally understandable under the circumstances.

Perhaps there's more to their relationship than we know of, though. Maybe they had exchanges before and for whatever reason Bush thought they were comfortable enough with one another for a little funny moment. Just because they're all world leaders doesn't mean they can't have some informal moments. Clearly we're not going to see eye-to-eye on this. I completely understand your perspective, I assure you. I'm only sharing what my initial reaction to clip was. I wasn't thinking - "what a buffoon!", but rather "that Merkel needs to lighten up!"

Let me assure you that I'm hardly a hyper-partisan with respect to American politics. Broadly speaking, I like Obama's demeanour and manner of speaking and impression of genuineness, but dislike some of his decisions (i.e. the initial apology-tour).

Anyways cheers.

[Guest American Woman]

See what I mean? I didn't even read any of those posts so I'm not sure what you're referring to. You can't fault me for not replying to things I haven't even read.

But I can fault you for replying to my response that pertains to what you haven't even read. After all, if you haven't even read the post I'm responding to, how would you know how to take what I've said?

Like I said, I didn't read it - my bad.

And evidently you either still haven't read it, or are still choosing not to comment on it -- for whatever reason.

Perhaps there's more to their relationship than we know of, though. Maybe they had exchanges before and for whatever reason Bush thought they were comfortable enough with one another for a little funny moment. Just because they're all world leaders doesn't mean they can't have some informal moments. Clearly we're not going to see eye-to-eye on this. I completely understand your perspective, I assure you. I'm only sharing what my initial reaction to clip was. I wasn't thinking - "what a buffoon!", but rather "that Merkel needs to lighten up!"

I see. So not knowing if there was more to the relationship than we know of, admitting that this isn't behavior you'd engage in yourself, you still judged Bush's behavior in a positive way and her's in a negative way.

At any rate, the chancellor's response is completely different from the mayor's response, so I would say that speaks for the appropriateness of Obama's and Bush's actions.

Having said that, cheer's back at'cha.

[Gabriel]

I was just making an observation on the Bush-Merkel backrub event, and not commenting directly on on your opinion. I don't think I was reacting without some appropriate frame of reference having not read the OP. I still haven't read the OP, as I just don't really care about the Obama-bow event. I'll go read it now and if I feel like it I may comment.

[Shady]

Obama bows again. This time to communist China. :angry:

PIC

[Smallc]

Let the ODS roll Shady. Every day you expose yourself a bit more.

[Guest TrueMetis]

Obama bows again. This time to communist China. :angry:

PIC

Why are you so obsessed with what a foreign president does?

[punked]

Obama bows again. This time to communist China. :angry:

PIC

HAHAHAHAHAH Shady shows how weak Obama is by posting a photo gallery which literally shows 100s of world leaders lined up to shake his had. Seriously go to Shady's link click through the gallery world leaders lined up like little kids to sit on Santa's lap it is crazy. Nice Shady.