Bakunin

"clear-eyed vision of Quebec" is a manifesto signed by a few political & financial celebrity but principally by Lucien bouchard to wake up quebeckers about upcomming challenge. I was very pleased because i like bouchard and facal vision of politics wich is center-right, a kind of progressist conservativism wich fits totally my vision. It has alot of echo in quebec right now and could lead to major change, IMO, needed change to face the new century with vigor. This major breakthrough for the right leaning movement could also speed up the begining of an interesting political change, the end of 100% public healthcare. Celebrity: Lucien Bouchard Joseph Facal Pierre Fortin Robert Lacroix Sylvie Lalande Claude Montmarquette André Pratte Denise Robert Jean-Claude Robert Guy Saint-Pierre Marie Saint Pierre Denise Verreault Manifesto website: http://www.pourunquebeclucide.com/site/cgi...me.index@lang=2

The is no comparison between Bush and Bosclair:1) Bush has never admitted to using cocaine. Most Bush voters believe the allegations against Bush to be false. I am sure Bush would have lost the election if he admitted that he had used cocaine. 2) All alleged cocaine use predates Bush' political career. If Bush had been using cocaine while he was governer of Texas then the allegations would have been taken much more seriously. The real issue here is Bosclair used cocaine while he was cabinet minister: that is the fact that means he has very poor judgement and there is not 'the best person for the job'. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I just think that many adversary are nervous to see him as PM and use this to attack him because they can't find anything else to attack him. Sure using cocaine is something very wrong, but he didn't use it on the job an he admitted it and said it was an error. Levesque had problem with alchool and was a heavy smoker, however, he was the best leader we had in 400 years. The question is simple, we want the best leader available and he his that.

So a candidate that is might be paying hush money to the local hell angel's chapter is acceptable to Quebequers? He is trying to keep his drug using past secret which means he is vulnerable to blackmail by anyone who knows the truth about it. Is this really the kind of person that should be premier? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Well why not ask this about Bush ? if the american conservative accepted it, i can't see why quebeckers shouldnt. But again, i think the question is about getting the best candidate availlable and as i can see, rough attacks on Boisclair is comming from other candidates that arent popular and the liberals wich aren't popular too. Ppl don't want Marois or Legendre.

A lot of denial here about the cocaine and from whom he got it while a cabinet minister. No one seems to care. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Exactly, we don't care, we want the best candidate availlable. Sure doing coke aint helping but i think ppl focus on the overall. The united states have an ex-cocain president and the republican, a very conservative party in a conservative country voted for him. I guess it explain a bit what is going on, we want the best overall candidate and we see alot of ppl taking on him like if it was the end of the world, his leadership adversary, the other party and alot of media to the point where it look like a crucification. I think this drive ppl crasy and help him. At equal competence, ppl would vote for a candidate that didn't take drugs but thats not the case.

Well they have to recycle the new 300millions surplus since they abolished the sponsorship program, they had to find another way to buy vote.

I think we do have a financial mess, the Federal debt as been taken care of, its still enormous and its gonna take an eternity to fix it, however what we pay back in the federal debt is added mutiplied by 3 to the provincal debt of evry province except Alberta. So in other word, our overall debt is still growing fast. Less faster than many country but it still growing fast and we did spent big time from the 70's to the 90's, we spent more than most of other and bigger country. There is still alot of thing to cut. This is why i think the perequation should go to the debt instead and the federal should stop spending in anything else than what he his supposed to do (army, national security and diplomacy), its all we ask. For the rest, evry region of canada as his own political vision. Imposing a national vision is all about dividing, fighting, generating conflicts and endless sadness by anything outside ontario. I think we could live with that, i guess ervy region would be ready to capitulate to ontario's voter decision and instore a liberal monarchy reign over canada forever and ever. We would be ready if they would at least leave us alone and stop invading our provincial juridiction, overtaxing citizen and imposing national standard such as a communist Healthcare system. We would be ready if the provinces would receive their proper share of the taxes and don't have to beg evry year for ottawa to pay its share of healthcare and education. The only way to do this is by fixing the constitution and define exactly what a federal government and a province can and cannot do. Meech was a good start. Impossing a constitution on regional part of a country like trudeau did is exaclty what the soviet union did and we all know how it ended... maybe we can spare the damage but we will have to act quickly because the country won't survive another 10 years like this. And by the way, immigration is a good way to fix the financial debt because it share our debt to a wider mass. However, like you say Argus, we will have to find a better way to integrate them. I suggest we give this task to the provinces to organize the ground work and try to let the immigrants choose what kind of province fits their vision, needs and culture. With all their personality, i guess anyone could be pleased in coming to canada. We shouldn't all park them in toronto's ghetto.

Maybe im old school but i think that a country must be built on a consensus to survive. What is a country if it isn't a consensus of people that agree to share their works and vision of the world ? The problem with canada is that the consensus have never been strong, ive heard that michael jean said that its no more the case, well i don't know where she have been lately but the consensus have never been weaker. Now the west is also starting to get tired of the trudeau centralist vision of canada. I don't know many country that where forced to agree against their will a constitution. One i know was the soviet union, i hope ppl at ottawa are brilliant enough to understand that one day or another canadian will have to sit down and find a strong consensus because if we don't, then the canadian society is in danger and may end split up like the soviet union.

English is the second language for most people in the world. If immigrants have to learn a second language they believe that English will provide them and their children more opportunities than French. No amount of a cajoling or regulation by the federal gov't will change this attitude. This means that the only way to get immigrants that will use french is to choose immigrants that already speak french. Unfortunately, this would mean increasing immigration from a few impoverished African and Caribbean countries which don't typically provide the skilled immigrants that this country needs.I understand why Quebequers would like to see more immigrants learning French, however, they must be realistic. I believe that even if Quebec was a separate country and it could basically trap immigrants in Quebec because of border controls it would still find that a lot of immigrants would use Quebec as gateway into North America and the ones with the skills would quickly move to Canada and the US instead of learning a language when they believe to be of limited use. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I agree, English his alot more attractive but the problem is that its too hard to integrate them. And anyway, we can't really compete with toronto and new york when it come to an anglophone or someone that wish to speak english. This is prolly why i think international adoption can be a partial solution. At least it fix the language barrier problem. Like you say, one of the bad thing is that we can't get skilled immigrants from haïti, rwanda, congo and etc.. Maybe we should concentrate more on scandinavian and russian immigrants but we clearly need the federal to help us out a way or another because our population is in stagnation since the 60's...

We do need more immigrants ! But thats not enough, i think we should push harder to make adoption alot easyer and cheaper too. And when your talking about a culture shock, well for sample there are alot of immigrants that don't even know that canada is billingual... They don't even know that there is a french region in canada and once they come here, they don't want to integrate our community. Its the federal responsibility to promote french immigration too... Somehow quebeckers only get 35 000 immigrants when its population growth is one of the lowest at 0,6% while ontario gets around 120 000-150 000.

albertan are lucky, you guys should be happy whatever he do with that money it will end up as a benefit, you guys have low income taxes, no debts, immigration is in good shape, the economy is good... Damn, could you guys build up a french city for exiled quebecers with the remaining benefits

I think the problem is if he say who gave it to him, then ppl will ask how often, then with who, then why, then how much etc... There could be no end to this and then it would hurt him politically. I think he his brilliant to stop there, yes the media will attack him for doing so but as we can see, he his 14% more popular since ppl know he took coke... Well frankly, i guess he have more supporters because of its nice appearance at one of the most popular variety tv-show sunday and not because of the coke . If he start talking about the detail of the thing then that could hurt him politically. IMO he is still one of the best candidate for the leadership race, unlike bush who prolly got brain damage for his drug use, Boisclair is a brilliant politician, his lasts years at havard university transformed him and he represent well the youth. He was deputy at 23years old, became a minister at 29 years and other than that he has been the parliament leader and then oposition leader so he has some sort of charisma and intellectual aptitude as a politician to already have this kind of carrer at such a young age, and he his good looking wich make him the media favourite. On the other side, he was arrogant, haughty and immature, he used drug, and the fact that he his gay prolly make him a target for the redneck. I guess when it come to choose a leader, you take the best available and its hard to qualify "the Best", i mean the guy do have exceptionaly quality and on the other hand he do have the worst past. Now if he have a good campain, if he proof that the past is over, that he is no more arrogant, haughty and immature, then i guess he will become the next prime minister. For now IMO he suceed because he already have 46% of advance against his only credible opposant... He have 64% of the vote, the main opposant have 18% and the 7 others have a combined 9%.

leger marketing is very reliable for the region of quebec, in fact its the most reliable one when it come to know the intention vote in quebec but i guess they didn't do a good job for the entire canada, just like english pollers always do a shitty job for the region of quebec. Its comprehensible.

If alberta get more money, then it will reflect in the equalization payments, soon enough alberta will be such rich that they will be the only province giving in eq. Then if i was albertan, i seriously ask for a better canada representation system. I would stop being such foolish & nice and ask what albertan deserve, its share of power at the federal government. Because clearly, alberta doesn't depend on canada anymore.

You know where they should be digging ? the gun control program. I remember at the gomery comission one of the company saying he was part of the gun control program and was going to lose the contract so he put presure to at least finish what he started. We never knew why he was going to lose the contract, we never knew what he was doing in that program. Was it another way to get money from the government to give to the liberals friends and party :/ who knows...

One of the goal of the sponsorship ad program was to put canadian flag evrywhere, find evry way possible to sponsorize canadian flag in quebec. For sample, canada day is way overfund by the federal in quebec than anywhere else. As a quebeckers im frustrated that those liberal are supid enough to think they can buy my affection with flag... Now evry time i see a canadian flag it reminds me of the sponsorship scandal... The canadian flag became a political weapon of propaganda and its very sad. I think it damaged canada, the objective failed. If the federal want to promote or fix unity then they should re-open the constitution and find a consensus between the trudeau vision of canada, quebeckers vision of canada and the west vision of canada. As long as this is not fix, unity is at risk.

Both are fighting for money from the same pockets, our pockets. If one take too much for his need, then it create a problem. Maybe theorically its not clear but in practice it is. Theorically, we can taxes citizen at 100% but in practice it doesn't work, there is a limit before the economy crash. Theorically, governments are suppose to work for the benefit of the citizen first, in practice, they fight against each others and we have to deal with the consequence. The benefit of the citizen doesn't come before the benefit of their party... Theorically, canada is a confederation, in theory the federal government was created by the province, in theory that government is limited by juridiction. In practice we live in a total different world. In theory a constitution is the most important consensus a society must have, its the hearth of the country, the reason it lives and reflect the beleive of that population, its the base of a modern democracy. In practice its a piece of papers some people dissrespectfully force down the troath of the others. So yeah, in theory Fiscal imbalance is impossible between 2 governments with taxations powers but in practice if one government abuse, it affect the other. At that point he can decide to respect the people first and ask the other government to stop abusing or he can decide to abuste the citizen, overtax them or give up its own juridiction and let the other government take it in charge. You see, its just a weapon after all. 2 governments using the same pocket to fill needs shouldn't be fighting each others, juridictions should be respected and taxation power not abused. If they can't the citizen must be able to sanction the government that abuse the other therefore its perfectly wise from the provincial government to inform us what is going on... We all know the huge federal deficit didn't disapear with good gestion....

Its funny because when the liberal use the government money to put canada's flag evrywhere in quebec, finance their election and get rid of their party's deficit, nobody seems to care outside quebec... But because quebeckers democratically decide to ellect 54 deputy wich aren't liberal, then they should worth less money than deputy outside quebec ? How do you think we should react ? By the way don't forget that quebeckers also pay taxes, so canada isn't financing the 75 deputy in quebec, quebeckers are and they choose not to give their money to the ndp and cons.

typically liberal... They can't win against regional party so they want to get rid of them and screw the laws. A bit like in cuba, a one party state...

when you write those kind of post eureka, you sound like a member of some kind of Federalist FLQ movement. An extremist, or in other word, someone who suffer brain damage...

A left federal party will never be able to emerge in quebec because the left is fisrt highly sovreignist and second, a bigger federal states mean violating provincial juridiction and mean smaller provincial government wich is not what the left want. This is also why even if the conservative are incompatible with quebeckers (mostly social conservative), well they will always be some kind of strategic ally even for the left. Because less federal states mean more provincial states, and most of the important issues like healthcare, education etc.. are provincial juridiction. So in other word, Layton is scoring in his own goal... If duceppe win, i guess this will be because alot of quebeckers want to get rid of the liberal at any cost and the strategic alliance (Bloc/cons) seems to work or at least make it harder for the liberal to be arrogant.

I don't think that's true, Bakunin. Wording still matters, sort of. But your basic point is right. Everyone knows what this is all about now. The question itself is a detail. It represent about 5%. When sovreignty is at 45% then independance is at 40% when sovreignty is 50% its 45% and when its 54% its 49%. However i think its not a good representation because its like the poll maker is asking what do you want to be sovreignist or independantist, 5% will say sovreignist but not independantist while at a point, both mean to form a country, its just for some ppl being independantist mean pushing harder. I susspect a part of the sovreignist movement to be more independantist since the sponsorship scandal( ~3-4%). However Its highly probable that the question will be something like this: Do you want quebec to become a sovreign country. Charest is not down and out yet. He's the Canadian comeback kid. Also, we need a thread on the PQ leadership. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I must disagree on that one, the 60-70% insatisfaction is for charest. At one point, i would have to say that Landry lost alot credibility too but not as much according to the poll. But when you think about referendum, then its highly possible for someone like Bouchard to be involved in the negociation or even yves séguin. When you see the federalist camp, there is chretiens wich in the mind of quebeckers = scandals, there is charest = insatisfaction, paul martin = ?? And their possible next leader, Couillard wich has the profile of a nationalist liberal.

I think its a false debate, if canadian only focus on clarity act as their main strategy, they won't be prepared. A few poll tested many questions and it doesn't make such a big difference. For sample this question: " Do you want quebec to become an independant country ?" was the lowest and it was still supported by 49% of quebeckers. But the worst is that the liberal even in a difficult situation are still hardly fighting with the quebec provincial federalist government, the allies they will need to work with in the next referendum. There are no federalist leader with enough credibility to win the personnality or charismatic debate. Will the sovreignist recognize the clarity act ? yes but it depend how the federalist use it, because its a vague act. First, they already said they wanted a simple question so there is no problem there. Second, the act force the federal to negociate if they lose, there is no problem there. Third, the act doesn't say what a clear result is and thats where all the problem reside, we all know Chrétiens fairplay and his tactics, he didn't want to say what a clear result before knowing the result. The sovreignist keep saying 50%+1 for legitimacy, while knowing they would have to find a compromise. Over 52%, it was clear enough for the sovreignist, under that i guess it would all be about negociation and maybe find a compromise.

The 1995 question was a "copy-paste" of the charlottown accord question. A question written by federalist...

Actually, Duceppe is more experienced in politics than Harper and his crappy strategists. Duceppe wanted to force an election 1 week after things started to get mad with the Gomery comission. At that time they had the opportunity to do so. He didn't want to give Paul martin the time to organise. However, harper didn't want to overthrow the government that fast, it took him too much time to react and when he finally understood that martin had a knee on the floor, it was too late. the liberal media where pushing hard to save the liberal from an election, Martin was back on his leg. Center-right, I guess im some kind of social democrats wich economically beleive in progressive conservative. Im just a little bit libertarian while thinking a bit more like the left on social issue like gay marriage, abortion, war in iraq, ecology and etc.. I hate the liberals, i vote for the bloc, i want the conservative to win. I know it can seem weird but its all about logic and strategic vote.

Who said i was a leftie ?