Human Rights Commission: Canada's Kangaroo Court

[capricorn]

The devil is in the details, though. These courts are set up to mediate the in-between cases, and not pursue criminal charges. That said, these proceedings can still cost a defendant a lot in terms of reputation, as well as time and money - so they need to be based in law and not politics.

It's interesting to note that in the Canadian Human Rights Commission's website, it says the terms of settlements are not meant to be punitive.

The purpose of section 13 and the other provisions of the CHRA is to prevent or rectify discriminatory practices or to compensate the victims of discrimination for the harm they have suffered. The purpose is not to condemn and punish the person who committed the discriminatory act. In contrast to the criminal ban on hate speech, an individual may be found to have breached section 13 even though she/he did not intend to expose others to hatred or realize that his/her communication might have this effect. The focus is on the effect of the act and not the intention with which it was performed. The ordinary remedy against an individual who is found by the CHRT to have breached the section is an order that she/he cease her/his discriminatory practices.

(my emphasis)

http://www.chrc-ccdp.ca/publications/repor...rt/page2-en.asp

Seems to me compensation can be termed punitive.

[Argus]

I don't know who the Vancouver Pastor was, but he may be referrring to Bill Whatcott, a Catholic activist who received a lifetime ban on public criticism of homosexuality. He was from Ontario but was charged in Saskatchewan. Is there another one?

Mr. Whatcott was not banned because he simply spoke out against homosexuality. He incited hatred with graphic pamphlets and fear mongering rallies. He's an absolute nutcase. This was not about 'freedom of speech'.

The provincial Human Rights Commission noted Whatcott was "ordered to discontinue distributing any materials that promote hatred against people because of their sexual orientation."

"The material is offensive and it's an affront on the basic tenets of our society, which is about multiculturalism, tolerance and peaceful co-existence," Const. Steve Camp, of the Edmonton police hate crimes unit, said.

Was there another case?

Sooo freedom of speech isn't there to protect people from saying things which are unflattering, offensive, and unpopular, right? It's only there to protect people from saying things everyone basically agrees with. Have I got that down about right?

[M.Dancer]

.... Jews who are currently in the process of ethnically cleansing Palestine of other Semites (ie palestinians) are the "ANTI-SEMITIC incarnate".

What you need to understand now is that when the organization of society that was called Communism in Russia and liberal 'Democracy' in Canada is fully operative, it, by its very nature, requires Thought Police, vigilant to detect and suppress symptoms of rationality among the herds of livestock.

Speaking truthfully about the apartheid regime in the gangster state of Israel warrants deportation and banishment from Canada!?

To those who are capable of reason and (like me)...

.... distressed about your prospects in the future, if you wish to speculate, estimate how long it will be before failure to kowtow before Jews will automatically entail death by torture...

Someone doesn't like joos...blacks, etc etc....

[M.Dancer]

this caused an outrage among our dear sensitive minorities, and this made them riot and burn and rape and loot for a few days.

Make much stuff up?

[lictor616]

Make much stuff up?

St-leonard had 6 reported rapes in the area where some girls got caught by rioting mobs of haitians.... we know that at least 2 were violently raped... the others might have been sexually assaulted or prodded by the howling pack of wild beasts.

[M.Dancer]

St-leonard had 6 reported rapes in the area where some girls got caught by rioting mobs of haitians.... we know that at least 2 were violently raped... the others might have been sexually assaulted or prodded by the howling pack of wild beasts.

Interesting. Interting that St leonard is about 5 miles from the riots, which were in the henri Bourassa Lacodaire neighbourhood and St leonard is north of Industrial.

I'm sure you have a cite....

[Progressive Tory]

Sooo freedom of speech isn't there to protect people from saying things which are unflattering, offensive, and unpopular, right? It's only there to protect people from saying things everyone basically agrees with. Have I got that down about right?

There is a difference between just saying things and inciting hatred through public rallies and graphic literature.

I can say (just don't tell Jason Kenney) that Israel is wrong to try to lay claim to Gaza and are engaged in terrorist activities against the children of Palestine.

However, if I stand on a street corner and hand out graphic images of dead Palestinian children, wave my fist in the air and incite the crowd against Israel, I should be arrested. That is not freedom of speech. It is inciting hatred.

Two thousand leaflets attacking gays and lesbians have put a Christian activist in western Canada under investigation by Edmonton police for hate crimes. The flyers by Bill Whatcott of Regina refer to gay marriage as "sodomite marriage" and use graphic language to describe the alleged sex practices of homosexuals.

They were stuffed into mailboxes, not offered on the street where you could refuse to take them.

I read his bio and I think if Ezra Levant really cared about this man he would get him some psychiatric help.

...spent his youth in a number of foster homes, where he reports having been physically and mentally abused. At the age of 14 he went to live on the street. By the age of 18 he had an addiction to sniffing glue and supported himself through theft and work as a gay prostitute By age 18 he reports having found God, and transformed his life.

He has just changed one addiction for another. That's the trouble with so-called 'Born Again Christians'. Often it is just a drug of choice, but as soon as you suggest that it is just fluffed off...'what's wrong with a littleGod in his life'? Not a thing if he doesn't lose touch with reality and devotes his life to 'hatred'.

He needs help before he turns that hatred into 'opening fire'.

[lictor616]

There is a difference between just saying things and inciting hatred through public rallies and graphic literature.

I can say (just don't tell Jason Kenney) that Israel is wrong to try to lay claim to Gaza and are engaged in terrorist activities against the children of Palestine.

However, if I stand on a street corner and hand out graphic images of dead Palestinian children, wave my fist in the air and incite the crowd against Israel, I should be arrested. That is not freedom of speech. It is inciting hatred.

Two thousand leaflets attacking gays and lesbians have put a Christian activist in western Canada under investigation by Edmonton police for hate crimes. The flyers by Bill Whatcott of Regina refer to gay marriage as "sodomite marriage" and use graphic language to describe the alleged sex practices of homosexuals.

They were stuffed into mailboxes, not offered on the street where you could refuse to take them.

I read his bio and I think if Ezra Levant really cared about this man he would get him some psychiatric help.

...spent his youth in a number of foster homes, where he reports having been physically and mentally abused. At the age of 14 he went to live on the street. By the age of 18 he had an addiction to sniffing glue and supported himself through theft and work as a gay prostitute By age 18 he reports having found God, and transformed his life.

He has just changed one addiction for another. That's the trouble with so-called 'Born Again Christians'. Often it is just a drug of choice, but as soon as you suggest that it is just fluffed off...'what's wrong with a littleGod in his life'? Not a thing if he doesn't lose touch with reality and devotes his life to 'hatred'.

He needs help before he turns that hatred into 'opening fire'.

your entire quote progressive_tory, incited hatred to me...

I felt violent and hateful while reading it... so by your logic you shouldn't have the right to say it...

You don't believe in freedom of speech if you don't believe it for the opinions you specifically despise. That's the bottom line. Free speech is either absolute or inexistent- analogous to pregnancy- one is either pregnant or NOT pregnant. there is no middle ground with free speech

[Argus]

There is a difference between just saying things and inciting hatred through public rallies and graphic literature.

Yes. Inciting Hatred is against the law. Had he done so, he could have been charged by the police and defended himself in court. I note he was not so charged, which would tend to be a convincing argument that he was not inciting hatred.

I can say (just don't tell Jason Kenney) that Israel is wrong to try to lay claim to Gaza and are engaged in terrorist activities against the children of Palestine.

However, if I stand on a street corner and hand out graphic images of dead Palestinian children, wave my fist in the air and incite the crowd against Israel, I should be arrested. That is not freedom of speech. It is inciting hatred.

You are entirely mistaken. You are quite free to hand out graphic images of dead Palestinian children, wave your fist in the air, and incite people against Israel. People will think you got lost from a college campus - where such things happen routinely, and are not against the law.

[normanchateau]

You cannot prove to be victimized by one's WORDS. The concept is inimical to a free and rational secular society.

So if I use words to ask someone to kill you, and that person kills you, should I be charged with a crime?

[lictor616]

Yes. Inciting Hatred is against the law. Had he done so, he could have been charged by the police and defended himself in court. I note he was not so charged, which would tend to be a convincing argument that he was not inciting hatred.

You are entirely mistaken. You are quite free to hand out graphic images of dead Palestinian children, wave your fist in the air, and incite people against Israel. People will think you got lost from a college campus - where such things happen routinely, and are not against the law.

pfaaaaa!!

when you people campaign for laws designed to protect the feelings of people who could be offended by the comments of other people you really think you have a real legal basis to do so? These "hate laws" have no basis in any rational Western Legal system... in fact the concept of hate speech only existed back in the middle ages when the church would prosecute people (like Galileo, Copernicus et al) for defiance of holy writ.

The liberals sometimes speak of "freedom from hate" and believe that they are achieving that with their "hate laws."

but the notion is entirely inimical to western legal conceptions- because you cannot prove how someone is hurt or deprived of a freedom by MERE WORDS THAT ARE SAID TO THEM. Words are too subjective and cant really cause any visible harm.

for instance if I tell someone that I believe the holocaust never happened and he punches me in the face- HE is the one guilty of a real crime or offense. he is the one that should be prosecuted for his ACT. Speech is not an "action" in the legal sense. Breaking a nose, causing bodily harm, turning over a car etc... IS.

In fact, to hear you chinless weak willed wonders talk about it, you would believe that "freedom from hate" and "freedom to feel good" were what a secular rational free society is all about. To lefties alike the so-called "freedom" of a homosexual not to be offended by the remarks of someone who considers him a degenerate or aberration ranks right up there beside freedom of speech and freedom to a fair trial -- in fact, a bit above freedom of speech and way above the freedom to a fair trial.

Edited March 31, 2009 by lictor616

[lictor616]

Yes. Inciting Hatred is against the law. Had he done so, he could have been charged by the police and defended himself in court. I note he was not so charged, which would tend to be a convincing argument that he was not inciting hatred.

are you suggesting I call the B'na B'rith of canada to see what measures can be taken to check the IP address of progressive-tory and see what legal defense can be entertained?

honestly I sick unto death to hear such NONSENSE.

Too much of the blood of our forefathers was spilled securing the freedom which these Politically Correct bigots would like to take away from us -- too much to permit them to continue trampling on our Rights with impunity.

[M.Dancer]

your entire quote progressive_tory, incited hatred to me...

I felt violent and hateful while reading it... so by your logic you shouldn't have the right to say it...

You don't believe in freedom of speech if you don't believe it for the opinions you specifically despise. That's the bottom line. Free speech is either absolute or inexistent- analogous to pregnancy- one is either pregnant or NOT pregnant. there is no middle ground with free speech

You certainly have the right. Mind you I don't think there are too many lawyers who would take you seriously...and free speach is not analgous to prenancy....you have the right to say what ever you want ...but it is conditional. You have to be responsible for your utterences. Say something that is liable to cause a disturbance and you could be charged with inciting a riot. Say or publish something defaming and you can be sued for slander or liable....say that gays, black, jews, catholic or white people should be beaten and killed and you could be charged witha hate crime.

[normanchateau]

To lefties alike the so-called "freedom" of a homosexual not to be offended by the remarks of someone who considers him a degenerate or aberration ranks right up there beside freedom of speech

What legislation currently denies Canadians the right to make such remarks?

[lictor616]

You certainly have the right. Mind you I don't think there are too many lawyers who would take you seriously...and free speach is not analgous to prenancy....you have the right to say what ever you want ...but it is conditional. You have to be responsible for your utterences. Say something that is liable to cause a disturbance and you could be charged with inciting a riot. Say or publish something defaming and you can be sued for slander or liable....say that gays, black, jews, catholic or white people should be beaten and killed and you could be charged witha hate crime.

i've seen people clamoring for the death of the "white race" on my campus ... no big whoop was made about it...

and I don't think there should have been anything made about it. that's FREEDOM OF SPEECH.

but here's another aspect of our present situation: there is a profound double standard in who can be discriminated against... heterosexual white males and fascists of course are free game... but not blacks, not gays, not jews not communists

if at least the laws where applied equally... i suppose there'd be some tiny shade of decency to it...

here are some notable anti-white racits in academia... non to date have been charged with hate crimes or "inciting hatred"

Rodolfo Acuna (professor of Chicano studies at Cal State Northridge) “There’s a growing feeling ‘Why should we pay for all these senior citizens’ if the majority of them are white and all they were willing to pay for was prisons?” [Jonathan Tilove, Generation Gap Becoming Racial Gap, San Francisco Examiner, Nov. 23, 1997, p. A17.] (added 2/05/03)

Ann Rhodes (University Relations Vice President at the University of Iowa speaking after it was discovered a black woman staged a phony hate crime) — “I figured it was going to be a white guy between 25 and 55 because they’re the root of most evil.” [Greg Smith, “Black Student Arrested in Racist Threats at Iowa Dental School,” AP, April 20, 2000. Scott Hogenson, “College Official Calls White Men ‘Root of Most Evil,’” CNSNews.com, April 21, 2000.] (added 2/05/03)

Noel Ignatiev (Jewish Harvard professor and editor of “Race Traitor” magazine) — “Keep bashing the dead white males, and the live ones, and the females, too, until the social construct known as the white race is destroyed. Not deconstructed, but destroyed.” [Robert Boatman, “Trent Lott’s of the Left,” Frontpagemag.com (online), January 3, 2003.] (added 2/05/03)

Haunani-Kay Trask (Professor of Hawaiian Studies at the University of Hawaii at Manoa, and author of the following poem)

Racist White Woman

I could kick

Your face, puncture

Both eyes.

You deserve this kind

Of violence.

No more vicious

Tongues, obscene

Lies.

Just a knife

Slitting your tight

Little heart.

For all my people

Under your feet

For all those years

Lived smug and wealthy

Off our land

Parasite arrogant

A fist

In your painted

Mouth, thick

With money

And piety

Gregory Jay (English professor at the University of Wisconsin, on the purpose of Whiteness Studies) — “to make visible the history and practices of white supremacy as found in social life, the law, literature, music, politics, and every other realm of our ‘civilization.’ ” [Chris Weinkopf, “Whiteness Studies,” Frontpagemag.com, June 25, 2003.] (added 6/29/03)

Edited March 31, 2009 by lictor616

[M.Dancer]

Rodolfo Acuna (professor of Chicano studies at Cal State Northridge) “There’s a growing feeling ‘Why should we pay for all these senior citizens’ if the majority of them are white and all they were willing to pay for was prisons?” [Jonathan Tilove, Generation Gap Becoming Racial Gap, San Francisco Examiner, Nov. 23, 1997, p. A17.] (added 2/05/03)

Ann Rhodes (University Relations Vice President at the University of Iowa speaking after it was discovered a black woman staged a phony hate crime) — “I figured it was going to be a white guy between 25 and 55 because they’re the root of most evil.” [Greg Smith, “Black Student Arrested in Racist Threats at Iowa Dental School,” AP, April 20, 2000. Scott Hogenson, “College Official Calls White Men ‘Root of Most Evil,’” CNSNews.com, April 21, 2000.] (added 2/05/03)

Noel Ignatiev (Jewish Harvard professor and editor of “Race Traitor” magazine) — “Keep bashing the dead white males, and the live ones, and the females, too, until the social construct known as the white race is destroyed. Not deconstructed, but destroyed.” [Robert Boatman, “Trent Lott’s of the Left,” Frontpagemag.com (online), January 3, 2003.] (added 2/05/03)

Haunani-Kay Trask (Professor of Hawaiian Studies at the University of Hawaii at Manoa, and author of the following poem)

None of those would be hate crimes....it is always open season of facsists..as it should be. I don't think they should be made objects of violence but of ridicule.

BTW....you c/p those from some really nasty nutbar sites....I think you might wear your hair a little too short, if ya dig.

[lictor616]

None of those would be hate crimes....it is always open season of facsists..as it should be. I don't think they should be made objects of violence but of ridicule.

BTW....you c/p those from some really nasty nutbar sites....I think you might wear your hair a little too short, if ya dig.

? who cares where thee quotes are coming from - they are accurate -

btw reverse the races of these quotes (make them anti balck say) and none of these people would have a job today.

To speak of the double standard I was referring to earlier

[M.Dancer]

? who cares where thee quotes are coming from - they are accurate -

Who knows if they are accurate, you copies them from racist nutbar sites....they tend to twist and distort to suit their twisted minds.

btw reverse the races of these quotes (make them anti balck say) and none of these people would have a job today.

To speak of the double standard I was referring to earlier

Hardly. Racial penis expert John Rushton still teaches at Western....

[Michael Hardner]

lictor,

Your posts are filled with errors.

You're incorrect when you try to say that Canadian HRCs protect people from offensive speech, it's hateful speech. There are lots of examples of offensive speech, but the examples they're after incite hated. Is there a grey area ? Sure, but let's call that as it is.

here are some notable anti-white racits in academia... non to date have been charged with hate crimes or "inciting hatred"

Those examples you give are all American, so that's neither here nor there.

I do think that the HRCs tread on some ground that comes dangerously close to suppressing opinion, rather than oppressing hatred. And the whole area is difficult, but we need to discuss these cases without hyperbole, without misrepresenting peoples' objectives and without mis-stating the facts.

[Progressive Tory]

your entire quote progressive_tory, incited hatred to me... I felt violent and hateful while reading it... so by your logic you shouldn't have the right to say it...

You don't believe in freedom of speech if you don't believe it for the opinions you specifically despise. That's the bottom line. Free speech is either absolute or inexistent- analogous to pregnancy- one is either pregnant or NOT pregnant. there is no middle ground with free speech

So Jason Kenney suggesting that any criticism of Israel is a 'hate' crime, is an example of 'free speech'?

I gave two examples without saying they were my opinions, because in fact I do not support Israel or Hamas in this conflict... only the innocent victims.

Those who defend the Danish cartoons and the minister who stuffed graphic homosexual literature in mailboxes, will cry foul when their religous beliefs are in question.

MPs assail CBC for 'sacrilege'

There is no middle ground with free speech, but I'm glad you realized that the second example could incite hatred. The pamphlets left in mailboxes were very graphic and unsolicited. It was the recipients who complained, not the CHRC. Their children could have taken them from the mailbox and maybe they don't want them to know about any sexual acts just yet.

[Oleg Bach]

I HATE the Human Rights Commission ...now try me..bring me before them and let me have a piece of their hypocratic self works program..get me on the pay role and let me deal with real human rights issues like the rights of dogs..who are human beings! Wait... lets start a great organization..and call it "The Human Dog Rights Commission" - we would have more support of this new tribunal ...I would sit as a judge...and my first case would be the wife that bring the husband before me on the very serious charge that her husband who liked clean white linen on his bed will not let the dog sleep in the middle...I would jail that cruel husband..the nerve of him wanting to be a human and be above a blood licking underware eating dog..

[Progressive Tory]

pfaaaaa!!

but the notion is entirely inimical to western legal conceptions- because you cannot prove how someone is hurt or deprived of a freedom by MERE WORDS THAT ARE SAID TO THEM. Words are too subjective and cant really cause any visible harm.

Words might not be, but stuffing unsolicited pamphlets in mailboxes showing graphic homosexual acts and aborted fetuses is a different matter. Children often get the mail (it is the highlight of my grandson's day at times), and if he brought in such a flyer I would have called the police. The recipients of the pamphlets were not impressed and did just that.

This minister needs an intervention before his hatred gets too out of hand. These are not the actions of a reasonable man.

That being said I hate Jason Kenney for trying to take away my freedom of speech. Anyone feel incited to boot him in the butt? ....anyone?

[Oleg Bach]

Words might not be, but stuffing unsolicited pamphlets in mailboxes showing graphic homosexual acts and aborted fetuses is a different matter. Children often get the mail (it is the highlight of my grandson's day at times), and if he brought in such a flyer I would have called the police. The recipients of the pamphlets were not impressed and did just that.

This minister needs an intervention before his hatred gets too out of hand. These are not the actions of a reasonable man.

That being said I hate Jason Kenney for trying to take away my freedom of speech. Anyone feel incited to boot him in the butt? ....anyone?

Goodness oh my! Imagine the children finding out that mum and dad support the mulching of fetuses...speaking of homosexual aggression..I found a pamphlet from a gay rights orgainization..extreme I am sure - that depicted two young males who demanded their gay rights...I swear that the models they used for the photos were not any older than 9 ...I found that disgraceful..and boardering on sexual interference.

If you are going to abort children and you believe in such an action - your children should know about what you believe in --- and let THEM judge you...why hide the truth from your kids?

[Alta4ever]

That being said I hate Jason Kenney for trying to take away my freedom of speech. Anyone feel incited to boot him in the butt? ....anyone?

How did Jason Kenney do that? He doesn't preside over the Human Rights Commission. I haven't seen him limiting your speech here. What I have seen though thought the use of section 13 of the Human Rights commission limit speech.

Edited April 1, 2009 by Alta4ever

[Progressive Tory]

are you suggesting I call the B'na B'rith of canada to see what measures can be taken to check the IP address of progressive-tory and see what legal defense can be entertained?

Too much of the blood of our forefathers was spilled securing the freedom which these Politically Correct bigots would like to take away from us -- too much to permit them to continue trampling on our Rights with impunity.

Why would you need my IP address? I'm pretty sure I'm still free to speak my mind about the fact that I recognize a difference between simply speaking and inciting hatred.

My grandfather was killed during the WWI (fighting for England) and my father injured during WWII. I'm pretty sure neither of them would feel they fought so we would be free to incite hatred. Something called the Holocaust proved what happens when it goes unchecked.

I'm not saying the CHRC always get it right, but they serve a purpose. They protect our freedom of speech by making sure that radicals don't destroy it by going too far.

Edited April 1, 2009 by Progressive Tory