margrace Posted October 30, 2007 Report Share Posted October 30, 2007 While we are enjoying the warmest fall in history and are being told we have moved from the growing area of 3 up to 4 the Southern United States is drying up http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21494919/ Government projects that at least 36 states will face shortages in 5 years. An epic drought in Georgia threatens the water supply of millions. Florida doesn't have nearly enough water for its expected population boom. The great lakes are shrinking. Upstate New York's resorviors have dropped to record lows. And in the west the Sierra Nevada snowpack is melting faster each year While we in Ontario enjoyed a hot supper, water levels are low and many trees are stressed from the lack of rain. Will the whole of the sountern US become a desert and what will happen to the food supply? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shakeyhands Posted October 30, 2007 Report Share Posted October 30, 2007 we hads a visitor up to our offices yesterday from our Atlanta offices, I was surprised how drastic the shortage was from his perspective. I wonder how long until our water agreements are broken. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leafless Posted October 30, 2007 Report Share Posted October 30, 2007 we hads a visitor up to our offices yesterday from our Atlanta offices, I was surprised how drastic the shortage was from his perspective.I wonder how long until our water agreements are broken. In Eastern Ontario I understand that there are already low water ground levels affecting many wells as a result of bottled water companies depleting the supply. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted October 30, 2007 Report Share Posted October 30, 2007 ...Will the whole of the sountern US become a desert and what will happen to the food supply? No.....the whole of the southern US will not become a desert. The "food supply" will be subjected to the same variables as before. The sky is not falling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
margrace Posted October 30, 2007 Author Report Share Posted October 30, 2007 No.....the whole of the southern US will not become a desert. The "food supply" will be subjected to the same variables as before. The sky is not falling. deny deny deny and one day soon it will be too late. Look at what is happening in Africa, the increase of desserts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted October 31, 2007 Report Share Posted October 31, 2007 deny deny deny and one day soon it will be too late. Look at what is happening in Africa, the increase of desserts Why do you persist in such nonsense....the southeastern part of the United States is vastly different from the southwest...nature and time would have made your assertion come true long ago if that were the case. Dustbowels have come and gone before. In 1997, it was great flooding and too much rain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shakeyhands Posted October 31, 2007 Report Share Posted October 31, 2007 deny deny deny and one day soon it will be too late. Look at what is happening in Africa, the increase of desserts I really like desserts. sorry..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guyser Posted October 31, 2007 Report Share Posted October 31, 2007 I really like desserts. sorry..... You missed "sorry #2" Dustbowels have come and gone before ewww..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbg Posted October 31, 2007 Report Share Posted October 31, 2007 In Eastern Ontario I understand that there are already low water ground levels affecting many wells as a result of bottled water companies depleting the supply. we hads a visitor up to our offices yesterday from our Atlanta offices, I was surprised how drastic the shortage was from his perspective.I wonder how long until our water agreements are broken. An epic drought in Georgia threatens the water supply of millions. Florida doesn't have nearly enough water for its expected population boom. The great lakes are shrinking. Upstate New York's resorviors have dropped to record lows. And in the west the Sierra Nevada snowpack is melting faster each yearWhile we in Ontario enjoyed a hot summer, water levels are low and many trees are stressed from the lack of rain. Will the whole of the sountern US become a desert and what will happen to the food supply? No need for panic. This is La Nina (link to National Weather Service EL NIÑO/SOUTHERN OSCILLATION (ENSO) DIAGNOSTIC DISCUSSION). For a more detailed description of the expected wintertime effects of this La Nina, see the Opening Post on this thread of "storm2k.org" (link), and my questions below it. The net effect of La Nina is to suppress the subtropical jet stream that characterizes El Nino. Since that subtropical jet creates cyclonic activity in the US South, it creates widespread rains there. In La Nina, the Bermuda High sets up and persists into the fall and often the winter. This creates warm, dry conditions. Sometimes, during La Nina that effect extends northward for lengthy periods, such as September-October 2007, May-July 1999, July-September 1995, June-August 1988, August-Septemeber 1973, and July-September 1955 (for one Ontario poster in particular who will understand that long-ago reference). Those summers also tend to be productive of hurricanes, since the subtropical jet is not ripping hurricanes to pieces as they form. Failed El Ninos (i.e. El Ninos that try to come on but don't quite make it) have similar effects, i.e. summers of 2005, 2002, 2001, 1991, 1980 and 1977. El Nino, La Nina (ENSO) cycles have been going on for a long time, and are reason to panic only for local areas immediately effected and without short-term remedy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
margrace Posted October 31, 2007 Author Report Share Posted October 31, 2007 I think if one lives out in the country then they understand more about growing conditions and weather. I have no doubt that the climate is in a warming stage, but it is happening a little too fast. I think that when it happened before we were not even around. People who only look at pavement and have never had anything to do with farming have no idea of the real weather. Sure our weather is a lot nicer, not so cold and we can now grow things we were not able to before. But we also had a horrendously hot summer with a lot of smog. Because of the bad growing conditions for wheat and soybean, there will be an increase if the price of any food using them. I know that the biggest fear is not the changing weather but the fact that we just may have to change our lifestyles to slow it down. Its always money isn't it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharkman Posted October 31, 2007 Report Share Posted October 31, 2007 Part of the problem in Georgia apparently is a major dam there and the refusal to reduce or stop the run off. It would kill fish, but in the light of the situation, certain measures are needed. They report there is only a 90 day supply of drinking water left. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Higgly Posted October 31, 2007 Report Share Posted October 31, 2007 (edited) No need for panic. This is La Nina How do you explain the problems with the Ogalala Aquifer? I'd say the title of this thread should not be "Crisis feared as US water supplies dry up", but "Crisis expected as US water supplies dry up". The question is: do we have a government strong enough to drive a bargain that is best for us? Right now, I'm kind of sceptical. So many issues are still on the table between us and the US and the US has consistently driven us to the wall with hardball (in fact unfair) tactics. This is an opportunity to right the wagon, but does the present government have the balls to do it? Let's not forget that it was the Liberals who refused to go to Iraq and it was our current PM who took out an ad in the New York Times advocating the invasion. Edited October 31, 2007 by Higgly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharkman Posted October 31, 2007 Report Share Posted October 31, 2007 (edited) How about you give your definition of a deal in this matter that would be best for us. Somehow I think it involves stiffing the Americans. Let's also not forget it was the Liberals who put us in Afghanistan... Edited November 2, 2007 by sharkman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbg Posted November 1, 2007 Report Share Posted November 1, 2007 How do you explain the problems with the Ogalala Aquifer?From a short google search, that aquifer is perennially overtapped. That has nothing to do with drought. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Higgly Posted November 1, 2007 Report Share Posted November 1, 2007 From a short google search, that aquifer is perennially overtapped. That has nothing to do with drought. That's what I meant Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbg Posted November 2, 2007 Report Share Posted November 2, 2007 That's what I meantThat's what I thought. It's a serious environmental issue, no doubt, but not necessarily a climate change issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottSA Posted November 2, 2007 Report Share Posted November 2, 2007 While we are enjoying the warmest fall in history and are being told we have moved from the growing area of 3 up to 4 the Southern United States is drying up http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21494919/ Government projects that at least 36 states will face shortages in 5 years. An epic drought in Georgia threatens the water supply of millions. Florida doesn't have nearly enough water for its expected population boom. The great lakes are shrinking. Upstate New York's resorviors have dropped to record lows. And in the west the Sierra Nevada snowpack is melting faster each year While we in Ontario enjoyed a hot supper, water levels are low and many trees are stressed from the lack of rain. Will the whole of the sountern US become a desert and what will happen to the food supply? Oh good greif. There won't be a noticeably difference for decades if there even is then, so lighten up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbg Posted November 2, 2007 Report Share Posted November 2, 2007 (edited) Oh good greif. There won't be a noticeably difference for decades if there even is then, so lighten up.ScottSA, I'm a climate change skeptic, but, as pointed out in this article (link) the short-term effects are severe. Edited November 2, 2007 by jbg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guyser Posted November 2, 2007 Report Share Posted November 2, 2007 Oh good greif. There won't be a noticeably difference for decades if there even is then, so lighten up. So says one who does not have a dock sitting 30 feet from the water on Georgian Bay Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
margrace Posted November 2, 2007 Author Report Share Posted November 2, 2007 You are right guyser, one who lives from the land and on it, not in a maufactured city setting, would have some idea of change. For instance my little Honey locast. !0 years ago it got its leaves in the middle of June and lost them in the first weeks of September. It badly winter killed and never reached any large preportions. It bloomed very weakly. Would you like to see it now? It gets its leaves by middle May and right now it has started to drop some of them. Noveember the first by the way.It doubled its height in several years and has had no winter kill for at least 4 years. It blooms spectacularly, just like the one's along the roadside near Kelowna BC. An increase in its gowing season of over two months. But of course our weather is not changing what an inane thing to say??????? If one goes into a site called arborday on the internet you will find a map that shows in the US the gowing seasons have move north one whole number, pretty big change when it comes to growing things but it also shows a huge change in the weather. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Topaz Posted November 2, 2007 Report Share Posted November 2, 2007 The Great Lakes are lower because of the heat in the summer, the drawing of water of both sides of the border and I think people don't realize how much water man is taking from them. I've seen the drought in the southern US and it will be interesting to see how they solve this crisis. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Higgly Posted November 2, 2007 Report Share Posted November 2, 2007 That's what I thought. It's a serious environmental issue, no doubt, but not necessarily a climate change issue. I thought this was a debate about water supplies. The US is running out of water and climate change is only part of the picture. Anybody been to Phoenix or Las Vegas? These people have no connection to reality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guyser Posted November 2, 2007 Report Share Posted November 2, 2007 I thought this was a debate about water supplies. The US is running out of water and climate change is only part of the picture. Anybody been to Phoenix or Las Vegas? These people have no connection to reality. Dont be part of the denial machine. It is global warming, climate change was conjured up because it was deemed less scary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
margrace Posted November 2, 2007 Author Report Share Posted November 2, 2007 The scarry thing is the amount of change in the last 10 years. I am 72 and In the last 10 years there have been more storms more changes in weather conditions than in the first 50 years of my life. Is it changing, yes, should we pay attention yes. I have my first Great granddaughter and what will life be for her. No I know some of you don't care its called being a sociopath, what I want it what you should get. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hydraboss Posted November 3, 2007 Report Share Posted November 3, 2007 So anyone who doesn't believe in climate change/global warming is a sociopath? Wow, Margrace, that's really deep. Have you ever NOT been scared by something? Is the water shortage Harper's fault, or GWB's, or both? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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