Tsi Nikayen' Enonhne'

She:kon! All of your questions have already been answered....5 or six times already. You must have been asleep during the history lessons. The Babino wrote: "Okwaho, if First Nations are sovereign entities that exist in a more concrete form, apparantly, than Canada itself, then what is the locus of their power? " The Haudenosaunee are a distinct sovereign confederacy of nations. We're not speaking for other First nations. We are empowered through us as people. "Where are their constitutions?" The Kayenera'ko:wa - The Great Law - our Constitution is over 1000 years old and was used as the model for the American Constitution. Who are the heads of state?Where are the parliaments? There are 50 Royaner positions who represent the clans of the individual nations who meet on a regular basis. Within each Nation the Royaner lead the people to consensus on every issue. The real authority is in the minds of the people who decide what is best for them. Consensus is then sought at the Confederacy Council among the nations and their suggestions are returned to the people for ratification. "Where are the taxes? Where are the laws, lawyers and judges?" We have no need for these things. Carefully managed our nations do not need to steal from us to support their obscessive spending habits. Outside of the Great Law which deals primarily with national issues, their is no need for prescriptive or pre-emptive laws in our society. Rather, our general belief is that people are inherently good and when they do something that cause harm, then there is a problem in their thinking. We have processe under which the individual, their families and the community will go in order to restore the good thinking. Where it is decided (on a case by case basis) some restoration is desirable, it will be factored into the result. "Where are their ambassadors? Where are the embassies? Where are the trade agreements?" We have trade agreements with many countries, primarily with Central and South America, as we have had for centuries - long before the Americans formed their governments. We also have nation to nation trade across the Americas. We the people are our own ambassadors. We have no need for embassies because YOU are living on OUR land. Your understanding is wrong and it is based on the many myths Canadians tell themselves and each other. You have no basis in law or reality for those myths. Continuing to tell yourself these lies and believing them after the facts have been presented to you indicates a psychosis that you really should have a professional look into. We are NOT subjects of the Crown and have maintained our way (dispite the armed removal of our Council in the early 1900s) of democracy for the last 1000 years. Our passports are valid in over 36 countries (there are more countries where we have not yet travelled) and they do not include the Crown's authority or insignias. They are issued by the Confederacy Council and they are identified under the Haudenosaunee Confederacy authority. That's what sovereign nations do. BTW show me a Canadian passport that also does not bear the Crown as your sovereign ruler....... O:nen

She:kon! No it doesn't! LOL . You can't understand it because it is beyond your limitations. "Time" and "space" are concepts of limitation. To control a limitation is to place a limitation on a limitation. Nada. I've answer question after question. That you won't accet the answer is a limitation in your own understanding. BTW I'm as old as they get......Hardly a "new ager".... O:nen

She:kon! Your reality is limited by your belief that your are limited. On the other hand my being is unlimited and therefore my reality confirms it. If you could see the western world view from outside of the box you have created to protect yourself from its effects, there is no doubt that you would agree with me. However since you can't the only measure of reality you have are the insane concepts of your own limitation. Don't believe me? Go ahead....define "freedom" without using the concepts of limitation. No games to be played. But then again you can't see sanity while viewing it from insanity...and no explanation by me will help you see it any clearer. O:nen

She:kon! Suicide bombers have an average kill ratio of 10 to 1. The US with all its technology and high tech weaponry cannot route out a few mountain goats hiding out in Afghanistan. The twin world trade towers were taken down by average technology - planes crashing into them and there were more casualties in those two instances than the US has ever visited on the "enemy" in Iraq or Afghanistan in one conflict. Low tech is effective, cheap and available to anyone with a little know-how. Most bombs can be made from household cleansers and garage tools. Rockets can be fashioned using basic chemistry knowledge. Personel mines can be made in coffee cans and stone tools and weapons are still effective adhoc. The point to be made is that the Russians and the US haven't been successful in the middle-east dispite all the high tech weaponry at their disposal. This is modern warfare - a kind that can strike and disable even the finest forces in the world. I'm happy to have my beliefs challenged. Except when your beliefs cannot fathom my beliefs then you really have nothing to challenge them with. In order to understand and challenge my position you must first be smart enough to ~see~ it. Admitted you can't. So there is nothing to gain by providing you with information you cannot process. We have discussed all the issues you have cited in great detail. There is no sens going over and over it when you didn't get it the first time. Our position is quite clear on sovereignty. Ours is intact and yours belongs to the Queen. All the mythology that you subscribe to can't erase those facts. All the spins and twists you make don't turn it away from the truth. You prove that we are not sovereign - demonstrating where we have prescribed our communiion with the British, or have capitulated, or have been conquered. Your laws - including the Proclamations do not apply to us. They apply to YOU and are statements made fro YOU to leave us alone. On the issue of compensation, you cannot unilaterally state anything. And as a Canadian citizen you don't even have a say in your political decision, the laws prescribed for you or the Constitution which limit your rights. That is all employees could hope for in a corporation under Crown authority. Using circular reasoning, FTA has attempted to justify the independence of Canada by asserting the myth that you are already sovereign. That is craziness. Rather, anyone of you should attempt to prove you are soverieng by your declarations of independence. Instead you attempt to dismiss your boss the Queen by saying she has no authority. You better get out all the consitutional documents. It is a long stretch to prove the Crown, YOUR Majesty and Sovereign Ruler are anything but in full control of the Corporation. O:nen

She:kon! If the Americans were as smart and they knew the strategies beforehand, they would not have been fooled by them. To my knowledge, none of our warriors that fought in Vietnam were fooled either. Only the "smart" Americans got sucker-punched by them. Low technology trumps high technology all the time. The Americans were defeated in Vietnam by their own egos. O:nen

She:kon! Fungku Charlie, No one can prove to you anything you refuse to believe. That makes shaft-shifting much more valuable to us. If you knew how it was done then you would believe it. My children learned how to shape-shift at a very early age. Its that easy and unfortunately you are "too smart" to believe it. I owe you nothing. Prove it to me you are really as smart as you ~think~ you are....... O:nen

She:kon! It is no circular logic. Canada does not have the authority to lock people up bu they do anyway. They do not have the authority to legislate us but they do anyway. One day it will come back to bite them in the ass. Perhaps when we lock up Judge Marshall for being illegally on our territory, then you will "get it..." O:nen

She:kon! Dispite the impotence of the court, the Stoney Pointers have returned to living on the site. It is theirs. Canadian Courts have no jurisdiction. They can rule and object all they want. Occupation works and it will continue to be the most effective method of territory restoration until your government decides to negotiate in good faith. Caledonia and the Wind Farm at Shelburne are just the beginning. O:nen

She:kon! Wrong again. Oka. Ipperwash. Caledonia. All are successful reclamations. Stay tuned....same bat channel....more to come...... Sure we end up negotiating but we hold the upper hand. O:nen

She:kon! The smartest among you reject the concept of "shape-shifting". How much more effective it is because you don't believe! 100 years ago doctors believed that death was inevitible when one stopped breathing. Then they discovered that the heart kept beating after death and they revised their definition of death to depend on no heartbeat. Then as recently as about 30 years ago, they realized that the brain continued to function after the breathing and heart stopped. Their new definitions involve the cessation of brain function. They are still in that archaic era defining death by physical properties. Yet life is so much more than someone's biased and judgemental observation of it. One's limits follow their belief in limitation and so no matter how smart and how strong you are you will always be limited to your final reward of death. That's what gives us an advantage. A warrior does not die until he has a vision of his death.....and then only because he believes his death is inevitible. Belief preceeds cause, and cause always preceeds effect. Producing an effect for someone when they cannot comprehend the cause scares the heebee geebees outta them. Shape shifting is not only possible and plausible when you know how but it is relatively easy. O:nen

She:kon! Riverspin, I have worse news for you. Treaties are agreements between nations formed out of good will and respect. Should one nation decide unilaterally to ignore the terms of the treaty then the penalties specifed in it will come in to effect. If there are no penalties then in the case of land treaties we have every right to take back the land and dispose of it in anyway we choose. Unilaterally ignoring the terms doesn't mean that you can still use the land AND ignore the terms. You lost. Thanks for supporting our cause by your understanding. O:nen

She:kon! Oops! We have our own passports issued by the Haudenosaunee Confederacy. Only sovereign nations have their passports recognized by 36 countries. O:nen

She:kon! As farmers and fishers Mohawks are relatively poor trackers....unless we have left a trail of beans behind us...and providing the birds haven't found our trail before we do..... However, we are adept at "getting around" without being heard or seen. We are adept at changing the rules of combat and making the enemy play our game (to their loss and without knowing the rules).m We are adept at fasting for weeks - going days without water even - in order to accomplish our mission. We are skilled at low tech weaponry being able to make highly effective weapons without tools or metals. We are tenacious fighters never giving up when we are mortally wounded. THAT is what the US Special Forces and Seals have some of our warriors training them for. Our warriors are there because they are mentally training special ops forces to meet the challenges. However, there is still lots of "mystical" skills we have not taught. It is unlikely given your easy reaction to fear, or your inability to detach from your visual senses that you could even understand many of the concepts. Those we reserve for ourselves. Those skills and knowledge kept the 2500 troops at Oka at bay, afraid of the backlash of the unknown. Sure it is fruitless to talk about military invasion as an option. However, the question was "are we prepared?" We are always prepared and capable. O:nen

She:kon! Treaties are NOT made with the citizens of a country. They are made only on a nation to nation basis. Proclamations of the Crown are statements of fact. In the case of the the Royal Proclamation and the Haldimand Proclamation they are a statement made to the citizens that no one is to encroach on the lands as they are beyond the control of the Crown. They merely state for the benefit of the citizens that the borders are their limits and qould be no different than stating the obvious that the US border is off-limits to British settlement. Anyone that can prove that the Haudensaunee Confederacy ever capitulated, or ever entered into an agreement that gave up their sovereignty, or were ever conquered by British forces will have scored a point. Since Canada is nothing more than a subject of the Crown (and more importantly did not have any authority when the proclamations were made) then a statement by a subject has no value in this discussion. The Crown's statement was directed towards its subjects - its citizens - and was further entrenched in the Charter of Rights and Freedoms as a continuation of that statement. The Haldimand Tract is off-limits to settlement and so any settlement that did occur without our permission is illegal. I would furhter implicate that given the Haldimand Tract was off-limits to British (and Canadians) that they no longer could hold themselves as citizens while living on Confederacy territory. While the US may recognize dual citizenship, and work visas, we do not. And so by right of territory anyone living on the tract are subject to the laws of the Confederacy. O:nen

She:kon! Mohawk Warriors are still training the US Special Forces and Navy Seals. You wouldn't think we would tell them everything we know, do you? O:nen

She:kon! No. Because we know how to manage our money and taxation is not necessary. The trillions in land values and the billions in trusts are sufficient to meet our needs. The funny thing is that if Canadians could live within their means like we do, there would be no need for taxes in your system either. Taxation is just a method that government uses to redistribute and share the wealth. Under our system we do not need a heavily bureaucratic government adminstration to look after people in our communities who might have hit a low period. Geoffery, the national debt is simply a debt that the government owes to its citizens. Government has borrowed from YOUR pensions, unemployment contributions and taxes to prop up party favours and perks for the ruling cadre. Since it is owed to you, and since we are not Canadian citizens that portion (being the debt) is totally your government's responsibility to you. We're not part of it....unless you are suggesting that we should seek to benefit more by demanding your government pay our portion of the debt back to us too! Politically yam, we cannot be pidgeon-holed. While our government system does lean towards protecting and defending the interests of the people, it also recognizes the needs to expand and adapt to outside advancements in technology. Socialism implies that we are people driven and people focused. Yet we are protective of the community, that comes through the people themselves as we see the basis of all survival and longevity in our government system has come from free will decisions and the common mind of the people. This is one of my favourite quotes: Balancing Individual Rights with Those of Collective “Each member of the community is to be respected for what he or she contributes to it, so the opinions and rights of the individual are very important. Progress to wards an economic plan for Kahnawake must be made by consensus. However, no individual can come before the community as a whole. Dissenting opinions are of value when they contribute alternatives to flawed proposals, but the majority must rule in order for the chosen project to have the support it will need to work.” From...The Economic Principals of The Women of the Longhouse, Kahnawake Survival of the community guarantees the survival of individuals within it. On the other hand, focus on only the survival of the individual will eventually lead to the destruction of the community and eventually self-destruction. O:nen

She:kon! This demonstrates how myopic some people are.....They think that we can't have our own sense of national pride (not supremecy) but must be copying some sort of "white culture" (which doesn't exist BTW) to assert our distinction. I am hardly a "native supremacist". Politically, I am a humanist. However, I can see why you would fear our assertion of our place in society as it erodes the authority "white' supremacists" like you have held in the mainstream for far too long. Unless you haven't noticed, the majority of people in major cities (and these are the guys and gals who run your government and big businesses) are brown people - the majority of whom are not only non-caucasian but who are also non-christians. I know this scares the pants off of you Mister v since as a minority in those places you stand not to be heard. It is the fear of the myopic racists that all the ill they have visited upon others in the name of apartheid and racial obstruction will be returned. I certainly understand your fears Mister v and will gladly elevate them should you continue to insist we are out to get you!......I mean if we are going to be labelled as violent antagonists them we might as well play the part for your benefit, right? O:nen

She:kon! Harper is impotent. He doesn't have the authority to legislate what to do about land claims because the land title and the rights that accompany them are protected under the Charter. And I doubt that people like McGinty or many other premiers would agree to an consitutional amendment in order to give him the authority. On our side of the equatio, there is no need for legislation (nor would be subject to it). Our new lands claim process involves taking the land in question back under our control and placing the burden of proof on Canada to prove it was ever relinguished. It is an effective and expedient process that no doubt will be expanded across Canada. Get used to it. There's lots more to come. O:nen

She:kon! It is no longer a "land dispute". The government has acknowledged that Six Nations holds title to the entire tract. It is a federal issues becuase the people squatting on our territory are Canadians and the federal government has to look after their business interests...I mean.....those people produce a lot of goods and losing them would put a serious dent in the Canadian economy. O:nen

She:kon! From my understanding (I haven't seen the archaeology reports for the Toronto site you referenced) many of the post-contact villages were blended villages- Iroquois and Mississaugas.. I had heard that two unique things at that site put archaeologists in a quandry. That of the "earthen sweat lodges" built into the side of the longhouse and that of the bear skull encircled by a ring of sticks. There were similar findings at an Oshawa site (Grandview) but it was deer skull. The Oshawa site was a pre-contact site and there are a number of Mississauga influences although it was clearly Cayuga. Two Oshawa sites (McLeaod and Grandview) were farming communities of a much larger village to the south. We do know that the Wendat did not disappear, anymore than the Seneca and Cayuga people disappeared from here. Rather they became part of something bigger and given the Confederacy expansion into the north lands of the Mississaugas and Wendat where the Mississaugas joined the Covanent Chain at the invitation of the north shore Confederacy Iroquois, it is likely the Wendat also became part of the Confederacy.......oral history references it but I cannot find any references in post-contact written history. Akia at the Wampum Chronicles has made a connection to the Seven Nations - where the Confederacy was expanded eastward up the St. Lawrence. We know that the British were trying to extend the Covanent Chain as a replacment to the Great Law (not being eligible to be protected by the Kayenera'kowa). My belief based on the infomration I have studied suggests that the Confederacy was much further in the interior - as high as the Kawartha Lakes Region (south and west of Apsley). As archaeologists uncover more longhouse sites, with the new thinking I believe that they will find a greater distribution of the Confederacy than originally thought. O:nen

She:kon! There is still nothing new that is either intelligent nor pertinient. I will correct this, however. Through the archaeology of the Great Lakes, archaeologists have recently discovered a huge mistake. They had presented their information believing that Huron were the Wendat and therefore assumed all villages along the north shore were Wendat. However, after studying the lithics and ceramics more carefully, they have changed their conclusions. The "Hurons" as the french called them was merely a distinction they used to differentiate between the North Shore Iroquois and the South Shore Iroquois. They essentially looked down the St. Lawrence and claimed one was Iroquois and the othe Huron. They were the same confederacy people, with the Seneca occupying the western region, Cayuga in the central regions and the Mohawk up the St. Lawrence River. The ceramic styles, the clay types and the chert predominently come from the south, while the next major source was along either the Niagara or the Trent, long which our people travelled between the southern villages. At Crawford Lake specifically the site is operated by the Conservation authority and when they make presentations they mix Mississauga tradition and Seneca tradition constantly. The last time I was there (I have been many times) I attempted to correct them but they were resistent to it. I have also extensively examined their ceramic and lithic collections and found that they are indeed Seneca origin. Crawford Lake site is the actual location of a 12th century village that was discovered by a flute when they were looking at the geology / biology of the lake bottom. Take that one off your list skyclapper. And take any other village along the north shores too. I have studied these places extensively and they are definitely Confederacy villages - for all of the last 1000 years! Skyclapper, get yourself some uptodate information. Presenting your 4th grade history books (which were likely stolen from your school) doesn't not amount to valid information. It merely shows how unintelligent you really are by limiting your search to infantile sources. As to the rest of the trolls, my isn't it wonderful how you all come out and still don't add to the discussion but like little carp go on a feeding frenzy once the big pike move on.... O:nen

She:kon! There is no intelligence in any of their incontenant posts, Okwaho. Maybe a laxative is in order for all of them. They certainly are full of it. O:nen

She:kon! Ha ha ha ha ha...!!!!! Canadians don't elect the politicians of their choice! You get the one the parties give to you. The election process is merely a confirmation of their choices for you. And once they get in they do what their leaders tell them to do. The average taxpayer has no clout where it concerns the government. You are just being used to feign democracy.......It is always a choice between the lesser of two evils...which one will screw you less..... As far as our claims go they exceed the authority fo your electoral process. The government, once it is in sesion is bound to follow Crown law. Crown law says that the Haldimand Tract belongs to us. You government will simply enforce their laws over you to pay the tab for their mistakes. It is this way and has always been this way. That's what happens when a corporation like Canada runs the show. Their business decisions are made completely independent of your protests. O:nen

She:kon! You can't give your government anything, let alone sdirection to act on your behalf. These transactions - the negotiations to the final signed documents will be completed without your input. You're dreaming if you think otherwise. Oh and BTW...We already ahve an agreement in principle that says the land is ours. The cost of compensation will be born by you the taxpayers and there isn't a thing you say or do that will change that outcome. O:nen

She:kon! They'll have no trouble accepting our claims, as the border and title to Haldimand never changed in the 1000 or so years it was in our possession. The west bank and Gaza Strip was occupied and turns out the Israelis had to vacate it because it rightfully belongs to the Palestinians. The illegal squatters on the west bank and the Gaza might be piussed about it but by international law they were evicted and anything they built on it stays there. We could take that extreme also but I suspect that Canada will do what has to be done in the end. Skyclad you lowlife troll, I would suggest that you arm yourself with some intelligent research and come back and see if you can join the discussion and make a legitimate point. The Clan Mothers are the "title-bearers" meaning that they hold the national territory for our interest. Our ownership of the parcels within the nation are protected from outside encroachment by that rightful title. Yet I can still own my own lot and do what ever I please with it (except sell it or lease it without the Clan Mother's permission). And just to temp your unintelligence with fact, the Great Law DOES have an amending formula. You can start looking NOW! Ready. Set GO! (that should keep you busy for the next week). Your are getting silly Riverspin. First you say Canadian law applies and then when you lose that argument you claim international law applies and then when you lose that again, you resort back to saying Canadian law applies. Neither applies, since "international law" is volunatry and Canada doesn't even have sovereign authority over its own government. The argument was lost 2 weeks ago, only you are unwilling to give it up. That makes it looklike a pathetic attempt to convince yourself what you want to believe is true. The sovereignty and the borders of the Haldimand Tract are holdings of the Haudenosaunee people. It is the Clan Mother's position in the community as title-bearers to make sure that none of it ever leaves our 7th generation children's possession. How hard is that for you to understand? Obviously you have lost your mind if you can't find that simple understanding. Oh and BTW your Supreme Court disagrees with you. They recognize that occupation of a land does not equate to ownership. Squatters and illegal occupiers have no right to claim what they have never held title to - even if by some shady dealings slimly lawyers created deeds without any authority. O:nen