No smoking in car with kids

[Topaz]

The Premier said after a government polling, people of Ontario said they wanted the law. I agree. Smokes are so addicted to the nicotine they can't make see what they are doing to themselves or their kids. One way around this and still get your nicotine boost is to wear the patch while in the car.

[guyser]

. One way around this and still get your nicotine boost is to wear the patch while in the car.

Or open the window.

[Topaz]

Or open the window.

That doesn't always work because it blows it right back in the back of the auto.

[Wild Bill]

That doesn't always work because it blows it right back in the back of the auto.

You should learn some basic science, starting with Bernouli's Principle. You could be right only if the car wasn't moving. Air moving past a window opening creates a low pressure area. Air moves from higher to low pressure areas. It can't help it! Physics doesn't care about being politically correct.

[AngusThermopyle]

Thank you WB, I was hoping someone would would mention that principle, also known as the venturi effect. It's very interesting actually and is also the same principle that fire hose nozzles and jet engines are based upon, among many other things. It is interesting how so many people state "facts" when the "facts" have zero basis in scientific principle.

[guyser]

You should learn some basic science, starting with Bernouli's Principle. You could be right only if the car wasn't moving. Air moving past a window opening creates a low pressure area. Air moves from higher to low pressure areas. It can't help it! Physics doesn't care about being politically correct.

Thank you. I was sick on that day in science, glad you made it in.

[seabee]

Smokers have known for decades that if you stop smoking, you get fat. So after a lot of propaganda, the percentage of smokers have drastically gone down, and obesity is now an epidemic. And it costs a fortune to the health system. Who profits? The pharmaco-medical complex. First, patches, pills and what not to stop smoking; none works at more than 20% efficiency, so you have to try them all. Next, as you get fat, all sorts of diets, pills, etc., whose benefits are at best temporary. Then you develop high blood pressure, cholesterol, diabetes, all of which require medicaments and regular visits to your m.d. for renewals. fpr which he gets paid. The pharmaco-medical complex makes billions a year out of the anti-smoking propaganda. Far more than it used to make before, since smoking causes no lifelong problems, but rather short-lived serious problems, frequently mortal, which are just a one shot money-making opportunity, while high blood pressure, diabetes or cholesterol bring small revenues every year, but for several decades.

Also, as smoking has decreased, smog has increased and is a serious health problem; you certainly can't blame smokers for that. Asthma has risen, especially juvenile asthma. Could it be that lung cancer is caused by something other than smoking?

And road-rage has appeared.

[blueblood]

I don't see the difference b/w smoking in the car and smoking in your home, it's both the smoker's property, if they can't smoke in the car then they can't smoke in the home and kids are present in the home as well. Hell some people live in cars for God sakes. What about RV's? This is a bogus law if you ask me, that person is not smoking in a public place.

[Leafless]

This is a bogus law if you ask me, that person is not smoking in a public place.

I agree.

Smoking is legal and the province has no right dictating a law relating to smoking in your own car regardless of who is in it.

This will probably only frustrate smokers and they will do it all the more.

I think eating a hamburger while driving is more dangerous to someone elses health relating to an inattentive driver eating that hamburg causing a head on collision and killing someone.

Why does Mc.Guinty just ban living and get it over with.

Edited March 6, 2008 by Leafless

[eyeball]

Its about time the state finally started treating ALL druggies like they were 2nd class citizens. Of course we'll also need a TIPS hot-line and lots of roadchecks to ensure this law is enforced and these dangerous criminals are brought to justice.

Its just a good thing we're also investing in thousands of new police. They'll have their work cut out for them. God bless that thin blue line.

[kuzadd]

Its about time the state finally started treating ALL druggies like they were 2nd class citizens. Of course we'll also need a TIPS hot-line and lots of roadchecks to ensure this law is enforced and these dangerous criminals are brought to justice.

Its just a good thing we're also investing in thousands of new police. They'll have their work cut out for them. God bless that thin blue line.

someone is being facetious??

I agree with Leafless and Blueblood on this one, stupid law, waste of time.

making criminals of people who were not previouly is a bad idea.

cigarettes are not illegal.

Edited March 6, 2008 by kuzadd

[kimmy]

Smokers have known for decades that if you stop smoking, you get fat. So after a lot of propaganda, the percentage of smokers have drastically gone down, and obesity is now an epidemic.

So, when I walk past a school and see morbidly obese kids, they're recovering smokers?

Maybe instead of gastric bypasses we should just start these lard-balls started on cigarettes.

I've never smoked in my life. You'd think I'd be huge by now.

Maybe the supposed obesity epidemic has less to do with the decrease in smoking and more to do with people adopting sedentary lifestyles and ramming fast food garbage down their faces instead of eating real food.

And it costs a fortune to the health system. Who profits? The pharmaco-medical complex. First, patches, pills and what not to stop smoking; none works at more than 20% efficiency, so you have to try them all. Next, as you get fat, all sorts of diets, pills, etc., whose benefits are at best temporary. Then you develop high blood pressure, cholesterol, diabetes, all of which require medicaments and regular visits to your m.d. for renewals. fpr which he gets paid. The pharmaco-medical complex makes billions a year out of the anti-smoking propaganda.

Being obese causes high cholesterol? Fat people have high cholesterol for the same reason they're fat in the first place: either they eat the wrong stuff, or they're genetically predisposed.

Same thing with diabetes. People don't develop diabetes because they got fat. People develop diabetes either because of genetic predisposition, or because of bad eating habits: routinely high blood-sugar levels caused them to produce insulin at sufficient levels that their bodies became resistant to insulin.

Far more than it used to make before, since smoking causes no lifelong problems, but rather short-lived serious problems, frequently mortal, which are just a one shot money-making opportunity, while high blood pressure, diabetes or cholesterol bring small revenues every year, but for several decades.

Smoking causes no long-term health problems until you get terminally ill and die? Wrong again, my wheezing friend.

Smoking causes a variety of chronic respiratory ailments, as well as heart problems and high blood pressure.

Also, as smoking has decreased, smog has increased and is a serious health problem; you certainly can't blame smokers for that. Asthma has risen, especially juvenile asthma. Could it be that lung cancer is caused by something other than smoking?

Cancer is caused by many things. Smoking is one of them.

And road-rage has appeared.

Road rage is caused by smokers who can't smoke while they drive? Even though there's not actually any law presently preventing them from smoking while they drive?

If even brief withdrawal from this drug causes episodes of berzerk raging, maybe this substance should be prohibited after all.

These arguments all fall under the category of correlation vs causation fallacy. That is, just because most crime is committed by people who eat bread is not evidence that eating bread causes crime.

-k

{Thanks for the chuckle, though.}

[kimmy]

You should learn some basic science, starting with Bernouli's Principle. You could be right only if the car wasn't moving. Air moving past a window opening creates a low pressure area. Air moves from higher to low pressure areas. It can't help it! Physics doesn't care about being politically correct.

Ok... so if just rolling down the window is so effective at removing smoke from moving vehicles...

...why is it that whenever I'm in a smoker's car, it smells like an ashtray?

-k

{and what happens when the vehicle stops at traffic lights?

"I'm sorry I ran the light, officer... but if I stopped, my kid might get sick!"}

[Drea]

I rarely smoke with the kid in the car. Not because doing so is criminal, but because he has stated how much he hates it. We smoke in our house but if he is watching a movie with us, for example, we will pause it and go elsewhere to smoke.

It's simple common courtesy, imo.

[AngusThermopyle]

...why is it that whenever I'm in a smoker's car, it smells like an ashtray?

Probably because they have an ashtray in the car. Or because they smoke with the windows up. All the why ifs in the world will not alter a cast in stone scientific principle proven millions upon millions of times over. Despite the fervent wishes of the societal nannies and busy bodies.

[eyeball]

someone is being facetious??

I agree with Leafless and Blueblood on this one, stupid law, waste of time.

making criminals of people who were not previouly is a bad idea.

cigarettes are not illegal.

I'm not being facetious at all. Smoking is immoral and cigarettes should be illegal. Nicotine is an addictive deadly drug. Smoking drugs in front of children sends them the wrong message and we all know how important it is tha kids get the right message. Smoking exposes kids to far more than just carcinagens. It inspires them to want to grow up too fast and to experiment with adult vices. I think smoking in front of children is akin to engaging in unprotected sex in front of children. They learn that bad unsafe behaviour is acceptable.

If we ever expect kids to get the message that doing drugs is wrong and bad not only for them but bad for society they need to be taught to revile these things and the people that do them at an early age. If they see their parents getting pleasure from these things it is natural they will want to partake in those pleasures too. Cigarettes are the original gateway drug.

It seems fairly obvious that all you types really care about is whether something is illegal or not so I'm quite certain if the government made cigarettes illegal tomorrow you would just automatically tow the line, because obeying the law, above all else, is really whats most important, isn't it?

Would you encourage children to call the police if they saw their parents smoking pot? Why?

[Drea]

I'm not being facetious at all. Smoking is immoral and cigarettes should be illegal. Nicotine is an addictive deadly drug. Smoking drugs in front of children sends them the wrong message and we all know how important it is tha kids get the right message. Smoking exposes kids to far more than just carcinagens. It inspires them to want to grow up too fast and to experiment with adult vices. I think smoking in front of children is akin to engaging in unprotected sex in front of children. They learn that bad unsafe behaviour is acceptable.

So best to let them SEE you putting the condom on... (?)

If we ever expect kids to get the message that doing drugs is wrong and bad not only for them but bad for society they need to be taught to revile these things and the people that do them at an early age. If they see their parents getting pleasure from these things it is natural they will want to partake in those pleasures too. Cigarettes are the original gateway drug.

Being born is the original gateway drug. Cig smoking is down, meth use is up. Maybe we should give 'em cigs...

It seems fairly obvious that all you types really care about is whether something is illegal or not so I'm quite certain if the government made cigarettes illegal tomorrow you would just automatically tow the line, because obeying the law, above all else, is really whats most important, isn't it?

Would you encourage children to call the police if they saw their parents smoking pot? Why?

If it becomes a crime to smoke with children in a vehicle (or the home), then it should also be a crime to feed them unhealthy foods.

[Topaz]

Smokers have known for decades that if you stop smoking, you get fat. So after a lot of propaganda, the percentage of smokers have drastically gone down, and obesity is now an epidemic. And it costs a fortune to the health system. Who profits? The pharmaco-medical complex. First, patches, pills and what not to stop smoking; none works at more than 20% efficiency, so you have to try them all. Next, as you get fat, all sorts of diets, pills, etc., whose benefits are at best temporary. Then you develop high blood pressure, cholesterol, diabetes, all of which require medicaments and regular visits to your m.d. for renewals. fpr which he gets paid. The pharmaco-medical complex makes billions a year out of the anti-smoking propaganda. Far more than it used to make before, since smoking causes no lifelong problems, but rather short-lived serious problems, frequently mortal, which are just a one shot money-making opportunity, while high blood pressure, diabetes or cholesterol bring small revenues every year, but for several decades.

Also, as smoking has decreased, smog has increased and is a serious health problem; you certainly can't blame smokers for that. Asthma has risen, especially juvenile asthma. Could it be that lung cancer is caused by something other than smoking?

And road-rage has appeared.

To answer your question about smoking and lung cancer they are connected no doubt. Have you ever seen a person with lung cancer dying??? Believe me its not pretty site what changes the body go through to reach death. Its alot better to try very hard to quit smoking then to worry about getting fat. Once you've succeed in quit smoking you can lose the fat. I find people who have any unhealthy addictions will come up with a million reasons why they should or shouldn't quit.

[GostHacked]

It is not just the nicotine that is the problem. It is also the habit of smoking. The habit is etched into the person's daily activities. It is very hard to break those long term habits. It can be done though.

Kimmy

I think he was really refering to people who are long time smokers, quit, then get fat, for they need to fill a bad habit with another one. Cigarettes and food are comfort habits. I am a smoker, (pot) and I tell you, every day after work I relax with a joint, (you can substitute wth cigarettes/alcohol/ ect here). Since I have had this habit for the last 6 years, it would be pretty hard to break it. The nicotine in cigarettes will make things much tougher, for you go through some withdrawl while you change the habitual routine.

But overall, I think this to be new law is absolutely retarded. Slippery slope indeed. The government works for me, not the other way around. The people tell the government what to do, not the other way around. Anyways, I am starting to ramble on.

Banning smoking in : workplace, malls, restaurants and other enclosed public spaces I do not have a problem with. If the government is telling me what to do in my own car or home, then I will gladly hand over those responsibilities to the government. They can take up the financial burden and other every day activities that goes on in my home and car. Get out, or take over completely.

Since it is my place, I will continue to make the rules.

[GostHacked]

It seems fairly obvious that all you types really care about is whether something is illegal or not so I'm quite certain if the government made cigarettes illegal tomorrow you would just automatically tow the line, because obeying the law, above all else, is really whats most important, isn't it?

Would you encourage children to call the police if they saw their parents smoking pot? Why?

You recall something called Prohobition in the US? And you know how long that lasted? You do realize the same things would happen with cigarettes if they became illegal, right?

And no, I do not encourage children to call the police on their parents if they caught them smoking pot. because , it is none of my damn business. If the pot or cigg smoking, alcohol or other drugs (even the legal pharmacuticle drugs can be habit forming and very dangerous) negitively impacts the childs life, then it should be family members and friends to intervene for the better. Be a man and get some balls, talk to the parents about your concern, don't ever leave it up to the cops to decide what actions should be taken. You will get more respect this way, and may actually solve the issue and positively impact the whole family's life. Leave the police out of it, not their problem, and a waste of resources to 'combat' a social issue, because it is not a criminal issue. If you support this, then you should support banning alcohol along with everything else.

I do know some parents that smoke, but not in front of their children. I do not have children yet, and I would rather my children learn about pot/alcohol/drugs and how they will affect your life if abused, from me than from the cops.

[eyeball]

If it becomes a crime to smoke with children in a vehicle (or the home), then it should also be a crime to feed them unhealthy foods.

If that's what the government decides who are we to argue? The most important thing kids need to learn is respect for law and order. If the state, in its wisdom, decides that something should be illegal and it passes laws that prevent or prohibit people from acting illegally then its our duty as law-abiding citizens to obey those laws. This is especially true in the case of parents. The family is our most important institution because it forms the state's front line on setting good examples for children. Instead it looks like some people in this thread are as much as saying that its okay for parents to behave like scofflaws in front of their children. How is the government to ever cultivate or engineer a sense of duty to law and order with this sort of thing happening?

Its strange don't you think that many of the would-be scofflaws in this thread who sneer at the idea of a nanny state are usually also the first to cheer when the state cracks down on other lawbreakers.

Police tell kids they should turn in their parents for smoking pot. What would you do if you saw your neighbor doing this in front of his kids? Mind your own business or call TIPS? What example would you have your kids follow?

I recall when I was a kid with my family coming back from the States. I was about 6 and when we crossed the border the guard asked my Dad if he'd bought any liquor or cigarettes on our visit. When my Dad said "no", I innocently piped up with, "but Dad what about all the beer and cigarettes in the trunk"? I still vividly remember my Grandmother laughing and saying "good for you". We didn't get home till really late that night.

[eyeball]

You recall something called Prohobition in the US? And you know how long that lasted? You do realize the same things would happen with cigarettes if they became illegal, right?

I think official hypocrisy is probably more damaging than the police-state that's required to enforce prohibition.

In my town the liquor dealers and two safe ingestion sites are within two blocks of the elementary school. Its shocking.

Oh the humanity.

Edited March 6, 2008 by eyeball

[Drea]

Police tell kids they should turn in their parents for smoking pot. What would you do if you saw your neighbor doing this in front of his kids? Mind your own business or call TIPS? What example would you have your kids follow?

Would you turn in your neighbour if you saw him standing out on his patio smoking a J?

The cops would probably tell you they'd look into it and then laugh behind your back. As if one person smoking a joint is worth a police visit.

Good thing most police officers know what's "busybodiness" and what is real criminal activity.

[eyeball]

Would you turn in your neighbour if you saw him standing out on his patio smoking a J?

The cops would probably tell you they'd look into it and then laugh behind your back. As if one person smoking a joint is worth a police visit.

Good thing most police officers know what's "busybodiness" and what is real criminal activity.

Some people, usually the same people who otherwise hate nanny-states, wouldn't think twice about calling the cops. Its weird isn't it?

[guyser]

If that's what the government decides who are we to argue? The most important thing kids need to learn is respect for law and order. If the state, in its wisdom, decides that something should be illegal and it passes laws that prevent or prohibit people from acting illegally then its our duty as law-abiding citizens to obey those laws. This is especially true in the case of parents. The family is our most important institution because it forms the state's front line on setting good examples for children. Instead it looks like some people in this thread are as much as saying that its okay for parents to behave like scofflaws in front of their children. How is the government to ever cultivate or engineer a sense of duty to law and order with this sort of thing happening?

Its strange don't you think that many of the would-be scofflaws in this thread who sneer at the idea of a nanny state are usually also the first to cheer when the state cracks down on other lawbreakers.

Police tell kids they should turn in their parents for smoking pot. What would you do if you saw your neighbor doing this in front of his kids? Mind your own business or call TIPS? What example would you have your kids follow?

I recall when I was a kid with my family coming back from the States. I was about 6 and when we crossed the border the guard asked my Dad if he'd bought any liquor or cigarettes on our visit. When my Dad said "no", I innocently piped up with, "but Dad what about all the beer and cigarettes in the trunk"? I still vividly remember my Grandmother laughing and saying "good for you". We didn't get home till really late that night.

Are you being facetious ? I sure hope so.

Rat out parents?