ExFlyer

Thanks for the debate. Can we agree that the army personnel may go out to the field and the rest of the military may not. Can we agree that the military salary is a good one, regardless where you sleep at nights? As you have said so many times, the Army does not have enough money for training nowadays. As an aside, I do not include the Rangers from up north. I have worked on the Twin Otters resupplying them with ammunition so they can go hunting. (sarcastic, but true) Can we agree that the Army has not been out of country in a number of years. Afghanistan, 9 or 10 years ago, Balkans over 13 years ago. And to be clear, those persons over there for those conflicts were not all Army. Can we agree that there are less than 3000 military personnel out of country right now and most of them are in logistic or admin or training support. As you stated earlier "a dick measuring contest" as clearly my Air Force dick is not as big as Army but, the Canadian Army has been somewhat home bound for quite a while. My very first point was that military pay is quite good, and it is, by comparison to civil counterparts.

The feds don't do medical stuff and only RCMP for law enforcement.

Is this what you are alluding to?? LOL

The garbage man in Edmonton gets $43K. Calgary $52K, Montreal $41.K Again, all in perspective. A average office clerk in Canada makes $33K but in the Military a private clerk makes $55 and in 3 to 4 years makes $63K. Again, it is all perspective, I never said everyone in the military is 9 to 5 but to recognize, many are. Look around the personnel on your last base and see how many did not deploy or only deployed ones in the past 10 or more years. There are a lot. I also said I have different perspective but , you should be able to have one as well. I told you I respect and recognize the Army (combat arms) is different . I also said not everyone, even most military are not in the Army, let alone combat arms. Danger pay is not life insurance, it is in recognition of the duty you are pulling and the more you pull, the more you get paid.... is it incentive to return?

I appreciate your perspective and you are correct, for those times in those situations but, Like I said, we have very few out of country personal now and in the past few years. (up to 3000 out of 90,000 regular and reserve). Yes, up to 40K personnel were in Afghanistan over a period of 10+ years. many served several times. Perspective now, 40K over 10 years is not a significant part of the military and that more than likely, as you said, the same personnel went back often. If you wish to use those types of equivalence, we had 90K X 10years personnel over those 10 years. 40K personnel in Bosnia (Balkan war) but it was a 19 year conflict and yes, we participated under NATO. Absolutely, positively, serving in a regiment as a soldier is far different than being in an Air Force squadron. I have also said that we do not have many hard core combat arms troops and they serve in conflict far more than any other military occupations. I apologize that this turned into a who served the most topic, I only said, in the beginning, that Military pay was pretty good. I am fully aware of who went and where, maybe my NDHQ tours showed me the "big" picture of service in the Military?

I am not disputing, I am just saying the military pay is not so bad anymore. Your comparison may, at certain times be correct but, as a rule, most military nowadays is a 9 to 5 job. As I have said, the Army guys are all home, only 3000 Canadian military are out of country now. As for the navy, we have very few ships and wiht exception of NATO duties, many of the sailors are home too. Airfofce, well, the y are all basically home except for missions of supply delivery. Pilots, doctors nurses etc (Ship captains?) are a rare exception although, they are quit well paid and are not under the same situations their civilian counterparts have endured the past few years. https://www.canada.ca/en/department-national-defence/services/benefits-military/pay-pension-benefits/pay/officers.html I fully agree that when out of country especially in conflict areas, you should get additional pay, oh wit, you do. As do out of country admin or logistic postings. https://www.canada.ca/en/department-national-defence/corporate/policies-standards/compensation-benefits-instructions/chapter-205-allowances-for-officers-and-non-commissioned-members.html As you agree with "the military could and should look at our pays and all the bonuses we are entitled to get" And, Canadian Military is not just combat arms soldiers.

My point is that they do get paid significantly more. Have a look at the link I posted. A clerk, admin staff, dental hygienist, stores man and other trades/jobs/occupations starting wage is $38K and within 3 years is $55K. That is a lot more than the civilian equivalent. Also, as I said, the lifestyle and risk is not as much as some (many) people think. Most Canadian military do not go into conflict. Hard core combat arms will but others, if sent at all, will be in what Canada normally sends, logistic support way back from the fighting. As for career flexibility, there is a lot of flexibility in the Military. I had a lot of infantry, artillery, signals soldiers remuster to aircraft technical trades after a few years. The Search and Rescue Tech trade has many soldiers that remustered. Once in, you can change to something else if whatever you initially chose does not suit you. Military is a family. It is not just soldiers as dougie like you to think. Most live for today and the future and are not absorbed by and live the past. Most also are in it for Country and not just a small regiment or squadron or ship. They very much feel and are very proud they are serving Canada.

Not arguing the lifestyle, just saying the pay is actually quite good and very often, for certain occupations, better than the civilian counterpart. Yes, there are implied dangers and risks every service person takes but lets not overplay that. Today, Canada has less than 3000 (out of about 90,000 regular and reserve persons) personnel out of country. There are the majority of service personnel do not partake in conflict events out of country. Yes ArmyGuy and even dougie have been but they are out and out soldiers and most Canadian Forces personnel are not "soldiers" per say, not combat arms people.

Fact is, Trudeau invoked the EMA and then revoked the EMA. All else is extraneous nonsense because it never happened. Sorry to hit you on the head with the reality hammer but, those are the facts.

BS. Complete and utter BS. But hey, it is your BS and stick to it

I will help you out here. Don't like what I say? Puts you on the spot to prove your statements? Getting caught up in your BS? Well, ignore me. Put me on ignore and I will be gone

Did I ever say that??? In your imagination perhaps. Get a grip and stay with facts.

Someone has to work to enact all the promises he made to appease all the people that voted him in.

Chuckle, don't trip over your feet backpedalling LOL Your partner in BS, westconman kept on and on about the vote that never happened. I don't disagree with anything that isn't BS so, ....

Ahahahaha You are one funny person...NOT! Your opinion is worth as much as the senators banter....lots of talk but of no benefit.

Don't know her, can't say. She did talk too much and they could have voted but.... they did not. Her personal issues do not make her any less talkative. You, like westconman seem to think you know a lot about other people. You accuse me of idolizing dishonest people. You do not know me so, I say, your defence of the senator is in the same category, you do not know here either so, your post is BS.

What fact? What logic? A senator speaking for 13 minutes? Yes, that is fact but...the vote never happened so she was just wasting time and blowing smoke. Maybe if she shut up, the vote could have happened?? LOL Here is the fact...there was no vote. Here is logic, the vote never happened no matter how much banter the senator went on. Trudeau is a dick. I could not care less if he ran again. I think Polliwhatever is a dick too so that makes them even. Oh and, you as a mindreader, thinking you know what s on my mind, are a monumental failure. If you read my posts about the commission and it's potential outcome you would see that I think Trudeau is gonna get the horses end of it. Some of you folks here on this forum are like puppets, hanging by little threads of things past. The event is over, the EMA is revoked, the vote never happened, the vaxx is done.... the only thread you have left is the commission report sometime in February.

Stop spinning, deflecting, excusing, wishing and hoping....there was no vote... LOL Wake up and smell the reality...there was no vote. Oh, have I mentioned to you that there was no vote? LOL

Batters banter. 13 minutes of it. LOL Oh wait, maybe you did not know.... There was no vote.... get it? LOL Jumping on westconmans bandwagon is something you do so well. Kudos

Chuckle... There was no vote.... get it? LOL

How can a vote go any way if there is no vote??? LOL Stop spinning, you will get dizzier LOL

I believe you said "maybe do you support the protesters in China? " I disputed saying anything about China. You seem to be unable to comprehend that. What affair?? The EMA? I have lots of opinions on it and said so in this thread. They are opinions, just as your opinions are yours. I also said, I do not compare Canada to any other country. You don't have to believe anything if you don't want to.

I have to disagree with you about pay. The military pay is very good in comparison to civil standards. Yes, there was at time when the pay was not as good but that has changed a lot. A private, off the street regardless of occupation makes $38K per year and within 3 years is up to $55K and within 5 years is up to $70K. Pretty good for a clerk or stores person and other trades within the military. Forced diversity is not working. It never will.

I accept facts when presented with proof, not hearsay. Put your money where your mouth is. Prove your statement "Then why did Trudeau ask to extend the EA?." Because you cannot, as it did not happen.

When did Trudeau "ask to extend the EA"??? Suck it up dude, he invoked it and he revoked it...no senate involvement ...they failed. Your assumption about the senate is unfounded as they did not vote. The had 10 days to debate and vote for or against it and they did not accomplish that.